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The way its written it could be both. Could have been written, though (he) weighing several tonnes it... seeing that its a bit weird noting the weight of a rock, though you're probably right.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/11/24 08:02:08
The whole "There are 2 unknown primarchs and legions we're never gonna tell you about! NYAH! NYAH! " thing gets kinda old.
As is my guess is they we're out into stasis along with their legions as a hedge against a future disaster, like GW sales dropping and needing new forces to boost it again.
Cynical? Sue me...
"I learned the hard way that if you take a stand on any issue, no matter how insignificant, people will line up around the block to kick your ass over it." Jesse "the mind" Ventura.
he knew he had been mistaken to believe it would support HIS mass. Though weighing
several tonnes, IT immediately tipped from position and slid from the wall.
the full stop (period) after 'his mass' and the comma before the 'it' means that the weight descriptor belongs to the IT (being the rock in this case)
sorry, grammar Nazi wants to inspect your papers and all.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Techpriestsupport wrote: The whole "There are 2 unknown primarchs and legions we're never gonna tell you about! NYAH! NYAH! " thing gets kinda old.
As is my guess is they we're out into stasis along with their legions as a hedge against a future disaster, like GW sales dropping and needing new forces to boost it again.
Cynical? Sue me...
the 2 legions were 'expunged' according to the first heretic novel. another theory I've read is its so people can create their own chapters. yet another (of mine) is that they ran out of themes but 18 seems like too strange a number to be left with.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/24 08:23:40
Regarding the two "missing" Legions, isn't there a piece of art of Malcador sat in a chair/throne which happens to feature skulls as part of the design - oh, GW - each of which feature the number of a "missing" Legion in Roman numerals?
Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
Kanluwen wrote: This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.
Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...
tneva82 wrote: You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling.
- No reason to keep this here, unless people want to use it for something...
Again, gw could pulls "DaddE for saw a disaster and held two legions in reserve, obfuscating their existence and placing them and their gear in stasis, against the day when the weakened imperium would need a sudden influx of maximum power reinforcements."
Is it really any harder to swallow than the primaris marines?
"I learned the hard way that if you take a stand on any issue, no matter how insignificant, people will line up around the block to kick your ass over it." Jesse "the mind" Ventura.
Dysartes wrote: Regarding the two "missing" Legions, isn't there a piece of art of Malcador sat in a chair/throne which happens to feature skulls as part of the design - oh, GW - each of which feature the number of a "missing" Legion in Roman numerals?
Yes.
Spoiler:
A little bit of righteous anger now and then is good, actually. Don't trust a person who never gets angry.
Yep, DaddE sure wanted peolle to think they we're eliminated so it'd be a big surprise when they returned miraculously...
"I learned the hard way that if you take a stand on any issue, no matter how insignificant, people will line up around the block to kick your ass over it." Jesse "the mind" Ventura.
I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/11/24 10:43:17
Andersp90 wrote: Unless the process of creating an astartes removes the subdermal veines and sweat glands, I dont see why they shouldn't be able to thermoregulate as normal.
Human thermoregulation isn't perfect either. Under intense heat and physical activity (like a battle in any hot environement) soldiers suffering from hyperthermia and severe dehydration is a more common and debilitating issue than injuries caused by the enemy.
I never said it was. I just argued that comparing a warmblooded meta human with a coldblooded turtle makes little sense..
A fused rib-cage makes thermoregulation significantly more difficult as it traps heat more easily add to that extra muscles and organs and an Astartes body is bound to generate more heat.
A fused ribcage wouldn't make a difference. Because yes, the extra muscle mass wil create more heath - but are they located inside the chest cavity? No..
Aaannnd astartes are wearing armor with built-in air conditioning.
dehydration which would explain why they are described as being extraordinarly foul smelling.
Andersp90 wrote: That is prob the thing I hate the most about the 40k universe. The incredibly inconscient fluff.
