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Deff koptas are pricey ones though. I did mine from land speeder stosm and plasticard

 IronSlug wrote:
Bonus question : As I read it, you roll for the SAG strength before firing the weapon, so before choosing a target, am I right ?

The answer is in the rulebook, page 5.

1) Choose Unit to Shoot With
2) Choose Targets
3) Choose Ranged Weapon

So you pick your target first, then you roll for Strength.

Aren't baby squigoths still decent? Haven't played with them in about a year so Idk if they got hit with a nerf recently.

Babysquigs seem decent, 165pts for a T7 18W 4+ save model that moves 10/8/6" and allows its 10 passengers to keep shooting while it mauls things. Lacks a heavy weapon worth using though, only has kannon/lobba/zzap access and can opt to not take one

Comparatively to the gargsquig, its roughly 3 squigs per gargsquig in points, but the gargsquig will pulverize anything it charges and it has a lot of guns on top of the 20 passengers while the squigs just have the 10 passengers and dont want to charge big things. Even the weakest gargsquig is as strong as the full strength squig, though its WS dropped so technically a little bit weaker.

But, i just hate the fething model for the squig. Gargsquig is gorgeous, regular squig is fugly...

ya they're pretty ugly. How often do Garg squigs even survive long enough to charge something these days? I feel like they would just get melted.

For me, usually it does, but my area doesnt have any macro weapons. At all. Only supers i see arent using macros.
I dont think anybody owns a Titan. Only macro weapon im aware of in my area is my ta'unar's big shoulder guns, which im not even using because that thing is horrible atm.

Probably the reason i have so much fun with it because it actually takes focus to kill it w/o macros.

True haha. do forgeworld models gain klan kulturs? I know the titans won't, but if the little squiggy's did that could make them decent.

I'm deciding how to model a Bonebreaka, and would like to know how peeps have been equipping theirs. As a base, it's a BW with a special deff rolla (the Bonebreaka Ram) and an 'ard case - what else is worthwhile for this vehicle, which presumably spends games in the enemy's face, ramming stuff as much as possible?

- a Killkannon looks tempting, as the short range doesn't matter and there's no troop-carrying penalty. No other big gun instead?
- big shootas would usually be wasted, or are they useful as screen shredders?

Anything from the BW Equipment list?
- Grot Rigger does look useful, unless the Bonebreaka is expected to die in the first few turns?
- the Claw or Ball do buff melee combat, but might be unnecessary?
- Is the Lobba worth the points cost for the fun ability to shoot over obstacles and occasionally hit something?

Any other thoughts? I can probably magnetize most 'sometimes useful' options.

 Clang wrote:
I'm deciding how to model a Bonebreaka, and would like to know how peeps have been equipping theirs. As a base, it's a BW with a special deff rolla (the Bonebreaka Ram) and an 'ard case - what else is worthwhile for this vehicle, which presumably spends games in the enemy's face, ramming stuff as much as possible?

- a Killkannon looks tempting, as the short range doesn't matter and there's no troop-carrying penalty. No other big gun instead?
- big shootas would usually be wasted, or are they useful as screen shredders?

Anything from the BW Equipment list?
- Grot Rigger does look useful, unless the Bonebreaka is expected to die in the first few turns?
- the Claw or Ball do buff melee combat, but might be unnecessary?
- Is the Lobba worth the points cost for the fun ability to shoot over obstacles and occasionally hit something?

Any other thoughts? I can probably magnetize most 'sometimes useful' options.

Big Shootas don't even need magnets really. But they're not completely useless, Evil Sunz can fire at full BS even after advancing. That said, if you want to keep them at the most competitive, don't take any guns at all. Killkannon is the best big gun but it's heavy so you probably don't get to fire it. It's "only" 15 points so killing a marine is going to pay it back but I don't think it's a competitive choice. The turret does make the Bonebreaka look absolutely bitchin' so I might take it at least sometimes. Incidentally I'm also building my Bonebreakas at the moment.

There's no need to glue/magnetize the big shootas or the turret, just use gravity.

I always play the BWs/Bonebreakas with no weapons, just the rollas.

