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 Irbis wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
Or put Target Priority on the Librarian that won't be shooting anyway...

Yup, I was thinking 10 man Infiltrator squad with Target Priority Librarian to trigger more 6s while also empowering them with to hit rerolls. Pity mini-apothecary can't heal characters, tho.

That doesn't work. The ability only triggers on unmodified rolls of 6.

Bolter drill, on the other hand, happens on a 6+. Imagine some crimson fist intercessors firing 40 shots at a unit of 20+. They'd have 2 hits on a 4+ to hit. This is a great warlord trait for my army.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

bananathug wrote:
I'm not sure if redeploying 3 units is worth a warlord trait. It's an awesome ability but I just don't think it's worth giving up a warlord trait.

The +1 to hit one though. That's juicy. If it can be used by some DA (hopefully with the <chapter> key word) that will really help my jerks blowing up all over the place...

How is helping one unit a turn better than frickin redeployment, especially with these armies with crazy mobility?

Lets you do weird things like deploy the infantry back on your baseline during normal deployment to upset/confuse your opponents deployment/plan, then redeploy those cheeky phobos wearers into infiltration range afterwards.

The Lieutenant or a Librarian as a Warlord seems to be the strongest plays.

These sorts of things are what hero buffs should have been as opposed to passive buffs. Things where you have to make active decisions. Thumbs up.

The redeploy one looks fun. It allows you to screw up an opponent's counter deploy or allows you to deploy aggressively for a seize and they redeploy if you don't get it.

happy_inquisitor wrote:


"Codex: Chaos Space Marines and Chaos Space Marine Squad are now removed from the B200b range and are no longer subject to compulsory re-order"

What does this actually mean? What is the B200b range? Is this some sort of stock code for GW stores or something?

 BrotherGecko wrote:
The redeploy one looks fun. It allows you to screw up an opponent's counter deploy or allows you to deploy aggressively for a seize and they redeploy if you don't get it.

The problem with this is that you pick your warlord trait before knowing who’s going first. Even then though, being able to redeploy 30 infiltrators up front if going first or move some suppressors in/out of sight after a seize is pretty huge.

Mandragola wrote:

The problem with this is that you pick your warlord trait before knowing who’s going first. Even then though, being able to redeploy 30 infiltrators up front if going first or move some suppressors in/out of sight after a seize is pretty huge.

Works for any <CHAPTER> infantry unit though, not just Vanguard.

The +1 to hit warlord trait is pretty good. Always on prescience. It has solid synergy with any high volume of shooting unit like Centurions, crusader raiders, repulsors, hellblasters and possibly a beefy squad of suppressors. I think it's a solid option and goes great on a libby who has no real shooting anyways. As always it has great synergy with crimson fists. Slap it on a horde busting dakka crimson fist centurion unit and watch them spew out bolter shots that generate more bolter shots on a 4+.

The re-deploy warlord trait has it's use. Having that in your pocket can really mess with the enemy if the map's terrain allows you to pull off some bait and switch. Overload a flank with infiltrators to bait out units against them then BOOP them to another flank. Your opponent might understand this tactic, but still has to respond to the threat of 30 primaris bodies being in their face turn one.

 Redemption wrote:

 Binabik15 wrote:
The Vanguard article's cover image shows a good side-view of a Suppressor. No additional jump pack/turbine hiding there, just as people assumed. Those are really weird models.

I'm guessing the 'jump pack' are the extra thruster pods on top of the backpack and on the back of the boots.

Has to be, but they look badly unbalanced as a result, IMO.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
In the grim darkness of the 41st Millennium, there is only... tennis?



People are having a lot of fun with these releases.

Ok, that's funny. The only thing I'd suggest is to make the ball a servoskull so that it's grimdark.

 Irbis wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
Or put Target Priority on the Librarian that won't be shooting anyway...

Yup, I was thinking 10 man Infiltrator squad with Target Priority Librarian to trigger more 6s while also empowering them with to hit rerolls. Pity mini-apothecary can't heal characters, tho.

That only happens on unmodified 6's

I'd rather have the redeploy on a strat rather than a WL trait. I just don't think I would use it over several of the other WL traits and unless they get some sort of vigilus detachment extra WL trait I'm not sure it will see much use but I do like it, just wish it was a strat as opposed to a WLT.

