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 BoomWolf wrote:
GW cant get a break.

No new models-whaaa I want new toys
New primaris line-whaaa they are phasing out my old models
Keeping the old line active while releasing new stuff-whaaa why can't they just kill the old line.

No fething pleasing people.

I just want my rhinos to have firing ports back and drop pods to be useful

Sgt. Cortez wrote:
You can still play with Rogue Trader models, Terminators on 25mm Bases or 3rd Edition Dark Eldar even though the latter are the worst minis GW ever sold and every player should have replaced them in 5th Edition . Nobody will stop you. If you don't want to buy Primaris then simply don't and continue playing with your existing Marines. You'll have less problems in any GW or tournament than I have since about 60% of my CSM have third party Bits on them....

I use my Rogue Trader Marines as Scouts. I doubt GW would tell me not to.

Brainling wrote:
They can produce the kits cheap. .

For now... How old is the Rhino molds? 15 years? At some points it isn't cheap.

But some people just prefer the alternative. Playing Classic Marines in 2020 like Sister players did in 2012-2018.

Reemule wrote:

Brainling wrote:
They can produce the kits cheap. .

For now... How old is the Rhino molds? 15 years? At some points it isn't cheap.

But some people just prefer the alternative. Playing Classic Marines in 2020 like Sister players did in 2012-2018.

Sisters werent the most popular army of a flagship product for over two decades, with kit numbers that drown out other factions.

Rhino kit is 20 years old, I think. 1999 sounds right ish.

Sgt. Cortez wrote:
You can still play with Rogue Trader models, Terminators on 25mm Bases

I used this example last night @flgs. Said I can plop down a patrol of my RTB-01 squad, w Terminator Capt on 25mm & Chaplain.

So I'm not too terribly worried.

I'm still thinking there'll be 30k, 40k (pre rift) & current 42k.

Honestly, I have not kept up with things, as I am busy with other things right now, when I am not painting. Regardless of what "Gee Dubs" wants to do with their new edition, I will still have my Crimson Fists. They can't take them away, and I will figure out a way to use them one way or another. If it means that I use a different rule system than what is current, than so be it.

My experience from WFB tells me that I don't need GW to have fun with my miniatures. All that I need are willing players, and the rulebooks that we agree to use. I would agree that anyone who is stuck with playing at a GW shop has an obstacle or two to overcome in finding a new venue. But, this makes for an opportunity for people to start thinking outside of the box(store) and go on your own path. This is your hobby, don't let them dictate to you what you do with your plastic guys.

I doubt GW will ever officially kill old marines there’s too much money there. But unless they bother to go back and give the Rhino and Razorback the new vehicle powers and tacticals the equiv of all the new primaris strats (and we know they won’t) then nonveteran old marines are still effectively squatted for any competitive game sense.

From the new previews I’m finally feeling like I might be able to build a mech marine force that plays like I miss from 3rd-5th edition, which is cool. But it still means I’m retiring like 5000pts of old marines and rhino-based tank models to rebuy my list as primaris.

Doing away with classic marines and terminators - over night - would be a dangerous move for GW. They are the most recognisable characters they have ever produced and are their bread and butter.

Out of all the characters they own, these two require a slow and gradual move over to the primaris design.

That said, I personally enjoy having both! The Astartes are the sacred history of a chapter while the Primaris are adding to that history. I cannot imagine 40K without the Death Wing Terminators, and yet the primaris are a great excuse to establish a new chapter with a clean slate.

Leave it as it is!

They aren't killing anything.

Traditional Marines will be supported and gain improved rules so you can play them for years to come.

I'm making the switch to Primaris because they simply look better and will be getting exciting and varied releases. There are already more varied kits in the Primaris range than the entire classic line, with the cool armours and weapons for different roles.

It has been two years. People have had over 24 months to accept Primaris. At this point you're either on board or you're not. If you're not pick a new faction or stop complaining. I hate Tau - you don't see me mocking their kits, complaining about the lore or look and bringing them up all the time to bash.

I do think that the primaris look better, as in they have better proportions, but I would have much more prefered to see the "old" marines models updated to also have better proportions, than having an entirely new thing.

Also am I the only one who is rather sad that. as it stands now, we will probably never see new or updated models for the classic indomitus terminator line?

I mean sure they want to push Primaris Marines and whatnot, but Primaris at least have the classic Power Armor (albeit with different helmet designs), but there is no adequate terminator equivalent in the Primaris model line in my opinion.

