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PiñaColada wrote:

 Redemption wrote:
I'm curious if that "mob up" that the Skarboy and 'Ard Boy stratagem mention means there some new rule to join multiple squads of boys together? Seems like a weird way to say the Mob Rule wouldn't work with other friendly units at least.

PiñaColada wrote:
I'm not even sure what the Killa Jet is (like on the model), am I missing something really obvious?

Maybe it's those two red squig-shaped things we thought were air intakes?

Spoiler:

I mean yeah, it pretty much has to be, hasn't it? Those are the only front facing things I can see on the model that could possible house a skorcha/twin meltas

I think it might be the rear of the Trike, the jet engine bit here (apologies for my poor paint skills);

with what we have previewed currently and asuming some price adjaustment to all our walkers to make them more viable then i would run this for a dreddmob.
everything is evilsunz for the bonuses to speed.
deffkilla trike for the advance and charge,
a full squad of killakans.
3-6 defdredds.
a barebones bigmek with kff (if no pts change the i would go for the index bikemek for the kff).
and then a morkanaut to hang back out of line of sight to be telyported at the enemy.

then have a batalion of deathskulls.
bigmek warlord with sag for sniping.
your pick for the 2nd HQ
then nothing but grots of 10s for cp battery.

of course this all assumes good pts decreases, but ill definitely give it a try when the codex comes out.

trike has potential of being decent. Need to get an inv on there somehow and a better mele weapon. Lets hope its a char with relic options.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 JimOnMars wrote:
Wartrike will also allow plenty of turn-1 assaults for trukks! Bye Bye gunlines!

a) trukk isn't much of a threat. Especially as good gunlines either have chaff you have to charge or aren't that worried as they can fall back and shoot back anyway.
b) 14"+d6+2d6=24" threat range. Even with reroll adding bit...For gunline that's fairly easy to avoid. You need threat range of at least 28" to reliably T1 charge gunlines. And gunline can always deploy bit further if they really feel the need.

There isn't take much room and pushing them back concedes board control. They also still get a reroll on the charge do they not?

You'd have to push that stuff WAY back to be secure.

Reroll doesn't add 4" to range. 18" after advance. 9" to charge 27" away. 29" is easy peasy and that's then less than 50% to succeed even with reroll. and that's if you deploy straight front and he doesn't have simply chaff to soak up your charge first. Of course these days chaff exists by bucketload so what will happen is your trukk charges chaff, kills with luck 1 model, then trukk and content gets blown apart.

You don't want to charge with trukk. You want to charge with contents. Or with something beefier than trukk. At least with battlewagon with death rolla. Or 12 warbikes. Also nice for dreadnoughts, killa kans, gorkanauts and stompas if those come useful. But trukk? You are just sacrificing trukk and the contents to prevent CHAFF from shooting 1 turn. whee.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JimOnMars wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 JimOnMars wrote:
Wartrike will also allow plenty of turn-1 assaults for trukks! Bye Bye gunlines!

a) trukk isn't much of a threat. Especially as good gunlines either have chaff you have to charge or aren't that worried as they can fall back and shoot back anyway.
b) 14"+d6+2d6=24" threat range. Even with reroll adding bit...For gunline that's fairly easy to avoid. You need threat range of at least 28" to reliably T1 charge gunlines. And gunline can always deploy bit further if they really feel the need.

There isn't take much room and pushing them back concedes board control. They also still get a reroll on the charge do they not?

You'd have to push that stuff WAY back to be secure.

Well, I was thinking 4 Trukks of 48 boyz and nobz plus a dajumping blob of 40 more. Plus not every gunline can fallback and shoot with every unit. Maybe with the (presumed) nerfs to IG they won't be taken in such quantities anymore, leaving only the hapless Tau, which can still erase a lot but it would be hard pressed to get through 40 t6 and 88 t4 points in one go.

