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2018/04/19 16:56:41
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
What's your plan after all the Lychguard die on turn 1?
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2018/04/19 17:09:31
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
I really want to use the monolith and like it.....unfortunately it doesn't have much fire power. I think this list is a great attempt, but it's all hyper-focused on the lychguard and the monolith......I'm not sure it would be very effective. I think you'd have tough time dealing with multiple Monsters/vehicles as there's not a lot in the list that has much punch. I think it would be fun to try in a casual game though for sure.
Two night scythes would allow you to dump out the lychguard within range and would save you about 60 points IIRC (by leaving out the monolith). Then you could use the deceiver to move the wraiths up immediately also....or take the deceiver out and use the points elsewhere.
I almost feel like the DDark is an auto-include....maybe not for this list.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/19 17:13:39
2018/04/19 17:12:57
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Anpu-adom wrote: It was a poorly worded question, and so the answer had no bearing. Besides, the Facebook crew have said that they aren't an official source for rulings...
So, it's a fart in the wind... best let it go.
If you read further down in the comments for that question Warhammer 40000 responds again. Here are two quotes in sequence
"Chris Holden: I believe it falls under the same catagory as the Raven Guard's Statagem and Genestealer Cult exceptions as it isn't holding them back in reserve as such and it is before the first battle round begins."
"Warhammer 40,000: As Chris has said, this can be benefited from as you're re-deploying a unit which is already on the table."
That response was about a question of the Deciever's Grand Illusion ability though, not the VoD
2018/04/19 17:14:52
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Kutlakh connects with Lychguard pooring out of Monolith for a 11" move and then a charge. Pop the 3++ stratagem first turn.
Wraiths protect Deceiver turn one, reanimate turn two, cc freely within enemy ranks. Scarabs move up to connect with Deceiver if he is left behind by the Wraiths.
Enemy ideally is too busy to care about monolith. If helpful, and if CP, Immortals late game teleports.
Cryptek connects with Lychguard or Wraiths using 16"movement, uses staff to help prevent overwatch.
2018/04/19 17:19:18
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
If you use the Monolith's Dimensional Corridor Stratagem, it all but guarantees a first turn charge.
Deploy both the Monolith and the Lychguard on the board and not hovering/on a Tomb World
Redeploy Monolith 12.1" away from an enemy unit with Grand Illusion
Dimensional Corridor the Lychguard to wholly within 3" of the Monolith, putting them 9.1" from the enemy unit
Move them 5"
Make a 5"+ charge roll (with optional reroll via the strat)
I've been toying around with a similar slingshot maneuver for a unit of Flayed Ones, and if I can do it without the Deciever.
2018/04/19 17:21:34
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
If you use the Monolith's Dimensional Corridor Stratagem, it all but guarantees a first turn charge.
Deploy both the Monolith and the Lychguard on the board and not hovering/on a Tomb World
Redeploy Monolith 12.1" away from an enemy unit with Grand Illusion
Dimensional Corridor the Lychguard to wholly within 3" of the Monolith, putting them 9.1" from the enemy unit
Move them 5"
Make a 5"+ charge roll (with optional reroll via the strat)
I've been toying around with a similar slingshot maneuver for a unit of Flayed Ones, and if I can do it without the Deciever.
Hmm...this has piqued my interest...I might need to tinker with this concept.
Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts
MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum.
2018/04/19 17:23:19
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
If you use the Monolith's Dimensional Corridor Stratagem, it all but guarantees a first turn charge.
Deploy both the Monolith and the Lychguard on the board and not hovering/on a Tomb World
Redeploy Monolith 12.1" away from an enemy unit with Grand Illusion
Dimensional Corridor the Lychguard to wholly within 3" of the Monolith, putting them 9.1" from the enemy unit
Move them 5"
Make a 5"+ charge roll (with optional reroll via the strat)
I've been toying around with a similar slingshot maneuver for a unit of Flayed Ones, and if I can do it without the Deciever.
Hmm...this has piqued my interest...I might need to tinker with this concept.
I think it has some teeth to it, definitely needs the right support network though....
2018/04/19 17:26:32
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Grimgold wrote:I think Nephrek should be the default dynasty for battalions if you are running more than 1 detachment, not only are they good for destroyers, but they are arguably our best dynasty for troops. Moving 11" a turn through, over, and past obstacles/enemy units is great for obsec units. I recently went undefeated in a tournament in part because I was so good at getting on objectives and holding them. It also makes our foot HQ much more mobile as well, which enables mobile phalanxes.
