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Some wacky moments from my last game;

Turn 1;
-I lose my Wazbomm Blasta jet, my Shokkjump Dragsta, and 29 Grotz turn one
-Bad Moon Lootas and a Deffskull SAGmek shoot a Land Raider and five Hellblasters off the table
-My Evil Sunz Warboss with Relicklaw and Fists of Gork assaults passed a scout screen into a Land Raider, dies in melee, then with Orkz is Never Beaten he leaves the Land Raider with two wounds (Also, forgot to reroll my wounds and attack squig).

Turn 2;
-I lose my shokk attack gun and several Ork Boyz to shooting from the nearly dead Land Raider and supporting cast.
-With no remaining Grot screen I teleport my Lootas across the board and dump shots into three Space Marine targets, except I rolled one shot and did poorly.
-Bonebreaka Tellyports in and assaults a now 3 wound Land Raider, mostly wiffs and leaves it with like a wound.
-My Deffkilla Wartrike assaults BobbyG. Then BobbyG kills my HQ in return, then my Wartrike swings more time, leaving BobbyG with 2 wounds.

Turn 3;
-My opponent Falls Back with his Land Raider then pummels my Bonebreaka with a quad lascannon pred. The Bonebreaka explodes, destroying the remaining Land Raider.
-On my turn, my Lootas split fire into three weak targets, rolls one shot, doesn't do much again.
-My index mek on Bike dies in assault with RubbertGuilliman

Turn 4;
-Threatening assaults with my remaining Ork boyz, my opponent start castling into the corner my Lootas are already kinda in.
-My Dakkajet dies, never really shooting much since most of my opponents targets were boxes.
-BobbyG declares an assault on my Lootas and dies in the overwatch. But gets back up at the end of the turn.
-On my turn I shoot three targets with my Lootas again, killing Guilliman and I think a Quad Laz pred.

At this point it looks like my remaining boyz will be too numerous for the remaining space marines to get a victory on the Scouring. Game is called. This game was unqiue in that I went second and somehow pulled a victory seemingly because his alphastrike put him in position to be assaulted turn one. My Lootas also shot very luckily on turn one. Land Raiders throw an impressive amount of dice. I really like the Deffskull rerolls I think I could run a mono deffskull list and be happy.

With as much that can go right on turn one, I'm starting to believe tellyporting anything really isn't neccassary and does more to hinder you by forcing you to make a spot for orkz to deepstrike. It's almost better to have more shooting or more melee area of influence turn one.

EDIT; Showin' off and shooting with Lootas, do you roll shots both times or once? The past two games my opponent and I have decided we roll once.

For lootas once. Usually would be each time you shoot(so say sag with the new strategem from special det) but loota weapon has specific exception that overrides default rules

And for added fun normally random roll aplies for entire phase but attacks it's different. So loota exception makes their attacks follow normal procedure!

Hello!
I need help please too much info lately..
Could You guys clear things for me..?

"Dakkajet Quite a solid little chaff-clearer/general infantry killer. Loves to be a shooty Kultur, with Freebootas boosting it up to hitting on 3s"................how on 3'???

"Lucky Gitz: 6++ invuln, all infantry gains objective secured, and you may reroll 1 dice per unit per phase to hit, wound, AND damage. Provides excellent rules for MSU ork lists with a balanced mix of melee and range particularly when the unit has one potent weapon - for example a Deff Dread with a single Kustom Mega Blasta who can make good use of all 6 potential rerolls if he gets a good turn."...............6 rerolls? Its only one dice per unit per all hits...

I have 50 boys to assemble ...shoota or chop or mix?

Thank You for explanation

metallum wrote:
Hello!
I need help please too much info lately..
Could You guys clear things for me..?

"Dakkajet Quite a solid little chaff-clearer/general infantry killer. Loves to be a shooty Kultur, with Freebootas boosting it up to hitting on 3s"................how on 3'???