Gunlines that can't fall back and shoot have instead plenty of chaff so your trukks will get into chaff, kill model or two(trukks arent' exactly h2h monsters...) and then he falls chaff back and blows trukks out, your boyz disembark losing ~8 of them and then gets plastered by fire.

Charging in with trukks loaded up with boyz is something people don't do because it sucks. You want to charge with contents. Which just ain't possible on T1. Even with this


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
Gorkanaut should be averaging about 6 hits with DDD. That's far from a game-changing weapon but still significantly more than a heavy bolter.

'Ardboyz stratagem seems pretty bad, while the Skarboyz stratagem seems pretty good.

7. 6 hits, 3 6's, that results in extra hit.

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:

 aracersss wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:


Snazzguns being heavy at 24" range isn't great. If you move you will be hitting on 6s.

aren't they bs4+ ?

Yep, and their weapons got a lot more punch than they used to have.

I can see the 24" range and heavy still being a problem, depending on points, especially if Ammor Runts are going to be a lot more limited.

Hard to tell without the codex though. I'm super excited!

Oh, are they still BS4+ now? Ok, that makes them a bit better. Might have to remodel my flash gitz conversions though, as the guns they have aren't heavy looking enough.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grimskul wrote:
Obviously points cost is a big factor with regards to how much better Flash Gitz are, but with their current weapon upgrade, don't they step on the toes of Lootas currently? They have better AP, same damage, with only one less strength and of course half the range. But with a 4+ save and guaranteed 3 shots and BS4+, they seem like they outdo Lootas in their own role tbh. I hope they've done something to make Lootas worth taking in their own right.

Aren't Deffguns longer range and S7?

Now, are my eyes deceiving me, or do the krew on the new vehicles look a bit heftier than normal Boys, a bit closer to Nob size?

 Yodhrin wrote:
Now, are my eyes deceiving me, or do the krew on the new vehicles look a bit heftier than normal Boys, a bit closer to Nob size?

Primarorks.

 Yodhrin wrote:
Now, are my eyes deceiving me, or do the krew on the new vehicles look a bit heftier than normal Boys, a bit closer to Nob size?

I imagine we'll see scale creep on all new Ork models to try and make them look less short next to Primaris marines. At least you can argue that the natural variation between Orks should generally favour those with the best toys like buggies.

Don't think orks are supposed to tower over space marines though...

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
Now, are my eyes deceiving me, or do the krew on the new vehicles look a bit heftier than normal Boys, a bit closer to Nob size?

Primarorks.

But the arms on the trike boss seem shorter than the biker nobz arm. Maybe even the Battlewagon gunner arms.

No more primate Orks :/

I want a trike boss with a two handed sword-choppa, blue warpaint and a belted plaid, yelling of Waaaaghs and leading a charge of bikers and boar bikers. But the biker design is really cool, too. Decisions, decisions.

PiñaColada wrote:


The Deffkilla wartrike. I'm a little bit disappointed he's only base S5. Another point of strength would have mde him hit with S8 attacks because of his weapon in CC, which would help immensly.

you're so right with this...
S8 would have made him so much better. I feel that S7 is a strange choice as it is as good as S5 vs most targets(3+ to wound) and still needs the 5+to wound a vehicle.
I hope this S+2 is wrong and we will be welcomed with a SX2 in the codex but i don't think that's going to happen.

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
By my math the Stompa's Dethkannon will average about 9.5 wounds to most tanks (that is factoring in DDD). That falls far short of fixing the Stompa by itself, but it is certainly an improvement.

Well, that's actually more than an IK Thermal Cannon will do on average IIRC. Having said that, da Stompa will probably have to come down to ~650 points including gear to be worth taking.

 wallygator wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:


The Deffkilla wartrike. I'm a little bit disappointed he's only base S5. Another point of strength would have mde him hit with S8 attacks because of his weapon in CC, which would help immensly.

you're so right with this...
S8 would have made him so much better. I feel that S7 is a strange choice as it is as good as S5 vs most targets(3+ to wound) and still needs the 5+to wound a vehicle.
I hope this S+2 is wrong and we will be welcomed with a SX2 in the codex but i don't think that's going to happen.