Since I play Evil Sunz I put 4 big shootas on mine, but that's mostly because I like rolling some dice. Realistically speaking you're getting 1 round of shooting with them, that's not worth 20 points. I would avoid the killkannon since it's a heavy weapon and you should be advancing. The zzap gun and lobba are plain just not good enough. Just build the rest of you list and if you have some extra points left over then start chucking big shootas on them I'd say, or a grot rigger I guess since they're the same amount of points. I'd just model the grot rigger on the vehicle anyway since he looks cool

So it's probably best to run them naked, but I hope that we get some point drops on the big shootas in the March FAQ since stuff like heavy stubbers dropped to 2 points.

I usually have 4 bigshootas and the killkannon on my bonebreaka but i could understand people not putting any guns on it, since thats a fair bit of points that wont be doing much if you advance (and now that we have a waaaagh that works on vehicles, advancing it is pretty easy to think about). Killkannon doesnt neuter the transport capacity, i could be wrong on the stock BW but the bonebreaka/gunwagon doesnt.
I just love the look of the dang thing with full gear on it. I have one assembled/primed (with the annoying to paint around bits not glued on like the 'ard case) and even flat black it looks sexy.

FW models did get kultures, its in the faq that dropped day1-2 of the codex. Supers have to have either the 3-5 LoW detachment or the Command detachment to get kultures though, as the single LoW slot aux slot specifically denies it. Oh no an ork player has to use 3 more HQs to get his super kulture rules? oh...oh thats SO hard to do! *cough*

Thanks, guys - that's the Xmas holiday modelling project sorted out then

I was puzzled by your references to not firing kannons etc while advancing - have I misunderstood the BW's Mobile Fortress 'this model ignores the penalty for moving and firing heavy weapons' rule?

 Clang wrote:
Thanks, guys - that's the Xmas holiday modelling project sorted out then

I was puzzled by your references to not firing kannons etc while advancing - have I misunderstood the BW's Mobile Fortress 'this model ignores the penalty for moving and firing heavy weapons' rule?

Well, the killkannon is heavy and all mobile fortress does is not give you the -1 to hit for moving and shooting with a heavy weapon. It doesn't change it to an assault weapon, which is the only type of weapon that you can advance and shoot with.

Mobile Fortress is MOVING and firing weapons, Advance is different.
You cannot normally fire anything except Assault weapons when you advance, and they fire at -1 to hit.
Mobile Fortress is specifically talking about just regular moving and firing, which is heavy weapons. Still cant fire heavy if you advance.
Killkannons are pretty good right now imo, theyre FINALLY priced right, but are expensive enough to justify leaving them off the bonebreaka.

Wagons are pretty fast but i find im often JUUUUST shy of a "safe" charge range if i never advance.

On topic of Mobile Fortress....is there ANY rules that it actually transfers to its occupants other than Freeboota +1 to hit when it goes off? I swear everything that should work has a stipulation where "Nope, open top no workie" like Mobile Fortress does (in the faq anyway dunno why they didnt put that in the stupid codex when it was faq'd in the index and refaq'd in the post-release faq)

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Mobile Fortress is MOVING and firing weapons, Advance is different.
You cannot normally fire anything except Assault weapons when you advance, and they fire at -1 to hit.
Mobile Fortress is specifically talking about just regular moving and firing, which is heavy weapons. Still cant fire heavy if you advance.
Killkannons are pretty good right now imo, theyre FINALLY priced right, but are expensive enough to justify leaving them off the bonebreaka.

Wagons are pretty fast but i find im often JUUUUST shy of a "safe" charge range if i never advance.

On topic of Mobile Fortress....is there ANY rules that it actually transfers to its occupants other than Freeboota +1 to hit when it goes off? I swear everything that should work has a stipulation where "Nope, open top no workie" like Mobile Fortress does (in the faq anyway dunno why they didnt put that in the stupid codex when it was faq'd in the index and refaq'd in the post-release faq)

Sadly, I don't think there is anything else, which kinda sucks because it'd be great if we could have our old dakka bunkers of old, but as is, there's no reason to put guys like lootas or tankbustas into battlewagons when you're gimping yourself from using your shooting stratagems.