"Lucky Gitz: 6++ invuln, all infantry gains objective secured, and you may reroll 1 dice per unit per phase to hit, wound, AND damage. Provides excellent rules for MSU ork lists with a balanced mix of melee and range particularly when the unit has one potent weapon - for example a Deff Dread with a single Kustom Mega Blasta who can make good use of all 6 potential rerolls if he gets a good turn."...............6 rerolls? Its only one dice per unit per all hits...

I have 50 boys to assemble ...shoota or chop or mix?

Thank You for explanation

Dakkajet: Has +1 to hit if all his guns shoot the same target. Add to this the +1 from freeboota and you hit on 3s

Deff Dreads: you can reroll a to-hit, to-wound and damage both in the shooting phase and in the fight phase. So 6 rerolls.

Usually boyz are better with choppas (depending on what you want to use them for). That being said, it's hard to get 30 of them to hit in melee, so for big units, mixing 10 or so shootas in isn't a bad idea.

Great!!!
Thanks!..
Now for Nobz 30 to assemble..
I read that big choppa and choppas are a go to load out.
Or mix them? and make them shooty?

I like couple big chopppa and choppa and more double choppas.

I have no idea if they'll listen at all but I imagine we should as a community try to drive through some of the point changes we should get considering Chapter Approved is now live.
I mean, I think Orks are essentially fine but there's room for improvement without being greedy.

What do people think about these changes? I'm trying to be realistic. Also, yes the mekboy shop is still terrible at that cost but I can't suggest 0 points can I?

PiñaColada wrote:
I have no idea if they'll listen at all but I imagine we should as a community try to drive through some of the point changes we should get considering Chapter Approved is now live.
I mean, I think Orks are essentially fine but there's room for improvement without being greedy.

What do people think about these changes? I'm trying to be realistic. Also, yes the mekboy shop is still terrible at that cost but I can't suggest 0 points can I?

Spoiler:

Points units:
Burna boyz - 10
Nobz on warbikes - 33
Tankbustas - 7
Painboy - 45
Boomdakka snazzwagon - 83
Kustom boosta-blasta - 90
Rukkatrukk squigbuggies - 100
Shokkjump dragstas - 100
Warbikers - 21
Gunwagon - 120
Killa kanz - 35
Trukk - 48
Mekboy workshop - 40
Stompa - 600

Points ranged weapons:
Big shoota - 2
Twin big shoota - 4
Rokkit launcha - 10
Kombi-weapon with rokkit launcha - 10
Twin rokkit launcha - 20
Kopta rokkits - 20
Grotzooka - 5
Lobba - 10
Kannon - 10
Zzap gun - 10
Stikkbomb chukka - 2
Bubblechukka - 20
Kustom mega-blasta - 7
Kustom mega-slugga - 5
Shokk Attack Gun - 20
Tellyport blasta - 8
Skorcha - 14
Kombi-weapon with skorcha - 15

Points melee weapons:
Power klaw - 10
Killsaw - 12 (Pair - 18)

Points other wargear:
Cybork body - 1

General notes:
The point drops on units, or sometimes lack thereof, is assumed to happen alongside wargear point drops.
Tankbustas go up 2 to keep them at 17 points because of lower costed rokkit launchas.

New unit abilities:
Burna boyz reroll wounds against infantry
Boomdakka snazzwagon gets a 1 use ramshackle save, basically you can choose to try and activate it any time you suffer a multi-damage wound but if you manage to roll a 6 the ability is lost after that due to the grot being dead.
Trukks get assault ramps - can deploy 6” away from trukk instead of 3”

GW has never considered the community when assining points. Ever. Why would they start now?

Played a couple games with my friend over the weekend. First game he wanted to try his grey knight list since the ca point drops. He brought 2 gm dreadknights, Draigo, ancient dude, couple captains, 2 squads of pallies, and 2 strike squads in rhinos. I brought the fairly standard loota star with boyz mix. Game was pretty much over by turn 2. Lootas and smashas just destroyed his dreadknights and the boyz were just killing and/or tarpitting everything else so we just called it at the end of 3. Unfortunately, Grey knights still really suck.

