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 Amishprn86 wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

 Galef wrote:
No, the hallmark of a FAIR game is when players don't get to take all the toys with no downsides. Where real tactical decisions matter

Yes, because taking a sword on an IG character with terrible melee ability is exactly equal to tactically deep striking a unit into a key position on the map.

It's just natural and completely fair for these things to have identical costs.

To be frank tho, the game is based for Narrative, open, and comp play. There is no way to balance a building/painting hobby game with fluff and comp in mind.

And that is why you are suppose to agree how to play with your opponent.

This is where i would slightly disagree and say that you can run strong fluff lists and do reasonably well in a lot of settings.

See Rumors: 40k FAQ Points Changes & Stratagems:
https://spikeybits.com/2018/09/rumors-40k-faq-points-changes-stratagems.html

Talos will be up +25 points
Agents of Vect Will be once per turn, not once per phase.
CP farming is getting nerfed -no clear idea just yet
Shining Spears getting points increase
Castellan is going to be over 700 points

One person's fluffy list is another person's broken net list. Alaitoc + Rangers = fluffy, but to many, that's the start of a broken list.

 wuestenfux wrote:
See Rumors: 40k FAQ Points Changes & Stratagems:
https://spikeybits.com/2018/09/rumors-40k-faq-points-changes-stratagems.html

Talos will be up +25 points
Agents of Vect Will be once per turn, not once per phase.
CP farming is getting nerfed -no clear idea just yet
Shining Spears getting points increase
Castellan is going to be over 700 points

Why Talos of all things?

 vipoid wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
See Rumors: 40k FAQ Points Changes & Stratagems:
https://spikeybits.com/2018/09/rumors-40k-faq-points-changes-stratagems.html

Talos will be up +25 points
Agents of Vect Will be once per turn, not once per phase.
CP farming is getting nerfed -no clear idea just yet
Shining Spears getting points increase
Castellan is going to be over 700 points

Why Talos of all things?

Agree, i was expecting a small increase, like 5-10pts at the most, but 25? WTF thats almost unplayable, just take 30 Grots instead...... at least most players are only taking 3, no one is spamming 9 and winning with 9......

Shining Spears getting a points increase?
That's fair, but can we get Windriders a decrease to be playable?
As-is, you should be able to get 2 WRs for just over 1 Spear. If Spears go up to about 40ppm, WRs should be >20ppm, or >25ppm with upgraded gun.

-

So GW continues to play whack a mole with the Craftworld codex to keep Ynarri balanced...

I would prefer if Ynarri shining spears had a different cost than Craftworld shining spears. Or place the points increase on the Ynarri HQ's.

Or just change the mechanic entirely, it's a nightmare to balance.

abyrn wrote:
So GW continues to play whack a mole with the Craftworld codex to keep Ynarri balanced...

I would prefer if Ynarri shining spears had a different cost than Craftworld shining spears. Or place the points increase on the Ynarri HQ's.

Or just change the mechanic entirely, it's a nightmare to balance.

I think they should actually just lower the cost of psykers and nerf the psy powers since they have so many that can stack.

No unit will ever be balanced when it can be fortuned, doomed, guided, quickened and concelaed all at the same time. Lower the effects (and points) of those powers.

The probability of Spikey Bits click-bait being correct or even "genuine" rumours is about as high as all-Terminator mono-Grey Knights winning the next Grand Tournament.

The funniest thing is alot of that just sounds like they read the Nova results thread.

Also that's a lot of things getting emergency points increases ahead of CA, which is GW self decreed points rebalancing method with FAQ's only dealing with emergency situations.

 wuestenfux wrote:
See Rumors: 40k FAQ Points Changes & Stratagems:
https://spikeybits.com/2018/09/rumors-40k-faq-points-changes-stratagems.html

Talos will be up +25 points
Agents of Vect Will be once per turn, not once per phase.
CP farming is getting nerfed -no clear idea just yet
Shining Spears getting points increase
Castellan is going to be over 700 points

Nothing about dis cannons for Deldar?

Sunny Side Up wrote:
The probability of Spikey Bits click-bait being correct or even "genuine" rumours is about as high as all-Terminator mono-Grey Knights winning the next Grand Tournament.

Hahahaha, that cracked me up!

