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SamusDrake wrote:

Voss wrote:

SamusDrake wrote:
Compared to last year's Titanicus, this is an excellent launch line up that cannot be faulted.

What do you mean? The only fault I can recall with Titanicus was how quickly it sold out. I doubt this will be any different in that regard, since GW loves the illusion that 'selling out' brings.

This is two factions, a handful of planes and a bunch of bobbins and tchotchkes.

To spare you from the horrors of a lengthy post - it was too limited and expensive. Not expensive for what it was, but just for getting a minimum group together for matched play. £175 - bargain or not - was too much for a starter set that didn't even cover a mandatory maniple for matched play.

Aeronautica, on the other hand has a very affordable starter set, two factions, match-play ready( so it seems )...campaign book, dice. The selection of aircraft is also decent.

If the rules and points are similar to the old AI, the contents of the starter will be close to the 100 points of an average 1 hour-ish AI game. However, the scenarios will be limited to Americans and Brits reliving the glory days of 1943-44 as Imperials Escort bombers to targets or off the board whilst the Orks try to intercept. Pure dogfighting will be a bit lacking and would need another 2 thunderbolts to evenly match forces outside of a ground tactical objective. IIRC the fighta bombas were still pretty well matched against the Thunderbolts, so the Ork side of the boxed set should be pretty good from the get go.

To anyone getting into the game a la carte, I suspect a box of dakka jets and a box of thunderbolts is all you need for good dogfighting. The pricing is pretty good, because if there's a group looking to play, the initial investment for a playable squadron is at the 25 GBP/40 USD level, like buying into a Necromunda gang. Whilst they mention up to 12 aircraft per side, 4-6 was always the sweet spot for fun fast gaming.

I hope that the missions are varied enough. Classic dogfighting is what I want the most, so I'll probably pick up an extra thunderbolt box. I wonder what the release schedule will be for the other races? are they going for a necromunda style where it takes a year to have everyone represented, it'll slows my interest in the game. I will buy the cools models no matter what as I can use them for cool stuff not game related.

Witchdoctor, thanks for the guidence.

For now...its a box of Thunderbolts for use in another game. If Aeronautica takes off( boom-boom! ) in the local game club then I'll get a copy of Rynns World and go from there.

Racerguy180 wrote:
I wonder what the release schedule will be for the other races?

Pure speculation on my end, but I'm willing to bet it'll be the T'au, if only because they were heavily featured in the only expansion book for the original game and that's the only other faction Karl Kopinski did pilot art for.

I think it is funny that the Ork aircraft are aerodynamically a better actual functional design than the Imperium aircraft. At high speeds the forward-swept wings will suffer catastrophic wing structure failure when flying under atmospheric conditions. Orks for the win!

 Tokhuah wrote:
I think it is funny that the Ork aircraft are aerodynamically a better actual functional design than the Imperium aircraft. At high speeds the forward-swept wings will suffer catastrophic wing structure failure when flying under atmospheric conditions. Orks for the win!

The existence of the (albeit prototype) Su-47,SR-10 and the X-29 argue that. They are irrelevant due to the nature of aerial combat putting emphasis on missiles not maneuverability, not structural weakness. Modern materials allow the wings to twist and bend the way they would need to at high speeds and attack angles.

Both those airplanes were discontinued due to the exact reasons I brought up. Assuming the power of a 40k aircraft is greater than modern jets, then high performance will be met with the wings warping or snapping off. The Imperials even lack the forward canard so it is just as high fantasy as Eldar flyers. I have no problem with fantasy, but I am amused by bad science, and that in all other forms it is an Ork thing. The Ork airplanes look like they actually work.

 Tokhuah wrote:
Both those airplanes were discontinued due to the exact reasons I brought up. Assuming the power of a 40k aircraft is greater than modern jets, then high performance will be met with the wings warping or snapping off. The Imperials even lack the forward canard so it is just as high fantasy as Eldar flyers. I have no problem with fantasy, but I am amused by bad science, and that in all other forms it is an Ork thing. The Ork airplanes look like they actually work.

Well lo and behold the Lightning also got discontinued, literally.

Looking over the contents and US pricing, two things hit me.

The buy in looks expensive, though not absurdly so.

There's really no need to purchase the starter set of you are planning to get the campaign book.

 Tokhuah wrote:
Both those airplanes were discontinued due to the exact reasons I brought up. Assuming the power of a 40k aircraft is greater than modern jets, then high performance will be met with the wings warping or snapping off. The Imperials even lack the forward canard so it is just as high fantasy as Eldar flyers. I have no problem with fantasy, but I am amused by bad science, and that in all other forms it is an Ork thing. The Ork airplanes look like they actually work.

