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Kanluwen wrote: I've been posting quite frequently that the Marines codex, when it dropped, saw basically none of the new items that the book brought.
This wasn't a surprise, this isn't interrupting anything. This was just a dragged out release. Rather than let each supplement 'wave' come out by itself with a single character, upgrade frame, and datacards--they held chunks of the actual new items back.
It's a terrible marketing strategy. All I wanted was Impulsors for the past month but can't buy impulsors...So I've just been painting and not buying stuff. GJGW. Costing yourself money. All of this stuff has been ready to ship out for months.
If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder
Yes, but surely that simply means you've saved enough money to pre-order 6, right? GW marketing genius!
You know you're really doing something when you can make strangers hate you over the Internet. - Mauleed
Just remember folks. Panic. Panic all the time. It's the only way to survive, other than just being mindful, of course-but geez, that's so friggin' boring. - Aegis Grimm
Hallowed is the All Pie The Before Times: A Place That Celebrates The World That Was
Platuan4th wrote: Yes, but surely that simply means you've saved enough money to pre-order 6, right? GW marketing genius!
Oh I'm gonna buy 3 right off the bat but I was gonna do that anyways...Literally the only thing that keeps me from buying my plastic crack is not being able to buy the plastic crack that I want at the time I want.
If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder
I'll definatly be buying some myself. whatever the cost if you wanna run mechanized you need transports, and it's eaither impulsors or repulsors, and repulsors are too points inefficant for a mechanized list.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
So far the price point has kept me from expanding my dunerider forces beyond my initial order for mechanicus. If they were $50 or $60, I'd probably have grabbed 2-3 more by now. Same with the Incursor. If it was $60, I'd probably go up to 3 or 4, instead of just 2.
IanVanCheese wrote: Worth pointing out, they haven't fixed the error on the IF upgrade sprue. The fist symbol is still backwards on the power fist.
Not a huge issue for me, but some people were super upset about it.
There was an interesting discussion about heraldry over on B&C. Someone who has studied the subject actually showed how there actually isn't an error - it matches historical heraldic principles perfectly, and as such is much more of a win for authenticity than people realize.
IanVanCheese wrote: Worth pointing out, they haven't fixed the error on the IF upgrade sprue. The fist symbol is still backwards on the power fist.
Not a huge issue for me, but some people were super upset about it.
There was an interesting discussion about heraldry over on B&C. Someone who has studied the subject actually showed how there actually isn't an error - it matches historical heraldic principles perfectly, and as such is much more of a win for authenticity than people realize.
IanVanCheese wrote: Worth pointing out, they haven't fixed the error on the IF upgrade sprue. The fist symbol is still backwards on the power fist.
Not a huge issue for me, but some people were super upset about it.
There was an interesting discussion about heraldry over on B&C. Someone who has studied the subject actually showed how there actually isn't an error - it matches historical heraldic principles perfectly, and as such is much more of a win for authenticity than people realize.
Got a link or quote?
Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone?
IanVanCheese wrote: Worth pointing out, they haven't fixed the error on the IF upgrade sprue. The fist symbol is still backwards on the power fist.
Not a huge issue for me, but some people were super upset about it.
There was an interesting discussion about heraldry over on B&C. Someone who has studied the subject actually showed how there actually isn't an error - it matches historical heraldic principles perfectly, and as such is much more of a win for authenticity than people realize.
Got a link or quote?
On mobile so it's hard to search back for it, so I'll grab one when I get home. I'll try to paraphrase and hopefully do it justice. It's regarding two key parts for symbols: facing and perspective.
In the case of things like animal heads, they always look to the front of the bearer. In the case of body parts like the fist, the thumb points to the front. But facing is considered in a resting position, like when standing at attention, so the symbol has to be reversed so the thumb points forwards. The Americans use this concept with their military personnel - the flag on American uniforms faces forward, similar to how it would look carried aloft in combat by a standard bearer. Facing the enemy. Always moving forward.
Then we consider perspective. Apparently, historical precedent for asymmetrical symbols mounted on things like gloves and rings and weapons are that they face the bearer. This way, if one placed their hands palm down on a table to swear an oath or something, the symbols would be facing the bearer and pointing towards their heart.
