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2019/05/08 11:18:19
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
CaptainO wrote:I used a Evil Sunz blitz brigade to great effect this weekend. I ran 2 battlewagons, one with deff rolla one bare, both ard case and a bonebreaker, two squads of 30 boys, a squad of 10, 3x10 grots, Wartrike, Warboss, two weirdboyz 3 squads of stormboyz, squad of nobs a squad of Kommandos and a nob with waaagh banner. I also run a Big Mek with KFF in a different detachment. I've Developed a trick that worked a charm that I haven't seen anywhere before.
The problem with all the wagons is that they are severely overcosted for what they give.
And many armies will chew through them easily even under the protection of KFF.
Couple weeks ago there were a big (over 100 players) tournament in Moscow, and wagons didn’t shine at all.
They also suffer from the terrain due to obscene footprint: unfortunate Ruins in the middle, and you spend extra turn to get into position.
I played as a Genestealer Cult vs bonecrusher list, and Ruins helped me to trap the wagons in very unfortunate positions.
Hammer and Anvil against shooty opponents also very hard to counter: Imperial Guard is very common nowadays, Castellan will remain in rosters even after the nerf, eldars are moving to the flyer-heavy lists, etc.
I don’t believe in them untill the CA2019 cuts the prices.
Cheers for your feedback.
No doubt my list would improve if the points dropped but it seems to be working at the moment.
Terrain can totally cause some issues for my attack but ITC LoS blocking stuff is my friend when running orks so I won't complain. If I can hide the battlewagons then all the better.
Youre right that a lot of armies will have sufficient firepower to destroy 1 battelwagon, maybe even two (I run a castellan in my soup list and its going nowhere) in turn 1 but the army is designed to turtle up T1 and be able to hit hard even if they go second. All I need is one battlewagon left with a reasonable number of wounds so that it can eat the overwatch for my 40 da jumped warpath boyz (who will be hitting on 2+ thanks to the waaagh banner Nob who hitched a ride on the same battlewagon. The Warboss with the back seat driver trait just jumps into the healthy battlewagon to give it ere we go and +1 to movement in the event his original transport is destroyed.
The battlewagons will be hitting on 2+ if they make the charge too thanks to the waaagh banner nob they just dropped off too.
I'm running a evil sunz blitz brigade, a deathskullz dread waagh spearhead and a mixed battalion for 21CP before detachments and extra relics. Thanks to the battlewagons I can get my drops down to 18. Guard or Tau gunlines (my most common opponents) often easily surpass this number of drops so I've been getting +1 to go first. As I said the army can take a pasting turn 1.
I'm taking on a tournament level tau list tomorrow and will report any success and failures.
I'm tempted to change the bonebreaker for a normal ard top battlewagon just to keep the points down. All I need is for the vehicle to make combat. D6 extra attacks are of debatable benefit.
My mobbed up squad of 40 boyz are currently all shoota boyz to give me some semblance of ranged firepower after they're da jumped but seeing as the squad will be hitting on 2+ in cc I'm tempted to change to choppas. Whar are peoples thoughts? I'm trying to calculate how well 40 boyz will fare against a tau greater good gunline (if they can avail of the 5+ + from the kff) in the event the battlewagon isn't their to eat the overwatch. My opponent is known to castellan up with effectively his entire brigade. Surely some of the boyz will survive....
2019/05/08 13:51:27
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
CaptainO wrote:I used a Evil Sunz blitz brigade to great effect this weekend. I ran 2 battlewagons, one with deff rolla one bare, both ard case and a bonebreaker, two squads of 30 boys, a squad of 10, 3x10 grots, Wartrike, Warboss, two weirdboyz 3 squads of stormboyz, squad of nobs a squad of Kommandos and a nob with waaagh banner. I also run a Big Mek with KFF in a different detachment. I've Developed a trick that worked a charm that I haven't seen anywhere before.
The problem with all the wagons is that they are severely overcosted for what they give.
And many armies will chew through them easily even under the protection of KFF.
Couple weeks ago there were a big (over 100 players) tournament in Moscow, and wagons didn’t shine at all.
They also suffer from the terrain due to obscene footprint: unfortunate Ruins in the middle, and you spend extra turn to get into position.
I played as a Genestealer Cult vs bonecrusher list, and Ruins helped me to trap the wagons in very unfortunate positions.
Hammer and Anvil against shooty opponents also very hard to counter: Imperial Guard is very common nowadays, Castellan will remain in rosters even after the nerf, eldars are moving to the flyer-heavy lists, etc.
I don’t believe in them untill the CA2019 cuts the prices.
Cheers for your feedback.
No doubt my list would improve if the points dropped but it seems to be working at the moment.
Terrain can totally cause some issues for my attack but ITC LoS blocking stuff is my friend when running orks so I won't complain. If I can hide the battlewagons then all the better.