For space marines, I head canon these instances as being a result of a sliding scale of how well a marine takes to their implants.
Many reject them, most 'succesful' applicants get some degree of function out of the implants. A rare few get almost perfect function (instead of improved clotting / healing, theirs works in seconds. Instead of a few inches taller they get an extra foot or two.
That is a good point.
Also:
"Most Chapters have existed for thousands of years. During that time, gene-seed belonging to some Chapters has mutated. This has resulted in changes in the exact nature of the artificially cultured organs. Such changes may sometimes make an implant useless. In other circumstances, changes in an organ might reduce its effectiveness or cause strange new effects. Whatever the result, it will affect the entire Chapter – all Space Marines belonging to a Chapter share implants cultured from the same original gene-seed.
As well as mutant implants, many Chapters have lost one or more types of gene-seed due to accident, genetic failure, or some other cause. Very few Chapters therefore possess all nineteen implants."
Andersp90 wrote: Yep, a loving and caring astartes giving a stricken guardsman CPR. That is totally a thing.
They probably wouldn't waste their time with a guardsmen unless there was literally nothing else for them to do, but for a fellow astarte? You bet your ass they would.
I agree, but what are they supposed to do? They can't remove armor to get to the wound.
And like I have already stated, their bodies are built to take care of any injuries. Larraman cells will stop any bleeding save for at fatal wound.
Marines can take their armour off and on without any help, they just normally have servitors or senchals to do it.
We do not know if they can remove their armor themselves without the help of a techpriest or techmarine.
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Plz stop pulling facts out of your ass. Its starting to get old.
And yes, a human can weigh 600+ kg. But they prob wouldent make good astartes...
According to Jes Goodwin who designed them so that’s as good as a fact to me. All these authors claiming otherwise are fools. 7 foot in armour. End of. I see a marine weighing as much as a lean lineman in football terms so 280-300 pound. Same again for armour there about. So the 400kg marks seems reasonable.
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Cars can weigh anywhere from 1,000KG-2,000KG. Each wheel of said car probably has more surface area than the foot of a marine, and cars have four of them. If a marine weighs "several tons" meaning at least two metric tons, a marine would have more than double the ground pressure of even the heaviest modern cars.
I can see a marine weighing 1,000 KG MAX. That is being generous and assuming that the marine himself weighs something like 400 kg and the armor is super heavy (600 kg) and uses servos to assist it's own movement.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/25 00:29:27
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Cars can weigh anywhere from 1,000KG-2,000KG. Each wheel of said car probably has more surface area than the foot of a marine, and cars have four of them. If a marine weighs "several tons" meaning at least two metric tons, a marine would have more than double the ground pressure of even the heaviest modern cars.
I can see a marine weighing 1,000 KG MAX. That is being generous and assuming that the marine himself weighs something like 400 kg and the armor is super heavy (600 kg) and uses servos to assist it's own movement.
The assumption that a material has to be dense/heavy is probably what leads him to the "1000 kg power armor idea".
- and it is simply false.
A suit of PA made of a graphene the thickness of a piece of paper would be all but impervious to kinetic energy projectiles (but would fail against plasma).
If a space marine was 2000 kg, they would be a 4000 plus pound human figure. That is a lot of mass in a very small area and would doom them on anything but the most secure areas of terrain.
If a space marine was 2000 kg, they would be a 4000 plus pound human figure. That is a lot of mass in a very small area and would doom them on anything but the most secure areas of terrain.
In the deathwatch core rulebook it is stated that power armor weighs 180 kg, and terminator armor 400 kg. ¨
As far as I know, those are the only numbers we have.
It is also stated that a marine in PA weighs 500-1000 kg depending on gear.
So an astartes prob clocks in at 320 kg without armor.
Andersp90 wrote: Unless the process of creating an astartes removes the subdermal veines and sweat glands, I dont see why they shouldn't be able to thermoregulate as normal.