Which is why the left handed power fist has the thumb pointed forward (facing) and the orientation flipped vertically (bearer's perspective).
IanVanCheese wrote: Worth pointing out, they haven't fixed the error on the IF upgrade sprue. The fist symbol is still backwards on the power fist.
Not a huge issue for me, but some people were super upset about it.
There was an interesting discussion about heraldry over on B&C. Someone who has studied the subject actually showed how there actually isn't an error - it matches historical heraldic principles perfectly, and as such is much more of a win for authenticity than people realize.
Got a link or quote?
On mobile so it's hard to search back for it, so I'll grab one when I get home. I'll try to paraphrase and hopefully do it justice. It's regarding two key parts for symbols: facing and perspective.
In the case of things like animal heads, they always look to the front of the bearer. In the case of body parts like the fist, the thumb points to the front. But facing is considered in a resting position, like when standing at attention, so the symbol has to be reversed so the thumb points forwards. The Americans use this concept with their military personnel - the flag on American uniforms faces forward, similar to how it would look carried aloft in combat by a standard bearer. Facing the enemy. Always moving forward.
Then we consider perspective. Apparently, historical precedent for asymmetrical symbols mounted on things like gloves and rings and weapons are that they face the bearer. This way, if one placed their hands palm down on a table to swear an oath or something, the symbols would be facing the bearer and pointing towards their heart.
Which is why the left handed power fist has the thumb pointed forward (facing) and the orientation flipped vertically (bearer's perspective).
I dig it.
Thank you.
If I got that right, and it certainly seems sensibly explained, I don't think I can believe it applies to the chapter badge on the fist. I'll stick with my solution and use a knife.
Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone?
IanVanCheese wrote: Worth pointing out, they haven't fixed the error on the IF upgrade sprue. The fist symbol is still backwards on the power fist.
Not a huge issue for me, but some people were super upset about it.
There was an interesting discussion about heraldry over on B&C. Someone who has studied the subject actually showed how there actually isn't an error - it matches historical heraldic principles perfectly, and as such is much more of a win for authenticity than people realize.
Got a link or quote?
On mobile so it's hard to search back for it, so I'll grab one when I get home. I'll try to paraphrase and hopefully do it justice. It's regarding two key parts for symbols: facing and perspective.
In the case of things like animal heads, they always look to the front of the bearer. In the case of body parts like the fist, the thumb points to the front. But facing is considered in a resting position, like when standing at attention, so the symbol has to be reversed so the thumb points forwards. The Americans use this concept with their military personnel - the flag on American uniforms faces forward, similar to how it would look carried aloft in combat by a standard bearer. Facing the enemy. Always moving forward.
Then we consider perspective. Apparently, historical precedent for asymmetrical symbols mounted on things like gloves and rings and weapons are that they face the bearer. This way, if one placed their hands palm down on a table to swear an oath or something, the symbols would be facing the bearer and pointing towards their heart.
Which is why the left handed power fist has the thumb pointed forward (facing) and the orientation flipped vertically (bearer's perspective).
I dig it.
Thank you.
If I got that right, and it certainly seems sensibly explained, I don't think I can believe it applies to the chapter badge on the fist. I'll stick with my solution and use a knife.
Fair enough. Could always use one of the new transfer sheets if you even want the symbol.
I think the biggest issue I'm going to run into is trying to make sure my Primaris sarges don't all look identical, symbol or otherwise...
Suppose it's a good thing I won't have many fist bearers.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/10/15 12:58:39
IanVanCheese wrote: Worth pointing out, they haven't fixed the error on the IF upgrade sprue. The fist symbol is still backwards on the power fist.
Not a huge issue for me, but some people were super upset about it.
There was an interesting discussion about heraldry over on B&C. Someone who has studied the subject actually showed how there actually isn't an error - it matches historical heraldic principles perfectly, and as such is much more of a win for authenticity than people realize.
Got a link or quote?
On mobile so it's hard to search back for it, so I'll grab one when I get home. I'll try to paraphrase and hopefully do it justice. It's regarding two key parts for symbols: facing and perspective.