Doesn't it reroll wound rolls though? Would basically be a bigger and badder Lightning Claw then. Besides, with 14" movement, 6" advance once per match and 3d6 charge from Ramming Speed you're looking at a reliable T1 charge (assuming Ramming Speed's leak is correct).

Pandabeer wrote:

 wallygator wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:


The Deffkilla wartrike. I'm a little bit disappointed he's only base S5. Another point of strength would have mde him hit with S8 attacks because of his weapon in CC, which would help immensly.

you're so right with this...
S8 would have made him so much better. I feel that S7 is a strange choice as it is as good as S5 vs most targets(3+ to wound) and still needs the 5+to wound a vehicle.
I hope this S+2 is wrong and we will be welcomed with a SX2 in the codex but i don't think that's going to happen.

Doesn't it reroll wound rolls though? Would basically be a bigger and badder Lightning Claw then. Besides, with 14" movement, 6" advance once per match and 3d6 charge from Ramming Speed you're looking at a reliable T1 charge (assuming Ramming Speed's leak is correct).

Hopefully we'll get a relic snagga klaw, I wrote in the speculations thread about it. But if the relic snagga had S+3 AP-3 Dd3 Reroll wounds (so 1 point better S & AP) it'd be a really good upgrade. The reroll wounds does take some sting away from being "only" S7 but orks aren't great against T8 units so the deffkilla hitting at S8 rerolling would be great

missed the reroll to wound from the leak. It would make him better indeed. we'll see soon enough

 wallygator wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:


The Deffkilla wartrike. I'm a little bit disappointed he's only base S5. Another point of strength would have mde him hit with S8 attacks because of his weapon in CC, which would help immensly.

you're so right with this...
S8 would have made him so much better. I feel that S7 is a strange choice as it is as good as S5 vs most targets(3+ to wound) and still needs the 5+to wound a vehicle.
I hope this S+2 is wrong and we will be welcomed with a SX2 in the codex but i don't think that's going to happen.

Not every vehicle is T8 though.

true. and the lesser T vehicles are not that big of a problem for orks. cracking the T8 soaks to much attacks without tankbustas/other S8 tools IMO.
Speaking about tankbustas, i wonder if they got any cheaper or better in the codex, as these guys are my primary AT source. Not that they're bad, but i find them expensive pointwise.

 wallygator wrote:
true. and the lesser T vehicles are not that big of a problem for orks. cracking the T8 soaks to much attacks without tankbustas/other S8 tools IMO.
Speaking about tankbustas, i wonder if they got any cheaper or better in the codex, as these guys are my primary AT source. Not that they're bad, but i find them expensive pointwise.

I'm hoping for a slight points decrease in the form of a Rokkit Launcha points decrease.

Tankbustas are good, but it feels like every other platform you can shove a rokkit launcha onto pays for that one unit's ability to reroll hits.

tneva82 wrote:

 wallygator wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:


The Deffkilla wartrike. I'm a little bit disappointed he's only base S5. Another point of strength would have mde him hit with S8 attacks because of his weapon in CC, which would help immensly.

you're so right with this...
S8 would have made him so much better. I feel that S7 is a strange choice as it is as good as S5 vs most targets(3+ to wound) and still needs the 5+to wound a vehicle.
I hope this S+2 is wrong and we will be welcomed with a SX2 in the codex but i don't think that's going to happen.

Not every vehicle is T8 though.

No, obviously not but T8 is something we struggle with in my experience. And let's not pretend S8 with a reroll would be undesirable against T7 (or T4 for that matter)

And if such a relic does exist in the codex then the warlord trait that gives +1attack and +1strength is going to be real nice to combo it up with

Oh sure it would be nice but then again that would make that weapon basically superior power klaw. I think it's pretty intentional it's S7 for total. For big stuff you get power klaw. Though albeit orks don't have any good vehicle busting h2h anyway. Even with S8 this would be bad vehicle hunter.

mass killsaws in hth is how you get the crump on vehicles

Getting more and more tempted to do a full on Kult of Speed.