Youre right that a lot of armies will have sufficient firepower to destroy 1 battelwagon, maybe even two (I run a castellan in my soup list and its going nowhere) in turn 1 but the army is designed to turtle up T1 and be able to hit hard even if they go second. All I need is one battlewagon left with a reasonable number of wounds so that it can eat the overwatch for my 40 da jumped warpath boyz (who will be hitting on 2+ thanks to the waaagh banner Nob who hitched a ride on the same battlewagon. The Warboss with the back seat driver trait just jumps into the healthy battlewagon to give it ere we go and +1 to movement in the event his original transport is destroyed.
The battlewagons will be hitting on 2+ if they make the charge too thanks to the waaagh banner nob they just dropped off too.
I'm running a evil sunz blitz brigade, a deathskullz dread waagh spearhead and a mixed battalion for 21CP before detachments and extra relics. Thanks to the battlewagons I can get my drops down to 18. Guard or Tau gunlines (my most common opponents) often easily surpass this number of drops so I've been getting +1 to go first. As I said the army can take a pasting turn 1.
I'm taking on a tournament level tau list tomorrow and will report any success and failures.
I'm tempted to change the bonebreaker for a normal ard top battlewagon just to keep the points down. All I need is for the vehicle to make combat. D6 extra attacks are of debatable benefit.
My mobbed up squad of 40 boyz are currently all shoota boyz to give me some semblance of ranged firepower after they're da jumped but seeing as the squad will be hitting on 2+ in cc I'm tempted to change to choppas. Whar are peoples thoughts? I'm trying to calculate how well 40 boyz will fare against a tau greater good gunline (if they can avail of the 5+ + from the kff) in the event the battlewagon isn't their to eat the overwatch. My opponent is known to castellan up with effectively his entire brigade. Surely some of the boyz will survive....
Care to post a more detailed list? I would like to vet it .
I´m having a blast with my freeboterz list, but ya never know
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/08 13:51:53
2019/05/09 10:07:43
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
CaptainO wrote:I used a Evil Sunz blitz brigade to great effect this weekend. I ran 2 battlewagons, one with deff rolla one bare, both ard case and a bonebreaker, two squads of 30 boys, a squad of 10, 3x10 grots, Wartrike, Warboss, two weirdboyz 3 squads of stormboyz, squad of nobs a squad of Kommandos and a nob with waaagh banner. I also run a Big Mek with KFF in a different detachment. I've Developed a trick that worked a charm that I haven't seen anywhere before.
The problem with all the wagons is that they are severely overcosted for what they give.
And many armies will chew through them easily even under the protection of KFF.
Couple weeks ago there were a big (over 100 players) tournament in Moscow, and wagons didn’t shine at all.
They also suffer from the terrain due to obscene footprint: unfortunate Ruins in the middle, and you spend extra turn to get into position.
I played as a Genestealer Cult vs bonecrusher list, and Ruins helped me to trap the wagons in very unfortunate positions.
Hammer and Anvil against shooty opponents also very hard to counter: Imperial Guard is very common nowadays, Castellan will remain in rosters even after the nerf, eldars are moving to the flyer-heavy lists, etc.
I don’t believe in them untill the CA2019 cuts the prices.
Cheers for your feedback.
No doubt my list would improve if the points dropped but it seems to be working at the moment.
Terrain can totally cause some issues for my attack but ITC LoS blocking stuff is my friend when running orks so I won't complain. If I can hide the battlewagons then all the better.
Youre right that a lot of armies will have sufficient firepower to destroy 1 battelwagon, maybe even two (I run a castellan in my soup list and its going nowhere) in turn 1 but the army is designed to turtle up T1 and be able to hit hard even if they go second. All I need is one battlewagon left with a reasonable number of wounds so that it can eat the overwatch for my 40 da jumped warpath boyz (who will be hitting on 2+ thanks to the waaagh banner Nob who hitched a ride on the same battlewagon. The Warboss with the back seat driver trait just jumps into the healthy battlewagon to give it ere we go and +1 to movement in the event his original transport is destroyed.
The battlewagons will be hitting on 2+ if they make the charge too thanks to the waaagh banner nob they just dropped off too.
I'm running a evil sunz blitz brigade, a deathskullz dread waagh spearhead and a mixed battalion for 21CP before detachments and extra relics. Thanks to the battlewagons I can get my drops down to 18. Guard or Tau gunlines (my most common opponents) often easily surpass this number of drops so I've been getting +1 to go first. As I said the army can take a pasting turn 1.
I'm taking on a tournament level tau list tomorrow and will report any success and failures.
I'm tempted to change the bonebreaker for a normal ard top battlewagon just to keep the points down. All I need is for the vehicle to make combat. D6 extra attacks are of debatable benefit.
My mobbed up squad of 40 boyz are currently all shoota boyz to give me some semblance of ranged firepower after they're da jumped but seeing as the squad will be hitting on 2+ in cc I'm tempted to change to choppas. Whar are peoples thoughts? I'm trying to calculate how well 40 boyz will fare against a tau greater good gunline (if they can avail of the 5+ + from the kff) in the event the battlewagon isn't their to eat the overwatch. My opponent is known to castellan up with effectively his entire brigade. Surely some of the boyz will survive....