Well seeing how 40k aircrafts loiter around leisuredly over battlefield slow enough to be shot by pistols and flamers I would assume they have lower power than modern jets

 Tokhuah wrote:
Both those airplanes were discontinued due to the exact reasons I brought up. Assuming the power of a 40k aircraft is greater than modern jets, then high performance will be met with the wings warping or snapping off. The Imperials even lack the forward canard so it is just as high fantasy as Eldar flyers. I have no problem with fantasy, but I am amused by bad science, and that in all other forms it is an Ork thing. The Ork airplanes look like they actually work.

When you look at the lore behind the lightning you'll see that the forward swept wings were a very hard hurtle to get over in the adaptation from it being an STC to a functioning fighter.

As someone who has worked as a line technician for years, and who is working on a pilot license, i don't see the problem at all. The writers give an in universe reason as to why it exists the way that it does, and continually adhere to that explanation. There is internal consistency, allowing for one to suspend disbelief.

 BrookM wrote:

Racerguy180 wrote:
I wonder what the release schedule will be for the other races?

Pure speculation on my end, but I'm willing to bet it'll be the T'au, if only because they were heavily featured in the only expansion book for the original game and that's the only other faction Karl Kopinski did pilot art for.

I reckon they'll be releasing the rest of the imperium aircraft( starting with lightning probably) alongside new faction (1 fighter+1 bomber) . This production load is even heavier than AT, and know how slow SG usually, I hope they can keep up.

 Sledgehammer wrote:

 Tokhuah wrote:
Both those airplanes were discontinued due to the exact reasons I brought up. Assuming the power of a 40k aircraft is greater than modern jets, then high performance will be met with the wings warping or snapping off. The Imperials even lack the forward canard so it is just as high fantasy as Eldar flyers. I have no problem with fantasy, but I am amused by bad science, and that in all other forms it is an Ork thing. The Ork airplanes look like they actually work.

When you look at the lore behind the lightning you'll see that the forward swept wings were a very hard hurtle to get over in the adaptation from it being an STC to a functioning fighter.

As someone who has worked as a line technician for years, and who is working on a pilot license, i don't see the problem at all. The writers give an in universe reason as to why it exists the way that it does, and continually adhere to that explanation. There is internal consistency, allowing for one to suspend disbelief.

It’s also the case that all the 40k factions have access to materials far stronger or lighter (for a given strength) than any we currently know so the existence of forward-sweep wings is by no means a deal breaker from an aero structure point of view. The Thunderbolt having all the streamlined grace of Worcester cathedral gives the impression that Imperial stuff is low tech, but it isn’t.

I’m i. Two minds as to what to buy now. A freind at my club is going in so I’m now considering giving the starter a miss for now, and buying the book, cards, and mat. (And use my existing planes, at least for a while)

Just notice that Marauder Bomber can now take missiles, So you can turn them into Air combat role with 4 pair of Sky strike missile now. I expect Destroyer would be able to do the same.

Glorious!

RFT wrote:

 Sledgehammer wrote:

 Tokhuah wrote:
Both those airplanes were discontinued due to the exact reasons I brought up. Assuming the power of a 40k aircraft is greater than modern jets, then high performance will be met with the wings warping or snapping off. The Imperials even lack the forward canard so it is just as high fantasy as Eldar flyers. I have no problem with fantasy, but I am amused by bad science, and that in all other forms it is an Ork thing. The Ork airplanes look like they actually work.

When you look at the lore behind the lightning you'll see that the forward swept wings were a very hard hurtle to get over in the adaptation from it being an STC to a functioning fighter.

As someone who has worked as a line technician for years, and who is working on a pilot license, i don't see the problem at all. The writers give an in universe reason as to why it exists the way that it does, and continually adhere to that explanation. There is internal consistency, allowing for one to suspend disbelief.

It’s also the case that all the 40k factions have access to materials far stronger or lighter (for a given strength) than any we currently know so the existence of forward-sweep wings is by no means a deal breaker from an aero structure point of view. The Thunderbolt having all the streamlined grace of Worcester cathedral gives the impression that Imperial stuff is low tech, but it isn’t.

I’m i. Two minds as to what to buy now. A freind at my club is going in so I’m now considering giving the starter a miss for now, and buying the book, cards, and mat. (And use my existing planes, at least for a while)

The issue with the thunderbolt isn’t structural, it’s that a design like that would struggle to get supersonic and even if it did have enough power it would be very unstable. Even well below supersonic the sharp edges would locally accelerate then separate the airflow, creating a wonderfully horrible mix of local shockwaves due to compressibility and sections of the aircraft that are permanently stalled.

The forward swept wings of the lightning are the least of the problems with the Imperial aircraft.

Guys, kindly take the whole "Can it fly? Should it fly? Here is why!" and whatnot to a thread of its own in 40k discussions please, thanks!

For me with the best part is the pricing is super reasonable and competitive with the old resin model pricing.