Next game I wanted to try out a bunch of stuff so we did a semi-competitive match. He brought Custodes with a mix of bikes, termies, normal dudes, Valoris, banner dude that gives everything -1 to hit around him, and a Telemon heavy dreadnought that fires 5 heavy bolter shots that are -2 and 20 autocannon shots at 2+ re-rolling 1's, T8, 15 wounds, and a 2+/4++/6+++ (that thing scares me). I brought the usual hq's plus a big mek with da souped-up skokka, 90 grots, 5 flash gitz and 5 kommados in a trukk, 10 nobz in a trukk, 8 meganobz in a teleporta, and 3 deff dreads in a teleporta.

Turn 1: I moved everything up and shot my gitz and sag who both did mostly nothing because of the -1 bubble, but I think I did a couple wounds to one of his bikes and something else. His turn he blew up my nob trukk so I popped my loot it stratagem. His bike squad charged my gitz trukk and did 5 wounds at -3 which I preceded to roll 5 6++ saves for for I guess when you take the deathskulls trait you get their luck as well, lol.

Turn 2: I brought in my manz and dreads from reserve. My bikerboss beelined it to the telemon that had a small enough hole for him to charge through, and other weirdboy cast fist of gork on him. My gitz and sag combined killed 2 normal custodes in front of the telemon making the hole a little bigger for my boss to charge. Onto assaults my boss luckily manages to weather overwatch with 1 wound remaining and makes his charge on the telemon. 2 of the 3 dreads make their charge into another squad and the manz unfortunately don't make it after my friend used a stratagem that basically cuts your charge distance in half. Nobs also charged into his bike squad. Dreads combined to kill 1 dude, nobs killed a bike and wounded another, and my boss left his telemon with 1 wound remaining from attacking twice after dieing. On his turn he destroys all my dreads and a couple manz.

Rest of the game: My flash gitz are able to stay stationary in the middle of the field the rest of the game and start whittling down his army. The manz get rekt after killing 1-2 dudes and the nobz kill another couple dudes. The last two turns consisted of him trying to kill his way through 90 grots while getting smited and shot by my gitz and sag. The game ends with him having basically Valoris and a banner dude left.

My takeaways (from a competitive standpoint):

Deff dreads: not good. Of course they can be good and even great depending on the match-up, but the reason why I wanted to take them as well as the nobs and manz is because I wanted to see how they'd perform in a bad matchup so I could test their competitive use going forward and sadly, dreads just don't make it. Like many have said it's incredibly difficult to get all 3 into combat meaning there's little reason to take more than 2 and at that point you start questioning if they're even worth taking in a teleporta. They also did almost diddly squat in combat before getting completely obliterated in return.

Manz: Decent. They didn't really do a whole lot offensively, but soaked up a good amount of firepower. As soon as they got into combat they got completely rekt, but that was expected since at that point I had multi-charged Valoris, his banner dude, and a lone bike (they did kill the biker at least). Overall I would definitely take them over deff dreads, but in games against armies that can hang with them I'm not sure I can justify spending that many points on a situational unit.

Nobz: Good. If the flash gitz hadn't balled out with their shooting the last couple turns these guys would of been mvp's. That 3+ save just makes them obnoxious and even more so once a few of them die off and you can fit them in cover super easy. Had they played basically any other army they would have gotten a lot more value, but even in this matchup they were able to make back most of their points on top of being a pest. Also they're a lot of fun to play.

Flash Gitz: who dem bois. Granted I came into the game with little expectation, but for only 5 dudes they were quite impressive and easily did the most damage out of any unit in my army. Are they competitive? not really. Their price basically makes sure of that, but if you can protect them and put enough pressure on your opponent that they don't become a priority target then your opponent will definitely regret it.

