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 Grimskul wrote:

Drdotts wrote:
Hey does anyone run chinork warkoptas? And if so how do you represent them on the table top? I feel like they would be really strong transports but I never see them used

A lot of FW Ork models are currently not in use because of how weirdly they're priced at the moment, and that the FW indices are going to be overhauled in the near future. As far as the current rules go, their main problem is that they kind of run into the same issues that trukks come into, namely that most of our units don't benefit from the use of transports. Even worse, it's not open-topped for whatever reason, so even a shooty unit like tankbustas don't get to shoot the turn they deep strike. To make matters worse, they have a plethora of heavy weapons and no innate rule to ignore the movement penalty to moving and shooting with heavy weapons, so you'd have to waste Moar Dakka on it to make it shoot normally. So overall, I would tell you to save your time and money until we get revamped FW rules.

They are open topped my dude.

I'd actually describe them as better Trukks. Free deepstrike, they can underslung a KMB, they have the fly keyword, and they don't degrade like Trukks do in terms of movement.

They are more fragile, and slightly more expensive (12 points) then the actual trukk you wanna take (Rocket Trukk baby).

But FW might legends them for all we know ( I believe the model has been out of print for 10 years...), so kitbash one with that in mind.

tulun wrote:

 Grimskul wrote:

Drdotts wrote:
Hey does anyone run chinork warkoptas? And if so how do you represent them on the table top? I feel like they would be really strong transports but I never see them used

A lot of FW Ork models are currently not in use because of how weirdly they're priced at the moment, and that the FW indices are going to be overhauled in the near future. As far as the current rules go, their main problem is that they kind of run into the same issues that trukks come into, namely that most of our units don't benefit from the use of transports. Even worse, it's not open-topped for whatever reason, so even a shooty unit like tankbustas don't get to shoot the turn they deep strike. To make matters worse, they have a plethora of heavy weapons and no innate rule to ignore the movement penalty to moving and shooting with heavy weapons, so you'd have to waste Moar Dakka on it to make it shoot normally. So overall, I would tell you to save your time and money until we get revamped FW rules.

They are open topped my dude.

I'd actually describe them as better Trukks. Free deepstrike, they can underslung a KMB, they have the fly keyword, and they don't degrade like Trukks do in terms of movement.

They are more fragile, and slightly more expensive (12 points) then the actual trukk you wanna take (Rocket Trukk baby).

But FW might legends them for all we know ( I believe the model has been out of print for 10 years...), so kitbash one with that in mind.

Ah, I must have missed the FAQ for them that added that in. In that case, I see it only as a deepstrike alternative for tankbustas and that's about it to be honest. Even then, not being able to use strats for the tankbustas inside when they land means it's still not as strong as tellyporting them in for shoot twice with bad moons. In both instances, the transport and the unit inside are basically guaranteed to die from return fire, so it's based on whether or not you think the transport cost is worth as much as 2CP.

Hey does anyone run chinork warkoptas? And if so how do you represent them on the table top? I feel like they would be really strong transports but I never see them used

I'm regularly running one in my DS tourney list. Tankbustas in combination with 2 Meks with Kustoms slugga - the latter help me fill a brigade and offer the cheap ablative wounds (via oilers) needed when the chinork is blown up - which happens every game, since it's usually rather close to the opponent and is really easy to kill... But I really like the flexibility of a deepstriking transport with 3 separate units inside, 2 of which are characters. offers much potential for objective grabbing etc... I sometimes also run a second chinork with either boys or another unit of tankbustas (I then split the meks off and buy an additional bomb squig for each squad, so that I have to ablative wounds in each kopta...), but that's mostly for fun games, so many points in reserve usually don't work too well. I would strongly advice to swap the nose gun for the kustoms blasta - as DS, that's really nice. Oh, and don't ever expect the deff guns to do anything at all - approx. 4 shots hitting on 6 are usually disappointing. And I have never managed to drop both bombs and regard myself lucky if I get even one off...

 Grimskul wrote:


Ah, I must have missed the FAQ for them that added that in. In that case, I see it only as a deepstrike alternative for tankbustas and that's about it to be honest. Even then, not being able to use strats for the tankbustas inside when they land means it's still not as strong as tellyporting them in for shoot twice with bad moons. In both instances, the transport and the unit inside are basically guaranteed to die from return fire, so it's based on whether or not you think the transport cost is worth as much as 2CP.

Yeah, tankbustas are ideal. Flash Gits work well too. You could probably toss 10 Nobs in there if you really wanted to, but ya know, Orks are a shooting army.