So I saw these supposed leaked point costs. I have no idea if they're real, I kinda hope not...

CSM 13
GP 70
MoP 90
Oblit 115
Venom 130

Autocannon 10
Plasmas Gun 11
Plasma Pistol 5


Captain in Phobos 110
Eliminator 18
Infiltrator 22
Helix Adept 32
Librarian in Phobos 100
Lt in Phobos 80
Suppressor 18

Accelerator Cannon 15
Bolt Sniper 3

 Togusa wrote:

happy_inquisitor wrote:


"Codex: Chaos Space Marines and Chaos Space Marine Squad are now removed from the B200b range and are no longer subject to compulsory re-order"

What does this actually mean? What is the B200b range? Is this some sort of stock code for GW stores or something?

It's likely stock code for everyone. The idea of "compulsory reorder" suggests that it's a reorder that is done automatically.

 Crimson wrote:
So I saw these supposed leaked point costs. I have no idea if they're real, I kinda hope not...

CSM 13
GP 70
MoP 90
Oblit 115
Venom 130

Autocannon 10
Plasmas Gun 11
Plasma Pistol 5


Captain in Phobos 110
Eliminator 18
Infiltrator 22
Helix Adept 32
Librarian in Phobos 100
Lt in Phobos 80
Suppressor 18

Accelerator Cannon 15
Bolt Sniper 3

I don't know where these points came from, but I doubt that infiltrators are more expensive than eliminators...

 Crimson wrote:
So I saw these supposed leaked point costs. I have no idea if they're real, I kinda hope not...

CSM 13
GP 70
MoP 90
Oblit 115
Venom 130

Autocannon 10
Plasmas Gun 11
Plasma Pistol 5


Captain in Phobos 110
Eliminator 18
Infiltrator 22
Helix Adept 32
Librarian in Phobos 100
Lt in Phobos 80
Suppressor 18

Accelerator Cannon 15
Bolt Sniper 3

Seems real. Super disappointed with the Venomcrawler. That is a hefty price. The Oblits are in the middle of where people were suspecting (between 100 and 130). Still 115 is pricey for how fragile they are relative to how much of a target they have on their backs (especially in a meta with all of the Imperial players running a poké-assassin in every list).

zinch wrote:

I don't know where these points came from, but I doubt that infiltrators are more expensive than eliminators...

They were from a Facebook group. It is completely possible that someone just made them up. Then again, it wouldn't be exactly unprecedented for GW to give stuff nonsensical point costs...

 Crimson wrote:
So I saw these supposed leaked point costs. I have no idea if they're real, I kinda hope not...

CSM 13
GP 70
MoP 90
Oblit 115
Venom 130

Autocannon 10
Plasmas Gun 11
Plasma Pistol 5


Captain in Phobos 110
Eliminator 18
Infiltrator 22
Helix Adept 32
Librarian in Phobos 100
Lt in Phobos 80
Suppressor 18

Accelerator Cannon 15
Bolt Sniper 3

If these are accurate the new CSM things are DoA, and one of the few good options(Oblits) just got priced into the trash bin. No one is going to drop 130 points on a Venomcrawler when you can get a Forgefiend or Defiler for 10 points more. Especially when Fiends/Deffys are barely used now.

zinch wrote:

 Crimson wrote:
So I saw these supposed leaked point costs. I have no idea if they're real, I kinda hope not...

CSM 13
GP 70
MoP 90
Oblit 115
Venom 130

Autocannon 10
Plasmas Gun 11
Plasma Pistol 5


Captain in Phobos 110
Eliminator 18
Infiltrator 22
Helix Adept 32
Librarian in Phobos 100
Lt in Phobos 80
Suppressor 18

Accelerator Cannon 15
Bolt Sniper 3

I don't know where these points came from, but I doubt that infiltrators are more expensive than eliminators...

Infiltrators will be more expensive than many other primaris because they have more abilities and gear. They certainly should be more expensive than intercessors which are already 17ppm. 22pts puts them exactly at 20pts per power level, which is reasonable considering all the things they get.

 Crimson wrote:
So I saw these supposed leaked point costs. I have no idea if they're real, I kinda hope not...