Stop worrying about it, its clear they aren't getting rid of them now.

 Ishagu wrote:
It has been two years. People have had over 24 months to accept Primaris. At this point you're either on board or you're not. If you're not pick a new faction or stop complaining. I hate Tau - you don't see me mocking their kits, complaining about the lore or look and bringing them up all the time to bash.

I agree. I think waving this blood shirt is getting a little bit tiresome at this point. We Primaris marine fans get it, there are a lot of vocal people that aren't fans them and the reasons why are starting to become cliche. So I will try to contain my excitement on Primaris. I would take it as a kindness that you rein in your disgust for them a bit.

Tiberias wrote:
I do think that the primaris look better, as in they have better proportions, but I would have much more prefered to see the "old" marines models updated to also have better proportions, than having an entirely new thing.

Also am I the only one who is rather sad that. as it stands now, we will probably never see new or updated models for the classic indomitus terminator line?

I mean sure they want to push Primaris Marines and whatnot, but Primaris at least have the classic Power Armor (albeit with different helmet designs), but there is no adequate terminator equivalent in the Primaris model line in my opinion.

Well, Chaos got one, so there has been an update to the dog-head, head-in-the-chest, hunch-back, I-have-to-s***-but-can't terminator pattern since Primaris Marines, and unfortunately, only the posing received anything that might resemble improvement.

That said, I have no doubt that there will eventually be Primaris 2+ armor heavy infantry at some point in time, and hopefully they will actually look good.


Also, if they had just been an update to the tactical marine kit, then existing marine players wouldn't have bought them. This way, more people will buy more of them, and there isn't a problem with dealing with old model vs. new model sizing regulations. The only real downside is the fluff, which is very much a problem for the individual, not as a whole.

Classic marines will never die!

I doubt it would happen, but it would be crazy cool if old marines and primaris marines had another civil war.

The glorious old guard holding the line against the upstarts.

G.L.O.R.I.O.U.S.

Take heed brothers, follow Gabriel Seth! Take up arms and stand your ground. NOT ONE STEP BACK!

Space marines built the Imperium, and will tear it asunder rather that face extinction under Mars sponsered mutants!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
10,000 years of martial glory will crush the upstarts!

The reality is that GW isn't going to make any more non-Primaris Marines...but they're going to keep selling non-Primaris Marines for at least this edition and through the next - and maybe even the next! There are SO MANY regular marine kits, and there are still many, many unit types that Primaris have not rendered redundant.

It's likely that classic marines will be around for a long while. Pretty much any group picture still has a ton of classic models in it since it'll be years for the primaris range to have enough units to be a full army.

That said GW pretty much lost me as a marine purchaser by making the switch as I have no interest in them from a fluff perspective since I find them to be a force that fundamentally alters what I liked about the IOM and 40k in general. A sudden influx of innovation, hope and hover tech every were is pushing 40k into generic sci fi setting.

Until sisters drop my wallet is pretty much closed outside of maybe another land speeder or two.

Heafstaag wrote:
Classic marines will never die!

I doubt it would happen, but it would be crazy cool if old marines and primaris marines had another civil war.

The glorious old guard holding the line against the upstarts.

G.L.O.R.I.O.U.S.

Take heed brothers, follow Gabriel Seth! Take up arms and stand your ground. NOT ONE STEP BACK!

Space marines built the Imperium, and will tear it asunder rather that face extinction under Mars sponsered mutants!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
10,000 years of martial glory will crush the upstarts!

or GW could tell an intreasting story

At some point, maybe soon, maybe later, GW is gonna produce a series of units that all have a Primaris stat-line, and have (in one way or another) the wargear options of Classic Marines.
And they'll just tell you that you can use a Primaris model to represent the guy with the Bolter Thingy and the Chainsword, or use a Classic Marine to represent the guy with the Bolter Thingy and the Chainsword.

The Classic Marines won't go away. They will disappear as distinct options, but they will be there like Rogue Trader Orks in a modern Ork army.

That's my prediction, anyway.

BrianDavion wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:
Classic marines will never die!

I doubt it would happen, but it would be crazy cool if old marines and primaris marines had another civil war.

The glorious old guard holding the line against the upstarts.

G.L.O.R.I.O.U.S.

