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Long title with a vagueish meaning, what I'm trying to say is: Is there anyway to justify in the lore a GSC rising up but never being consumed by a hive fleet?

I love the GSC I have and the new range, but I'm not warming up to the idea that they get eaten. I know it happens and I know it has nothing to do with the tabletop but I'm a little picky with my lore.

I have thought of a few ways and I would like feed back as to if it's viable and/or if there are other ways to do this. I'd like to be able to have my cult spread throughout a sector for campaigns and whatnot.

The way that made the most sense to me was this; the planet the Cult rises up on is a dormant Necron Core World, which happens to have pylons across the system or some Necron device that shrouds the systems presence from the warp so the Hive fleet can't see the psychic presence of the Patriarch. The only problem I could see with this is that it might affect the psykers as well.

Another one is just that there are no hive fleets around so it would be centuries before they arrived.

Any help would be appreciated

The latter is definitely viable- Necromunda has GSC activity, but is lodged safely within Segmentum Solar. It will be some time before the Hive fleets approach it.

Other options are simply to have the cult spreading to other planets in a wave before the fleet- it is one cult, but no longer has a home planet.

Could go for an Ymgarl genestealer-type cult. After the 'Nids have consumed the planet, they refuse to reabsorb the Ymgarl strain due to its instability. You could potential build a situation where they manage to rebuild a colony on the world after it has been eaten.

Something else would be to have your cult based within a mobile space habitat. As the fleets approach, it simply moves to the next system, and is never caught. This would also mean that the habitat would act as a beacon constantly revealing new systems to be consumed for the following Hive fleet(s)

There could be number of reasons why your cult's not getting nommed.

GSC could have taken root in a area without hive fleets in the vicinity and it'll take countless centuries for them to arrive. Some cults grow big enough to form small empires.

GSC also send missionaries and genestealers abroad to carry on the good word, maybe even some higher ranking members also migrate to help out.

If you want to be a bit of more esoteric you could say that your broods got quirk in their genes that makes nids blind to them. Or maybe they're one of those cult that has a moment of clarity right before the end, only for some of them to get away at the last moment.

I dunno, those are some I've though of. Go forge that narrative.

The Ymgarl idea is great, it would explain certain cult factors too.

And the moment of clarity at the end.

Ok, what about this; The Cult rises for generations, but due to its instability from the Ymgarl gene its numbers are very low. The tyranids come and attack the planet, at the height of fighting the Patriarch is slain and the backlash allows them to see the Nids for what they are. After taking casualties, the Cult retreats and flees the planet, regrouping at a massive mining colony in an asteroid belt by the planet. Here, a purestrain evolves and the new patriarch takes control, now everyone sees the previous events as the Patriarch saving them from a great flood (metaphorically), they see the tendrils of the hive as the great Stoneborn serpent from cult myth. Since they have an Ymgarl factor the Nids ignore them, consume a majority of the sector before an Imperial fleet comes and destroys the nascent Hivefleet. The imperium re settles what planets are not consumed and the major battleforce leaves the system. The Cult, witnessing the destruction of what they believed to be their god, becomes enraged and begins to rebuild and plan on the original planet, waiting for the day the Imperium expands into their territory so they may exact revenge.

Still only a base for lore, but explains that they live through the tyranids, their heavy use of mining equipment and such, and their low numbers. Someone on dakka suggested making a con/pro chart to keep homebrew factions from being mary sue, not sure who it is but I think i'll try it.

How else could I bolster this lore? Should I change anything? Thanks for your help

Of particular note is successful infiltration of Astra Militarum Regiments.

No, not the local PDF, but troopers trained for off-world. Sure, they may well be sussed out eventually - but how far and wider could they have spread in the meantime? Where did they add their taint?

It is mostly a matter of not reaching critical mass.

A violent city would prevent the spread.

Have them jump space station to space station. There are not enough belivers there.

You could come up with some apolgetic as to why they have no patriarch, and why no new genstealer has taken on the mantle. Perhaps some one, or a conspiracy keepa killing new emergent patriarch. It is just about coming up with a descent apolegetic.

Cults exists for many many generations. The tyranid invasion just happens at the end. From a month to how long it is going to take to eat the system/planet. Don't focus on that last month. In the meantime the cult is a good organisation breaking free from the often comifical fachist imperial sociaty. It is as if starship troopers was the other way around.