Care to post a more detailed list? I would like to vet it .
I´m having a blast with my freeboterz list, but ya never know
Sure thing. I'm keen to hear your thoughts. My list couldn't be any different from a shooting based freeboterz list. Its cool the codex allows that.
I've changed the bonebreaker for a deff rolla battlewagon as the cost of 20 points and 8 transport spaces just didnt make sense for only d6 attacks.
On a completely different note has anyone tried blood axe bikers or stompa. The blood axe strat allows you to deep strike the stompa for 2CP (not to mention the 2+ save when 18" away) and the counts in cover + shoot after falling back seems ideal for bikers. I doubt theyre competitive but it could be interesting. You could only start a mek with kff in the stompa while its in deep strike as that combo takes you to just under half your points.
2019/05/09 10:27:43
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
On a completely different note has anyone tried blood axe bikers or stompa. The blood axe strat allows you to deep strike the stompa for 2CP (not to mention the 2+ save when 18" away) and the counts in cover + shoot after falling back seems ideal for bikers. I doubt theyre competitive but it could be interesting. You could only start a mek with kff in the stompa while its in deep strike as that combo takes you to just under half your points.
Doesn't the Bloodaxe Strat only work on Infantry units? I don't have my Dex at hands
Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like soup. Now you put soup in a cup, it becomes the cup; You put soup into a bottle it becomes the bottle; You put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Now soup can flow or it can crash. Be soup, my friend.
2019/05/09 10:32:38
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
Blood axe stratagem is 1CP and works only on PL9 or less units. Pretty sure stompa goes over that ;-) And regular DS caps out at 20PL. The vigilus formation had DS for stompa but of course requires 3 super heavies. Good luck fitting in 2k.
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2019/05/09 11:03:45
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
1 CP infantry only, outside of 3-4 MANz, characters or 20 boyz it's completely useless, and even those applications aren't great.
IMO, the only reason to play blood axes is to have a grot battalion with CP regeneration trait on a SAG.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/09 11:04:05
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2019/05/09 12:00:58
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
CaptainO wrote:I used a Evil Sunz blitz brigade to great effect this weekend. I ran 2 battlewagons, one with deff rolla one bare, both ard case and a bonebreaker, two squads of 30 boys, a squad of 10, 3x10 grots, Wartrike, Warboss, two weirdboyz 3 squads of stormboyz, squad of nobs a squad of Kommandos and a nob with waaagh banner. I also run a Big Mek with KFF in a different detachment. I've Developed a trick that worked a charm that I haven't seen anywhere before.
The problem with all the wagons is that they are severely overcosted for what they give.
And many armies will chew through them easily even under the protection of KFF.
Couple weeks ago there were a big (over 100 players) tournament in Moscow, and wagons didn’t shine at all.
They also suffer from the terrain due to obscene footprint: unfortunate Ruins in the middle, and you spend extra turn to get into position.
I played as a Genestealer Cult vs bonecrusher list, and Ruins helped me to trap the wagons in very unfortunate positions.
Hammer and Anvil against shooty opponents also very hard to counter: Imperial Guard is very common nowadays, Castellan will remain in rosters even after the nerf, eldars are moving to the flyer-heavy lists, etc.
I don’t believe in them untill the CA2019 cuts the prices.
Cheers for your feedback.
No doubt my list would improve if the points dropped but it seems to be working at the moment.
Terrain can totally cause some issues for my attack but ITC LoS blocking stuff is my friend when running orks so I won't complain. If I can hide the battlewagons then all the better.
Youre right that a lot of armies will have sufficient firepower to destroy 1 battelwagon, maybe even two (I run a castellan in my soup list and its going nowhere) in turn 1 but the army is designed to turtle up T1 and be able to hit hard even if they go second. All I need is one battlewagon left with a reasonable number of wounds so that it can eat the overwatch for my 40 da jumped warpath boyz (who will be hitting on 2+ thanks to the waaagh banner Nob who hitched a ride on the same battlewagon. The Warboss with the back seat driver trait just jumps into the healthy battlewagon to give it ere we go and +1 to movement in the event his original transport is destroyed.
The battlewagons will be hitting on 2+ if they make the charge too thanks to the waaagh banner nob they just dropped off too.
I'm running a evil sunz blitz brigade, a deathskullz dread waagh spearhead and a mixed battalion for 21CP before detachments and extra relics. Thanks to the battlewagons I can get my drops down to 18. Guard or Tau gunlines (my most common opponents) often easily surpass this number of drops so I've been getting +1 to go first. As I said the army can take a pasting turn 1.
I'm taking on a tournament level tau list tomorrow and will report any success and failures.
I'm tempted to change the bonebreaker for a normal ard top battlewagon just to keep the points down. All I need is for the vehicle to make combat. D6 extra attacks are of debatable benefit.