Mephrit requires our troops to be close to get the advantage of -1 AP, which is easier said than done for units that moves 5". Nihilakh requires them to stand still to get the reroll ones to hit, which we won't get if we send our troops to capture objectives. I don't see Warriors and immortals taking advantage of Novokh, they aren't really great in CC and are too slow to catch the few units that are worse in CC.
If I were going mono detachment sautekh would probably be my choice, since they are the second best for our troops (maybe best depending on application), since they can advance and fire their weapons. The dynasty also buffs several units such as CCBs, Annihilation barges, Doom Scythes, and wraiths with Transdimensional beamers. Access to the majority of our special characters is what seals the deal.
Nihilakh seems the best for a spearhead detachment, go for two DDA a spyder and a cloak tek, so they repair any incoming damage and the DDA can reroll ones since they don't have to move with their range.
I agree with this assessment. I like running a mono Dynasty with Immotekh, though I can see how a Nihilakh spearhead and Novokh Outrider are powerful. Similarly to the Tyranid book taking different detachments from different hive fleets, I see competitive Necron lists running at least 2, if not 3 different dynasties. Sautehk or Mephrit for the battalion depending on flavor, with Nihilakh and Novokh detachments.
Novokh vanguard. Forget Pretorians, i don't know what to do with them, but lychguard and flayed ones are the two most wound pumping units we have (lychguard vs multi wound models, flayed ones vs multiple models), Reroll to hit is just a big bonus. Blood rite stratagem is just the icing on the cake. Deepstriking won't help them charge, you need an invasion beam. So you need to build a fair share of your army around it. But there's something to do here. May be with a mephrit warrior bataillon.
And i like Sautekh DDA. Once you blow up the necessary treats on T1-T2, you find out moving and firing S8 D3 is good enough, and you need these 20 rapid fire guns and hard shell to crack on the front lines.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/19 17:29:17
2018/04/19 17:29:23
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
I think Flayed Ones need to be considered in that list to support the Lychguard. Offensively, point for point, Flayed Ones are actually in a good spot. It's just delivery that's an issue.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
2018/04/19 17:33:58
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I think Flayed Ones need to be considered in that list to support the Lychguard. Offensively, point for point, Flayed Ones are actually in a good spot. It's just delivery that's an issue.
Not a bad concept. The question is, do you deep strike them turn 2 as backup, or use them as the primary assault force, bearing in mind the whole unit has to arrive within 3 inches of the Monolith before movement or is destroyed. Just food for thought here.
Bedouin Dynasty: 10000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4000 pts
The Custodes Winter Watch 4000 pts
MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum.
2018/04/19 17:46:48
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Anpu-adom wrote: It was a poorly worded question, and so the answer had no bearing. Besides, the Facebook crew have said that they aren't an official source for rulings...
So, it's a fart in the wind... best let it go.
If you read further down in the comments for that question Warhammer 40000 responds again. Here are two quotes in sequence
"Chris Holden: I believe it falls under the same catagory as the Raven Guard's Statagem and Genestealer Cult exceptions as it isn't holding them back in reserve as such and it is before the first battle round begins."
"Warhammer 40,000: As Chris has said, this can be benefited from as you're re-deploying a unit which is already on the table."
That response was about a question of the Deciever's Grand Illusion ability though, not the VoD
Yeah....the important thing to pay attention to is their response. "you're re-deploying a unit which is already on the table."
I'm done posting or talking about this in this thread though.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I think Flayed Ones need to be considered in that list to support the Lychguard. Offensively, point for point, Flayed Ones are actually in a good spot. It's just delivery that's an issue.
Not a bad concept. The question is, do you deep strike them turn 2 as backup, or use them as the primary assault force, bearing in mind the whole unit has to arrive within 3 inches of the Monolith before movement or is destroyed. Just food for thought here.
That's definitely important to think about.....the monolith has a pretty large footprint though. I think you could manage to be within 3 inches.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/19 17:48:10
2018/04/19 17:49:05
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
I don't like giving up on the Wraiths, if deceived to enemy's doorstep they pose a big enough threat that they will be soaking up fire that may save the monolith and lychguard and they do reasonably well against hordes if need be. And Nephrekh they dart 18" in a straight line and charge with a stratagem if need be.
2018/04/19 18:40:11
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
If you use the Monolith's Dimensional Corridor Stratagem, it all but guarantees a first turn charge.
I know. I presumed the Lychguard would probably charge and kill something without losing much in assault.
Then they'll die as they'd be all alone in the middle of your opponents army. They aren't going to withstand an armies worth of offense.