Ah, Mobile Fortress refers to Moving only, not moving in general :( Thanks.

So then yeah, a Bonebreaka ain't going to be shooting unless it has no reason to advance, which you'd hope isn't often, coz it wants to spend the whole game ramming stuff if possible.

I'm still going to model a killkannon turret though, even if it will be left off for most games...

 Clang wrote:
Ah, Mobile Fortress refers to Moving only, not moving in general :( Thanks.

So then yeah, a Bonebreaka ain't going to be shooting unless it has no reason to advance, which you'd hope isn't often, coz it wants to spend the whole game ramming stuff if possible.

I'm still going to model a killkannon turret though, even if it will be left off for most games...

Go for it! It's an easy magnetisation. I'd reccomend you magnetise the deff rolla as well (just put magnets instead of the plastic nubs that fit into the actual vehicle) so you have all your options. Like that, you can run it as a gunwagon as well should you wish. And with running a risk of sounding like a broken record, magnetise the actual guns going into the turret as well because come next FAQ/CA or 9th maybe the zzap gun is amazing. It's a lot easier to do all that now than breaking it apart and fixing it later.

Bonebreaka here gains four big shoota, simply because they are reasonably cheap assault weapons so don't slow the thing down, while giving it some ranged option on the way in, with enough shots to get past the rubbish BS, maybe.

other weapons either slow it down or have a rate of fire too low to be worth the cost.

can see the advantage to having no guns as well




Automatically Appended Next Post:

PiñaColada wrote:

 Clang wrote:
Ah, Mobile Fortress refers to Moving only, not moving in general :( Thanks.

So then yeah, a Bonebreaka ain't going to be shooting unless it has no reason to advance, which you'd hope isn't often, coz it wants to spend the whole game ramming stuff if possible.

I'm still going to model a killkannon turret though, even if it will be left off for most games...

Go for it! It's an easy magnetisation. I'd reccomend you magnetise the deff rolla as well (just put magnets instead of the plastic nubs that fit into the actual vehicle) so you have all your options. Like that, you can run it as a gunwagon as well should you wish. And with running a risk of sounding like a broken record, magnetise the actual guns going into the turret as well because come next FAQ/CA or 9th maybe the zzap gun is amazing. It's a lot easier to do all that now than breaking it apart and fixing it later.

mine doesn't have a single magnet...

the rolla just clips into place, the ram will as well if you cut a bit off the mounting pins, the other turrets etc will just sit in place, option to stick a bit of ballast on the base of them.

also found if you don't glue the lid on the main turret the other guns can be slotted in and out easily enough as well

 Weazel wrote:

 Clang wrote:
I'm deciding how to model a Bonebreaka, and would like to know how peeps have been equipping theirs. As a base, it's a BW with a special deff rolla (the Bonebreaka Ram) and an 'ard case - what else is worthwhile for this vehicle, which presumably spends games in the enemy's face, ramming stuff as much as possible?

- a Killkannon looks tempting, as the short range doesn't matter and there's no troop-carrying penalty. No other big gun instead?
- big shootas would usually be wasted, or are they useful as screen shredders?

Anything from the BW Equipment list?
- Grot Rigger does look useful, unless the Bonebreaka is expected to die in the first few turns?
- the Claw or Ball do buff melee combat, but might be unnecessary?
- Is the Lobba worth the points cost for the fun ability to shoot over obstacles and occasionally hit something?

Any other thoughts? I can probably magnetize most 'sometimes useful' options.

Big Shootas don't even need magnets really. But they're not completely useless, Evil Sunz can fire at full BS even after advancing. That said, if you want to keep them at the most competitive, don't take any guns at all. Killkannon is the best big gun but it's heavy so you probably don't get to fire it. It's "only" 15 points so killing a marine is going to pay it back but I don't think it's a competitive choice. The turret does make the Bonebreaka look absolutely bitchin' so I might take it at least sometimes. Incidentally I'm also building my Bonebreakas at the moment.

Killkannon might be worth considering as a fallback deterrent if you're going to tellyport the Breaka in (so it gets to fire at least once).