My mobbed up squad of 40 boyz are currently all shoota boyz to give me some semblance of ranged firepower after they're da jumped but seeing as the squad will be hitting on 2+ in cc I'm tempted to change to choppas. Whar are peoples thoughts? I'm trying to calculate how well 40 boyz will fare against a tau greater good gunline (if they can avail of the 5+ + from the kff) in the event the battlewagon isn't their to eat the overwatch. My opponent is known to castellan up with effectively his entire brigade. Surely some of the boyz will survive....
Care to post a more detailed list? I would like to vet it .
I´m having a blast with my freeboterz list, but ya never know
Sure thing. I'm keen to hear your thoughts. My list couldn't be any different from a shooting based freeboterz list. Its cool the codex allows that.
I've changed the bonebreaker for a deff rolla battlewagon as the cost of 20 points and 8 transport spaces just didnt make sense for only d6 attacks.
On a completely different note has anyone tried blood axe bikers or stompa. The blood axe strat allows you to deep strike the stompa for 2CP (not to mention the 2+ save when 18" away) and the counts in cover + shoot after falling back seems ideal for bikers. I doubt theyre competitive but it could be interesting. You could only start a mek with kff in the stompa while its in deep strike as that combo takes you to just under half your points.
even deep striking the stompa is useless, at its cost it is 1/2 of a 2k points list and may as well only have 30 woulds as the last 10 have it crippled beyond useablity,. the lack of an inv save means you deep strike it in and everythign on the table opens fire. even if you get a charge off 8th allowing units to fall back with no penalty and then still open fire means mayeb you got lucky and killed one model/unit... but because of the stompa's point cost it will always have killed somethign cheape rthan it. also with properly doen bubble wrap congrats you probably killed a unit of guardsmen or zombies before dying.
10000 points 7000 6000 5000 5000 2000
2019/05/09 13:30:40
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
My bad. Just read the dex there. Somehow missed the INFANTRY part of sneaky gits. Thought for a moment blood axes and stompas became usable.
A Blood axe speed freak outrider detachment may be useful (i'm not saying competitive just useful). Run it with a wartrike. 3+ Armour save and the ability to fall back and shoot combined with the speed freak detachments mobility. The battlewagon list I'm running currently is serving me well (game tonight against an unbeaten Tau list will be interesting) I just have a load of converted cyboars/warbikes that won't be seeing the light of day until the next chapter approved.
Thoughts on whether the 40 boyz mobbed up squad with warpath, that I'll be da jumping should be armed with shootas or sluggas and choppas. My list is on this page. Its fairly light on shooting currently but my intent is to use the last of my 21CP to use what remains of the 40 man squad to fight a second time. The unit will be buffed by a waaagh banner nob so hitting on 2+ in cc. Also I use the super powered KFF strat to try and give the 40 boyz a 5++ to overwatch.
2019/05/09 13:31:54
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
CaptainO wrote: On a completely different note has anyone tried blood axe bikers or stompa. The blood axe strat allows you to deep strike the stompa for 2CP (not to mention the 2+ save when 18" away) and the counts in cover + shoot after falling back seems ideal for bikers. I doubt theyre competitive but it could be interesting. You could only start a mek with kff in the stompa while its in deep strike as that combo takes you to just under half your points.
The only way to deep strike the stompa is to get a supreme command detachment with a stompa and get the stompa specialist detachment. While you're at it, add the relic for 5++ in combat and shooting and make it Mork's one for re-rolling ones to wound, with probably freebootas or bad moons kulture so it actually has the chance to kill something. That's the best stompa you are going to get, but it still sucks.
As for blood axe bikers... might as well have no culture at all. You want to move forward and use their guns, so you are always within 18" of whatever is shooting you, same is true for many ork units. Meanwhile, falling back is only attractive when you are still in combat during your movement phase. This only happens if you charge something, that something does not fall back or die to your attacks over the course of two combat phases, or if something charged you, failed to kill you and you want to get away from it. In short: never.
I have played a dozen games with blood axes, it's a completely useless culture outside of the ability to trade a relic for a warlord trait.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
CaptainO wrote: A Blood axe speed freak outrider detachment may be useful (i'm not saying competitive just useful). Run it with a wartrike. 3+ Armour save and the ability to fall back and shoot combined with the speed freak detachments mobility. The battlewagon list I'm running currently is serving me well (game tonight against an unbeaten Tau list will be interesting) I just have a load of converted cyboars/warbikes that won't be seeing the light of day until the next chapter approved.