Completely and 100% right though. I think i'll wait for a more reputable source.

 chimeara wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
See Rumors: 40k FAQ Points Changes & Stratagems:
https://spikeybits.com/2018/09/rumors-40k-faq-points-changes-stratagems.html

Talos will be up +25 points
Agents of Vect Will be once per turn, not once per phase.
CP farming is getting nerfed -no clear idea just yet
Shining Spears getting points increase
Castellan is going to be over 700 points

Nothing about dis cannons for Deldar?

Its a small rumor, there will be 30+ changes.

Ice_can wrote:


Also that's a lot of things getting emergency points increases ahead of CA, which is GW self decreed points rebalancing method with FAQ's only dealing with emergency situations.

How many units is he suggesting?

As for the points increase, it's so they can "test" them before C.A and then reduce the cost again in C.A. to get people hyped to buy it!

If blasters, ravagers and grotesques don't go up to I have no idea what game GW is looking at.

That being said I'm holding off on judgement as to GWs ability to balance the game until after CA. My guess is they have to hold off on some things that are going to happen in CA so this can't be the fix to end all fixes. Especially since GW is still sending things to printers so most likely the CA stuff was done BEFORE this FAQ...

Well, I'm glad I didn't get a Castellan yet... I really hope they don't nerf it to the ground.

Ice_can wrote:
The funniest thing is alot of that just sounds like they read the Nova results thread.

Also that's a lot of things getting emergency points increases ahead of CA, which is GW self decreed points rebalancing method with FAQ's only dealing with emergency situations.

To be fair, there did end up being points changes in the big FAQ. Sure, not masses of them. But some.

OK, they're never going to completely redo the whole CP generation. As it is, there's a huge divide between people who actually even READ the FAQs. Anyone developing a new formula for CP is in for dissapointment. GW isn't going to go through the effort in explaining a new system.

The simplest solution is keeping CPs in their respective detachment. If it gets addressed at all.

This is GW were talking about. The same ones that though Rule of Three would balance spam.

abyrn wrote:
So GW continues to play whack a mole with the Craftworld codex to keep Ynarri balanced...

I would prefer if Ynarri shining spears had a different cost than Craftworld shining spears. Or place the points increase on the Ynarri HQ's.

Or just change the mechanic entirely, it's a nightmare to balance.

The "whack-a-mole" analogy is quite apt. I won't be able to not think of it like this now.

And agreed, Ynnari just needs a true codex with particular datasheets rather than cherry-picking for the other books.
So you'd have a CWE Spears unit entry and a Ynnari Spears unit entry. Each with their own rules and points.
It's also be a good opportunity to retool SfD

-

Kdash wrote:

Ice_can wrote:


Also that's a lot of things getting emergency points increases ahead of CA, which is GW self decreed points rebalancing method with FAQ's only dealing with emergency situations.

How many units is he suggesting?

As for the points increase, it's so they can "test" them before C.A and then reduce the cost again in C.A. to get people hyped to buy it!

C.A. is most likely done already heading to the printers now or close to it. There is not really any time to get any meaningful tests from the FAQ that could influence C.A. Also, its important for most folks to note that C.A. is probably going to fix a lot of points issues as it is, so this FAQ would only be fixing ones that GW feels they "missed" in C.A. or they are doing an early correction for those units.

bananathug wrote:
If blasters, ravagers and grotesques don't go up to I have no idea what game GW is looking at.

That being said I'm holding off on judgement as to GWs ability to balance the game until after CA. My guess is they have to hold off on some things that are going to happen in CA so this can't be the fix to end all fixes. Especially since GW is still sending things to printers so most likely the CA stuff was done BEFORE this FAQ...

You are more wrong than anyone, Blaster are fine, MELTA needs to go down to Blaster level, there is a reason NO ONE takes Melta and only "some" players takes Blasters (all tournament winning lists DONT take Blasters).


To add, DC should be 20pts, Ravager points are fine, the Dissie at 15pts wll make the 125pt Ravager 140pts, thats perfect, if you go to much over its not even worth playing, b.c you can just take a Reaper and give it +1 Toughness for a better vehicle.

I think one of the things GW should do is say that once an army has its own codex the index data sheets for that army are no longer available in matched play. I know that this will upset people who are using legacy models but this edition change happened more than a year ago. If you can't afford to update your army then just play open or narrative play games. The whole codex/index thing is confusing and adding unneeded complexity to the game at this point.

If you have followed AoS, you know that legacy models are not going to last.