Also, I didn't say this was even a bad idea. I just wondered what his actual plan was after that happened. To which he responded. I do agree the Monolith will probably be ignored, it's not dangerous/easy enough to kill to worry about it. I disagree that Kutlakh would ever reach the Lychguard; they're going to be dead before he gets there.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2018/04/19 18:46:29
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
If you use the Monolith's Dimensional Corridor Stratagem, it all but guarantees a first turn charge.
I know. I presumed the Lychguard would probably charge and kill something without losing much in assault.
Then they'll die as they'd be all alone in the middle of your opponents army. They aren't going to withstand an armies worth of offense.
Also, I didn't say this was even a bad idea. I just wondered what his actual plan was after that happened. To which he responded. I do agree the Monolith will probably be ignored, it's not dangerous/easy enough to kill to worry about it. I disagree that Kutlakh would ever reach the Lychguard; they're going to be dead before he gets there.
100% agree. Once your opponent sees what lychguard are capable of they'll be focus fired until they're dead.
2018/04/19 18:48:59
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
That being said, putting a giant threat with big neon-arrow pointing at itself saying "SHOOT ME" is still a good strategy. If it's a good enough and tough enough threat, it does draw all the fire while allowing the entire rest of your army to move up and have the rest of the board.
That kind of play style alone is usually enough to win and Maelstrom or turn-based scoring missions. You can run out to a big lead and hang on avoiding getting tabled. Fortunately Necrons have some speed and/or durability to make that happen.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/19 18:50:50
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2018/04/19 18:54:24
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
torblind wrote: I don't like giving up on the Wraiths, if deceived to enemy's doorstep they pose a big enough threat that they will be soaking up fire that may save the monolith and lychguard and they do reasonably well against hordes if need be. And Nephrekh they dart 18" in a straight line and charge with a stratagem if need be.
Just keep in mind the wraiths cant charge the first turn after grand illusion. Even with the strategem.
2018/04/19 18:59:44
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
I'd definitely be curious to see how the list would do. I just think that 381 points for the monolith to do its single trick is a steep price to pay.... I'd probably use the enhanced invasion beams to bring something else nasty with the lychguard. You'd need to reconfigure the list though.
2018/04/19 19:03:17
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Also, it's a one trick pony. It only works if you go first. Anytime you go second against someone that's seen this before will just get close enough to prevent you from disembarking from the Monolith.
Also also, Flayed Ones will probably do this better than Lychguard.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/19 19:04:26
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2018/04/19 19:10:01
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
Well I plan to bring the Wraiths (and the CTan up too), so he's going to have to choose.
Also this was sword and board Lychguard, not too scary damageoutputwise.
Kutlakh may make it up as an optional 3rd redeployed dude.
Having 6 wraiths up there with them, he'd probably go for them instead, possibly leaving the C'Tan naked, and also the wraiths are 18 wounds T5/3++ and Lychguard are 20 wounds T5/3++ (wtih stratagem)
It would be unfortunate to go up against Null Zone though.
2018/04/19 19:20:59
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
A third of the time, he only brings the Monolith though.
It's a gamblers strategy.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2018/04/19 19:26:58
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
You could always just plan on the deceiver only getting the monolith through. Then you'd setup an extra unit in Tombworld deployment, that way you can use the enhanced invasion beams to bring in two units for 1 CP.
2018/04/19 20:15:16
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
You might want to consider breaking the Flayed Ones into slightly smaller groups of 15, and either leave a 10 man one in reserve or buy Deathmarks for reactionary measures, or Scarabs as you make mention of earlier.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
2018/04/19 21:43:21
Subject: Re:Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
punisher357 wrote: You could always just plan on the deceiver only getting the monolith through. Then you'd setup an extra unit in Tombworld deployment, that way you can use the enhanced invasion beams to bring in two units for 1 CP.
Not on turn 1, so it's not really relevant to this strategy.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2018/04/19 22:23:05
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
punisher357 wrote: You could always just plan on the deceiver only getting the monolith through. Then you'd setup an extra unit in Tombworld deployment, that way you can use the enhanced invasion beams to bring in two units for 1 CP.
Not on turn 1, so it's not really relevant to this strategy.
doh'
already forgot about that...since they're going into reserves that wouldn't work....
2018/04/19 22:55:37
Subject: Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - New FAQ discussion p.72
So we can use Deceiver to redeploy Vault, himself and maybe someone else before turn 1. With 4++ and without deepstrike heavy coming/shooting Vault potentially can survive and do some damage unless we're playing Tau / AdMech.
10000 pts
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