In the case of things like animal heads, they always look to the front of the bearer. In the case of body parts like the fist, the thumb points to the front. But facing is considered in a resting position, like when standing at attention, so the symbol has to be reversed so the thumb points forwards. The Americans use this concept with their military personnel - the flag on American uniforms faces forward, similar to how it would look carried aloft in combat by a standard bearer. Facing the enemy. Always moving forward.
Then we consider perspective. Apparently, historical precedent for asymmetrical symbols mounted on things like gloves and rings and weapons are that they face the bearer. This way, if one placed their hands palm down on a table to swear an oath or something, the symbols would be facing the bearer and pointing towards their heart.
Which is why the left handed power fist has the thumb pointed forward (facing) and the orientation flipped vertically (bearer's perspective).
I dig it.
Thank you.
If I got that right, and it certainly seems sensibly explained, I don't think I can believe it applies to the chapter badge on the fist. I'll stick with my solution and use a knife.
Fair enough. Could always use one of the new transfer sheets if you even want the symbol.
I think the biggest issue I'm going to run into is trying to make sure my Primaris sarges don't all look identical, symbol or otherwise...
Suppose it's a good thing I won't have many fist bearers.
Eh, I can sculpt, so it's not like I don't have alternatives. Plus I don't need my models to suffer from fist overload, so it's not a loss to have a plain power fist. But it can't hurt to have a look around and read an explanation that may give me a better feeling about what I thought was a sculpting error.
Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone?
Platuan4th wrote: Yes, but surely that simply means you've saved enough money to pre-order 6, right? GW marketing genius!
Oh I'm gonna buy 3 right off the bat but I was gonna do that anyways...Literally the only thing that keeps me from buying my plastic crack is not being able to buy the plastic crack that I want at the time I want.
So they haven't cost themselves any money? You're buying the same amount you would anyway? Just smoothing the profits curve a little.
Forget Impulsors...just waiting on the Incursors to complete my RG army (although to be fair, still have plenty of painting to do.) he Q is, will it be easy to make a 2nd HW mine as I know the box will only have the one for a marker (I guess I could clip the one the guy is carrying).
Kanluwen wrote: It will be doubled up sprues in all likelihood. That's how all the Primaris stuff has been to date for the "Troops" choices.
I hope that is the case. I want to make three squads of 5 Infiltrators and one squad of Incursors by combining one of these kits with the Shadowspear Infiltrators.
I'm pretty excited to pick up a box of Infiltrators/Incursors and use the extra parts to make some of the Reivers I have into more useful dudes. Figure I can mix bodies and end up with ten of each from a single box since Reivers are worthless.
Man, at first when I saw Wrack and Ruin I thought that would be great for ITC magic boxes, until I noticed that the unit had to be visible (womp womp).
Prometheum5 wrote: I'm pretty excited to pick up a box of Infiltrators/Incursors and use the extra parts to make some of the Reivers I have into more useful dudes. Figure I can mix bodies and end up with ten of each from a single box since Reivers are worthless.
Hope this is right. I think maybe the models will share a gun, with an added scope, rather than having one of each type. I guess you could stick the scope on a reiver's carbine thing though. You do seem to get enough heads for everyone.
The bigger issue with the Fist for me is that it’s too small for a Primaris marine. It looks like they just took an old MK VII one and stuck it to the sprue, though presumably they took the time to add on the symbol (apparently facing the right way) first. But the guy’s arm is not long enough.
It’s odd. Once I saw that it was too small I found I couldn’t unsee it. I’ve given my characters power fists from Terminators instead and they look much better.
Edit: that rules preview tells us virtually nothing, right?
I guess it’s good to see the leaked rules were true, including the super doctrine, which we hadn’t seen in print before.
The psychic power provides a way of causing 1.5 wounds to a unit in terrain on average, which is lower than the 2 average damage from smite and useless against targets that aren’t in terrain. 3 average damage against a building would be cool, if anyone took buildings ever.
Tor Garadon feels like a missed opportunity to me. He’s like Feirros, except without the things that make Feirros good.
As a Crimson Fist player it’s nice to hear that I’ll be able to use the Fist of Vengeance power again. It’s less clear if I’m able to use all these Imperial Fist-only things. Was it ever clarified if Crimson Fists could take the siege detachment?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/10/16 15:28:59
Prometheum5 wrote: I'm pretty excited to pick up a box of Infiltrators/Incursors and use the extra parts to make some of the Reivers I have into more useful dudes. Figure I can mix bodies and end up with ten of each from a single box since Reivers are worthless.
