Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The real play would be to go Legion scale or smaller. You want big enough scale to see the characters, but as small as possible to allow for more vehicles.

 Platuan4th wrote:
Hasbro DID try rebooting and marketing GI Joe to adults several times and it always fails because the majority of Joe collectors/fans just want the exact same thing over and over. That's why Renegades(read: GI Joe doing the A-Team thing complete with the intro homaging the A-Team show intro) failed despite being an entirely enjoyable show with an amazing concept that fit the idea of Joe perfectly.

Yeah, entertaining to me definitely does not mean entertaining to everyone, or even enough people to really have it be financially viable. In fact, my "ideal" vision of a GI Joe reboot is probably so far from the original intent of the show as to almost be a totally different thing, so I doubt anyone would even be interested. I guess it would depend on what the nostalgia generally "hangs" on, to me, it's the aesthetics mostly, but I can see how it would be vastly different for (most) other people.

Maybe one day I can actually get "good" at 3D modeling and make my own printable Alley Vipers, (but that is not likely).

I enjoyed Renegades. Seemed much more modern and "subversive" than I expected it to be.

That said, I would also do terrible things for a good Alley Viper set of minis. Such a cool design.

 Easy E wrote:
I enjoyed Renegades. Seemed much more modern and "subversive" than I expected it to be.

That said, I would also do terrible things for a good Alley Viper set of minis. Such a cool design.

I actually have to plead ignorance, since I never actually saw it. In fact, before this thread, I probably hadn't thought about my old figures since, well, since the 90's when I was still playing with them. Even when those films came out a while back, I think they were so divorced from the old aesthetic that it immediately didn't appeal to me.

I'm definitely partial to the later 80s and some of the early 90's aesthetic, browsing through those lines brings back some fond memories. It looks like they wildly diverged from that and eventually came back around to some things closer, eventually, with some of the action figures. My "dream" of it is the weird, 80's aesthetic to the Cobra stuff wedded to a "post-Modern" sort of narrative. I don't know that it would or could work, probably not, but I realize now (and this probably explains a lot about me) I was/am always a Cobra fan-boy for the most part, or at the very least, a crypto-Cobra fan boy,

For me I'd either want some semi realistic commando type missions ala the Larry Hama comics or crazy epic battles ala the cartoon.

Or may e a two scale game with both?

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
For me I'd either want some semi realistic commando type missions ala the Larry Hama comics or crazy epic battles ala the cartoon.

Or may e a two scale game with both?

Yeah, I think either something like a scope like Infinity, where you get "specialists" that each have certain skills and you have something like 10, 15, 20 people per side. So, you get your demo expert, your melee expert, your "leader" or commander, hacker/com's expert and so on. But, there could also be something like "line" troops, especially for Cobra. In fact, with all the different sorts of Cobra guys, you get all sorts of different "line" specialists. The GI Joe teams are clearer in this sort of specialist paradigm too, since each model is an sort of named, individual person and so is a unique amalgam of skills. So, broadly, it's Cobra forces of mostly narrow "line" specialists with few "unique" leaders vs. Joe forces of multi-specialists with few narrow line specialists.

Or, as you point out, a larger scope (and smaller scale, I guess) is also pretty interesting, where you get whole squads of different Vipers, for example. Then you definitely get to include vehicles too. Whole squads of different Vipers is definitely a draw here, where you get to use multiple squad types in specialist sort of ways. I think the "issue" there is that the GI Joe's themselves don't really have much in the way of line troops, but I can imagine a way to make some up, that the sort of faction mechanic would be, for example: 9 "line troops" + 1 "Joe" as a squad leader, who them offers "bonus" skill/ability/whatever to that unit based off their particular "unique" set. Cobra, on the other hand, has line troops locked in the certain skill/ability sets and "leaders" function only as command/coordination and separate "units" altogether.

But, here, I am going way too far to something that would never happen,

Hasbro is super conservative, largely to their detriment, I think. But, as someone who is not a shareholder, I'm of course not risk averse.