I think this is overly dismissive. I've found them to be fine. The lack of stratagems on Tankbustas doesn't really matter, as tankbustas are really, really good as long as they are shooting at vehicles. Tossing them in a transport I've actually found they live a couple of turns, while deepstriking TB in is immediate death. If I shoot twice over two turns, it's like showing off for free.

The Chinork really is a more flexible trukk imo. Two less capacity is unfortunate, but otherwise, it's better in places where you're considering a Trukk.

I'm currently building a list that has an airwing with 1 Wazbomm and 2 burna bommers. Should I make them pyromaniacs for extra mortal wounds of keep them deff skulls for the smasha and mega cannons? Opinions?

 Jidmah wrote:
I'm currently building a list that has an airwing with 1 Wazbomm and 2 burna bommers. Should I make them pyromaniacs for extra mortal wounds of keep them deff skulls for the smasha and mega cannons? Opinions?

The more competitive option is probably giving it a proper main culture. It also means you can slot them in a battalion if you want without going for air wing.

Burna bombers are still good on MW in movement, and the real power in blowing yourself up is unchanged by culture.

tulun wrote:

 Grimskul wrote:


Ah, I must have missed the FAQ for them that added that in. In that case, I see it only as a deepstrike alternative for tankbustas and that's about it to be honest. Even then, not being able to use strats for the tankbustas inside when they land means it's still not as strong as tellyporting them in for shoot twice with bad moons. In both instances, the transport and the unit inside are basically guaranteed to die from return fire, so it's based on whether or not you think the transport cost is worth as much as 2CP.

Yeah, tankbustas are ideal. Flash Gits work well too. You could probably toss 10 Nobs in there if you really wanted to, but ya know, Orks are a shooting army.

I think this is overly dismissive. I've found them to be fine. The lack of stratagems on Tankbustas doesn't really matter, as tankbustas are really, really good as long as they are shooting at vehicles. Tossing them in a transport I've actually found they live a couple of turns, while deepstriking TB in is immediate death. If I shoot twice over two turns, it's like showing off for free.

The Chinork really is a more flexible trukk imo. Two less capacity is unfortunate, but otherwise, it's better in places where you're considering a Trukk.

I'll take your word for it, I don't see trukks as very useful outside of FG and Tankbusta platforms, so the chinork being better in that regard doesn't mean that much more to me competitively speaking. I'm all for people kitbashing proppa models for it rather than just going for the recast route though, so I'll see how they do in my next TTS game to see the difference myself.

Agree, I had them as part of my battalion but and was fiddling around with a big mek on warbike for my second KFF (with kleverest boss and killsaw), until I realized that a wazbom isn't that much more expensive that the mek, but does much way more damage at 36" range. So three planes are pretty much set in stone.

In case someone is interested:


Only 6 CP left, with two reserved for 'eadbuts and one or two for jumping the SJD to safety. Still want to give the list a try, enemy is probably going to be a rather competitive BA army, so it's a good chance to test stuff under pressure.
Also my first time trying to replace my warbikers with MANz in that list. I'm probably changing too much at once

 Grimskul wrote:


I'll take your word for it, I don't see trukks as very useful outside of FG and Tankbusta platforms, so the chinork being better in that regard doesn't mean that much more to me competitively speaking. I'm all for people kitbashing proppa models for it rather than just going for the recast route though, so I'll see how they do in my next TTS game to see the difference myself.

I think Flash Gits are competitive now in this meta Although how people use them still might be grot shields / tellyporta to save on points. I'm a big fan of TBs, but it really depends how often you see vehicles in your local meta.

If you take multiple units of Gits, having a transport option that can fly (you wanna usually do this in a vehicle heavy list, which means it's really easy to position it if it starts on the board since it can fly over your units, while the trukk might struggle... it also has 16" movement, and can advance 8" automatically) / DS for free doesn't seem bad. It's basically trading ~15 points at the cheapest for 2 CP (trukk vs Chinork), and both platforms will not withstand heavy fire anyway. But yeah, try away. I've had great experiences with them so far. Keep in mind they are currently NOT clan locked for transport, so you can have it be a Deathskull Chinork for the invul save / full re-rolls on the Kustom Mega Blasta while having whatever else you want inside.

The chinork is destined for legends as soon as the new forge world book is released. Which to be fair sounds like a bit off. The index is mostly obsolete so I’m unsure how people use it as almost every unit has An updated legends or codex dataslate.

Flash Gitz problem is your all in on that detachment you need to trigger the bonus and then you want other units to benefit. I’m glad they gave Gitz a new extended range strat. I wish kommandos and tankbustas got a new strat.