Tankbustas - have ork players changed how they equip or size their Tankbusta squads? From reading the new codex, I get the impression:
- 5 is still too small a squad - 10 is still better
- put a Boss Nob in charge (costs nothing, minor stats improvement)
- rokkit pistols and tankhamma still aren't worth it
- squig bombs are still an amusing use of spare points, despite the increased cost
- Bad Moons are the most useful clan? Although Deathskulls and Freebooterz aren't terrible, they seem less reliable.

Modelling-wise, the GW set gives a Nob, 2 squigs, 1 rokkit pistols, 1 tankhamma and 2 boyz, which seems a poor squad. How are players expanding their squads? Buying up rokkit bits from the Boyz and Loota sprues? Converting, e.g. looting imperial missile launchers?

 Clang wrote:
Tankbustas - have ork players changed how they equip or size their Tankbusta squads? From reading the new codex, I get the impression:
- 5 is still too small a squad - 10 is still better
- put a Boss Nob in charge (costs nothing, minor stats improvement)
- rokkit pistols and tankhamma still aren't worth it
- squig bombs are still an amusing use of spare points, despite the increased cost
- Bad Moons are the most useful clan? Although Deathskulls and Freebooterz aren't terrible, they seem less reliable.

Modelling-wise, the GW set gives a Nob, 2 squigs, 1 rokkit pistols, 1 tankhamma and 2 boyz, which seems a poor squad. How are players expanding their squads? Buying up rokkit bits from the Boyz and Loota sprues? Converting, e.g. looting imperial missile launchers?

Any shooting asset should be Bad Moonz for utilizing Showin' Off. Once you already have a shooting asset using Showin Off, you then want a Deff Skull unit for Wreckerz.

Showin Off almost works too well on Lootas to use it on Tankbustas, unless you really just don't want to bring Lootas. Tankbustas should probably be Deffskullz, so they can use Wreckerz.

Beyond all else, you just want like 5 Tankbustas so you can maybe use the grenade stratagem if you accidentally get close enough. Deffskull Squigbomb rerolls are kinda nice.

I have one box of Tankbustas, the other 25 Tankbustas I have are made from Rokkit bitz in the Boy and Loota box, as you say.

I'm having soo much fun with my Lootas right now that I have not been fielding Tankbustas. Really, this edition has brought KMB weapons out in the Deffskull army, the free reroll works nice without burdening my CP for Wreckerz. IF I get around to making a Freeboota army I am sure my Tankbustas will find their way into a Trukk or Battlewagon to assist Flash Gitz from inside 24" ranges. Not using Stratagems from vehicles has kinda pigeonholed Tankbustas and Flash Gitz into the Freeboota Kulturs. In the Deffskull Kultures I would want all of the Damage D6 weapons, your Shokkjump Dragstas, Wazbomb Blastajet, SAG Mek, Kustom Mega Blastas/Sluggas/Kannonz all these weapons just seem more interesting then trying to make Tankbustas work outside of a transport just to get Wreckerz.

 Clang wrote:
Tankbustas - have ork players changed how they equip or size their Tankbusta squads? From reading the new codex, I get the impression:
- 5 is still too small a squad - 10 is still better
- put a Boss Nob in charge (costs nothing, minor stats improvement)
- rokkit pistols and tankhamma still aren't worth it
- squig bombs are still an amusing use of spare points, despite the increased cost
- Bad Moons are the most useful clan? Although Deathskulls and Freebooterz aren't terrible, they seem less reliable.

Modelling-wise, the GW set gives a Nob, 2 squigs, 1 rokkit pistols, 1 tankhamma and 2 boyz, which seems a poor squad. How are players expanding their squads? Buying up rokkit bits from the Boyz and Loota sprues? Converting, e.g. looting imperial missile launchers?

For tankbustas you go big or you go home. It's a heavy CP investment but the Wombo-combo will delete anything that isn't an Ion Bulwark+Rotate Ion Shields (aka a 3++) knight off the field. The reason you want Bad Moonz is due to the stratagem, the kultur is actually redundant on Tankbustas.