The wartrike will have 4+ armor as soon as it starts moving. When in combat for two turns, it will have either killed whatever it was charging or be dead. You are off way better with deff skulls, snakebites or evil suns for your speed freaks.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/09 13:35:13
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2019/05/09 14:18:00
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
Not fan of 40 mob myself. Attacks is rarely problem. Losing option for endless tide hurts. Fresh 30 is more dangerous than remnants of 40 and ability to redeploy elsewhere can win games
2024 painted/bought: 109/109
2019/05/09 14:32:56
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
CaptainO wrote:I used a Evil Sunz blitz brigade to great effect this weekend. I ran 2 battlewagons, one with deff rolla one bare, both ard case and a bonebreaker, two squads of 30 boys, a squad of 10, 3x10 grots, Wartrike, Warboss, two weirdboyz 3 squads of stormboyz, squad of nobs a squad of Kommandos and a nob with waaagh banner. I also run a Big Mek with KFF in a different detachment. I've Developed a trick that worked a charm that I haven't seen anywhere before.
The problem with all the wagons is that they are severely overcosted for what they give.
And many armies will chew through them easily even under the protection of KFF.
Couple weeks ago there were a big (over 100 players) tournament in Moscow, and wagons didn’t shine at all.
They also suffer from the terrain due to obscene footprint: unfortunate Ruins in the middle, and you spend extra turn to get into position.
I played as a Genestealer Cult vs bonecrusher list, and Ruins helped me to trap the wagons in very unfortunate positions.
Hammer and Anvil against shooty opponents also very hard to counter: Imperial Guard is very common nowadays, Castellan will remain in rosters even after the nerf, eldars are moving to the flyer-heavy lists, etc.
I don’t believe in them untill the CA2019 cuts the prices.
Cheers for your feedback.
No doubt my list would improve if the points dropped but it seems to be working at the moment.
Terrain can totally cause some issues for my attack but ITC LoS blocking stuff is my friend when running orks so I won't complain. If I can hide the battlewagons then all the better.
Youre right that a lot of armies will have sufficient firepower to destroy 1 battelwagon, maybe even two (I run a castellan in my soup list and its going nowhere) in turn 1 but the army is designed to turtle up T1 and be able to hit hard even if they go second. All I need is one battlewagon left with a reasonable number of wounds so that it can eat the overwatch for my 40 da jumped warpath boyz (who will be hitting on 2+ thanks to the waaagh banner Nob who hitched a ride on the same battlewagon. The Warboss with the back seat driver trait just jumps into the healthy battlewagon to give it ere we go and +1 to movement in the event his original transport is destroyed.
The battlewagons will be hitting on 2+ if they make the charge too thanks to the waaagh banner nob they just dropped off too.
I'm running a evil sunz blitz brigade, a deathskullz dread waagh spearhead and a mixed battalion for 21CP before detachments and extra relics. Thanks to the battlewagons I can get my drops down to 18. Guard or Tau gunlines (my most common opponents) often easily surpass this number of drops so I've been getting +1 to go first. As I said the army can take a pasting turn 1.
I'm taking on a tournament level tau list tomorrow and will report any success and failures.
I'm tempted to change the bonebreaker for a normal ard top battlewagon just to keep the points down. All I need is for the vehicle to make combat. D6 extra attacks are of debatable benefit.
My mobbed up squad of 40 boyz are currently all shoota boyz to give me some semblance of ranged firepower after they're da jumped but seeing as the squad will be hitting on 2+ in cc I'm tempted to change to choppas. Whar are peoples thoughts? I'm trying to calculate how well 40 boyz will fare against a tau greater good gunline (if they can avail of the 5+ + from the kff) in the event the battlewagon isn't their to eat the overwatch. My opponent is known to castellan up with effectively his entire brigade. Surely some of the boyz will survive....
Care to post a more detailed list? I would like to vet it .
I´m having a blast with my freeboterz list, but ya never know
Sure thing. I'm keen to hear your thoughts. My list couldn't be any different from a shooting based freeboterz list. Its cool the codex allows that.
I've changed the bonebreaker for a deff rolla battlewagon as the cost of 20 points and 8 transport spaces just didnt make sense for only d6 attacks.
On a completely different note has anyone tried blood axe bikers or stompa. The blood axe strat allows you to deep strike the stompa for 2CP (not to mention the 2+ save when 18" away) and the counts in cover + shoot after falling back seems ideal for bikers. I doubt theyre competitive but it could be interesting. You could only start a mek with kff in the stompa while its in deep strike as that combo takes you to just under half your points.
[/spoiler]
Is definitely the opposite of what I play I wonder, how do you deal with the chaff? Shoota boyz? Doesn't that works against you if you wanna attack juicy targets on the backline?
You definitely have a strong T2 thanks also to the new FAQs helping the stormboyz. But I feel that if you would go second, you wouldn't survive 2 rounds of shooting and all your nobz and warboss would be sorely exposed to enemy fire. 5++ is good but is not a game changer.
What does back seat driver provide? I think I missed that trait
For information I play
At 1750
Dakkajet 6 supashoota * 2
Wazbomb KFF 1 supashoota
Warboss on bike relic klaw
2 weirboy
SSAG
Mek on bike KFF 10*2 grots
30 shoota boyz
1 gorkanaut
3 Smashaguns
3 Traktor kannon
5 stormboyz
At 2000
Take off stormboyz
Add 1 gorkanaut
All freebooterz
2019/05/09 15:23:28
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
So far I've just embraced the chaff with my da jumped boyz and then fought a second time ideally tri-pointing a model the second time I fight in order to prevent them being shot in the opponents turn.