Human thermoregulation isn't perfect either. Under intense heat and physical activity (like a battle in any hot environement) soldiers suffering from hyperthermia and severe dehydration is a more common and debilitating issue than injuries caused by the enemy.
I never said it was. I just argued that comparing a warmblooded meta human with a coldblooded turtle makes little sense..
A fused rib-cage makes thermoregulation significantly more difficult as it traps heat more easily add to that extra muscles and organs and an Astartes body is bound to generate more heat.
A fused ribcage wouldn't make a difference. Because yes, the extra muscle mass wil create more heath - but are they located inside the chest cavity? No..
Aaannnd astartes are wearing armor with built-in air conditioning.
dehydration which would explain why they are described as being extraordinarly foul smelling.
Andersp90 wrote: That is prob the thing I hate the most about the 40k universe. The incredibly inconscient fluff.
For space marines, I head canon these instances as being a result of a sliding scale of how well a marine takes to their implants.
Many reject them, most 'succesful' applicants get some degree of function out of the implants. A rare few get almost perfect function (instead of improved clotting / healing, theirs works in seconds. Instead of a few inches taller they get an extra foot or two.
That is a good point.
Also:
"Most Chapters have existed for thousands of years. During that time, gene-seed belonging to some Chapters has mutated. This has resulted in changes in the exact nature of the artificially cultured organs. Such changes may sometimes make an implant useless. In other circumstances, changes in an organ might reduce its effectiveness or cause strange new effects. Whatever the result, it will affect the entire Chapter – all Space Marines belonging to a Chapter share implants cultured from the same original gene-seed.
As well as mutant implants, many Chapters have lost one or more types of gene-seed due to accident, genetic failure, or some other cause. Very few Chapters therefore possess all nineteen implants."
Andersp90 wrote: Yep, a loving and caring astartes giving a stricken guardsman CPR. That is totally a thing.
They probably wouldn't waste their time with a guardsmen unless there was literally nothing else for them to do, but for a fellow astarte? You bet your ass they would.
I agree, but what are they supposed to do? They can't remove armor to get to the wound.
And like I have already stated, their bodies are built to take care of any injuries. Larraman cells will stop any bleeding save for at fatal wound.
Marines can take their armour off and on without any help, they just normally have servitors or senchals to do it.
We do not know if they can remove their armor themselves without the help of a techpriest or techmarine.
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Plz stop pulling facts out of your ass. Its starting to get old.
And yes, a human can weigh 600+ kg. But they prob wouldent make good astartes...
600kg is a lot of a fatty, but marines a massive, they are probably as wide as that fatty but made of muscle
I was having a discussion I'm not just trying contradicting you cause its fun, what they actually weigh is ridiculously trivial, we only argue things like this because its fun to theorise. Yeah seems like its okay for you to use facts, stop acting like an idiot.
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Cars can weigh anywhere from 1,000KG-2,000KG. Each wheel of said car probably has more surface area than the foot of a marine, and cars have four of them. If a marine weighs "several tons" meaning at least two metric tons, a marine would have more than double the ground pressure of even the heaviest modern cars.
I can see a marine weighing 1,000 KG MAX. That is being generous and assuming that the marine himself weighs something like 400 kg and the armor is super heavy (600 kg) and uses servos to assist it's own movement.
The assumption that a material has to be dense/heavy is probably what leads him to the "1000 kg power armor idea".
- and it is simply false.
A suit of PA made of a graphene the thickness of a piece of paper would be all but impervious to kinetic energy projectiles (but would fail against plasma).
It isn't made of graphene though, only the plates are made of ceremite, there is still a lot of metal etc. Ceremite is a type of ceramic but its obviously a dense ceramic as its stops penetrations from projectiles so its obviously dense and very heavy. Graphene is quite new (well the new successful examples), so GW would have never of thought to use that as the basis for power armour.