The real problem with my ideal GI Joe game is it's basically a video game, 1 Joe should be a match for 10 or more Cobras (barring the named Characters of course).

Hrm. Were there ever any good GI video games?

While I love the original GIJoe, none of the spinoffs were ever as interesting as the original cartoon and marvel comics. The IDW comics and also the Resolute series of shorts/movie was the exception, Resolute was everything I ever wanted from a modern GIjoe series, I wish it had caught on more.

Sadly, I think actual real-world events had too big of an impact on the premise of GIJoe and US soldiers fighting terrorism was no longer the saturday morning cartoon material it had been pre-9/11. Younger people that WOULD have been GIJoe fans instead either went more into the superhero aspect and became MCU fanboys or more into the jingoistic soldier worship aspect and became Call of Duty fanboys.

As for miniatures, I'd hoped to get a Heroclix set ever since heroclix first came out. Or, since it was Hasbro owned, an Axis & Allies expansion would have been awesome. Still hoping we see something from Wizkids.

I feel like a co-op boardgame would be pretty much the perfect medium for GIJoe, something like an Imperial Assault reskin with Joes and Cobras

Kid_Kyoto wrote:The real problem with my ideal GI Joe game is it's basically a video game, 1 Joe should be a match for 10 or more Cobras (barring the named Characters of course).

Hrm. Were there ever any good GI video games?

I couldn't think of one, so I searched and seems there really wasn't ever one as far as I can tell.

Kalamadea wrote:While I love the original GIJoe, none of the spinoffs were ever as interesting as the original cartoon and marvel comics. The IDW comics and also the Resolute series of shorts/movie was the exception, Resolute was everything I ever wanted from a modern GIjoe series, I wish it had caught on more.

Sadly, I think actual real-world events had too big of an impact on the premise of GIJoe and US soldiers fighting terrorism was no longer the saturday morning cartoon material it had been pre-9/11. Younger people that WOULD have been GIJoe fans instead either went more into the superhero aspect and became MCU fanboys or more into the jingoistic soldier worship aspect and became Call of Duty fanboys.

Hmm, I might have to check out the IDW comics and that show. I saw a clip of the Resolute show and it seems decent, although I think it's still somewhat not what I'd call my "ideal" reboot.

I think I'd personally do it as divorcing Cobra and the Joes from the American government/military/"terrorist" dynamic, instead reimagining Cobra as some corporate conglomerate that grows so big, that it also takes on an international paramilitary role as well. Maybe even they were/are contracted as a paramilitary enforcement arm of the UN. Of course though, corruption and profit seeking, lead it to do all sorts of unethical and amoral things. Since they are a big, global corporation, the Joes are another paramilitary group, but one focused on something like "ethics," or, at least, curbing what they know is the unethical actions of Cobra. So, they aren't US military assets direct, but they are focused on doing what the US military can't, because Cobra is essentially an international body and because of corruption, economics, politics and other factors, the US often doesn't want to/can't actually take direct action again Cobra. Plus, Cobra would be minorly circumspect, especially since, for example, they are also a media conglomerate.

So, for example, they might go somewhere and perform a military action there, but guess what media covers it? Cobra media. And, do you think they would paint the Cobra action as unethical? So, it's the Joes who work to try to undermine Cobra interests as much as possible. It also gives Cobra some "limits" since they can't just go full-scale, total-war on places, since that could not be covered up realistically. So, you get the aim to have their Vipers (of various sorts) as necessarily small scale teams, designed to work clandestinely in most cases where Cobra is contracted, or places where it can be easy wand-waved, media-spun away, ex post facto.

Am I almost writing slash fiction here? I don't know, maybe that is a terrible idea, but it seems, off the top of my head, to be interesting and minorly "realistic." I guess, as an recently realized and admitted Cobra fan-boy, I want Cobra to be a little less hand-wringing, moustache-twirling evil, just more amoral and completely unethical. But, as I said before, I am fairly certain my vision is not market or profitable in all likelihood. As you say, I think the world as "moved on." Honestly, so have I, but I still have some nostalgia for the old aesthetics.