My SSAG and smasha gunz are the only range really. Backline targets can be hit by the SSAG big killa Meks shooting which get +1 to wound naturally or an additional +1 to wound if I use the Death skulls strat.
I deep strike or mount 70% of my army not only to keep my drops down to 17 but also to keep the army safe.
The 18" 5++ is to give the battlewagons some staying power. I fully expect at least 1 battlewagon to die if I don't go first (probably 2) but the grots within will take the casualties as a result of 1s and then be set up in such away that the characters that came out of the destroyed battle wagon aren't the closest model. If needed they can even be used as a grot shield if someone is trying to snipe the now semi exposed characters.
Both meks (who aren't mounted as 1 provides kff and the other is not the same clan) are equiped with grot rigger predominantly to add some protection from snipers.
Back seat driver adds +1 to movement of the vehicle the character is in and also (and more importantly) gives the vehicle ere we go. If the warbosses initial vehicle is destroyed he can just hop in another t2. Any (top bracket) battlewagon hes in will have 12 + 1 (for evil sunz) + 1 (for back seat driver) + d6+1 (for advance) + 3d6 rerollable (back seat driver + ramming speed) provided its within 6 of my wartrike.
What helped the stormboyz in the new faqbtw? The main thing that improved orks was the ability to warpath a squad before sending them into combat.
Do you da jump the shoota boyz? I assume you take da jump, is warpath your other psychic power?
2019/05/09 17:00:21
Subject: Re:No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
Just a very quick question.
I have seen it mentioned multiple times in this thread as well as other places.
People seem to believe that there is an immenent points drop coming for orks.
Is there a date for this or is it simply an assumption?
Armies:
2019/05/09 17:10:36
Subject: Re:No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
Chaos Legionnaire wrote: Just a very quick question.
I have seen it mentioned multiple times in this thread as well as other places.
People seem to believe that there is an immenent points drop coming for orks.
Is there a date for this or is it simply an assumption?
pure assumption
that would have been in the FAQ if it were to be addressed. the nexty points drop possibility will be in chapter approved where they do most of the points changes for balance but that will not be until Q4 2019 so at least 3 more months.
as for why orks would get points down and what units. the FAQ killed loota bomb and orks are not really performing that great in tournaments, they are kind of a gate keeper army. people prepare to see them and have to be abel to beat us to get to the top tables, but our army does not actually make it to the top tables often in larger events.
there are a lot of units that need points decreases to be usable but that does not mean GW will actually give them drops. nobody on the rules team seems to play orks and it shows. its a chaos, eldar and imperium edition as it has been for the last 3 editions (special mention to tau somebody msut have taken them up as they are now getting more podium placements these days and might be the new top dog but that remains to be seen)
10000 points 7000 6000 5000 5000 2000
2019/05/09 17:35:33
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
I still don't buy into the mindset that we're "not top table material" or "gatekeepers". The OP has 4 armies that placed in the top 3 for tournaments, and we had two armies make it into the top 20 (in an 800+ person tournament) a few months back or so. At the end of the day, I think we probably have one of the best, if not *the* best mono army in the game right now. Even with the Loota nerf. And while I agree we can't stack up to Imp Soup or Flyer Spam, if those are the only two army types that can keep us down, then I can't really complain.
2019/05/09 18:47:08
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
gungo wrote: To answer the question above about how storm boyz got better in the faq. Fly was fixed
This, you can jump over chaff in order to charge backline.
I like your strategy, one question though, how do you keep pace with the mek?
I usually take da jamp and warpath, also da fist if vs hordes. I usually jump the boyz t1 vs gunline, vs hordes I wait T2, or da Jump Just within 18" in some odd corner in order to:
Distract the opponent fire
Bait the mainline in be disrupted
Shoot em and proc +1 for the dakkajet that will proc for the rest of the army with help of the gunz.
So far I beaten everything but those goddamn Ad mech and their broke dakkabots. Dude they need to go
90 points for a dreadnaught that kan shoot 18 shots with 6MW, reroll to hit and W and his turn get 4++???? GTFO!!!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
flandarz wrote: I still don't buy into the mindset that we're "not top table material" or "gatekeepers". The OP has 4 armies that placed in the top 3 for tournaments, and we had two armies make it into the top 20 (in an 800+ person tournament) a few months back or so. At the end of the day, I think we probably have one of the best, if not *the* best mono army in the game right now. Even with the Loota nerf. And while I agree we can't stack up to Imp Soup or Flyer Spam, if those are the only two army types that can keep us down, then I can't really complain.
Agree 100%. How allies works is completely broken, otherwise any other codex 1 vs 1 really struggle vs orks
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/09 18:48:41
2019/05/09 19:11:27
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
gungo wrote: To answer the question above about how storm boyz got better in the faq. Fly was fixed
This, you can jump over chaff in order to charge backline.
