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addnid wrote:

 deffrekka wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
My store isnt a proper GW store though, in fact 40k is like a quarter of the people that regular the place.

Mine isnt a GW either. Most of the people who go play Magic or Transformers. I had to run a 40k campaign just to get games, and now ive got a rota set up so more tabletop games are played instead of just card games (as i dont play card games, nothing against them, just arent my thing). In my area I am the only Ork and Admech player. Its mainly Marines, one Dark Eldar player, a handful of T'au, GSC and Nid players and then Guard and Sisters. I tend to get 3 games on a Saturday and thats it, but before January I took a looooong ass break from 40k, since May last year as I couldnt stand 8th (still cant stand it but 30k has died out pretty badly so what can you do haha!).

Transformers is a game ??

A card game yea. If it were tabletop id be all over it

theres cardgames for just about everything. Vastly easier to print them vs tabletop wargames so people are more willing to just "try" with a bs cardgame. If it flops, eh not out much. If it explodes in popularity WINWINWIN!!

I know some people that would freak out if a transformers (or Gundam) Wargaming game popped up

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
If I cut off your head, Jid and you cut off my arm and broke my back, who would you say has "won" the fight?

Me. Because i never lose. If I win, I win, if I die it doesn't count, because I'm dead. And if I run away, I can come back to win another day. Waaagh!

 Vineheart01 wrote:
theres cardgames for just about everything. Vastly easier to print them vs tabletop wargames so people are more willing to just "try" with a bs cardgame. If it flops, eh not out much. If it explodes in popularity WINWINWIN!!

I know some people that would freak out if a transformers (or Gundam) Wargaming game popped up

Tbh id play a Transformers wargame hahaha I just dislike card games with a passion and what its been doing to my community is pushing people further from the hobby as card game require less time, space and skill. They prefer the less effort and ease of access than the 40k grind hahaha the campaign ive started has atleast added to people to play against and get people building and painting again. A lot of people in my area arent really fond of 8th, with like the character rules, all the auras and rerolls.

 deffrekka wrote:

addnid wrote:
Guys do you know if by the 29th we will have the rules out ? Sorry for asking, the info was surely written here somewhere

Preorder 21st, out by the 28th is my Bet. Otherwise it wont be a March release. Unless they pull an Orktober and release it the next month haha

Except for GW it's the preorder that counts as release day. 29.2 preorders were february releases. Not march.

Though I agree 21.3 is the likely preorder date. I was somewhat waiting sisters to be 21 and 28 for preorders but gw pulled surprise move there putting them before PA AND having 8 kits at once. Had they been 21 and 28 for preorder though would have fulfilled gw's promise of all in march. All would be in preorder in march.

Hello there! I'm wanting to take my boys to non-gw tournaments and after delaying it for long enough I'm looking to finally make the switch to 32mm bases. I have well over 200 boys that need doing so are looking for the most economical/quick way. How have you guys coped? Cheers

PS: grats @Englishman on the news

There's a company or two that sells ring adapters to move 25MM up to 32MM rounds. Here's one site there's another that makes them in MDF, can't find it just now.
https://www.eccentricminiatures.com/adapterrings.html


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Here's another one MDF rings. Bulk deal looks good.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/200x-3mm-MDF-Adapter-25mm-To-32mm-Round-Base-War-Hammer-40K-Age-Of-Sigmar-AOS/141560835101?hash=item20f5aeec1d:g:zaoAAOSw05leMkrg

generally unless they require it at said tourny i dont think anybody has made the change.
I sure havnt. Im not rebasing 300+ models. That is a lot more time/money than people realize.

So Long, Uncontrolled Bursts used on a Chinork potentially confers a hit modifier to the passengers.

Couple things I’d like to clarify:
1) does this prevent that? From the FAQ

Do Stratagems used on a Transport affect units embarked within that transport? For example, if I use More Dakka! on
a Battlewagon, do any units embarked inside benefit from it? In addition, can you use Stratagems on units embarked within a transport (e.g. can you use Showin’ Off on a Bad Moons Infantry unit embarked within a Battlewagon)?
A: No to both.