You take a full unit of Bad Moonz Tankbustas + Bomb Squigs, Tellyport them in (2cp), use More Dakka! (2cp) so you're exploding on 5+ with re-rolls to hit, then use Showin' Off (2cp) to fire the 15 Tankbustas (since the squigs are dead) again. Remember the squigs benefit from DakkaDakkaDakka and the re-roll to hits too. Make sure to bring Dakkajets or Da Jumping Shoota Boyz to clear out the Loyal 32/Loyal 12 first.

I guess if you know you're going to face an Ion Bulwark+Rotate Ion Shields Knight then maybe Evil Sunz Tankbustas with Hammers might be the way to go but at that point you're losing off the bat to begin with.

I'm not a fan of the biggest squad of tankbustas to be honest, I prefer 10+2 bomb squigs in a trukk. Usually I pick 2 of those squads. Disembark one and showing off if they're bad moons, with gretchins in front of them, otherwise they should stay in the vehicle as long as the trukk survives. Deathskulls ones are also good in 2x5 in a trukk because you get more re-rolls and potentially the D6 re-roll on both bomb squigs.

If you play a greentide a big blob that arrives by tellyporta and shielded by gretchins is definitely the way to go with bustas but if you play mechanized lists, like I mostly do, they do their work in trukks even with no CP invested on them.

JimOnMars wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:
I have no idea if they'll listen at all but I imagine we should as a community try to drive through some of the point changes we should get considering Chapter Approved is now live.
I mean, I think Orks are essentially fine but there's room for improvement without being greedy.

What do people think about these changes? I'm trying to be realistic. Also, yes the mekboy shop is still terrible at that cost but I can't suggest 0 points can I?

Spoiler:

Points units:
Burna boyz - 10
Nobz on warbikes - 33
Tankbustas - 7
Painboy - 45
Boomdakka snazzwagon - 83
Kustom boosta-blasta - 90
Rukkatrukk squigbuggies - 100
Shokkjump dragstas - 100
Warbikers - 21
Gunwagon - 120
Killa kanz - 35
Trukk - 48
Mekboy workshop - 40
Stompa - 600

Points ranged weapons:
Big shoota - 2
Twin big shoota - 4
Rokkit launcha - 10
Kombi-weapon with rokkit launcha - 10
Twin rokkit launcha - 20
Kopta rokkits - 20
Grotzooka - 5
Lobba - 10
Kannon - 10
Zzap gun - 10
Stikkbomb chukka - 2
Bubblechukka - 20
Kustom mega-blasta - 7
Kustom mega-slugga - 5
Shokk Attack Gun - 20
Tellyport blasta - 8
Skorcha - 14
Kombi-weapon with skorcha - 15

Points melee weapons:
Power klaw - 10
Killsaw - 12 (Pair - 18)

Points other wargear:
Cybork body - 1

General notes:
The point drops on units, or sometimes lack thereof, is assumed to happen alongside wargear point drops.
Tankbustas go up 2 to keep them at 17 points because of lower costed rokkit launchas.

New unit abilities:
Burna boyz reroll wounds against infantry
Boomdakka snazzwagon gets a 1 use ramshackle save, basically you can choose to try and activate it any time you suffer a multi-damage wound but if you manage to roll a 6 the ability is lost after that due to the grot being dead.
Trukks get assault ramps - can deploy 6” away from trukk instead of 3”

GW has never considered the community when assining points. Ever. Why would they start now?

With all due respect, but how do you know? Point changes are made, from index to codex and from codex to FAQ/CA. In a lot of those cases they're on units that the community has brought up as being poorly costed (and a lot of the times they're changed for seemingly little reason to be fair). How do you know they're not listening? Just because they don't go out and say "blablabla made a solid argument about the cost of centurions" doesn't mean they didn't take it into consideration.