The buy in is $40 as long as one person has either the rulebook or campaign book and there's a hex mat to play on. I imagine there are already or will be some nice 3rd party mats too.

Seriously, if it's like the old AI, this is going to be fun with a single faction fighter box and it will be worth having a fighter box from every faction.

I get that GW wants everyone to buy 12-20 aircraft rosters so they can play every possible scenario, but they should really be playing up the whole: "all you need is a box of Dakkajets" aspect of the game to get more people invested.

witchdoctor wrote:
For me with the best part is the pricing is super reasonable and competitive with the old resin model pricing.

The buy in is $40 as long as one person has either the rulebook or campaign book and there's a hex mat to play on. I imagine there are already or will be some nice 3rd party mats too.

Seriously, if it's like the old AI, this is going to be fun with a single faction fighter box and it will be worth having a fighter box from every faction.

I get that GW wants everyone to buy 12-20 aircraft rosters so they can play every possible scenario, but they should really be playing up the whole: "all you need is a box of Dakkajets" aspect of the game to get more people invested.

In case you still didn't know the unboxing video on "Too Many Metal Men" Youtube chanel skim through almost all the basic rule from the box.


Finally a good look at the sprue and model, its like they're reading my yesterday comment (probably certainly not)

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/08/27/aeronautica-imperialis-the-modelsgw-homepage-post-2fw-homepage-post-2/

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/08/27/aeronautica-imperialis-the-modelsgw-homepage-post-2fw-homepage-post-2/

In short, some sprue pics and the promise that more Imperial and Ork aircraft are on the way.

Ninja'd!

Nice to see them confirm the scale is the same as AT! No doubt the result of them being asked that question by legions of epic fans!

The Thunderhawk is going to be enormous, old AI one was big enough, and I really hope they do a Manta at that scale and just go nuts.

As for new planes, I think we'll Eldar and Chaos first. They're kind of the two extremes whilst Tau are a lot more like the Orks & Imps.

 zedmeister wrote:
Nice to see them confirm the scale is the same as AT! No doubt the result of them being asked that question by legions of epic fans!

Good news indeed!

Quick question - even if I only want the Imperial stuff and the Rynn’s World book, it still makes sense to buy the starter at discount, doesn’t it?

Nice!

With all the options mentioned, what are people's thought on "WYSIWYG" for this game? Do you plan to build a different ship for each main version of an airship, but not for the optional wargear? Is it okay to put on wargear for looks even if it doesn't make it into your list? Etc...


Edit: Alpharius, see this post, I think in your case you'd be better off going the a la carte route:

Chopstick wrote:
So Aircraft box is 40US$ based on UK price

So the value of the starter set

2 thunderbolt : 20$

2 Marauder : 40$

3 Dakkajet : 20$

2 bommer : 20$

Some low effort board print, booklet, and stock dice : worthless.

Total value of 100$

So you get 10$ value, mainly because that Marauder is actually very expensive, since they had to make another half sprue for the weapons.

Building an Ork Squadron is much cheaper, having no variant do save the wallet lol, look like Chaos and Eldar might be in the same vein.

Interesting!

And do we think we’ll eventually get a hex to inches/CMs conversion too?

This game feels like it needs more room to breathe...

The Rynn world campaign book is an expansion based on a Scenario in the original rulebook. Clash of Aces, Ork Ace Black Barun vs Imperial Ace Ricter Dagor Jaml.

Also I noticed on the Marauder Bomber weapon sprue you get 8 Hellstrikemissiles and 8 Bombs, which mean you won't have enough to arm 2 Marauder full of missile.

And since they didn't have Skystrike missiles, I suspect it'll be on the Marauder Destroyer weapon sprue, probably alongside another set of Hellstrike Missile.

Or else you had to stole them from the Thunderbolt sprue, which is really dumb. I don't need that many bombs, especially since Marauder Bomber or Destroyer all come with bombs bay.

Hm... the video makes it look rather a lot like Blue Max, IMHO...

Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

 Alpharius wrote:
Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

Well, for me a good thing, as it's a pretty great game I've played and loved since the 80s

Are ships like the Arvus and Aquila lander something that could be feasible with this sort of gameplay? It would be interesting to see those in this sort of scale but I have no idea if they'd work, is there a list of what was available in the original release anywhere?

 Mentlegen324 wrote:
Are ships like the Arvus and Aquila lander something that could be feasible with this sort of gameplay? It would be interesting to see those in this sort of scale but I have no idea if they'd work, is there a list of what was available in the original release anywhere?

Someone posted a page from the old rule book earlier in this thread that had a full list of aircraft with their points cost.

Yes, slow transports have a place in missions where you need to drop troops off without them getting shot out of the sky. The Arvus had a model, can’t remember if the Aquila did.