 Grimskul wrote:
Even worse, it's not open-topped for whatever reason, so even a shooty unit like tankbustas don't get to shoot the turn they deep strike.

Actually it has been errataed to be.

If you deseprately want to try burnas these could be useful as you can get them to range on T1 with burnas from inside and flamers on the kopta. More of casual game fun though. But at least you get to shoot with your burnas quaranteed(well unless you go 2nd and are facing indirect fire that can blow the kopter)

Drdotts wrote:
Hey does anyone run chinork warkoptas? And if so how do you represent them on the table top? I feel like they would be really strong transports but I never see them used

You can cobble together a. Chinork from a Trukk and two Deff Koptas. I use mine to transport Freebootaz Flash Gitz - if you have to take a deduction for moving Heavy Wpns, it might as well be them. Then Loot It for a 3+ save :-)

gungo wrote:

Flash Gitz problem is your all in on that detachment you need to trigger the bonus and then you want other units to benefit. I’m glad they gave Gitz a new extended range strat. I wish kommandos and tankbustas got a new strat.

a smasha gun battalion solves that problem. you can still bring a deathskull/dreadwaagh as a second bat.

badruk with mek KFF as HQ 3x10 gretchin to shield the gits as troops, 10Flashgitz and 6-10 smashas

thats about 600-900 points and a solid base for a list. you could expand with a dakkajet and/or burna, maybe even a gunwagon with the boomer and 4 bigshootaz. plenty opportunities to get the trait off : )


Edit:
what extended range strat?

Edit2:
that's my chinork (frontgun was magnetized and is missing^^)

RedNoak wrote:

Edit:
what extended range strat?

One of the Saga of the Beast stratagems: Speshul Shells - 2CP - Extend the range of a Flash Gitz unit by 12" for a shooting phase.

+12" sounds pretty useful... although damn pricey for 2CP

RedNoak wrote:
+12" sounds pretty useful... although damn pricey for 2CP

It would probably be borderline insane at 1 CP. Range is really the only drawback Gits have over Lootas.

Yeah, after their chapter approved points drop I've had quite a bit of success running 2 decent sized units of gitz with Baddrukk around. Though early and late game they tend to really feel the limits of their range. It's in the midgame where there is target saturation midfield do they pump out the damage.

its one of those weird situational stratagems. 1cp for +12" range would be insane, but 2cp feels way overpriced given how cp hungry orks are to function.
I think if it added something else to make it more worth the 2cp it'd be fine. As is i dunno if i'd use it, i usually only have 6cp left over to do things with nowadays

 Vineheart01 wrote:
1cp for +12" range would be insane, but 2cp feels way overpriced given how cp hungry orks are to function.

Agreed, maybe 1CP & Once per battle would be the best price point.

As it is, as you said it's a situational stratagem. Not to be used every game, but to be kept in mind for situation where it really makes a difference.

I’m liking my Mek guns in my grot detachment... reroll 1s and 6++ is useful. Add the da jump weirdboy to the list and he can send out obj camping grots that are a little bit harder to kill as well.

I was hoping grot detachment and the new strats would make kans good again but while better they are still not competitive.

gungo wrote:
I’m liking my Mek guns in my grot detachment... reroll 1s and 6++ is useful. Add the da jump weirdboy to the list and he can send out obj camping grots that are a little bit harder to kill as well.

I was hoping grot detachment and the new strats would make kans good again but while better they are still not competitive.

I think the problem is that Kanz just aren't a good shooting platform, so you kinda have to go all in on their CC aspect instead. If we could replace the klaw with ranged weapons like another rokkit launcha, then I think they would be able to utilize the reroll one's to hit more effectively and then sparkly bitz wouldn't be a complete waste on them.

One thing that has popped into my mind. How good would Deffkopta spam be in the current meta? Make em speed freaks and throw in a wartrike and you've got 23" move before even rolling for charge.

at that point i'd be swapping to koptas for the sheer mobility and still having some form of melee (it isnt...amazing but its way better than nothing).
Yeah, koptas are hitting on 5s, but the way they operate thats not too big an issue (deathskullz perk).

Also koptas dont fight for heavy slots, and kanz would not only be battling for the slot but also the detachment since they'd want grotmobz. Boomboyz would affect them still of course but i still wonder if that one is worth using at all.

They are only a few points different as it is (remember the kan klaw is free atm, if it could be swapped it would have to be priced)

I've been watching the AoW 40k streams recently and Marky Perry has been running Kans, Deffkoptas, and Nob Bikers in lists all as evil sunz speed freaks. It's interesting to see in action, he's effectively using the Speed Freeks detachment to get those obscene movements across the board and uses wartrikes to enable the advance and charge. Kans are a bit more passive in function but are basically a big meaty screen. He's been testing it against Nick Nanavati and Richard Siegler with some success, so there's definitely merit to these ideas.