An interesting twist would be if, instead of eating them, invading Tyranids actually took the cultists and made them commanders in the hive fleets. Doing so on occasion could help bolster GS recruitment, as people might come to believe that the GS religion is true due to this evidence, thus allowing the Tyranids to take more planets. An alternate idea would be for the knowledge that the 'Star Gods' aren't the beneficent saviours that cultists thought they were being spread from planet to planet, leading to double uprisings with Genestealers, Patriarchs and all, overthrowing planetary governments but also preventing any Tyranid invasions. This could lead to the 'micro-empire' situation that I mentioned earlier, with maybe even a new hive mind coming into being, one possibly smarter than the Tyranid hive mind due to the ingenuity, intelligence and flexibility of the influence of semi-human modes of thinking.

I think your suggestions are very far away from the canon description of tyranids. Commanders have not place in that hiarcy in any defenition except metaphoricaly.

But do what you want.

I think parts of GSC can spread quite fine. The pauper prices, or one of them, I do belive are a rebellius group fighting for fredom. Only the core of the movement is GSC. Of course little does that help when you spread the tainted hostile DNA around.

Being part of GSC is a very doomed possition with certain occupational risk some generations down the line. Also, see cosmic horror:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lovecraftian_horror

 Niiai wrote:
I think your suggestions are very far away from the canon description of tyranids. Commanders have not place in that hiarcy in any defenition except metaphoricaly.

But do what you want.

I think parts of GSC can spread quite fine. The pauper prices, or one of them, I do belive are a rebellius group fighting for fredom. Only the core of the movement is GSC. Of course little does that help when you spread the tainted hostile DNA around.

Being part of GSC is a very doomed possition with certain occupational risk some generations down the line. Also, see cosmic horror:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lovecraftian_horror

Not commanders in a human sense, but beings in a high station in the hive mind, like a Swarmlord. I think a well-educated cultist, such as maybe a Magos, could be extremely helpful to the Tyranids, as not only might they have info on Imperial defenses, but could relay to the hive mind information about Imperial society at large, such as specifics about how resented Imperial oppression is, how threats like Chaos and various xenos races are already straining the Imperium's resources, as well as pointing out some of the key worlds of the Imperium whose loss could cripple the state if they were destroyed. While I understand that mass feeding is in the Tyranid nature, I think that the hive mind's decision to devour every last cultist out there is counterproductive, as they could provide an unique perspective into human society that the Tyranids might not have had before.

It could be that their Genestealers are from a different Hive Fleet, so instead of welcoming the Hive Fleet that attacks their planet, they flee.

They do cordinate with local GSC. Mainly by having the broooodlord fall under the hive mind again. And he communicate with the rest. The Primus, while a recently new lore addition, does co-ordinate the local resistance. Something anybody who has ever done cordinations of large groups of people know that it is hell to change a command structure fast. Also, the hivemind mainly communicate within the synaptic network and a lot of the cltists might not be have acces to it, if at all.

After wards how ever only a genestealer or a lictor, probably other life forms as well, would just need to eat the brain of any potensial 'commander' and now the hive mind knows what ever information was important. Is the primus better at planing then the combined mind power of the hive mind? Nope. Reasons for keeping them around? Slim and few.

There have been media exploring this. The zerglings incorperate Kerrigan and others but that is a different beast entierly. The Borg do have 3 of 9 as a induvidual while part of the borg for a short period, but it does not work out great for either of them.

You can probably come up with an apolagetic. What ever narative floats your boat, go sailing.

Nurglith: Those things, the divition of hive fleets, are not well defined by GW. But genestealers, at least some of them, always try to escape with the evacuation of the plannet in order to spread. And spread they do. It often creates cascading effects, spreading the cult even further.

Also, I think humans have a tendensy to think of the GSC as a unified whole, but if they have spread out over several planets and systems, eating a big chunk of of the established cult does not diminish the remaining cults. Where do one cult end and another start? If you cut a wurm in two, do you now have two wurms? (The awnser to that is no for the most part, but it is a good methaphore.) They continue to proliferate. They inject their taint into anything.

"Don't you eat that yellow snow, out therw where the huskeys go."

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Of particular note is successful infiltration of Astra Militarum Regiments.

No, not the local PDF, but troopers trained for off-world. Sure, they may well be sussed out eventually - but how far and wider could they have spread in the meantime? Where did they add their taint?

I'm not a fan of Brood Brothers or the such (with the exception of tanks and such). In the lore for my cult most of the recruiters and the people who deem where people go are loyal to the cult, as such most of the Neophytes that enter the AM or PDF are sent into tank companies (Steelborn Wyrms) or super heavy companies (Adamantium Vipers). So the presence in the regimental foot soldiers is low. The reason being that since they have low numbers, being able to have armored elements is preferable to ground troops.

And Niiai's got a good point too, since their numbers are low- due to the Ymgarl instability and losses from insurrection- the Tyranid hive doesn't deem them a high priority.

