Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Breton wrote:

 Huron black heart wrote:
An already expensive hobby gets even more so.
And to those who defend the pricing as GW just trying to make money must surely think, when's enough enough.
I've purchase a lot in the last year or so, Start collecting boxes and some of the other boxed sets have been relatively good value. But it's getting harder for me to accept the prices, particularly when my hobby budget doesn't increase at anything like the rate GW's prices do.

There's a guy at work who just got a cost of living adjustment raise. Can you believe he's charging his employer more money for the same work he did before? It's almost like I... I mean HE thinks prices go up over time and wages go up over time causing prices to rise.. in some sort of cycle where costs inflate. Some sort of... oh what's a good word.. inflationary cycle? I joke, but it's pretty basic. Prices go up, wages go up, wages go up, McDonalds installs Self Service Kiosks. They're not charging you for the table, they have to make that money back somehow.

Wages have nowhere increased at the same rate as housing, electricity, or even GW pricing and we all know it. They increased pricing on new items (90€ Bloodthirster vs. 110€ GUO) and it was kinda accpeted because it meant older kits could stay the same price. So stop pretending this is okay.

Breton wrote:

 Huron black heart wrote:
An already expensive hobby gets even more so.
And to those who defend the pricing as GW just trying to make money must surely think, when's enough enough.
I've purchase a lot in the last year or so, Start collecting boxes and some of the other boxed sets have been relatively good value. But it's getting harder for me to accept the prices, particularly when my hobby budget doesn't increase at anything like the rate GW's prices do.

There's a guy at work who just got a cost of living adjustment raise. Can you believe he's charging his employer more money for the same work he did before? It's almost like I... I mean HE thinks prices go up over time and wages go up over time causing prices to rise.. in some sort of cycle where costs inflate. Some sort of... oh what's a good word.. inflationary cycle? I joke, but it's pretty basic. Prices go up, wages go up, wages go up, McDonalds installs Self Service Kiosks. They're not charging you for the table, they have to make that money back somehow.

I understand your point, mine was that GW's prices go up far more than inflation.

I think people who defend product price hikes have little to no idea how cheap GW is getting these kits produced. They'd still make a solid profit if the kits were half as expensive as they are now. To argue any defense of the prices (heck, the prices before the recent raises), you'd have to presume that the kit was reasonably priced before the increase....which isn't the case.

I have other games where I can purchase a box of 20 multipart plastic miniatures for around $30 USD. Those companies don't bump their prices every 18 months for fun. They're smaller and less successful companies than GW. GW is just in the fortunate enough position to have a rabid following, allowing them to get away with it.

Now, full disclosure; I 100% support GW doing whatever the hell they want. It's their company. I'm not entitled to cheaper GW kits, nor do I think they're committing any sort of crime. I will continue to vote with my wallet, and that's fine. Not worried about it.

AngryAngel80 wrote:
I think people are trying to dig around for reasons GW had no choice but to raise prices.

Truth is, all of these boogeymen were around and GW has been on an upward swing the whole time. This is simply GW showing there ain't nothing new here at all.

Remember when they said they were done with the price hikes ? I do, at least not on old kits, doing it with updated stuff.

This new GW horsecrap was never real, it was the same old GW just with a fancy new green suit, made of money and the wrecked wallets of the older fans. The only thing good about this is I have most all of these old kits I'll want aside from maybe some more Ogryns at some point.

Welcome back old GW, i knew you were just waiting to say hello once more.

I guess we need to get ready for when your standard small transports - like the dunerider - are going to be costing upwards of 100$ Glad we gave them all that feedback that these high costs were bad, I see they took it straight to heart.

The only feedback GW cares about is profit. Complaining on Dakka, FB or the "community" survey won't cause GW to lower prices or write better rules. Tanking profits will. Yet people continue to throw their money at GW.

 Hanskrampf wrote:

Wages have nowhere increased at the same rate as housing, electricity, or even GW pricing and we all know it. They increased pricing on new items (90€ Bloodthirster vs. 110€ GUO) and it was kinda accpeted because it meant older kits could stay the same price. So stop pretending this is okay.