It's a shame that the Deffkoptas aren't affected by any of the Kustom Jobs. Giving them Sparkly bitz or Dirty gubbinz would be pretty fun.

But yeah, if running them in larger units as an outrider or a distraction force I'm not sure if Deffskulls are that useful. Evil suns gives 4" of movement if you get to advance and charge. Freebootaz lets you model them as tiny flying pirate ships and try to support one another by killing stuff (or work with a flying wing to double down on the theme) Boomboyz with the rokkits does give a nice little bump in damage.

Actually, thinking back to the blue boyz, Mechanical seizures would be quite good for upping the koptas output in both ranged and melee if you ganged up on one poor bastard or centrepiece unit. Though evil suns does let you use visions to get a bunch of re-rolls.

Flyboyz could be interesting if you're spamming koptas and stormboyz, but there's still a fair bit of ignores cover about.

I do like the KMB and Rocket Kopta.

But I dunno. 3 Big Shootas Deff Koptas is basically a Mega Trakk (2 rockets ones is ~1 mega trakk). And if you want a combat heavy unit, you can give double their output for 1 CP.

I wager you'd be better served taking 1 Mega trakk instead over ~3 koptas. Combo it with Seizure too.

cody.d. wrote:
One thing that has popped into my mind. How good would Deffkopta spam be in the current meta? Make em speed freaks and throw in a wartrike and you've got 23" move before even rolling for charge.

I have tons of koptas left from 5th, but sadly spamming them is something that didn't work well for me.

Units of 5 still have the moral problem of being just ld7. While it's not trivial to trigger that from shooting(weapons that can do that tend to be wasted on koptas), getting charged by a DP, dread or a HQ with a relic weapon can easily cause multiple koptas do implode and then you lose your unit.
Having a warboss or a slightly larger mob of boyz/warbikers nearby is pretty much mandatory.
In addition, units of 5 really shine when they can use long, uncontrolled bursts to destroy FLY units which are not hard to hit. Outside of that, I usually use them as deep striking unit that doesn't cost any of my valuable CP.
Due to FLY they can enter buildings, assassinate characters and fly over screens to tie down valuable units. However, you don't really need 15 models doing that, and buggies (even the KBB) just provide much more value when you just stand and shoot from a safe distance.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
its one of those weird situational stratagems. 1cp for +12" range would be insane, but 2cp feels way overpriced given how cp hungry orks are to function.
I think if it added something else to make it more worth the 2cp it'd be fine. As is i dunno if i'd use it, i usually only have 6cp left over to do things with nowadays

Sisters have similar 12" boost for multi melta retributors that also gives +1 damage. Though the range bonus isn't as essential as they can move 6" and shoot without -1.

Also +1 dam is "bit" different to 4 multi meltas than 10 flashgits.

cody.d. wrote:
One thing that has popped into my mind. How good would Deffkopta spam be in the current meta? Make em speed freaks and throw in a wartrike and you've got 23" move before even rolling for charge.

I like deffkoptas but I’m not exactly sure they will be in our next codex unless they get a new model. I don’t see the current model surviving the transition.

I find deffkoptas speed fine thier issue is expensive rokkits and poor shooting platforms. They also lost a lot of options like kmg and bombs. If we ever get a new model I think giving them bombs and having those bombs be affected by pyro subkulture would make them better.

Right now the best load out for deffkoptas are flyboys or bloodaxe w the new psyker. They become essentially 3+ save models that are ok in combat and either have -1 to hit in melee or can’t be hit by overwatch. Regardless koptas are mostly for objectives or filling out a brigade.

Now that people have had some time to try out the new SoTB rules, has there been a consensus on which kustom jobs are worth getting for the buggies? I know the the Souped Up Speshul, Nitro Squigs and Sizzly Rivets are more on the "no" column for competitive games, but how about Korkscrew or the Gyroscopic Whirlygig? I feel like the latter has character assassinating potential, as well as late game grabbing opportunities, and Korkscrew could give some much needed punch to finish off a weakened unit or vehicle. Gork's Roar seems like a good buff as well if you deign to take a Wartrike, since it gives him near guaranteed screen clearing capabilities. I'm currently making a Deffskull Brigade list and I'm figuring out whether or not I should take both the Korkscrew and Gyroscopic Kustom Jobs but that means I have a leftover spot in my FA slot that I think would be better filled if there was only one or the other.