Nuffin' but Buggies, Trukks, Fightas, Wagons, Bikes. May not be much cop on the field, but would sure be fun, and look impressive!

 The Phazer wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
Now, are my eyes deceiving me, or do the krew on the new vehicles look a bit heftier than normal Boys, a bit closer to Nob size?

I imagine we'll see scale creep on all new Ork models to try and make them look less short next to Primaris marines. At least you can argue that the natural variation between Orks should generally favour those with the best toys like buggies.

Eh, for me it's actually a good thing, I collect small-scale games these days and have been using Nobs as the basis for my Boys for a while now(regular Boys look a tad daft next to truescale Marines). Using these in GorkaMorka will be an expensive prospect though, since I convert up on-foot versions of all vehicle crew using the same components o_0

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Getting more and more tempted to do a full on Kult of Speed.

Nuffin' but Buggies, Trukks, Fightas, Wagons, Bikes. May not be much cop on the field, but would sure be fun, and look impressive!

I mean, battlewagons with deffrollas is already one of the best non-boyz units in the codex for us, and now they advance and charge? sounds pretty hot to me. I'm planning on having as much of my army crammed into battlewagons as humanly possible and then fill the rest with bikes and buggies.

 Latro_ wrote:
mass killsaws in hth is how you get the crump on vehicles

Problem is no good delivery method for those. Meganobz too slow, too expensive, too soft, struggle to hit and have very few attacks. Characters can't even have and they are expensive per attack and generally don't have much attacks to begin with. Long gone are days where warlord was credible threat to vehicle. Dd3 weapons need tons of attacks to really make a threat.

simple painboy and big mek on bikes are 7 attacks. agree though its not a great pointswise

the_scotsman wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Getting more and more tempted to do a full on Kult of Speed.

Nuffin' but Buggies, Trukks, Fightas, Wagons, Bikes. May not be much cop on the field, but would sure be fun, and look impressive!

I mean, battlewagons with deffrollas is already one of the best non-boyz units in the codex for us, and now they advance and charge? sounds pretty hot to me. I'm planning on having as much of my army crammed into battlewagons as humanly possible and then fill the rest with bikes and buggies.

And that's given me an idea to create passenger inserts for the Battlewagons. Just measure out the interior of the passenger deck, get some thin plasticard type stuff, and pack that shape with as many Boyz as you can. Lift in an out as necessary. Make them look really squidged in. Maybe take a page from the Dark Eldar vehicles, have some Boyz converted up to be hanging off?

 Latro_ wrote:
simple painboy and big mek on bikes are 7 attacks. agree though its not a great pointswise

And that results in 6 wounds vs leman russ if you get to combat...201 pts, doesn't even kill it and barely degrades leman russ IF they can make combat which they might on turn 3-4 once enough chaff has been cleared...

Back to the point "not worried". And leman russ is among softest T8 targets there is for kill saws...

2cp to make a boyz unit 5+ save...really?
'Ard Boyz has always been a 4+....wtf....waste of cp...

man i cant wait for that wartrike boss!

 Vineheart01 wrote:
2cp to make a boyz unit 5+ save...really?
'Ard Boyz has always been a 4+....wtf....waste of cp...

Would you rather pay CP, a thing that you get simply for the list you bring...or actual points?

I am surprised about the 5+ save though.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
2cp to make a boyz unit 5+ save...really?
'Ard Boyz has always been a 4+....wtf....waste of cp...

Would you rather pay CP, a thing that you get simply for the list you bring...or actual points?

I am surprised about the 5+ save though.

CP are a resource just like points. Armies that effectively use points in list creation and CPs during the battle are the armies that win.

It's a total waste of CP which is the same as wasting points on bad units.