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The only thing I don’t like about the new morale rules are it’s a lot more dice rolling and slowing the game down.

Before it was one dice roll and math (minus any free rerolls or gak)
Now it’s one dice roll and math and a die roll for every other model

As people stated it’s still going to be mostly passing for everyone followed by breaking heads or whatever their armies bespoke morale rule is.

It just seems like a whole lot of dice rolling for very little effect. They should have left the old rule of morale and just made it mandatory if you failed morale you always lose 1 model regardless of bespoke rules.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
just dawned on me that its actually possible for marines to fail morale now.
5man squad loses 3 dudes, thats less than half their numbers remaining so they get an additional -1 penalty.
Its still a 50-50 die roll and they can freely reroll it, but its a lot better than a third chance (or 1/6 if ultras).
I may actually see a marine player fail leadership for once. Even 10man hellblasters have never, ever failed LD for me.

The -1 is on extray casualties. You lose 3, he needs to roll 6 with reroll to fail. Then on 1-2 last marine runs.

So for numbers: after killing 3 from 5 strong squad 108 time 1 time half strength thing affected so you have 2 squads that are on last survivor, 1 dead and 105 squads with 2 marines each.

Until codex gives improved atsknf.

Out flanking Mek guns anyone?

We can do 4 Mek Guns for 1 CP, or 9 for 2 CP.

They don't get penalized for move and shoot, have good range, and now can line up on a board edge somewhere and get pot shots off before being shot back. With likely getting blast too, have them show up and melt a few nasty marine squads turn 2.

and they can be affected by these strats because they are Core, nor Ork.

thats just wrong lol.... i love it

Probably they still get to reroll, so that 50-50 becomes more like 30-70 but still better than now!

Yeah i misread what that extra -1 penalty was. Nvm thats definitely an anti-horde bit since it doesnt do anything unless you fail in the first place, it makes the extra fleeing models more likely not the failed test more likely.

Either way, its not that big of a deal. Odds are the last 5 boyz of a 30man squad are not going to completely run away, even with 1-2's fleeing (assuming the boss isnt nearby to punch'm into shape)

tulun wrote:
Out flanking Mek guns anyone?

We can do 4 Mek Guns for 1 CP, or 9 for 2 CP.

They don't get penalized for move and shoot, have good range, and now can line up on a board edge somewhere and get pot shots off before being shot back. With likely getting blast too, have them show up and melt a few nasty marine squads turn 2.

and they can be affected by these strats because they are Core, nor Ork.

That's actually a really cool idea for the new edition and a great way to take advantage of the new mobility options made available to vehicles now. Depending on how the Mek Gunz are costed in the new edition, this could make KMK more viable since the 36" range was always an issue compared to the smasha gun, this could be a good way to compensate for that.

 Grimskul wrote:

tulun wrote:
Out flanking Mek guns anyone?

We can do 4 Mek Guns for 1 CP, or 9 for 2 CP.

They don't get penalized for move and shoot, have good range, and now can line up on a board edge somewhere and get pot shots off before being shot back. With likely getting blast too, have them show up and melt a few nasty marine squads turn 2.

and they can be affected by these strats because they are Core, nor Ork.

That's actually a really cool idea for the new edition and a great way to take advantage of the new mobility options made available to vehicles now. Depending on how the Mek Gunz are costed in the new edition, this could make KMK more viable since the 36" range was always an issue compared to the smasha gun, this could be a good way to compensate for that.

I think it's useful tech.

Maybe even the best iteration -- 8 Mek Guns (16 PL) + new Big Mek w/ KFF (3 PL), for 2 CP.

I guess endless green tide has suddenly become much more reliable. And large mobs of killa kanz definitely like the new morale rules.

 Jidmah wrote:
I guess endless green tide has suddenly become much more reliable. And large mobs of killa kanz definitely like the new morale rules.

It was always a bit bizarre that a mob of 6 would lose a couple and then pretty much evaporate. Thematic, definitely, but still a bit gak. This will help a bit, which is nice.

Edit: Read one rule with 2 clauses as 2 seperate rules. Ignore me.

Flanking flash gits can also come handy. It would allow saving on the mandatory truck or wagon and since they are only 24", they are sometimes out of range turn 1 anyway.

Mercenaries coming to save the day! Ha!


