Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Played some 1.5k games. And I gotta say, WOW necrons are squishy (As expected with my durability chart). I spent my entire game in cover, staying out of cultist RF range and traded blows and almost got tabled (he wasn't in cover). Like, I have no idea how mephrit is ever anything that would cross my mind with a glass cannon army. Especially because I'd rather stay in ruins and shoot instead of chase after that elusive 12'' range.

Nephrek netted me like 4 objectives and replaced HQ auras.

Also destroyers are just meh so far. I hope they get better. 5 did 7 wounds to obliterators :/

I won in the end because it was ITC and necrons love that.(2 out of 4 VP only for every secondary)

Going through the little bit of lore stuff we have compiled im thinking the new model is a Crypt Stalker. Very excited. Im just hoping i dont need 2.

 rvd1ofakind wrote:
Played some 1.5k games. And I gotta say, WOW necrons are squishy (As expected with my durability chart). I spent my entire game in cover, staying out of cultist RF range and traded blows and almost got tabled (he wasn't in cover). Like, I have no idea how mephrit is ever anything that would cross my mind with a glass cannon army. Especially because I'd rather stay in ruins and shoot instead of chase after that elusive 12'' range.

Nephrek netted me like 4 objectives and replaced HQ auras.

Also destroyers are just meh so far. I hope they get better. 5 did 7 wounds to obliterators :/

I won in the end because it was ITC and necrons love that.(2 out of 4 VP only for every secondary)

Are Destroyers one of the most over hyped units of ALL time?

Msolve wrote:

 rvd1ofakind wrote:
Played some 1.5k games. And I gotta say, WOW necrons are squishy (As expected with my durability chart). I spent my entire game in cover, staying out of cultist RF range and traded blows and almost got tabled (he wasn't in cover). Like, I have no idea how mephrit is ever anything that would cross my mind with a glass cannon army. Especially because I'd rather stay in ruins and shoot instead of chase after that elusive 12'' range.

Nephrek netted me like 4 objectives and replaced HQ auras.

Also destroyers are just meh so far. I hope they get better. 5 did 7 wounds to obliterators :/

I won in the end because it was ITC and necrons love that.(2 out of 4 VP only for every secondary)

Are Destroyers one of the most over hyped units of ALL time?

Not in the slightest, Destroyers are our best damage dealing unit while using EP.

What did you roll for damage? Against Obliterators, Gauss Cannon damage averages range from 7.9 damage (1,2), 15.8 damage (3,4), and 23.7 damage (5,6). On average you will be pumping out 15.8 wounds a turn, so it seems like you rolled on the low end of damage for that round of shooting, which can also be remedied with a Command Re-Roll.

I re-rolled before rolling for them (to finish off a unit)
I mean, ofc this was unlucky. But still... ugh... When I pay 2 CP and they kill for half their points only..... Then die like flies... :/

 rvd1ofakind wrote:
I re-rolled before rolling for them (to finish off a unit)
I mean, ofc this was unlucky. But still... ugh... When I pay 2 CP and they kill for half their points only..... Then die like flies... :/

Yeah definitely seems like bad luck. If you are having problems with survivability, I would suggest having a Chrono-Tek escort them. The buff to RP and the 5++ helps them greatly, and because the Choro-Tek will be Nephrekh, it will be able to keep up with the Destroyer's movement.

I had chronotek. Wasn't able to use it once. since I always had a 5+ save at the end of the day despite being pepere with lascannons and obliterator shots

The Necron titan unit actually make me go check and realise that Necrons were the only army without any potential access to a Titan unit from FW (this assumes that you convert an Eldar to a Dark Eldar variation - otherwise Dark Eldar are also without a titn - then again Dark Eldar have almost nothing from FW).

So this huge spider walker is fantastic for Necron and brings them in line with everyone else from 40K. I really like the design - huge walking spider strider with two massive front arms for close combat and two huge cannon arms. Visually it looks like a powerful assault titan unit - the kind which has a strong shot, but which is fast enough to get across the battlefield and happily into close combat.
Of course the forearms could be a missleading detail and it could otherwise be a powerful gun/artillery platform - but we kind of have that from the Pylon (even if the pylons are really rather dull to look at*)



* they are the kind of thing that looks great on something like Epic scale games where you've got a few dozen to form an artillery battery

I think the new 'Titan' looks pretty awesome tbh.