This message was edited 10 times. Last update was at 2018/11/25 09:07:50
Actually, ceramic makes sense for space marine armor. We have bullet resistant ceramics today that go into ballistic vests. Most ceramics also have an extremely high specific heat, which means they would be good at resisting heat transfer and be a good armor against things like plasma weapons.
I am assuming "ceramite" is some hitherto undiscovered ceramic that is extremely light, bullet resistant, and has a ridiculously high specific heat.
That is actually a lot cooler than "adamantium" a naturally occurring element that supposedly exists and is lighter and stronger than titanium, yet is not on the periodic table of elements .
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/25 12:12:29
Andersp90 wrote: Unless the process of creating an astartes removes the subdermal veines and sweat glands, I dont see why they shouldn't be able to thermoregulate as normal.
Human thermoregulation isn't perfect either. Under intense heat and physical activity (like a battle in any hot environement) soldiers suffering from hyperthermia and severe dehydration is a more common and debilitating issue than injuries caused by the enemy.
I never said it was. I just argued that comparing a warmblooded meta human with a coldblooded turtle makes little sense..
A fused rib-cage makes thermoregulation significantly more difficult as it traps heat more easily add to that extra muscles and organs and an Astartes body is bound to generate more heat.
A fused ribcage wouldn't make a difference. Because yes, the extra muscle mass wil create more heath - but are they located inside the chest cavity? No..
Aaannnd astartes are wearing armor with built-in air conditioning.
dehydration which would explain why they are described as being extraordinarly foul smelling.
Andersp90 wrote: That is prob the thing I hate the most about the 40k universe. The incredibly inconscient fluff.
For space marines, I head canon these instances as being a result of a sliding scale of how well a marine takes to their implants.
Many reject them, most 'succesful' applicants get some degree of function out of the implants. A rare few get almost perfect function (instead of improved clotting / healing, theirs works in seconds. Instead of a few inches taller they get an extra foot or two.
That is a good point.
Also:
"Most Chapters have existed for thousands of years. During that time, gene-seed belonging to some Chapters has mutated. This has resulted in changes in the exact nature of the artificially cultured organs. Such changes may sometimes make an implant useless. In other circumstances, changes in an organ might reduce its effectiveness or cause strange new effects. Whatever the result, it will affect the entire Chapter – all Space Marines belonging to a Chapter share implants cultured from the same original gene-seed.
As well as mutant implants, many Chapters have lost one or more types of gene-seed due to accident, genetic failure, or some other cause. Very few Chapters therefore possess all nineteen implants."
Andersp90 wrote: Yep, a loving and caring astartes giving a stricken guardsman CPR. That is totally a thing.
They probably wouldn't waste their time with a guardsmen unless there was literally nothing else for them to do, but for a fellow astarte? You bet your ass they would.
I agree, but what are they supposed to do? They can't remove armor to get to the wound.
And like I have already stated, their bodies are built to take care of any injuries. Larraman cells will stop any bleeding save for at fatal wound.
Marines can take their armour off and on without any help, they just normally have servitors or senchals to do it.
We do not know if they can remove their armor themselves without the help of a techpriest or techmarine.
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Plz stop pulling facts out of your ass. Its starting to get old.
And yes, a human can weigh 600+ kg. But they prob wouldent make good astartes...
600kg is a lot of a fatty, but marines a massive, they are probably as wide as that fatty but made of muscle
I was having a discussion I'm not just trying contradicting you cause its fun, what they actually weigh is ridiculously trivial, we only argue things like this because its fun to theorise. Yeah seems like its okay for you to use facts, stop acting like an idiot.
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Cars can weigh anywhere from 1,000KG-2,000KG. Each wheel of said car probably has more surface area than the foot of a marine, and cars have four of them. If a marine weighs "several tons" meaning at least two metric tons, a marine would have more than double the ground pressure of even the heaviest modern cars.