Building out my half of the Team Tournament for LVO. Do you think taking two units of Tankbustas is too "all in" if my partner goes for chaff-clear via Khorne daemons?

I'm hoping that the Bad Moons reroll 1's will help with accuracy against non-Vehicle armor, especially when combined with more dakka and showin' off.

Had an experimental game tonight trying out things I'd not used so far, namely lootas and battlewagons.
I was up against a strong Tau gunline, including a riptide, and we played a new mission from chapter approved where there are 5 prepositioned objectives and every turn one randomly becomes 2 vps if you're on it.

Orks won convincingly 20 - 7

I played an evil sun battalion with 2 mobs of 20 Boyz in battlewagons with dethrollas, one mob of 30 for da jump, a footslogging Warboss and a kff big mek on bike. I paired it up with a spearhead of Bad moons containing a warphead, 2 units of 12 grots, 10 lootas and a couple of smasha gunz.

For 1500 points it's not terribly optimised, but I wanted to try out the loota bomb, particularly to see how resilient it is, and it surprised me somewhat. Turn one I da jumped the lootas just shy of half way up the board, and ran some grots just ahead of them in a building. Even with more dakka, and showing off, their shooting was a bit disappointing, but it definitely had potential.

What really caught my eye was when it came to the tau shooting phase it took his entire army's shooting to kill these 10 lootas and their grot screens. I deliberately ran 2 units of 12 grots, so that I would minimise the effects of moral, but afterwards we reckoned that a unit of 25 lootas would be truly fearsome. Even with a modest grot screen, I would have had over 15 left for the next round, by which time he'd have more problems than just lootas. This experience demonstrated that whilst cp heavy and dependent, they could be very survivable, and still kick out a bunch of dakka. They'd definitely benefit from having a more dedicated list though.

The Evil sunz were absolutely stunning in assault, dropping in from teleporta and da jump, combined with the battlewagons unloading and charging basically meant I mashed up his gunline barring the riptide, whilst continuing to score objectives. Sadly we only made it to turn 4, but by then the ork lead was insurmountable, and only by tabling me could he have won.

We both had a fun game, tau are still filth when it comes to gun line shooting, but finally it looks like orks have the tools to get in and wreck face.

Seems like he should have ignored the 10 lootas completely.

I'm surprised he wasn't more worried about the boyz and battlewagons.

 ajax_xaja wrote:
Building out my half of the Team Tournament for LVO. Do you think taking two units of Tankbustas is too "all in" if my partner goes for chaff-clear via Khorne daemons?

I'm hoping that the Bad Moons reroll 1's will help with accuracy against non-Vehicle armor, especially when combined with more dakka and showin' off.

Spoiler:

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Orks) ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Clan Kultur: Bad Moons

+ HQ +

Kaptin Badrukk

Weirdboy : 3. Da Jump, Da Best Armour Teef Can Buy, Scorched Gitbonez, Warlord

+ Troops +

Boyz
. Boss Nob: Power Klaw, Slugga
. 29x Ork Boy W/ Shoota

Gretchin: 10x Gretchin

Gretchin: 10x Gretchin

+ Elites +

Tankbustas
. Boss Nob: Rokkit Launcha
. 8x Tankbusta: 8x Rokkit Launcha

Tankbustas
. Boss Nob: Rokkit Launcha
. 9x Tankbusta: 9x Rokkit Launcha

+ Fast Attack +

Shokkjump Dragstas
. Shokkjump Dragstas: Rokkit Launcha

+ Dedicated Transport +

Trukk: Big Shoota

Trukk: Big Shoota

++ Total: [49 PL, 1000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

Gotta be honest, I'd be worried putting that many points into trukkbustas at 1k (though if you know exactly what your ally brings I guess it's at 2k). I guess one of the risks you're running is if you're facing an IK is that they'll pop both trukks quite easily and then the tankbustas are really exposed. Though that can be somewhat mitigated by keeping all your grots near the trukks at the start of the game so if you don't get first turn and they blow up you trukk you can jump the tankbustas out behind the grots and use the shield strat. I'm just wondering if you can switch out one of the trukkbusta squads for some mek gunz. I'd argue that tankbustas might be slight overkill in their statline against some smaller, light vehicles such as Dark Eldar, at the same time you need anti-tank against superheavies..