On topic: when people are running Scarab screens, how many units do people prefer? and how many bases per unit?

Came out of a tournament with a total wipeout and 2 narrow deafeat where the opponent had like half a unit left and a character. Lost the initiative on both defeat and won initiative on my win.
I went 3DDA 2X5 destro 30 tesla immo. I guess its one of the best working list so far.



So i left out a nikilah spearhead to as planned to save an HQ and integrated my 3DDA in the bataillon. Mistake. Spend the extra points on Anrakyr in my Nephrek detachment who could still MWBD my nikilah immortals. Mistake 2.

This is is close to what i want but here's the few shortfall.
1) Nikilah immortals. Sounds cool, hit on 2+ reroll 1s. On an objective with the stratagem and Anraky that makes 3A immortals with 2+ saves. In theory. In practice your stucked with non moving immortals and they get shot down pretty fast still. In no game i had the opportunity to do 3 MWBD as planned since i always lost at least 1 unit, or was not in range.
2) Nikihalh DDA: work well on turn 1 and 2. But you eventually got to move: you face infantry and want those rapid fire shots, you get charged and need to get out of close combat etc. In my experiences Sautekh plays better with DDA (5 games vs 1). So perhaps the Sautekh bataillon for the immortals and DDA is still the best option.
3) Destroyers. I would have been better with a Cryptek and VoD than Anrakyr and sending 2 in deep strikes. 2 Games the opponent didn,t move close enough, i had to wait to turn 2 for a proper deepstrike, a VOD cryptek would have done the job, and grant an extra shooting turn (or at least wipe out something that doesn't shoot you on turn 2). Points saved from Anrakyr and remove 1 scarab can give you 2X6 destroyers instead of five, in all games an extra destroyer would have made a big difference (many times where 1 or 2 soldiers were left standing). In both game i lost my an hair, an extra turn of destroyer shot would have turned the tide.

So this is my 2 conclusion. Sautekh ­is better than Nikilah even for DDA.
Better to have 1 unit of destroyers teleport with VoD and a cryptek.
Yeah don't hesitate to give a destroyer unit as bait to save your immortals, if you bring down the bing guns with DDA and destroyers first, you'll need those tesla immortals to take out whats left. In my 2 deafeats my destroyers where the last survivors. Not as efficient.

Jackers wrote:
I think the new 'Titan' looks pretty awesome tbh.

On topic: when people are running Scarab screens, how many units do people prefer? and how many bases per unit?

If you go to the actual blog page for the Warhammer community they say it is an imperial knight sized model

That was a great read! Who were you up against?

What's the general consensus on Wraith weapons? Are transdimensional beamers worth the points, or should I use particle casters?

Use casters, or even better, naked.
Its 4 points for a single S6 shot on a unit with a bunch of S6 attacks that have pen. Not worth it.

Msolve wrote:

 rvd1ofakind wrote:
Played some 1.5k games. And I gotta say, WOW necrons are squishy (As expected with my durability chart). I spent my entire game in cover, staying out of cultist RF range and traded blows and almost got tabled (he wasn't in cover). Like, I have no idea how mephrit is ever anything that would cross my mind with a glass cannon army. Especially because I'd rather stay in ruins and shoot instead of chase after that elusive 12'' range.

Nephrek netted me like 4 objectives and replaced HQ auras.

Also destroyers are just meh so far. I hope they get better. 5 did 7 wounds to obliterators :/

I won in the end because it was ITC and necrons love that.(2 out of 4 VP only for every secondary)

Are Destroyers one of the most over hyped units of ALL time?

Most overhyped unit of all time? Just because he had one gakky roll and got wiped because he misplaced them? Basically every competitive win I have seen Necrons get has been off the back of destroyers, so I wouldn't say they are overhyped.

 EnTyme wrote:
What's the general consensus on Wraith weapons? Are transdimensional beamers worth the points, or should I use particle casters?

I think they are a luxury that can sometimes be afforded.

S6 is nice with T3 targets to plunk a few extra wounds here and there, even if in cc since they're pistols.