Blackie wrote:I'm not a fan of the biggest squad of tankbustas to be honest, I prefer 10+2 bomb squigs in a trukk. Usually I pick 2 of those squads. Disembark one and showing off if they're bad moons, with gretchins in front of them, otherwise they should stay in the vehicle as long as the trukk survives. Deathskulls ones are also good in 2x5 in a trukk because you get more re-rolls and potentially the D6 re-roll on both bomb squigs.

If you play a greentide a big blob that arrives by tellyporta and shielded by gretchins is definitely the way to go with bustas but if you play mechanized lists, like I mostly do, they do their work in trukks even with no CP invested on them.

I also prefer the less CP demanding 10 tankbustas+2squigs/12 tankbustas in a trukk. My lists are fairly mechanised like yours so there's a fair bit of target saturation going on. Usually I can place the trukk in a way that if I don't get T1 and my opponent blows the trukk up I can still jump the tankbustas out of LoS so they at least get one turn of shooting.

PiñaColada wrote:

I also prefer the less CP demanding 10 tankbustas+2squigs/12 tankbustas in a trukk. My lists are fairly mechanised like yours so there's a fair bit of target saturation going on. Usually I can place the trukk in a way that if I don't get T1 and my opponent blows the trukk up I can still jump the tankbustas out of LoS so they at least get one turn of shooting.

Any real disadvantage to making that 2 units of 6 in the same trukk? I'm running them as Deathskulls so that gives two units that can claim objectives, and two sets of rerolls, even if they end up always shooting at the same target.

Thrund wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:

I also prefer the less CP demanding 10 tankbustas+2squigs/12 tankbustas in a trukk. My lists are fairly mechanised like yours so there's a fair bit of target saturation going on. Usually I can place the trukk in a way that if I don't get T1 and my opponent blows the trukk up I can still jump the tankbustas out of LoS so they at least get one turn of shooting.

Any real disadvantage to making that 2 units of 6 in the same trukk? I'm running them as Deathskulls so that gives two units that can claim objectives, and two sets of rerolls, even if they end up always shooting at the same target.

Not really I'd say. There are some considerations though.

Elite slots - Do you need to fill another one? Then consider use two units.
If you're running low on slots then just use one unit. This will rarely happen though.

If you're often playing missions with kill points it might matter if you choose one or two units.

The real thing to consider in my opinion is whether you're willing to throw buffs on the unit if they survive after the trukk is destroyed. My unit of 10 (+2 squigs) often manage to survive with all the actual tankbustas left, meaning I'm far more willing to throw buffs on them than if they were 2 groups of 6.

All of this is fairly minor stuff though, so go for whatever you feel like will help you out the most. Meaning if you need to fill elite slots for a brigade or get more obsec then try that build out.

Thrund wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:

I also prefer the less CP demanding 10 tankbustas+2squigs/12 tankbustas in a trukk. My lists are fairly mechanised like yours so there's a fair bit of target saturation going on. Usually I can place the trukk in a way that if I don't get T1 and my opponent blows the trukk up I can still jump the tankbustas out of LoS so they at least get one turn of shooting.

Any real disadvantage to making that 2 units of 6 in the same trukk? I'm running them as Deathskulls so that gives two units that can claim objectives, and two sets of rerolls, even if they end up always shooting at the same target.

Sooner or later they are out of truck, likely after t1 of enemy, and then 2 units is worse than 1

Thrund wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:

I also prefer the less CP demanding 10 tankbustas+2squigs/12 tankbustas in a trukk. My lists are fairly mechanised like yours so there's a fair bit of target saturation going on. Usually I can place the trukk in a way that if I don't get T1 and my opponent blows the trukk up I can still jump the tankbustas out of LoS so they at least get one turn of shooting.

Any real disadvantage to making that 2 units of 6 in the same trukk? I'm running them as Deathskulls so that gives two units that can claim objectives, and two sets of rerolls, even if they end up always shooting at the same target.