Switching out the smaller trukkbusta squad nets you 217 points. (9x17 & 64) For that you could get 3 Smasha guns, 2 traktor kannons and fill up your remaining tankbustas squad with two more tankbustas. The smasha guns are pretty good at pulling double-duty if you're facing an army that doesn't have as many vehicles since they still have a fair amount of shots and can target something a bit more elite. Traktor kannons are handy to have just to negate some negative to hit modifiers without having to disembark your tankbustas and then spend CPs on them. Mek guns are also pretty handy to just take up space in your backfield, so holding objectives and deepstrike denying, not to mention the fact that they're individual units so they're much more resistant to superheavies. Might be something to consider..

I'm not sure how capable Khorne daemons are of a T1 charge but nothing in your army really screams long range. I'm guessing you'll be da jumping the boyz T1. What's the reasoning behind badrukk?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
By the way, how are people playing the Megatrakk Scrapjets now? Are you playing with one big shoota firing at BS4 and the other at BS5 or both at BS4?

 JimOnMars wrote:
Seems like he should have ignored the 10 lootas completely.

I'm surprised he wasn't more worried about the boyz and battlewagons.

He wanted to shut down pretty much my only shooting threat, and because of the nature of the game turn one basically meant me hunkering on my objectives to score points. The lootas were definitely his best target then.
Turn 2 I advanced up the board, but in such a way he only had one target, an Ard top battlewagon protected by kff which weathered the limited storm of fire very well. Turn 3 was me holding 3 objectives and challenging the 2 in his deployment zone. As my advance had forced him to edge back off he only had screens of drones and some firewarriors holding these and with two battlewagons of boys, teleporting meganobz and da jumping boyz he basically melted everything bar his riptide and suits. I played totally to the objectives and aimed at wiping out his numerous bodies to contest objectives.

I'd built such a lead that with only one turn left, he'd have had to try and kill my remaining units, which probably would have only been a handful by then. He could have done it, but I would have made him work for it.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/989097-Just%20before%20turn%202%20shennigans.html

The photo shows the end of movement on turn 3, just about to charge the first battlewagon into the centre mass loaded with Boyz, the meganobz charging into wipe out the drones and steal the objective, the mob of 30 da jumped Boyz at the top of the screen multi charging drones and firewarriors to knock them off their objective, the zhardsnark model was proxying as my big mek on bike with kff who's scoring the middle objective, and the tall building centre right is where my lootas and grots used to be. My warphead, and smasha guns are scoring my backfield objective.
By the end of this turn there were no more firewarriors by the riptide but my entire boy squad was blown away, and there were no more drones and only 4 meganobz on the other objective. They withstood an absolute storm of pulse rifle fire, much to my OPs frustration. The first battle wagon was blown up, and all the Boyz inside were whittled down, but still functioning ready to charge turn 4 backed up with the Boyz and battle wagon following behind.
I had no command points left by this stage.

 ajax_xaja wrote:
Building out my half of the Team Tournament for LVO. Do you think taking two units of Tankbustas is too "all in" if my partner goes for chaff-clear via Khorne daemons?

I'm hoping that the Bad Moons reroll 1's will help with accuracy against non-Vehicle armor, especially when combined with more dakka and showin' off.

Spoiler:

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Orks) ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Clan Kultur: Bad Moons

+ HQ +

Kaptin Badrukk

Weirdboy : 3. Da Jump, Da Best Armour Teef Can Buy, Scorched Gitbonez, Warlord

+ Troops +

Boyz
. Boss Nob: Power Klaw, Slugga
. 29x Ork Boy W/ Shoota

Gretchin: 10x Gretchin

Gretchin: 10x Gretchin

+ Elites +

Tankbustas
. Boss Nob: Rokkit Launcha
. 8x Tankbusta: 8x Rokkit Launcha

Tankbustas
. Boss Nob: Rokkit Launcha
. 9x Tankbusta: 9x Rokkit Launcha

+ Fast Attack +

Shokkjump Dragstas
. Shokkjump Dragstas: Rokkit Launcha

+ Dedicated Transport +

Trukk: Big Shoota

Trukk: Big Shoota

++ Total: [49 PL, 1000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

curious, why badrukk? I mean he basically has bad moonz trait slapped on by default even though hes a freeboota not a badmoon but hes not all that great imo.