Also, I think a unit of 20 boys (1cp) will be mandatory as reserves if nothing else to counter the enemies reserves.

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:
Flanking flash gits can also come handy. It would allow saving on the mandatory truck or wagon and since they are only 24", they are sometimes out of range turn 1 anyway.

Flash gitz will suffer the -1 penalty though as they're infantries. Yes they might be out of range turn one but they'll also be protected by a trukk (which may also be useful to give them 3+ thanks to Loot It! as soon as it gets wrecked) or by shielding grots.

I'm not crazy about the idea of outflanking mek gunz, because with the new table size range shouldn't be an issue (and only KMK have 36'', Smashas and Traktors are 48'') and if they are alone in the open they'll get assaulted immediately. Outflankning 10 tankbustas with 4 bomb squigs near some cover maybe? Cheaper than tellyporting the typical 15 man squad, in terms CP and points invested, and basically the same firepower.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 r_squared wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
I guess endless green tide has suddenly become much more reliable. And large mobs of killa kanz definitely like the new morale rules.

It was always a bit bizarre that a mob of 6 would lose a couple and then pretty much evaporate. Thematic, definitely, but still a bit gak. This will help a bit, which is nice.

This is very nice. Combined with the Tin Eadz bonus and a kustom job Killa Kanz will definitely see some games. Unless GW screws up and increases their points cost disproportionately.

 Blackie wrote:


I'm not crazy about the idea of outflanking mek gunz, because with the new table size range shouldn't be an issue (and only KMK have 36'', Smashas and Traktors are 48'') and if they are alone in the open they'll get assaulted immediately. Outflankning 10 tankbustas with 4 bomb squigs near some cover maybe? Cheaper than tellyporting the typical 15 man squad, in terms CP and points invested, and basically the same firepower.

you could open up a whole new flank... bring up a couple of mek guns and a big mob of boyz... maybe through in some hard melee stuff. you could trow in ALOT for 19 powerlevel

it depends on the enemy of course... but against castle armies with a lot of shooting, might be worth it

Mek Gun outflanking will have uses. Largely depends on the matchup and board.

I think people are underestimating obscuring terrain a bit.. it's really going to change how we play. Long range lines of sight are going to be really hard to draw unless you're busting up a Knight who can't hide behind obscuring.

Edit: Remember, positioning is going to *really* matter. The SSAG can at least be transported / Da Jumped; Mek Guns are largely immobile (3" movement). Getting them into a good shooting lane on a flank is probably going to be one of the best uses for them, especially as they can be outflanked for relatively cheaply.

tulun wrote:
Dense cover is confirmed in tyranid faction focus.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/06/23/faction-focus-tyranidsgw-homepage-post-4fw-homepage-post-4/

I am a fan

Tau can fire overwatch just like this edition.

IE: Every unit by default fires overwatch for free.

When flipping through our codex for things for tactical reserves, things that make sense have coming in from a flank are few and far between. Almost every unit that would make sense to put in reserves is 10 PL or more, which means you can just tellyport them instead wasting 2 CP on reserves.

So, to fill up those first 9 PL for 1 CP mostly gretchin units are worth considering:
- A mek gun is 2 PL each, you can have up to 4 coming in wherever you need.
- 3 killa kanz are 7PL
- 30 gretchin are 4 PL
- 10 gretchin are 1 PL, so there is no reason not fill up reserves with these little buggers.
- 5 nobz or flash gits are 7 PL
- bonebreaka and gunwagon are 9 PL
- bigtrakk is 9 PL

Hopefully powerlevel will get adjusted to match point costs, which would allow pairs of dreads or buggies to come in from the side as well.

 Jidmah wrote:


Hopefully powerlevel will get adjusted to match point costs, which would allow pairs of dreads or buggies to come in from the side as well.

I think they've said they are going to.

Remember, though -- if you have something that is 10 PL that you are considering tellyporting, and you are outflanking stuff that is 9 PL, you could outflank both for 2 CP, or tellyporta / outflank for 3 CP, as it is combined power level.

So the consideration at the 10ish PL range to outflank still largely depends if you are outflanking other units. If it's the only thing, of course, just port it.