Beamers are nice against elite infantry with good save, especially if you run them with sautekh to better shoot when they dart ahead. They can even fly out of cc, shoot, and charge back in.

I'm toying with the idea of bringing a single whip in as well, if you see yourself losing a model on cc, put wounds on it and of it goes it still gets to fight, could make a difference now that they are more potent

Personally, I don't think the wraith upgrades are worth it. Maybe if we get some point decreases elsewhere, but as it sits, the wraiths I run will be stock

Raxxamous wrote:

Most overhyped unit of all time? Just because he had one gakky roll and got wiped because he misplaced them? Basically every competitive win I have seen Necrons get has been off the back of destroyers, so I wouldn't say they are overhyped.

OK, please tell me how do I not misplace them. I placed them 23'' away from what I wanted to shoot (Everything I wanted to shoot was next to each other) and in cover. You can't really hide from 48'' guns and you can't really hide 5 destroyers behind LoS.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Use casters, or even better, naked.
Its 4 points for a single S6 shot on a unit with a bunch of S6 attacks that have pen. Not worth it.

Okay. That kind of confirms what I was thinking. They're probably the next kit I'll be putting together, and I'm just trying to get so ideas on how to build them. I already have six with whip coils from 7th, but I was wondering if either gun was worth it. I'll build them with the caster, but only use the if I have a couple extra points to spare, which was mostly what I planned on anyway. Also, just to chime in on the Destroyer debate, I seem to have the absolute worst luck on any d3 roll I've ever made, so my view may be tainted, but I don't see them as an auto-include. I think we have other options that are just as viable.

 EnTyme wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Use casters, or even better, naked.
Its 4 points for a single S6 shot on a unit with a bunch of S6 attacks that have pen. Not worth it.

Okay. That kind of confirms what I was thinking. They're probably the next kit I'll be putting together, and I'm just trying to get so ideas on how to build them. I already have six with whip coils from 7th, but I was wondering if either gun was worth it. I'll build them with the caster, but only use the if I have a couple extra points to spare, which was mostly what I planned on anyway. Also, just to chime in on the Destroyer debate, I seem to have the absolute worst luck on any d3 roll I've ever made, so my view may be tainted, but I don't see them as an auto-include. I think we have other options that are just as viable.

Out of curiosity what other options do you think are as viable as destroyers?

punisher357 wrote:

 EnTyme wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Use casters, or even better, naked.
Its 4 points for a single S6 shot on a unit with a bunch of S6 attacks that have pen. Not worth it.

Okay. That kind of confirms what I was thinking. They're probably the next kit I'll be putting together, and I'm just trying to get so ideas on how to build them. I already have six with whip coils from 7th, but I was wondering if either gun was worth it. I'll build them with the caster, but only use the if I have a couple extra points to spare, which was mostly what I planned on anyway. Also, just to chime in on the Destroyer debate, I seem to have the absolute worst luck on any d3 roll I've ever made, so my view may be tainted, but I don't see them as an auto-include. I think we have other options that are just as viable.

Out of curiosity what other options do you think are as viable as destroyers?

Destroyers are a strong unit that will get targeted, not bringing them because they get shot down is just bonkers. Should you take weaker units then? Then your second strongest unit gets it instead.

Having units that enemies throw everything at is a good thing, not a bad thing

FYI started a thread under proposed rules to speculate and wishlist about the FW necron construct

 rvd1ofakind wrote:
Played some 1.5k games. And I gotta say, WOW necrons are squishy (As expected with my durability chart). I spent my entire game in cover, staying out of cultist RF range and traded blows and almost got tabled (he wasn't in cover). Like, I have no idea how mephrit is ever anything that would cross my mind with a glass cannon army. Especially because I'd rather stay in ruins and shoot instead of chase after that elusive 12'' range.

Nephrek netted me like 4 objectives and replaced HQ auras.

Also destroyers are just meh so far. I hope they get better. 5 did 7 wounds to obliterators :/

I won in the end because it was ITC and necrons love that.(2 out of 4 VP only for every secondary)

How have Doomsday Arks performed for you so far, if you have used them?