That is the premise of "Renegades", H.

 Easy E wrote:
That is the premise of "Renegades", H.

Yeah, I did notice the corporate aspect when I watched the first episode. Probably should have just kept watching more. I still think the lack of my "preferred" late 80's aesthetic, plus the sort of "kiddy" feel to it, kind of kills it to me. I'm completely unreasonable in my desires,

 Kalamadea wrote:
While I love the original GIJoe, none of the spinoffs were ever as interesting as the original cartoon and marvel comics. The IDW comics and also the Resolute series of shorts/movie was the exception, Resolute was everything I ever wanted from a modern GIjoe series, I wish it had caught on more.

Sadly, I think actual real-world events had too big of an impact on the premise of GIJoe and US soldiers fighting terrorism was no longer the saturday morning cartoon material it had been pre-9/11. Younger people that WOULD have been GIJoe fans instead either went more into the superhero aspect and became MCU fanboys or more into the jingoistic soldier worship aspect and became Call of Duty fanboys.

As for miniatures, I'd hoped to get a Heroclix set ever since heroclix first came out. Or, since it was Hasbro owned, an Axis & Allies expansion would have been awesome. Still hoping we see something from Wizkids.

I feel like a co-op boardgame would be pretty much the perfect medium for GIJoe, something like an Imperial Assault reskin with Joes and Cobras

The storyline has moved a lot farther on, and Larry Hama has been a big part of moving past the old "G.I.Joe, fighting Terrorists" routine.

I talked to Hama about it, he told me that people were misrepresenting the characters, so he's trying to stick with the property as long as he can, but as he's getting older, he's having a chore getting others on board with his visions on where the story is going. IDW has this tendency of putting other writers and artists on the title that honestly just need to work with Larry Hama, and learn the lore, before they are let loose on the title.

In my opinion, The higher ups at IDW are pawning off the G.I.Joe name to other up and comer writers, who need to try to earn their stripes by just throwing the title their way, and letting them do what they want with it, but they are dropping the ball. G.I.Joe has a new title, where, right off the bat, they destroyed G.I.Joe as a concept, and threw it into some crazy SJW mutation on par with Sitterson's commie vision of what he thought it was supposed to turn into. The new book is at like Issue 3 or 4, and quite honestly, I don't see it lasting a year, because the story is crap. This additional book is a horror story of biblical proportions that has nothing to do with G.I.Joe.

I only follow Hama's run, right now around 268/269 and the Original Marvel timeline continues long past the 80's ideas. On several occasions, G.I.Joe and Cobra have had to team up/ combine forces against other threats, the current one being both Cobra Commander/ Mindbender, and a particularly nasty A.I. that is running roughshod over anyone you sent to deal with it. The October Guard, Dreadnocks, and Ninja clans are all indirectly working towards the same goal, as Cobra is snatching up the Sean Collins Snake eyes, who they think is the original, and trying to use the brain scanner to turn him into a Cobra agent.

So far, Cobra's got him, but the Joes and Dreadnocks, and October Guard are all moving in on him in completely different plans.

The Ninja angle has already taken quite a few turns, and a few issues back, Dr. Venom has returned in an unexpected way that has honestly sent the current Snakeeyes on a path to acquire the old Snakeeyes brainwave scanner imput to turn him into Old Snakeeyes. ( There's another girl, who they put the Snake eyes personality into her, and she's got the old Snakeeyes style, and is fighting like he used to... )

 Grot 6 wrote:

 Kalamadea wrote:
While I love the original GIJoe, none of the spinoffs were ever as interesting as the original cartoon and marvel comics. The IDW comics and also the Resolute series of shorts/movie was the exception, Resolute was everything I ever wanted from a modern GIjoe series, I wish it had caught on more.

Sadly, I think actual real-world events had too big of an impact on the premise of GIJoe and US soldiers fighting terrorism was no longer the saturday morning cartoon material it had been pre-9/11. Younger people that WOULD have been GIJoe fans instead either went more into the superhero aspect and became MCU fanboys or more into the jingoistic soldier worship aspect and became Call of Duty fanboys.