A deathskull 12 attack bonebreaker charging 3d6, all for 4 cp (1 for the kustom job, 1 for the reserve strat, 2 for ram speed), could be a laugh.
Not a good use of cp, but a fun one

"The largest challenge for the T’au Empire in the new edition is the change to the Fly keyword. It no longer offers units the ability to Fall Back and shoot, which means you need to put extra effort into screening enemy charges and preventing your critical shooting units from being engaged in combat. Thankfully, screening is about to become much more effective. You can also look at new kinds of screening units, like Kroot, since you can now escape even when you’re surrounded."

tulun wrote:
"The largest challenge for the T’au Empire in the new edition is the change to the Fly keyword. It no longer offers units the ability to Fall Back and shoot, which means you need to put extra effort into screening enemy charges and preventing your critical shooting units from being engaged in combat. Thankfully, screening is about to become much more effective. You can also look at new kinds of screening units, like Kroot, since you can now escape even when you’re surrounded."

At last, the absolute bane of my meta is the FLY keyword.

 r_squared wrote:

tulun wrote:
"The largest challenge for the T’au Empire in the new edition is the change to the Fly keyword. It no longer offers units the ability to Fall Back and shoot, which means you need to put extra effort into screening enemy charges and preventing your critical shooting units from being engaged in combat. Thankfully, screening is about to become much more effective. You can also look at new kinds of screening units, like Kroot, since you can now escape even when you’re surrounded."

At last, the absolute bane of my meta is the FLY keyword.

They also announced the hit modifier rules in the same article.

Basically, it's what we expected (you add up / subtract all hit rolls, and if they exceed +1 or -1, they become +1 or -1). It means stuff like Flash gits will NEVER hit on a 6+, no matter what -- same with a Morkanaut with the new +BS trait. This is pretty nice for units that we can get to a BS4+, because it also means you should never have to use more Dakka on them unless you really want those bonus explosions.

It also means stuff like Dakka jets can now never hit on a 3+. Oh well.

tulun wrote:

 r_squared wrote:

tulun wrote:
"The largest challenge for the T’au Empire in the new edition is the change to the Fly keyword. It no longer offers units the ability to Fall Back and shoot, which means you need to put extra effort into screening enemy charges and preventing your critical shooting units from being engaged in combat. Thankfully, screening is about to become much more effective. You can also look at new kinds of screening units, like Kroot, since you can now escape even when you’re surrounded."

At last, the absolute bane of my meta is the FLY keyword.

They also announced the hit modifier rules in the same article.

Basically, it's what we expected (you add up / subtract all hit rolls, and if they exceed +1 or -1, they become +1 or -1). It means stuff like Flash gits will NEVER hit on a 6+, no matter what -- same with a Morkanaut with the new +BS trait. This is pretty nice for units that we can get to a BS4+, because it also means you should never have to use more Dakka on them unless you really want those bonus explosions.

It also means stuff like Dakka jets can now never hit on a 3+. Oh well.

How will flash gitz never hit on 6? They have Dakka Dakka Dakka...plus they said earlier that all hits of natural 6's will be a hit regardless of modifiers.

Sorry, so with these new rules

a BS4 model will only hit between a 3-5+.

IE: Flash Gits never have to use more dakka because they have been forced down to a 6+

tulun wrote:
Sorry, so with these new rules

a BS4 model will only hit between a 3-5+.

IE: Flash Gits never have to use more dakka because they have been forced down to a 6+

I'm almost 100% positive that an unmodified 6 will still count for dakka dakka dakka.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Dakka Dakka Dakka literally says: Each time you roll an unmodified hit roll of 6 for an attack with a ranged weapon by a model in this unit, that hit roll succeeds regardless of modifiers.

... you're missing the point here...

The worst Flash Gits ever hit on is a 5+ now.

That's a huge buff for them.

tulun wrote:
... you're missing the point here...

The worst Flash Gits ever hit on is a 5+ now.

That's a huge buff for them.

Ok, yes. See the way you wrote it though made it sound as if flash gitz would never hit on a 6.

 Haasbioroid wrote:

tulun wrote:
... you're missing the point here...

The worst Flash Gits ever hit on is a 5+ now.

That's a huge buff for them.

Ok, yes. See the way you wrote it though made it sound as if flash gitz would never hit on a 6.

He wrote it sorta clunky, yeah. But the point is that certain units will be able to always hit on something other than a 6

Similar for Mek Guns (and grot units in general). 5+ to hit at worse, potentially re-rolling ones.