I like your strategy, one question though, how do you keep pace with the mek?
I usually take da jamp and warpath, also da fist if vs hordes. I usually jump the boyz t1 vs gunline, vs hordes I wait T2, or da Jump Just within 18" in some odd corner in order to:
Distract the opponent fire
Bait the mainline in be disrupted
Shoot em and proc +1 for the dakkajet that will proc for the rest of the army with help of the gunz.
So far I beaten everything but those goddamn Ad mech and their broke dakkabots. Dude they need to go
90 points for a dreadnaught that kan shoot 18 shots with 6MW, reroll to hit and W and his turn get 4++???? GTFO!!!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
flandarz wrote: I still don't buy into the mindset that we're "not top table material" or "gatekeepers". The OP has 4 armies that placed in the top 3 for tournaments, and we had two armies make it into the top 20 (in an 800+ person tournament) a few months back or so. At the end of the day, I think we probably have one of the best, if not *the* best mono army in the game right now. Even with the Loota nerf. And while I agree we can't stack up to Imp Soup or Flyer Spam, if those are the only two army types that can keep us down, then I can't really complain.
Agree 100%. How allies works is completely broken, otherwise any other codex 1 vs 1 really struggle vs orks
Just to clarify in case your opponent is playing those Kastelan Robots wrong - they're 110 points and can't really have a 4+ invulnerable (which is only against ranged attacks) and 18 shots in the same turn due to having to change their protocols (unless he uses a stratagem which can only work on them once, after that they are stuck in their current protocol), they can't re-roll wounds at all while they are also fishing out mortal wounds (it takes different Forgeworld dogmas, the re-roll wounds are only through a relic and are restrictive) and they can't move at all if they are shooting 18 shots. They're great, to be sure, but they don't play quite like you described. They'll go down quickly to Lootas and SSAG both shooting twice and are pretty much out of the game if you get them in melee because they can't fall back if they're shooting twice. I play both Ad Mech and Orks but I've never played Vs Ad Mech as Orks. In my mind the trick to win would be deesptrike, da jump, fighting twice, Greentide strat etc, really play to Orks' strengths.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/05/09 19:13:12
2019/05/09 19:58:42
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
Jidmah wrote: 1 CP infantry only, outside of 3-4 MANz, characters or 20 boyz it's completely useless, and even those applications aren't great.
IMO, the only reason to play blood axes is to have a grot battalion with CP regeneration trait on a SAG.
I think blood axe kommandoez can be pretty handy for scoring. 3+ armored deepstriking orks for just 8 ppm are neat.
Don't kommandos only get 4+ to their save from being in cover? It doesn't stack, it replaces the usual +1 to a +2 instead for when they're in cover. And although it does synergize with their ability, I find that the 18" range for being in cover in the open makes it limited even if you deep strike them. Deffskull kommandos are still probably the best ones, thanks to them having obsec.
2019/05/09 20:21:48
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
Yeah, just a 4+. But they'll get it "all the time" as long as shots are coming from 19+ inches away. Not bad, but I don't think the Blood Axe Kulture is really worth it, even for that. Rarely do battles remain outside of 18", since 18" is kind of the median range for most guns. And Kommandos have such short range weapons that you'll want to be inside 18" yourself. It'd be a much more useful Kultur if it was -1 to hit outside of 18" instead. Pair that with a KFF, and Ork survivability skyrockets.
2019/05/09 21:06:23
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
gungo wrote: To answer the question above about how storm boyz got better in the faq. Fly was fixed
This, you can jump over chaff in order to charge backline.
I like your strategy, one question though, how do you keep pace with the mek?
I usually take da jamp and warpath, also da fist if vs hordes. I usually jump the boyz t1 vs gunline, vs hordes I wait T2, or da Jump Just within 18" in some odd corner in order to:
Distract the opponent fire
Bait the mainline in be disrupted
Shoot em and proc +1 for the dakkajet that will proc for the rest of the army with help of the gunz.
So far I beaten everything but those goddamn Ad mech and their broke dakkabots. Dude they need to go
90 points for a dreadnaught that kan shoot 18 shots with 6MW, reroll to hit and W and his turn get 4++???? GTFO!!!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
flandarz wrote: I still don't buy into the mindset that we're "not top table material" or "gatekeepers". The OP has 4 armies that placed in the top 3 for tournaments, and we had two armies make it into the top 20 (in an 800+ person tournament) a few months back or so. At the end of the day, I think we probably have one of the best, if not *the* best mono army in the game right now. Even with the Loota nerf. And while I agree we can't stack up to Imp Soup or Flyer Spam, if those are the only two army types that can keep us down, then I can't really complain.