We do? We know that? A $25 box in 1995 - according to https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/ which uses "the latest US government CPI data published on June 12 to adjust for inflation and calculate the cumulative inflation rate through May 2019".- should cost 42.01 today, and a $35 box should cost 58.81. I can't remember if a Dread was a $25 or $35 box (or if it was plastic yet - I think so but it was 25 years ago), it's on GamesWorkshop.com for 46.25. I'm pretty sure the Tactical Squad was a $25 box, and it's $40.00 now. It's also a newer kit (than the ones from 1995 I liked for the parade formation look) with more options. The Rhino - a $20-25 - box is 37.25.

It's probably not fair compare scouts Asasult and Devastator marines, they'll have additional factors - usually a switch from metal to plastic. And Scouts didn't even have a box, they were 2 or 3 to a blister now $25 a box.

We're not that far off of inflation, some over some under.

This seems like a good time to ask if anyone knows about an online store that sells at a discount in Canada?

Well, these increases are massive in part.
And then they want new players to enter the game.
But I guess plastic is pretty expensive and a hard Brexit is looming when Boris J. is taking over.

BrianDavion wrote:

 Galef wrote:
I never thought politics would directly affect my hobby, but I totally expected this after Trumps trade war tariffs with China.

I'm not blaming GW for these price changes. It's total political BS.

-

funny thing is I was kind of hoping Brexit would lead to GW price drops. I mean.. woulda been nice

I know they promised £35m a week to the Imperium but I'm not sure we can trust everything written on the side of a GSC Chimera.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, these increases are massive in part.
And then they want new players to enter the game.
But I guess plastic is pretty expensive and a hard Brexit is looming when Boris J. is taking over.

They feel massive. But only because they're coming all at once. If GW had incrementally upped the price every year, as opposed to a bigger up every several years most people wouldn't even notice it. Instead of realizing how many kits they bought over the past 10 years for $5-10 less than they should have, they're paying attention to yesterday's $40 instead of today's $45.

Say you buy Model Kit A every year. Starting at $20 going up $1 every year, and the price goes up $1 every year to a final price of $24. over 5 years you'll spend - 20, 21, 22, 23, and 24, or $110. If they raise the price $5 every 5 years you'll spend 20+20+20+20+25 = $105. But you're going to notice that $5 a lot more than that $10. You're thinking about how many $5's you're going to need for the future, now how many $5's you didn't pay the previous 5 years.

Well whats the point, there are now whole armies outthere that have good to great 3rd party ioptions completely unique to your liking.

All this has done is Promote this behaviour.

funny thing is I was kind of hoping Brexit would lead to GW price drops. I mean.. woulda been nice

A hard brexit will certainly introduce customs duty.
This could affect the sales to the EU. Bad news us players in the non-UK.

Breton wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, these increases are massive in part.
And then they want new players to enter the game.
But I guess plastic is pretty expensive and a hard Brexit is looming when Boris J. is taking over.

They feel massive. But only because they're coming all at once. If GW had incrementally upped the price every year, as opposed to a bigger up every several years most people wouldn't even notice it. Instead of realizing how many kits they bought over the past 10 years for $5-10 less than they should have, they're paying attention to yesterday's $40 instead of today's $45.

Say you buy Model Kit A every year. Starting at $20 going up $1 every year, and the price goes up $1 every year to a final price of $24. over 5 years you'll spend - 20, 21, 22, 23, and 24, or $110. If they raise the price $5 every 5 years you'll spend 20+20+20+20+25 = $105. But you're going to notice that $5 a lot more than that $10. You're thinking about how many $5's you're going to need for the future, now how many $5's you didn't pay the previous 5 years.

I don't know of any other companies that regularly increase the price of old merchandise. It's normally the opposite, prices go down over time.

Their investment into those kits is more than paid off at this point its almost pure profit

 fraser1191 wrote:
This seems like a good time to ask if anyone knows about an online store that sells at a discount in Canada?

Meeplemart. 15% off GW retail, free shipping on orders over 200 CAD. Great selection of non-GW products as well, they're a huge retailer in Toronto.

Time to shell out the $200 for that 3d printer....