Hope this is right. I think maybe the models will share a gun, with an added scope, rather than having one of each type. I guess you could stick the scope on a reiver's carbine thing though. You do seem to get enough heads for everyone.
I had not considered that but you may be right. The bolters could have optional scope/ammo piece like the Intercessor bolt rifles to save on arms. Could still be workable with Reiver Bolt Carbines, but a little more work than I'd thought.
What a waste of a spell slot, provided nothing at all happens to buildings in the near future that actually makes them good.
The Doctrine has been discussed since the leaks and rumours, and we've seen Tor's data sheet. Such a weird unit. He should have had a heavy Bolter on his shoulder or a bolt weapon in that other empty hand. I love the model though and I'll find room for him for the 2+ BS power and his ridiculous fist.
Already expected that strat - everyone else got one exactly like it for their own preferred doctrine.
Eye of Hypnoth, just like it was in Vigilus, is awesome here. No issues with that. Hoping more Vigilus stuff makes it over...
Lemondish wrote: What a waste of a spell slot, provided nothing at all happens to buildings in the near future that actually makes them good.
The Doctrine has been discussed since the leaks and rumours, and we've seen Tor's data sheet. Such a weird unit. He should have had a heavy Bolter on his shoulder or a bolt weapon in that other empty hand. I love the model though and I'll find room for him for the 2+ BS power and his ridiculous fist.
Already expected that strat - everyone else got one exactly like it for their own preferred doctrine.
Eye of Hypnoth, just like it was in Vigilus, is awesome here. No issues with that. Hoping more Vigilus stuff makes it over...
It works on buildings or any unit standing in terrain. I've yet to see a single game that doesn't have people put models in terrain if only to put them up higher so they can get better Line of Sight.
Yeah, and it's cast on a 6...and does wounds on a 5+...that's better across the board than the Thousand Sons version, only exception is the target unit needs to be wholly within a terrain feature. That's common where I play. It does mean people will start leaving one model from each squad just outside of terrain though to try to avoid it.
That is NOT a bad spell by any stretch if you play on tables with actual terrain. The same can be said for the IF trait, but....most people play on crap tables where it doesn't come into play.
PS: I'm pretty sure you could snipe characters in cover with that as well...so...yeah that's a great spell.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/10/16 17:44:47
Elbows wrote: Yeah, and it's cast on a 6...and does wounds on a 5+...that's better across the board than the Thousand Sons version, only exception is the target unit needs to be wholly within a terrain feature. That's common where I play. It does mean people will start leaving one model from each squad just outside of terrain though to try to avoid it.
That is NOT a bad spell by any stretch if you play on tables with actual terrain. The same can be said for the IF trait, but....most people play on crap tables where it doesn't come into play.
PS: I'm pretty sure you could snipe characters in cover with that as well...so...yeah that's a great spell.
Average of 3 mortal wounds isn't bad either. I feel like the best use for it would be things like Devastators or Heavy Weapon Teams parked up high in a building.
Ahh ok, yes I see now that it does mortal wounds on a 5+. I'd initially read it as 6+ for some reason. An average 3 mortal wounds isn't too bad. It could be great for hitting characters with, as a good roll could kill people.
Your opponent can just get out of terrain though I guess. They may as well, since your whole army ignores cover.
It's arguably better for a successor that doesn't ignore cover, like Crimson Fists, than it is for Imperial Fists.
Mandragola wrote: Ahh ok, yes I see now that it does mortal wounds on a 5+. I'd initially read it as 6+ for some reason. An average 3 mortal wounds isn't too bad. It could be great for hitting characters with, as a good roll could kill people.
Your opponent can just get out of terrain though I guess. They may as well, since your whole army ignores cover.
It's arguably better for a successor that doesn't ignore cover, like Crimson Fists, than it is for Imperial Fists.
Terrain can still be used to keep things out of line of sight, or make it easier to gain LoS. Even if it doesn't give a cover save, it still has useful functionality.
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