Just wishing that they decide to use a good few pages of CA2018 to reprint all the point values, as otherwise this becomes a mess.

I wish to take unit X, so I check the codex, then check CA2017 in case it was revised, then check the FAQs, in order in case one supersedes another, then check CA2018, just in case.

would actually be something to make CA very useful, an annual adjustment where needed and re-print of all point values

Talos up 25 is to low. It’s gets T7 and 4++ with more or less no effort. That the same stats as a hive tyrant. Has anybody done the math on what it takes to remove 9 talos with t7 and 4++. Either they raise the price in talos with more then 25p or they have to raise the price on other things buffing it to. It’s cheaoer then a carnifex and are twice as good.

Haywire weapons feels to cheap for what they do. 15p for a cannon doing mortal wound on 4+ and a d3 on 6+, that’s in addition to any other damage.. That’s bonkers. 270p for 6 skyweavers shooting 6d6 haywire shots. That is killing anything in the game if it has doom in it. Could almost kill anything even without doom. Should maybe change the wording to “wound vehicles on 2+. If wounding on 6+ doing 1 mortal wound in addition to any other damage). That feels more reasonable for 15p. Even a Heavy venom cannon is 25p and it’s not even close imo.

 Amishprn86 wrote:

bananathug wrote:
If blasters, ravagers and grotesques don't go up to I have no idea what game GW is looking at.

That being said I'm holding off on judgement as to GWs ability to balance the game until after CA. My guess is they have to hold off on some things that are going to happen in CA so this can't be the fix to end all fixes. Especially since GW is still sending things to printers so most likely the CA stuff was done BEFORE this FAQ...

You are more wrong than anyone, Blaster are fine, MELTA needs to go down to Blaster level, there is a reason NO ONE takes Melta and only "some" players takes Blasters (all tournament winning lists DONT take Blasters).


To add, DC should be 20pts, Ravager points are fine, the Dissie at 15pts wll make the 125pt Ravager 140pts, thats perfect, if you go to much over its not even worth playing, b.c you can just take a Reaper and give it +1 Toughness for a better vehicle.

Yeah, blasters should have been dissies. Blasters are cheap but I agree are more of a boogyman than those stupid cannons. I just can't look at the prices of marine weapons and then eldar weapons and keep my thoughts straight yeah, ravagers at 140-150 seems fair.

I think this FAQ will be used to address the stuff they missed in C.A. like the rest of you. Curious what we will be able to learn about what's coming in CA from the FAQ.

leopard wrote:
Just wishing that they decide to use a good few pages of CA2018 to reprint all the point values, as otherwise this becomes a mess.

Not disagreeing, but unfortunately I know this won't happen. If they were to reprint all of the point values in CA2018, they would very likely lose individual codex sales.

SG

 ServiceGames wrote:

leopard wrote:
Just wishing that they decide to use a good few pages of CA2018 to reprint all the point values, as otherwise this becomes a mess.

Not disagreeing, but unfortunately I know this won't happen. If they were to reprint all of the point values in CA2018, they would very likely lose individual codex sales.

SG

Aware its unlikely, mores the pity.

but then I also wish they went back to printing this stuff to be split and stuck in a binder.

and thats not going to happen anytime soon either

jesper77 wrote:
Talos up 25 is to low. It’s gets T7 and 4++ with more or less no effort.

You mean besides consuming its chapter tactic, as well as keeping within 6" of a target that anyone with two functioning neurons is going to snipe out immediately.

jesper77 wrote:
That the same stats as a hive tyrant.

Sure, as long as one ignores all the psychic bs tyrants can do. I'll happily take an increased point cost increase on a Talos if I can Cast 2, Deny 1 and impart a -1 to all psyker rolls for my enemies. Oh and make its buddies immune to morale.

jesper77 wrote:
It’s cheaoer then a carnifex and are twice as good.

Bahahahaha

Oh, you were serious. That's unfortunate. And hilariously inaccurate.

 ServiceGames wrote:

leopard wrote:
Just wishing that they decide to use a good few pages of CA2018 to reprint all the point values, as otherwise this becomes a mess.

Not disagreeing, but unfortunately I know this won't happen. If they were to reprint all of the point values in CA2018, they would very likely lose individual codex sales.

SG

Tobad its not something we can ever test (or would get data on from GW) but I see no reason why points in CA would cost codex sales. The points are useless without the rules which are still limited to the codex.