I can see a marine weighing 1,000 KG MAX. That is being generous and assuming that the marine himself weighs something like 400 kg and the armor is super heavy (600 kg) and uses servos to assist it's own movement.
The assumption that a material has to be dense/heavy is probably what leads him to the "1000 kg power armor idea".
- and it is simply false.
A suit of PA made of a graphene the thickness of a piece of paper would be all but impervious to kinetic energy projectiles (but would fail against plasma).
It isn't made of graphene though, only the plates are made of ceremite, there is still a lot of metal etc. Ceremite is a type of ceramic but its obviously a dense ceramic as its stops penetrations from projectiles so its obviously dense and very heavy. Graphene is quite new (well the new successful examples), so GW would have never of thought to use that as the basis for power armour.
I used graphene as an example to show you that a material can be incredibly stong and light at the same time.
In the deathwatch core rulebook it is stated that power armor weighs 180 kg, and terminator armor 400 kg. ¨
As far as I know, those are the only numbers we have.
It is also stated that a marine in PA weighs 500-1000 kg depending on gear.
So an astartes prob clocks in at 320 kg without armor.
Each space marine only producing two sets of progenoids, it just doesn't seem like that would be enough to keep a chapter going what with casualties that you can't get them from, failed implants, etc.
"I learned the hard way that if you take a stand on any issue, no matter how insignificant, people will line up around the block to kick your ass over it." Jesse "the mind" Ventura.
w1zard wrote: Actually, ceramic makes sense for space marine armor. We have bullet resistant ceramics today that go into ballistic vests. Most ceramics also have an extremely high specific heat, which means they would be good at resisting heat transfer and be a good armor against things like plasma weapons.
I am assuming "ceramite" is some hitherto undiscovered ceramic that is extremely light, bullet resistant, and has a ridiculously high specific heat.
That is actually a lot cooler than "adamantium" a naturally occurring element that supposedly exists and is lighter and stronger than titanium, yet is not on the periodic table of elements .
adamantium its perfectly plausible that a new element could be found that is a combination of current elements, as for a a new element probably unlikely but not impossible.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/11/25 15:29:56
The silly side of orks (it should be turned down a touch)
Basically anything turned up to 11 would be turned down to 8 or 9 if I were in charge, too many things have become over the top caricatures of themselves
The silly side of orks (it should be turned down a touch)
Basically anything turned up to 11 would be turned down to 8 or 9 if I were in charge, too many things have become over the top caricatures of themselves
Orks can't get more silly for me, that's why I collect them.
w1zard wrote: Actually, ceramic makes sense for space marine armor. We have bullet resistant ceramics today that go into ballistic vests. Most ceramics also have an extremely high specific heat, which means they would be good at resisting heat transfer and be a good armor against things like plasma weapons.
I am assuming "ceramite" is some hitherto undiscovered ceramic that is extremely light, bullet resistant, and has a ridiculously high specific heat.
That is actually a lot cooler than "adamantium" a naturally occurring element that supposedly exists and is lighter and stronger than titanium, yet is not on the periodic table of elements .
adamantium its perfectly plausible that a new element could be found that is a combination of current elements, as for a a new element probably unlikely but not impossible.
a combination of elements would be a compound, not an element. Unless you meant properties of the elements?
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Cars can weigh anywhere from 1,000KG-2,000KG. Each wheel of said car probably has more surface area than the foot of a marine, and cars have four of them. If a marine weighs "several tons" meaning at least two metric tons, a marine would have more than double the ground pressure of even the heaviest modern cars.
I can see a marine weighing 1,000 KG MAX. That is being generous and assuming that the marine himself weighs something like 400 kg and the armor is super heavy (600 kg) and uses servos to assist it's own movement.
The assumption that a material has to be dense/heavy is probably what leads him to the "1000 kg power armor idea".
- and it is simply false.
A suit of PA made of a graphene the thickness of a piece of paper would be all but impervious to kinetic energy projectiles (but would fail against plasma).