No, quite the opposite. I think you should definitely go with 2x5-6 tankbustas in the same vehicle. I tried it the 5-6 times I've played the deffskulls brigade. The Wreckers stratagem is actually a trap, a unit of 10-12 tankbustas must disembark to use it and for 2 CPs you should get something like +1-2 successful wound rolls, which should end with +3 wounds after the saves. Sometimes even 0 saves as those 1-2 rolls can be saved with decent odds, rokkits are only AP-2. I prefer using 2 free re-rolls while sitting on the transport instead.

The wreckers stratagem is nice on nobz or meganobz instead.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:

Thrund wrote:

PiñaColada wrote:

I also prefer the less CP demanding 10 tankbustas+2squigs/12 tankbustas in a trukk. My lists are fairly mechanised like yours so there's a fair bit of target saturation going on. Usually I can place the trukk in a way that if I don't get T1 and my opponent blows the trukk up I can still jump the tankbustas out of LoS so they at least get one turn of shooting.

Any real disadvantage to making that 2 units of 6 in the same trukk? I'm running them as Deathskulls so that gives two units that can claim objectives, and two sets of rerolls, even if they end up always shooting at the same target.

Sooner or later they are out of truck, likely after t1 of enemy, and then 2 units is worse than 1

If you have 3 BWs-Bonebreakas their trukk can survive 3+ turns. If the opponent fires his anti tank towards the rokkit trukks sparing a big vehicle or my mek gunz I'd be super happy with that. Deathskulls vehicles are also more resilient than standard ones with their free 6++, and there's also ramshackle.

I like the Extra Stikkbombs Stratagem for my TBs. Put em in a Trukk with a couple Squiggs. Get in close and when the enemy pops the Trukk, you throw down some Stikkbombs. Go from 10 shots to 20 (on average). Even use Shoot Again (if you go Bad Moonz) to get in another 10. That's a lot of hurt.

Course, I do think MANz might be better AT, with Klawz. Higher S, better AP, and better to-hit, and still plenty of attacks. But might be subjective.

Played another game today this time trying out a Goff green tide. Told my opponent to bring the custodes biker spam with the loyal 32 cause I wanted to see how'd they do against one of the worst matchups. Things were looking pretty bleak after the first two turns, but managed to pull it around the last 3 turns and the game ended in a tie with him having just his bike captain with 1 wound remaining (he tanked 2 smasha's at the end so I almost tabled him). Green tide is still pretty solid I think. Also a Goff bikerboss with the relic klaw is absolutely bonkers. Did 8 damage 4 wounds in one round of combat before even attacking twice and that was with him hitting at -1 because of the bike captains relic thing, lol.

I like to run my Biker Bosses with Super Cybork and Bad Moonz trait. Guy tanked 4 Fight Phases of attacks before going down.

So perhaps an easy question for you guys but I'm finding myself in a bind. What anti-armor units should I be getting? I had a good run but my main opponent beat me twice in a row now using helldrakes and lots of armour. The flaw of only having SAGs for anti-armor is keeping my list down but I'm not sure what to get.
Tankbustas seem nice but pretty expensive points wise, and I probably need to buy a trukk for them too, scrapjet seems a nice alternative but not sure how good they are.

A killa claw and brutal but kunnin warboss will destroy pretty much anything armored.
At range, smasha gunz and tankbustas are the main options.

hortsmann wrote:
A killa claw and brutal but kunnin warboss will destroy pretty much anything armored.
At range, smasha gunz and tankbustas are the main options.

Or flier. Or anything opponent screens.

At range add in lootas that are also more flexible than bustas. 15 of them with more dakka and showing off will bust drake with 75% of average output(well actually tad less than that) so you can afford some bad dice rolling as well. By the time warboss does 1 lootas have done 2-3.

edit: Actually remembered drake doesn't have -1 to hit so you can even not use the more dakka and you STILL have more wounds than average result. If you are willing to spend CP every time you roll 1 for # of shots you indeed average 16 wounds even without more dakka. Albeit in practice you average less in long run as overkills from shooting 3 per round doesn't carry over to compensate for the 1/9 times you roll 1 round per loota but when you roll 3 you can kill 1(average is 10.45 wounds) and even if not likely fairly crippled so shoot the 2nd round to another and use mek guns to finish the 2 likely near dead turkey then so....yeah rolling that 3 is nice and you do have 44% chance of getting that. 55% if you roll 1 and 2(which incidentally doesn't change average # of shots but does adjust volatily of your shots)