Take heed brothers, follow Gabriel Seth! Take up arms and stand your ground. NOT ONE STEP BACK!

Space marines built the Imperium, and will tear it asunder rather that face extinction under Mars sponsered mutants!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
10,000 years of martial glory will crush the upstarts!

or GW could tell an intreasting story

Your math is faulty, as what I mentioned would be an interested story.

Heafstaag wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:
Classic marines will never die!

I doubt it would happen, but it would be crazy cool if old marines and primaris marines had another civil war.

The glorious old guard holding the line against the upstarts.

G.L.O.R.I.O.U.S.

Take heed brothers, follow Gabriel Seth! Take up arms and stand your ground. NOT ONE STEP BACK!

Space marines built the Imperium, and will tear it asunder rather that face extinction under Mars sponsered mutants!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
10,000 years of martial glory will crush the upstarts!

or GW could tell an intreasting story

Your math is faulty, as what I mentioned would be an interested story.

no I don't think it would the imperial civil war is over done

 Saturmorn Carvilli wrote:

 Ishagu wrote:
It has been two years. People have had over 24 months to accept Primaris. At this point you're either on board or you're not. If you're not pick a new faction or stop complaining. I hate Tau - you don't see me mocking their kits, complaining about the lore or look and bringing them up all the time to bash.

I agree. I think waving this blood shirt is getting a little bit tiresome at this point. We Primaris marine fans get it, there are a lot of vocal people that aren't fans them and the reasons why are starting to become cliche. So I will try to contain my excitement on Primaris. I would take it as a kindness that you rein in your disgust for them a bit.

We wouldn't complain so much if they weren't pushed so hard as the replacements to our current collections. That's the rub.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:

Well, Chaos got one, so there has been an update to the dog-head, head-in-the-chest, hunch-back, I-have-to-s***-but-can't terminator pattern since Primaris Marines, and unfortunately, only the posing received anything that might resemble improvement.

Them's fightin words.

It seems to me they will not create any more classic marine kits. It seems they are committed to a larger scale going forward. They only invented the “Primaris” story as a way to explain two scales of Marines existing simultaneously because they could not update the marine line overnight. It will take a few years but eventually the Primaris line will be complete enough to stop selling many classic kits, except those that are used for Horus Heresy.

-Rids

 Insectum7 wrote:

 Saturmorn Carvilli wrote:

 Ishagu wrote:
It has been two years. People have had over 24 months to accept Primaris. At this point you're either on board or you're not. If you're not pick a new faction or stop complaining. I hate Tau - you don't see me mocking their kits, complaining about the lore or look and bringing them up all the time to bash.

I agree. I think waving this blood shirt is getting a little bit tiresome at this point. We Primaris marine fans get it, there are a lot of vocal people that aren't fans them and the reasons why are starting to become cliche. So I will try to contain my excitement on Primaris. I would take it as a kindness that you rein in your disgust for them a bit.

We wouldn't complain so much if they weren't pushed so hard as the replacements to our current collections. That's the rub.

except GW isn't psuhing them hard as replacements. they've repeatedly said these are reinforcements, and supplements etc the people pushing them as replacements, seem to be the player base, whom are convinced "GW IS GONNA STEAL MY OLD MARINES" meanwhile I've always maintained GW'll produce both because they'll be happy to double dip as long as old marines are selling

BrianDavion wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

 Saturmorn Carvilli wrote:

 Ishagu wrote:
It has been two years. People have had over 24 months to accept Primaris. At this point you're either on board or you're not. If you're not pick a new faction or stop complaining. I hate Tau - you don't see me mocking their kits, complaining about the lore or look and bringing them up all the time to bash.

I agree. I think waving this blood shirt is getting a little bit tiresome at this point. We Primaris marine fans get it, there are a lot of vocal people that aren't fans them and the reasons why are starting to become cliche. So I will try to contain my excitement on Primaris. I would take it as a kindness that you rein in your disgust for them a bit.

We wouldn't complain so much if they weren't pushed so hard as the replacements to our current collections. That's the rub.

except GW isn't psuhing them hard as replacements. they've repeatedly said these are reinforcements, and supplements etc the people pushing them as replacements, seem to be the player base, whom are convinced "GW IS GONNA STEAL MY OLD MARINES" meanwhile I've always maintained GW'll produce both because they'll be happy to double dip as long as old marines are selling

I hope you're right, however, those Primaris models are features suuuuper heavily in the majority of the GW pics, as far as I can tell. And from what I've heard about the fluff, normal marines may not be being made any more. If someone can correct me on this point, I'd definitely welcome it. But from my understanding at the moment, fiction-wise Primaris are literally the replacements.