Graphene the thickness of a piece of paper would be garbage armor and useless because we have a word for graphene the thickness of paper, it's called graphite. Graphene is special because of its structure at the nanoscale-scale makes it a highly useful nanomaterial because it's literally an atom thick. It is however useless for body armor applications because numerous layers of graphene is just graphite. It wouldn't even stop a sledgehammer, much less a bullet. You also NEED density and weight to get proper armor that will absorb kinetic energy. Light armor is worthless against something like autocannon or bolter fire, as it will likely demolish internal systems or wreck the wearer's body. Or falling from high altitude. Authors often describe marines as ridiculously heavy, which makes sense in all context. Especially given that FFG's weights are just as idiotic and braindead as FW's, and are obviously not true given events in the novels.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/11/25 23:36:35
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
w1zard wrote: I always thought a space marine weighed about 400-500KG in armor. Weighing several tons would mean they would sink into whatever ground they were standing on unless it was metal or concrete.
Its more like 1000kg + a car weighs more than that and apart from the engine its mostly frame, power armour is probably denser and the material is denser so I'd say 800kg-1200kg. Sinking into the ground wouldn't matter as their strength would mitigate that, elephants seem to do just fine, they are on 4 legs but also weigh twice as much than your average car. The heaviest man was 600kg+ so I think an astartes would weigh much more than 400kg-500kg without armour, especially with all that reinforced bone and dense fibre bundles. Plus we'd also need to know the height of an astartes which has varyied from 7.8 - 10 feet.
Cars can weigh anywhere from 1,000KG-2,000KG. Each wheel of said car probably has more surface area than the foot of a marine, and cars have four of them. If a marine weighs "several tons" meaning at least two metric tons, a marine would have more than double the ground pressure of even the heaviest modern cars.
I can see a marine weighing 1,000 KG MAX. That is being generous and assuming that the marine himself weighs something like 400 kg and the armor is super heavy (600 kg) and uses servos to assist it's own movement.
The assumption that a material has to be dense/heavy is probably what leads him to the "1000 kg power armor idea".
- and it is simply false.
A suit of PA made of a graphene the thickness of a piece of paper would be all but impervious to kinetic energy projectiles (but would fail against plasma).
Graphene the thickness of a piece of paper would be garbage armor and useless because we have a word for graphene the thickness of paper, it's called graphite. Graphene is special because of its structure at the nanoscale-scale makes it a highly useful nanomaterial because it's literally an atom thick. It is however useless for body armor applications because numerous layers of graphene is just graphite. It wouldn't even stop a sledgehammer, much less a bullet. You also NEED density and weight to get proper armor that will absorb kinetic energy. Light armor is worthless against something like autocannon or bolter fire, as it will likely demolish internal systems or wreck the wearer's body. Or falling from high altitude. Authors often describe marines as ridiculously heavy, which makes sense in all context. Especially given that FFG's weights are just as idiotic and braindead as FW's, and are obviously not true given events in the novels.
I'm pretty sure that a matrix of graphene layered with ceramite(or whatever special material is)would be an excellent kinetic & directed energy dissapator. we dont even have a roughly practical understanding of how power armour actually works and its innermost workings(physics-wise).
But either way a marine in armour is heavy.
On the subject of Power Armor, it's been mentionned that a Space Marine with a "dead armor", when the generator pack of a power breaks down and all servo-motors are innactive, struggles to move around and finds it very difficult to do so. Some design seem to be able to completely trap a Space Marine if they aren't powered. It happened to a Black Templar on Hellreach. A Sister is basically completely trap in an innactive power armor. If a Space Marine struggles to move around and is heavily weight down by an inactive armor, it must be quite heavy and downright impossible for a woman to carry around. This leaves me to wonder how Power Armors interract with the user to generate strength.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/26 02:14:43
Heresy World Eaters/Emperors Children 
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