 Castozor wrote:
So perhaps an easy question for you guys but I'm finding myself in a bind. What anti-armor units should I be getting? I had a good run but my main opponent beat me twice in a row now using helldrakes and lots of armour. The flaw of only having SAGs for anti-armor is keeping my list down but I'm not sure what to get.
Tankbustas seem nice but pretty expensive points wise, and I probably need to buy a trukk for them too, scrapjet seems a nice alternative but not sure how good they are.

I take it since your are running SAG mekz then you must also be Deffskullz right now right? I would hands down recommend the Shokkjump Dragsta and a Wazbomm Blastajet with KFF. They are sweet, the Deffskull rerollz are reallyreally sweet.

If you are Bad Moonz, and with SAG Mekz I hope you aren't, then your anti-armor is Lootas.

If you are Freebootas then you should start including Mek Gunz for Anti Armor.

Or you mix&match clans. You want 2 battallions as a minimum and 3 isn't going overboard so take 3 clans and take best units for each trait that way.

I'm still trying to find my clan, played mostly Deff Skulls but played evil sunz last few games. SAG performance dropped quite a bit but it was nice for my footslogging boys. I guess I need more lootas then, I already use a squad of 8-10 (limited by models atm), but seems to me that unless I get first turn the helldrakes will still maul them.
Edit: I should probably mention mixing clans is a no-no for me. My friends frown upon it, considering it the same as souping. Since they don't soup their armies neither will I.

 Castozor wrote:
I'm still trying to find my clan, played mostly Deff Skulls but played evil sunz last few games. SAG performance dropped quite a bit but it was nice for my footslogging boys. I guess I need more lootas then, I already use a squad of 8-10 (limited by models atm), but seems to me that unless I get first turn the helldrakes will still maul them.
Edit: I should probably mention mixing clans is a no-no for me. My friends frown upon it, considering it the same as souping. Since they don't soup their armies neither will I.

Drakes will NOT maul them if you don\t want them. Grot screen. Best 1 drake would do is the flamer grilling 3.5 hits that turn into about 2 wounds which equals to 30% chance of killing one loota.

Good luck clearing lootas with helldrake!

With 10 you average about 10 wounds. Mind you when you do get that 3 shots you average out 14 wounds with shoot twice so you will at least destroy 1. Depending on what other AT you have you might want to split those to 2 drakes and finish with rest of guns.

BTW with grot screens and fliers be careful. Here unit of 30 can be very good as you can cover every direction with one unit. With 10 strong units say you have unit at front and back...well back unit won't protect from front and vice versa. He can move drakes to rear and shoot with some other unit the rear. If you have 30 you can surround 360 degree and remove casualties at more conveniently. 2x30 and you can do double layer even.

Thanks for the solid advice, I only have 20 grots atm, which is one of my problems. I did try to screen but it just wasn't enough. Biggest issue was I had nothing else to throw at his dreads afterwards which let to my initial question.
Guess I might just need more grots rather than dedicated anti-tank.

 Castozor wrote:
Thanks for the solid advice, I only have 20 grots atm, which is one of my problems. I did try to screen but it just wasn't enough. Biggest issue was I had nothing else to throw at his dreads afterwards which let to my initial question.
Guess I might just need more grots rather than dedicated anti-tank.

If you are forced into a Mono list I recommend Deffskullz, Freebootaz, or Evil Sunz.

Once you have 30 Grotz, you may find that you still need like 60 Grotz to cover your Lootas, in the interim, while you wait to buy more models, perhaps consider a Painboy or KFF nearby to make them play larger. If you think you have opponents that might consider firing at the Lootas, the KFF becomes nice.