I think it'll come down to the fleet not showing up because things keep happening to either diminish or erase the psychic presence of the cult.

I appreciate all the feedback, I'm thinking of posting the models I have finished in Showcase section.

Are there any known cults whose colors are green, red, and black?

When I converted my GS cult, I tied them to a rogue mechanicus faction, who had become self aware, and used technology to produce a hybrid tyranid/robot to act as an overriding hive mind which blocked the signals from the fleet. Like electronic countermeasures.

Weeeeelllll there technically is a GSC cult that migrated and ended up in nurgle's garden and are now spreading Papas love around.

I am fairly sure that Chaos tainted gsc tend to become unstable and therefore get ignored by hivefleets.

There's definitely the opportunity for an uprising to succeed, but the Nids are driven off all the same. Guess it all depends on how well defended the system is, and how big the Hive Fleet is.

Some are mere splinters, rather than the more commonly imagined numberless horde. These can be stopped and even eradicated. And it's also possible that the defending fleet is shattered in the effort, despite the victory.

That can land a planet squarely in the claws of the Cult.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
There's definitely the opportunity for an uprising to succeed, but the Nids are driven off all the same. Guess it all depends on how well defended the system is, and how big the Hive Fleet is.

Some are mere splinters, rather than the more commonly imagined numberless horde. These can be stopped and even eradicated. And it's also possible that the defending fleet is shattered in the effort, despite the victory.

That can land a planet squarely in the claws of the Cult.

True.

I also found the cult.
It's in the 7th ed Codex
Tenebrous the name.

Warp storm preventing the psychic signal from getting to the 'Nids.

'Nids arrive in sector, but are defeated early, so the Cult is never discovered - and the next hive fleet is several thousand years out.

Patriarch accidentally gets radiation poisoning (warp poisoning or similar mutation), and is no longer able to send out the signal to the fleet. So everything else works as usual, but no fleet is signaled.

 Kharne the Befriender wrote:
Long title with a vagueish meaning, what I'm trying to say is: Is there anyway to justify in the lore a GSC rising up but never being consumed by a hive fleet?

I love the GSC I have and the new range, but I'm not warming up to the idea that they get eaten. I know it happens and I know it has nothing to do with the tabletop but I'm a little picky with my lore.

I have thought of a few ways and I would like feed back as to if it's viable and/or if there are other ways to do this. I'd like to be able to have my cult spread throughout a sector for campaigns and whatnot.

The way that made the most sense to me was this; the planet the Cult rises up on is a dormant Necron Core World, which happens to have pylons across the system or some Necron device that shrouds the systems presence from the warp so the Hive fleet can't see the psychic presence of the Patriarch. The only problem I could see with this is that it might affect the psykers as well.

Another one is just that there are no hive fleets around so it would be centuries before they arrived.

Any help would be appreciated

In "Deathstorm", a Broodlord/patriarch kept an invading tyranid force at bay, so that it could settle and old grudge.

And in another story, we see a cult that is pretty much independent from the tyranids (something happened to the patriarch).

So it IS indeed possible.

Interesting stuff and great ideas. Are patriarchs given actual names or just ominous titles like 'The Exalted One'?

 Kharne the Befriender wrote:
Interesting stuff and great ideas. Are patriarchs given actual names or just ominous titles like 'The Exalted One'?

In the last story it has - somehow - fused with the avatar of khaine, creating an entire craftworld of GSC.

The craftworld has returned from the edge of the galaxy, to find more aeldari to boost their dwindling numbers (caused by daemon incursions).

I dont think the broodlord/patriarch had any plans to hook up with the hive fleets.

Note that this is a story from BL, not fanfiction.

That's pretty cool actually, plenty of conversion potential

It would be cool do to the avatar with the rules of the big abberaration character or the patrirach itself.

I see a couple of possibilities.

1. The cult starts up, but there is some sort of environmental factor that renders most people sterile... maybe some sort of radiation or something. The cult progresses, but VERY slowly, never able to reach a critical mass.

2. The cult progresses as normal, but everytime a Patriarch forms, it is assassinated. The cult is being watched and "pruned" by either a Deathwatch operative buying time until reinforcements arrive or an Alpha Legion operative maintaining a potential threat to the Imperium until he's ready to allow the cult to blossom.

3. Any number of environmental factors that could blank out psychic transmissions. One thought is that a cult rises in an asteroid field/mining colony. Several of the asteroids have remnant Pylon tech, creating a psychic blanket, protecting the colony from discovery.

You essentially want some external factor that allows the cult to grow, but limits or periodically reverses that growth.