It`s time GW admit pound is not 1.2x euro and start giving non-brits the real price.
If no deal is reached probably we can expect at least 10% drop of the currency value, until things stabilized.

 fraser1191 wrote:
This seems like a good time to ask if anyone knows about an online store that sells at a discount in Canada?

https://www.meeplemart.com/

Discounts vary between 10 and 18% on GW prices and shipping is a flat $10 unless you spend over $200, then it's free.

I've never been anything less than completely satisfied with them.

Breton wrote:

 Hanskrampf wrote:

Wages have nowhere increased at the same rate as housing, electricity, or even GW pricing and we all know it. They increased pricing on new items (90€ Bloodthirster vs. 110€ GUO) and it was kinda accpeted because it meant older kits could stay the same price. So stop pretending this is okay.

We do? We know that? A $25 box in 1995 - according to https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/ which uses "the latest US government CPI data published on June 12 to adjust for inflation and calculate the cumulative inflation rate through May 2019".- should cost 42.01 today, and a $35 box should cost 58.81. I can't remember if a Dread was a $25 or $35 box (or if it was plastic yet - I think so but it was 25 years ago), it's on GamesWorkshop.com for 46.25. I'm pretty sure the Tactical Squad was a $25 box, and it's $40.00 now. It's also a newer kit (than the ones from 1995 I liked for the parade formation look) with more options. The Rhino - a $20-25 - box is 37.25.

It's probably not fair compare scouts Asasult and Devastator marines, they'll have additional factors - usually a switch from metal to plastic. And Scouts didn't even have a box, they were 2 or 3 to a blister now $25 a box.

We're not that far off of inflation, some over some under.

They were overpriced back in the day, and just beginning to be tolerable (with the SCs and smaller starter boxes). GW is just raising the prices back up to their absurd boutique prices.

Not a single Australian, I'm actually a little proud right now.

The real question is, how will the consumer react? In the past, there’s been plenty of vocal outrage over the cost, but that GW has never been out of the black the outrage hasn’t been great enough to hurt GW.

This might be a gambit to start the long process of squatting older models.

GW Exec: So, we raised prices on Tactical Marines, and no one is buying them? I guess the people want us to stop making them. Strike them from the lists!

Breton wrote:

 Hanskrampf wrote:

Wages have nowhere increased at the same rate as housing, electricity, or even GW pricing and we all know it. They increased pricing on new items (90€ Bloodthirster vs. 110€ GUO) and it was kinda accpeted because it meant older kits could stay the same price. So stop pretending this is okay.

We do? We know that? A $25 box in 1995 - according to https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/ which uses "the latest US government CPI data published on June 12 to adjust for inflation and calculate the cumulative inflation rate through May 2019".- should cost 42.01 today, and a $35 box should cost 58.81. I can't remember if a Dread was a $25 or $35 box (or if it was plastic yet - I think so but it was 25 years ago), it's on GamesWorkshop.com for 46.25. I'm pretty sure the Tactical Squad was a $25 box, and it's $40.00 now. It's also a newer kit (than the ones from 1995 I liked for the parade formation look) with more options. The Rhino - a $20-25 - box is 37.25.

It's probably not fair compare scouts Asasult and Devastator marines, they'll have additional factors - usually a switch from metal to plastic. And Scouts didn't even have a box, they were 2 or 3 to a blister now $25 a box.

We're not that far off of inflation, some over some under.

I bought Ork boys in 2004 for $20 for a box of 16. Now it's $35 for 10. If we adjust it to the price of 16 boys like the old pack, that would be $56.

Adjusting for inflation, a $20 box in 2004 should cost $27.84. The current price is almost exactly DOUBLE of the inflation rate. You can't even use the excuse of models being better now vs then. They are literally the exact same models. We are paying double price for two decade old products. That is absolute madness.

Or, it might be a board trying to maximise returns for their shareholders. Which they're mandated to do by law.

It's probably the sinister, vague, conspiracy thing, tho.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Or, it might be a board trying to maximise returns for their shareholders. Which they're mandated to do by law.

It's probably the sinister, vague, conspiracy thing, tho.

Isn't that law just specific to the US?