And they've already claimed my beloved Calgar.

I look forward to seeing the language around it in the new codex.

well I *DO* think everything new will be Primaris and they have become the new marine posterboy. just I don't see them ditching the old marine kits anytime soon, although older kits like rhinos etc I'd be a little leery of, but if GW's smart the new SOB rhinos will make the sisters bling optional so that even if GW decides to discontinue the current rhino it'll still be accessable

Primaris exist because someone after the raging dumpster fire that was the chs fiasco sat with the board and patiently explained the difference between copyright and designright.

Once the rocking,screaming and cold sweats stopped minions were sent to summon the design studio and commands were given. The marineus biggus defendus from ye olde design rights was born.

The only thing that would kill the real marine line is someone testing there knowledge of designrights in relation to marines.

Nah, I like the Proper Marines; can't stand the Primaris stuff. Seem like a lot of the new rules benefit the regular lads as much as the Primaris, so I'm pretty pleased with that.

Why would GW get rid of the obviously superior Space Marine Classic?

Backspacehacker wrote:To answer your question what will stop you, GW, GW will stop you. If you play in their stores or events they will.

To give you an example as to the hate, I'll try to give you an example. Imagine you had a classic car, just think of a classic car you like and you put in a lot of time, money, passion, and energy into it. And you always would take it to the biggest car show that was in reasonable distance to you. Everyone liked having you there, it was a good time. Then, one day, for no real reason, the car show you took your car to, one day said, hey every that came out after this year is not considered a classic anymore by us and can't be entered into the show, you can still bring it down, but it's not officially part of the show. And your classic car was at the cut off and can't enter. So now that thing you put so much time energy and money into is no longer valid at the show you always loved entering and had been a part of for years.

Your gonna feel kinda left out, and upset because they just instantly turned their back on you. Sure you can buy a new car that fits their guide lines but it's not the classic care you like, so really your just buying the new classic car to be able to enter the show with any car not the one you like.

That's what it feels like to be a space marines player who used to play classic marines.

Okay, genuinely curious - have you EVER been told "you can't play old Marines" at a GW store? Because while GW are certainly making many new Primaris models, they've never stopped anyone playing and using their old models as far as I've seen.

Your analogy works better as:
You have a car, which you take to shows, events, work and repair it lovingly, etc etc
The company who make the car release a new model. You can still enter your car into the show like you always used to, you can still drive it around, but there's other new cars around. Turns out it's a really popular new car, and the company are very proud of it, but that doesn't stop you still entering and being proud of your own.

They still sell the old car too!

Honestly, I don't get the Primaris fear. GW haven't done anything with the old Marines they haven't done with any other pre-8th army. They've just released new models which run parallel to the old Marines. While I disagree with people's arguments of "they look bad!", that's at least understandable as opinion. The arguments of "my old marines are being killed off" is simply unfounded, especially with the latest rules.

Heafstaag wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:
Classic marines will never die!

I doubt it would happen, but it would be crazy cool if old marines and primaris marines had another civil war.

The glorious old guard holding the line against the upstarts.

G.L.O.R.I.O.U.S.

Take heed brothers, follow Gabriel Seth! Take up arms and stand your ground. NOT ONE STEP BACK!

Space marines built the Imperium, and will tear it asunder rather that face extinction under Mars sponsered mutants!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
10,000 years of martial glory will crush the upstarts!

or GW could tell an intreasting story

Your math is faulty, as what I mentioned would be an interested story.

I'll be honest, it's really not that interesting. The whole "omg old army rebels against the new army" is pretty dull, in my eyes - hell, we've already had a similar event already happen in 40k itself (the Horus Heresy started because Horus was afraid that he and his army would be replaced and forgotten).

I think it was way more interesting and non-standard if the Primaris were actually respected and the Imperium wasn't just being grimdumb.

So you’re angry because you’re anxious that they’re going to get rid of the classic space marine line but you’re angry because they haven’t gotten rid of the classic space marine line. That makes perfect sense.

Or are you just upset that you didn’t get to have an I told you so moment after two years of claiming that there was going to be a non-primaries purge?