2) The trigger is if the Chinork targets a flying unit. Does that mean once it fires, the units inside can target any units for a bonus attack or just flying units?

That faq is specifically talking about Stratagems in general, such as "More Dakka" not transferring.
Open Topped still transfers modifiers, so while theyre not affected by the stratagem/aura they still get the +1 since its a modifier on the transport.

I forget the exact wording on Uncontrolled Bursts. Does it say "use this when fly targets fly, that unit gets +1 to hit until the end of the phase" or "...+1 to hit when targeting fliers"

A conditional modifier wouldnt transfer because it wouldnt be actively in effect if the unit inside is firing, since it requires the transport to be firing to set it off. But if that +1 lasts the phase, golden.

1) the Stratagem isn't affecting the embarked unit; the Open-Topped rule is.

2) the Strategem states that the +1 only applies to shooting attacks made against units that can FLY.

 Jidmah wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
If I cut off your head, Jid and you cut off my arm and broke my back, who would you say has "won" the fight?

Me. Because i never lose. If I win, I win, if I die it doesn't count, because I'm dead. And if I run away, I can come back to win another day. Waaagh!

I submit to this irrefutable logic.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
That faq is specifically talking about Stratagems in general, such as "More Dakka" not transferring.
Open Topped still transfers modifiers, so while theyre not affected by the stratagem/aura they still get the +1 since its a modifier on the transport.

I forget the exact wording on Uncontrolled Bursts. Does it say "use this when fly targets fly, that unit gets +1 to hit until the end of the phase" or "...+1 to hit when targeting fliers"

A conditional modifier wouldnt transfer because it wouldnt be actively in effect if the unit inside is firing, since it requires the transport to be firing to set it off. But if that +1 lasts the phase, golden.

So if I understand this correctly, the way I should think of it is:

Both transport and passengers gain an ability where by if they target a flying unit, they get +1 to hit.

This might all be moot in 2 months anyway. FW codex are last chance to buy. Wonder if the Chinork gets the axe :(

No, the unit inside wouldnt get it because its a conditional effect not a flat modifier.

Open Topped does not transfer rules, otherwise stratagems and auras WOULD affect them. It transfers static modifiers, which Uncontrolled Bursts is not a static modifier (i.e. once its applied its there until the end of the phase or later).

If the modifier goes away because the unit is no longer targeting a specific unit, no transfer.

Its annoying, and people will fight you tooth and nail for the 1 rule that does work (freeboota aura +1 to hit is a static modifier and does transfer once the transport has it at all) because of that stupid stratagem faq, no matter how much you state the stratagem/aura is not being transferred, the specific effect is.

I wish they'd revamp how embarked units work. The ruling that theyre "technically not there" is beyond stupid and breaks way too many molds.

Wording is as such:

Use this Stratagem at the start of your Shooting phase. Select an ORK VEHICLE unit from your army that can FLY. Until the end of the phase, add 1 to hit rolls for shooting attacks made by that unit that target enemy units that can FLY.

This is the wording for LUB:

"Use this Stratagem at the start of your Shooting phase. Select an ORK VEHICLE unit from your army that can
FLY. Until the end of the phase, add 1 to hit rolls for
shooting attacks made by that unit that target enemy units
that can FLY."

 Vineheart01 wrote:
generally unless they require it at said tourny i dont think anybody has made the change.
I sure havnt. Im not rebasing 300+ models. That is a lot more time/money than people realize.

The adapter ring route really isn't too bad if you buy in bulk. It took me $22 and probably 6 hours to get all of the rings on my 90+ boys.

its all a confusing mess, i dunno how many times i've emailed GW about open-topped.
But i dont think LUB transfers, since it only gives the +1 when "that unit targets a unit that can FLY" - the embarked unit is not "that unit" so it cant trigger the +1 to get transferred, since with that wording it goes away if they are not actively targeting a FLY unit.
And the condition is the stratagem itself anyway, which is specifically denied transferring to the embarked unit.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
its all a confusing mess, i dunno how many times i've emailed GW about open-topped.
But i dont think LUB transfers, since it only gives the +1 when "that unit targets a unit that can FLY" - the embarked unit is not "that unit" so it cant trigger the +1 to get transferred, since with that wording it goes away if they are not actively targeting a FLY unit.
And the condition is the stratagem itself anyway, which is specifically denied transferring to the embarked unit.