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Or, it might be a board trying to maximise returns for their shareholders. Which they're mandated to do by law.

It's probably the sinister, vague, conspiracy thing, tho.

Of course that is what they are doing. They are trying to make more money. No one has said anything different...

However this behavior is the exact thing that caused them to lose a huge chunk of marketshare and priced out a large portion of the potential customer base. Price increases are not a sustainable way to increase profit. Companies that chase ever increasing yearly growth are inherently self destructive.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Or, it might be a board trying to maximise returns for their shareholders. Which they're mandated to do by law.

It's probably the sinister, vague, conspiracy thing, tho.

Isn't that law just specific to the US?

Nope. It appears in the Companies Act, 2006.

s. 172 Duty to promote the success of the company
(1)A director of a company must act in the way he considers, in good faith, would be most likely to promote the success of the company for the benefit of its members as a whole

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/172

"[M]embers", in context, means "shareholders".

A version of it also appears in both the Canada and Ontario Business Corporation Acts - and probably every other Province and Territory's version of the same law. It's a fairly fundamental tenet of corporate law.

redboi wrote:

Of course that is what they are doing. They are trying to make more money. No one has said anything different....

Except for that one poster, who floated a vague, sinister conspiracy mere minutes before I posted.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Time to shell out the $200 for that 3d printer....

10/10 highly reccomend. with the right settings a $200 printer can make models pretty close to GW quality. for $500 you can get one that does every bit the same detail as GW models

In part, this was not unexpected, GW is nothing if not ever eager to banish good will as quickly as it grows it.

Though for the old marines, it may be just as simple as they want to raise the costs of stuff old marine and make the primaris line seem by default more reasonable. Like the tac squad box, now priced up to be more comparable to the Primaris squad boxes. Given that, who will pick up an inferior rules wise box over the new hotness when the price of the kits is so similar ?

Maybe it is just to bring kits in line with another, but I'm sure some of it is also just to remove incentives to models they want to phase out with lines they want to push.

As always though GW does nothing without some ambiguity to it. The only thing clear being, they are greedy as the day is long, and that hasn't changed from the old dark days to the new dark days. This time they just have much better PR to spin it and a more public front to brush any concerns under the rug and let the fanboys shout down disagreement. So better implementation but still the same net goal, gouging away.

I continue to feel bad for anyone who would even try to get into this hobby. It was expensive before, now it's literally the choice between this and a moderate army, or other more useful items, like a computer, tablet hell entertainment system. All of which are more key to modern day life then some plastic army men.

It isn't just a matter of this one price hike, but each new kit growing more and more cost bloated. Doesn't hurt as much if you already have it all on hand. However starting up ? It hurts the hobby and player base. Even myself I've chosen to sit out releases and wait for discounts, as I won't support the insane costs for some of these releases.

There is no justification for the hikes, other than moar money. If it was to keep things running, the customer base would embrace it, but no one should love to be gouged.

Why I Don't Care: A Novella

GW are a business. Of course the justification is to make money. You gift your labour, do you?

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Why I Don't Care: A Novella

GW are a business. Of course the justification is to make money. You gift your labour, do you?

As a customer, my main priorities are the impacts to the customer. Saying "GW is a business" doesn't justify their actions in the slightest. I don't exactly benefit from their increased profit margins, so why should I care?

Looking at the prices specifically for my main faction:

Valkyrie will be priced out of what I'd spend. Had only vaguely considered getting one though, as while I do have some Scions, I've been able to use them this far without one.

Hydra also reached that threshold, but my meta only has a few air units (and aren't other units better anyways?)

Ogryns I was always on the fence on. I've got Crusaders as a melee meatshield already; not sure I absolutely need Ogryns on top of that.

I'll have to think seriously about whether I'll want another Russ.

With some spare parts, I can always split the Heavy Weapons Teams from 3 teams into 6 or more, that price doesn't bother me.

I rarely get command squads, so that doesn't bother me either.

I've got plenty of regular Guardsmen, so I probably won't get more. If I do though, I can save some money per squad by getting two packs of the 5 man Easy to Build sets with one Infantry box.

Overall, not much change for me.