I don't have em. Thinking about them because heldrakes are quite problematic. They charge turn 1 always. And Necrons pretty much only have scarabs for defense.

torblind wrote:

punisher357 wrote:

 EnTyme wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Use casters, or even better, naked.
Its 4 points for a single S6 shot on a unit with a bunch of S6 attacks that have pen. Not worth it.

Okay. That kind of confirms what I was thinking. They're probably the next kit I'll be putting together, and I'm just trying to get so ideas on how to build them. I already have six with whip coils from 7th, but I was wondering if either gun was worth it. I'll build them with the caster, but only use the if I have a couple extra points to spare, which was mostly what I planned on anyway. Also, just to chime in on the Destroyer debate, I seem to have the absolute worst luck on any d3 roll I've ever made, so my view may be tainted, but I don't see them as an auto-include. I think we have other options that are just as viable.

Out of curiosity what other options do you think are as viable as destroyers?

Destroyers are a strong unit that will get targeted, not bringing them because they get shot down is just bonkers. Should you take weaker units then? Then your second strongest unit gets it instead.

Having units that enemies throw everything at is a good thing, not a bad thing

I would also almost always DS them on the flank if you don't want them to get shot up too much, as that greatly decreases the amount of fire your opponent can direct towards them. It forces your opponent to either let them live or reposition the opposite flank to try to deal with them, which can give you a great advantage.

Destroyers are our best unit in the book in terms of damage output, mobility and strategem efficiency combined. What else do they need to make them good in your opinion? Should they cost less? Be smaller models? Be tougher? You can't have it all. Use the tool for what it's for.

punisher357 wrote:

 EnTyme wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Use casters, or even better, naked.
Its 4 points for a single S6 shot on a unit with a bunch of S6 attacks that have pen. Not worth it.

Okay. That kind of confirms what I was thinking. They're probably the next kit I'll be putting together, and I'm just trying to get so ideas on how to build them. I already have six with whip coils from 7th, but I was wondering if either gun was worth it. I'll build them with the caster, but only use the if I have a couple extra points to spare, which was mostly what I planned on anyway. Also, just to chime in on the Destroyer debate, I seem to have the absolute worst luck on any d3 roll I've ever made, so my view may be tainted, but I don't see them as an auto-include. I think we have other options that are just as viable.

Out of curiosity what other options do you think are as viable as destroyers?

Tomb Blades have performed well for me. I also feel Wraiths are a viable option. I never said Destroyers are bad, but I hate the models and the fluff behind them, so if I can find an excuse not to take them, I will. They're our "best" unit from a min/max standpoint, but I feel they aren't so much better that they are irreplaceable. Also keep in mind that I don't play tournaments, so I'm not concerned with having to fight the most broken list the internet can rules lawyer up. I've done extremely well in my local league since the codex came out using mostly Immortals and Warriors with HQ support and Tomb Blades to do the heavy lifting. The only list that's beaten me is a Monster Nid list, and that was mostly because I went second.

Okay, well, fluff and aesthetic being personal preference thing, not taking them in a list is like wearing dress shoes in a race: you might think it looks better but it's probably going to hinder your performance.

If you're not too concerned with winning, no prob, but people who come looking for hints and suggestions on how to make the most out of their army lists deserve to hear the truth: From a competitive tactics standpoint, Destroyers are the best unit, point for point, in the codex, and not taking them is almost like giving yourself a handicap.
Just because some people have had anecdotal experiences where they didn't work out the way they were hoping does not mean they're any less effective (plus, it really helps to know how to play them to get them most bang for your buck. That's the reason so many people take them in Nephrekh detachments, to keep them safe until it's time to best employ them).

Reread my post. I'm saying there are other options. Not that those options are better, just that they exist, and your army can absolutely be competitive without taking a min-max unit. A tactica thread should include tips for multiple types of meta, and tournament play is far from the only meta.

That's fair. Sometimes one doesn't have access to destroyers, after all. Either due to points limit or not having the physical model, so coming up with an alternative is helpful.
I actually really like the fluff, as its the closest thing we have now to traditional necrons. The models aren't bad, imo. If they are to be updated, they need to look more menacing and mechanical, as if the destroyer stripped away all traces of necrontyr and became a pure weapons platform. Something like a gun platform with a head.