Yeah that’s why I want to get the order of operations here right.

And why I’m confused. So does the Chinork need to go first and it’s fine until end of phase? But does the modifier drop as soon as the shooting sequence ends?

The effect "when you target a fly" lasts the phase, but you are no longer targeting a unit that can fly when you are done shooting so the +1 goes away correct.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
The effect "when you target a fly" lasts the phase, but you are no longer targeting a unit that can fly when you are done shooting so the +1 goes away correct.

Anyone got an argument otherwise?

Sounds like a case where the unit gets the bonus hit but never gets a chance to use it. Boo.

I seem to remember everyone's favorite rules lawyer (I actually mean that sincerely and not in a snarky manner) BaconCatBug ruled against it transferring to the occupants of the chinork. This was back around a month or so after the Ork codex so that post is probably still somewhere in this thread.

But yeah, I'd assume it doesn't work so confer with your opponent/TO before actually trying to use it

The only open-topped transferring effect i will fight tooth and nail for is Freeboota +1 and any -1 to hit debuff that targets the vehicle (such as the Venator from Forgeworld, if a vehicle it shot suffers a wound it has a -1 to hit)

Those are constant modifiers that are always there once applied for a phase/turn. Only others i can think of are like LUB where its a specific condition while that unit is actively doing something.

One of the few times i played solid freeboota i tried to say this was a thing and my opponent (who ironically had a venator) tried to dispute it, and then immediately claim the -1 applies to the embarked unit too. Picked up my models and walked away refusing to play him again, hate people who selectively approve of rules.

Freeboota aura is no question from me. If the trukk gets the bonus, the passengers do, and you can *easily* make the argument. If the trukk also gets a negative, they also do. It even makes sense from RAI (if something is affecting the trukk, you'd think the passengers would also be affected).

This was an odd edge case. LUB was probably not written with the Chinork in mind. It was also just a nice side benefit of what I'd consider a useful transport (it honestly just makes some units insanely powerful if they could get a cheap +1 to hit vs flyers).

 DrGiggles wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
generally unless they require it at said tourny i dont think anybody has made the change.
I sure havnt. Im not rebasing 300+ models. That is a lot more time/money than people realize.

The adapter ring route really isn't too bad if you buy in bulk. It took me $22 and probably 6 hours to get all of the rings on my 90+ boys.

It's not just bases though but also movement trays. And some basing systems are hard to extend from already made base to other without looking silly or being extra hard.

Right gents I know it's off topic but you'll be pleased to know I'm having a Boy. So I'll now have a couple of Boyz!

Thanks for all the well wishes. Much appreciated ya soppy gits!

Good on ya buddy!

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Right gents I know it's off topic but you'll be pleased to know I'm having a Boy. So I'll now have a couple of Boyz!

Thanks for all the well wishes. Much appreciated ya soppy gits!

Congrats AAE!

Congratz!

Also do people really use movement trays for melee armies? i find them irritating when assaults are involved.
I use them for my admech because it makes keeping the dozen or so 5x squads separated at a glance, but they generally never see melee. Tried it on my boyz once and it just irritated me to no end.

edit: and i dont feel bogged by moving tons of boyz. Just lay a short ruler infront of the furthest up boy and with both hands move the entire squad up appropriately. I spend 10x more time rolling Shoota damage via Badmoonz than i do moving lol

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Congratz!

Also do people really use movement trays for melee armies? i find them irritating when assaults are involved.
I use them for my admech because it makes keeping the dozen or so 5x squads separated at a glance, but they generally never see melee. Tried it on my boyz once and it just irritated me to no end.

Nope, over 13 years of playing Orkz I have mastered the art of moving mobs of boys super fast, I have never found in an arduous task