CSM 13
GP 70
MoP 90
Oblit 115
Venom 130

Autocannon 10
Plasmas Gun 11
Plasma Pistol 5


Captain in Phobos 110
Eliminator 18
Infiltrator 22
Helix Adept 32
Librarian in Phobos 100
Lt in Phobos 80
Suppressor 18

Accelerator Cannon 15
Bolt Sniper 3

Primaris wise

Captain at 110? That's really, REALLY expensive for a guy with a knife. Absolute pass. Garbage bin.

Elimintors at 21 points is pretty good. Cheap enough to bring in force to be a threat to characters while not breaking the bank.

Infiltrators at 22 are REALLY expensive. 5 more points than an intercessor for a unit that is worse at fighting and has to give up shooting to use their grenade to be -1 to hit? They might find a place just because of their scrambler, but geez they are super expensive. I think they will be a pass outside of just being there to deny DS and even then you can just take guardsmen to do the same for less. If you only ever fight against GSC then yeah they are great, but otherwise very cost prohibitive for a unit that might be useful.

Helix adapt for 32 points is kinda hefty. He brings back 22 point boys on a 5+ and heals them, but I don't see him being taken just because he will be in a squad that is likely going to be small size due to their very high price point.

Librarian for 100 is solid and stays in line with the cost of a primaris psyker. Libbys are already pretty expensive, but he is not terrible by any stretch I think.

LT for 80 points? Hard pass. He has pathetic weaponry and pays to deploy outside your deployment zone with units you don't even want to bring. I'll take a normal Lt. over him any day.

33 point suppressors are pretty solid I think. 33 points for two ap-2 auto cannon with the fly keyword is not bad at all. Very competitive with a hellblaster with the advantage of being far faster, having the fly keyword, optional smoke grenade and operate at full damage output up to 48 inches. I'll take two s7 ap-2 d2 shots over 1 overcharged s8ap-4 d2 shot any day.

If these are real, I'm most bummed about the Infiltrators. I wanted to get a lot of them, as I think they look cool. I was expecting them to be the same cost as the Intercessors, or couple of points more at most. Five points more would be bonkers.

I'd argue that these are made up, not because of any balance, but the boxed stuff (starters and board games with 40k rules) I've seen is prefab (i.e. "this is the cost of 10 CSM with this load out" rather than "CSM x 10 + weapon + weapon + weapon" or whatever).

I haven't seen all of the starters in 8th, though: are some points written like normal codecies?

anyone that thought infiltrators wouldn't cost multiple points more than intercessors was smoking crack.

They have the same statline, a better gun (auto wound on unmod 6s to hit), special deployment rules aka scouts, can deny DS built in, and have an upgrade that lets them heal and restore slain models, oh and 1 use smoke grenades.

Obviously they are going to cost more points than intercessors.

blaktoof wrote:

They have the same statline, a better gun (auto wound on unmod 6s to hit),

They don't have a better gun, they have a worse gun. The Intercessor bolters have better range, and most importantly AP-1.

at best their guns are a wash vs intercessors. I figured they’d be about 18-19 points.

If they aren’t made up points, then you’ve HAVE to buff them with the vanguard librarian to even remotely get their points worth.

Ugh I really hope those points are wrong, as I love the models.

 Togusa wrote:

happy_inquisitor wrote:


"Codex: Chaos Space Marines and Chaos Space Marine Squad are now removed from the B200b range and are no longer subject to compulsory re-order"

What does this actually mean? What is the B200b range? Is this some sort of stock code for GW stores or something?

I believe so. I left the quote entirely unchanged from source, probably means a lot more to the GW person who sent it

If these are the point costs they're going to end up with a point drop. All of it.

I expected them to be more, but, not 5 points more. Maybe 3 max.

Still, we'll find out the true costs soon enough. I'm guessing the HQ models also dont have equipment paid for, so, could go up by 4-8 points each depending on loadout. (4 for force sword,4/5 for gun and 3 for camo cloak etc)

I was convinced (admittedly based on nothing but a hunch) that infiltrators would be 19 points each. 22 is a bit too steep unless they also get some real nifty unique strats.

Eliminatos and suppressors are priced correctly though.

The venomcrawler is probably 15 points overcosted and the obliterators maybe 10 points over?