Agree 100%. How allies works is completely broken, otherwise any other codex 1 vs 1 really struggle vs orks
Just to clarify in case your opponent is playing those Kastelan Robots wrong - they're 110 points and can't really have a 4+ invulnerable (which is only against ranged attacks) and 18 shots in the same turn due to having to change their protocols (unless he uses a stratagem which can only work on them once, after that they are stuck in their current protocol), they can't re-roll wounds at all while they are also fishing out mortal wounds (it takes different Forgeworld dogmas, the re-roll wounds are only through a relic and are restrictive) and they can't move at all if they are shooting 18 shots. They're great, to be sure, but they don't play quite like you described. They'll go down quickly to Lootas and SSAG both shooting twice and are pretty much out of the game if you get them in melee because they can't fall back if they're shooting twice. I play both Ad Mech and Orks but I've never played Vs Ad Mech as Orks. In my mind the trick to win would be deesptrike, da jump, fighting twice, Greentide strat etc, really play to Orks' strengths.
What happened is that he had the 4++ when I had T1, than changed protocol in his T1 and was backed by Cawl and some other stratagem shenanigans.
I really hope he misunderstood because otherwise they are completely broke
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/09 21:07:10
2019/05/09 21:31:12
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
If you feel like something might be broken, you're always within your rights to ask to see the source material your opponent is using for his army and his actions. Look it over and make sure it's on the up and up. But also remember that your opponent is human too. He/she might make mistakes or misread things.
2019/05/09 22:29:10
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
flandarz wrote: Yeah, just a 4+. But they'll get it "all the time" as long as shots are coming from 19+ inches away. Not bad, but I don't think the Blood Axe Kulture is really worth it, even for that. Rarely do battles remain outside of 18", since 18" is kind of the median range for most guns. And Kommandos have such short range weapons that you'll want to be inside 18" yourself. It'd be a much more useful Kultur if it was -1 to hit outside of 18" instead. Pair that with a KFF, and Ork survivability skyrockets.
Even making it +1 cover for shots outside of 12" would make it more palatable. I'm not sure how we'd buff the falling back ability though, beyond letting us fall back and shoot+charge, rather than just one.
2019/05/09 22:46:13
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
Yeah. It's kinda sad how disparate the Kulturz are in viability. You got real great Kulturs like Death Skullz and Evil Sunz. You got pretty good ones like Blood Moonz and Freebooterz (I kinda think Blood Moonz dropped a bit since you can't Mob Up your Lootaz anymore). Then you got Blood Axez, Goffz, and Snakebitez, which I consider to be (at best) no better than just going with no Kultur. Outside of fringe situations, of course.
2019/05/09 23:08:37
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
flandarz wrote: Yeah. It's kinda sad how disparate the Kulturz are in viability. You got real great Kulturs like Death Skullz and Evil Sunz. You got pretty good ones like Blood Moonz and Freebooterz (I kinda think Blood Moonz dropped a bit since you can't Mob Up your Lootaz anymore). Then you got Blood Axez, Goffz, and Snakebitez, which I consider to be (at best) no better than just going with no Kultur. Outside of fringe situations, of course.
Seems par for the course like most books though, GW have a hard time balancing them one another, much less against other books. How often do you see White Scars SM, Biel-Tan Eldar or Armageddon Steel Legion IG? Even with the recent Vigilus book, GW managed to overshadow a lot of the legion traits with the specific renegade traits.
I hope at some point that GW gives us a Grot Kultur via White Dwarf or one of the expansion books, it's something woefully lacking when regarding any non-Mek gun Grot unit in the army.
2019/05/10 00:24:31
Subject: No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
flandarz wrote: That's fair. I just feel like it sucks more for Orkz than for a lot of other Factions, simply because Ork Kulturz are so different in lore.
True dat. It also doesn't help that what we have is literally all we got. Imperials at the very least you can have "counts-as" for a lot of factions with soup, even Eldar to an extent with since they have Ynnari, Harlequins, and DE. Even Tyranids have GSC now. It's really just Tau, Necrons and Orks that have no friends to make up for any lacklustre faction rules.
2019/05/10 01:31:34
Subject: Re:No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
A few more unnamed or xenos only units would be nice like the ambul but more exotic. Maybe with a strategem like the assassins one. In essence like the damn endless spells from AOS.
2019/05/10 05:35:01
Subject: Re:No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread (8th edition codex post FAQ)
I played around with Blood Axes when the codex first dropped. Mostly because I've always been a Blood Axe player due to fluff.
The problems with the kultur have already been stated. 1. Orks tend to want to be within 18" of the enemy, and so the always being in cover thing only helps them 1 .
2. Orks rarely fall back, and most of the time your opponent falls back first and so the other part of the kultur ends up doing nothing.
Now where this kultur shines is on what are currently overpriced units. It works well I'm a gunwagon, it would be useful in a buggy themed army, and it adds durability to our flyers.
So, if gw where to lower the points on our bikes, buggies, wartrike and gunwagon you could build an effective Blood Axe army, but until those units are made playable, players are better off taking a kultur that benefits the units that are usable.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/05/10 05:35:42
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