Also i can attest the badmoonz reroll 1 can be amazing. I can count on my hands the amount of times in 6 games ive had a shooting attack whiff (not talking saves being good talking my ability to HIT being bad), in fact ive even had a few extreme cases where i somehow had more KMB hits than i even had shots...lol...

 Nym wrote:

 IronSlug wrote:
Bonus question : As I read it, you roll for the SAG strength before firing the weapon, so before choosing a target, am I right ?

The answer is in the rulebook, page 5.

1) Choose Unit to Shoot With
2) Choose Targets
3) Choose Ranged Weapon

So you pick your target first, then you roll for Strength.

I assume this also means you have to declare more dakka on lootas before rolling for the number of hits? I had this come up in a game yesterday, and played it like this, but obviously I'd prefer it if we were able to roll for numbers of hits first.

 Vineheart01 wrote:

 ajax_xaja wrote:
Building out my half of the Team Tournament for LVO. Do you think taking two units of Tankbustas is too "all in" if my partner goes for chaff-clear via Khorne daemons?

I'm hoping that the Bad Moons reroll 1's will help with accuracy against non-Vehicle armor, especially when combined with more dakka and showin' off.

Spoiler:

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Orks) ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Clan Kultur: Bad Moons

+ HQ +

Kaptin Badrukk

Weirdboy : 3. Da Jump, Da Best Armour Teef Can Buy, Scorched Gitbonez, Warlord

+ Troops +

Boyz
. Boss Nob: Power Klaw, Slugga
. 29x Ork Boy W/ Shoota

Gretchin: 10x Gretchin

Gretchin: 10x Gretchin

+ Elites +

Tankbustas
. Boss Nob: Rokkit Launcha
. 8x Tankbusta: 8x Rokkit Launcha

Tankbustas
. Boss Nob: Rokkit Launcha
. 9x Tankbusta: 9x Rokkit Launcha

+ Fast Attack +

Shokkjump Dragstas
. Shokkjump Dragstas: Rokkit Launcha

+ Dedicated Transport +

Trukk: Big Shoota

Trukk: Big Shoota

++ Total: [49 PL, 1000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

curious, why badrukk? I mean he basically has bad moonz trait slapped on by default even though hes a freeboota not a badmoon but hes not all that great imo.

Also i can attest the badmoonz reroll 1 can be amazing. I can count on my hands the amount of times in 6 games ive had a shooting attack whiff (not talking saves being good talking my ability to HIT being bad), in fact ive even had a few extreme cases where i somehow had more KMB hits than i even had shots...lol...

He's not great, true, but certainly better than the SAG big mek. 3 S8 AP-3 D3 shots at BS4+ with natural re-rolling 1s and another re-roll thanks to the ammo runt makes him a fair alternative to 3x smasha gunz, since they basically have the same cost, but he's also useful to unlock detachments, he cannot be targetable unless he's the closest dude but he also got an invuln, a high save for orks standards, and an ammo runt to sacrifice.

 Nym wrote:

 IronSlug wrote:
Bonus question : As I read it, you roll for the SAG strength before firing the weapon, so before choosing a target, am I right ?

The answer is in the rulebook, page 5.

1) Choose Unit to Shoot With
2) Choose Targets
3) Choose Ranged Weapon

So you pick your target first, then you roll for Strength.

 Singleton Mosby wrote:

 Nym wrote:

 IronSlug wrote:
Bonus question : As I read it, you roll for the SAG strength before firing the weapon, so before choosing a target, am I right ?

The answer is in the rulebook, page 5.

1) Choose Unit to Shoot With
2) Choose Targets
3) Choose Ranged Weapon

So you pick your target first, then you roll for Strength.