As for miniatures, I'd hoped to get a Heroclix set ever since heroclix first came out. Or, since it was Hasbro owned, an Axis & Allies expansion would have been awesome. Still hoping we see something from Wizkids.

I feel like a co-op boardgame would be pretty much the perfect medium for GIJoe, something like an Imperial Assault reskin with Joes and Cobras

The storyline has moved a lot farther on, and Larry Hama has been a big part of moving past the old "G.I.Joe, fighting Terrorists" routine.

I talked to Hama about it, he told me that people were misrepresenting the characters, so he's trying to stick with the property as long as he can, but as he's getting older, he's having a chore getting others on board with his visions on where the story is going. IDW has this tendency of putting other writers and artists on the title that honestly just need to work with Larry Hama, and learn the lore, before they are let loose on the title.

In my opinion, The higher ups at IDW are pawning off the G.I.Joe name to other up and comer writers, who need to try to earn their stripes by just throwing the title their way, and letting them do what they want with it, but they are dropping the ball. G.I.Joe has a new title, where, right off the bat, they destroyed G.I.Joe as a concept, and threw it into some crazy SJW mutation on par with Sitterson's commie vision of what he thought it was supposed to turn into. The new book is at like Issue 3 or 4, and quite honestly, I don't see it lasting a year, because the story is crap. This additional book is a horror story of biblical proportions that has nothing to do with G.I.Joe.

I only follow Hama's run, right now around 268/269 and the Original Marvel timeline continues long past the 80's ideas. On several occasions, G.I.Joe and Cobra have had to team up/ combine forces against other threats, the current one being both Cobra Commander/ Mindbender, and a particularly nasty A.I. that is running roughshod over anyone you sent to deal with it. The October Guard, Dreadnocks, and Ninja clans are all indirectly working towards the same goal, as Cobra is snatching up the Sean Collins Snake eyes, who they think is the original, and trying to use the brain scanner to turn him into a Cobra agent.

So far, Cobra's got him, but the Joes and Dreadnocks, and October Guard are all moving in on him in completely different plans.

The Ninja angle has already taken quite a few turns, and a few issues back, Dr. Venom has returned in an unexpected way that has honestly sent the current Snakeeyes on a path to acquire the old Snakeeyes brainwave scanner imput to turn him into Old Snakeeyes. ( There's another girl, who they put the Snake eyes personality into her, and she's got the old Snakeeyes style, and is fighting like he used to... )

Comic books rule..... its like day sof Our Lives but with a lot more actual fighting!

 H wrote:

Kid_Kyoto wrote:The real problem with my ideal GI Joe game is it's basically a video game, 1 Joe should be a match for 10 or more Cobras (barring the named Characters of course).
Hrm. Were there ever any good GI video games?

I couldn't think of one, so I searched and seems there really wasn't ever one as far as I can tell.

There were two for the NES.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G.I._Joe_(NES_video_game)
and an arcade game
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G.I._Joe_(arcade_game)

 Robert Facepalmer wrote:
There were two for the NES.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G.I._Joe_(NES_video_game)
and an arcade game
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G.I._Joe_(arcade_game)

Yeah, I meant more to answer were there any good games, but I wasn't clear enough. I saw that a couple were made, but they definitely didn't look good to me.

I had always hoped that the Skylanders craze would have led to a similar video game only for G.I. Joe.

As an aside, GI Joe and Cobra weren't the only two groups involved in all of their skirmishes, just the most prevalent.

Russia had their own group, but I can't remember the name, Oktober Guard (or was that their Avengers)?

It wouldn't take much to make different groups and then expand other villianous groups out from Cobra. Remember that Destro had his own force before the toy line died, the Iron Grenadiers.

Scale-wise, though, I think we'd either have too look at Infinity with no Vehicles or maybe Star Wars Legion if we can get standard military units involved on the non-Villain side.


As a side note: Had Alley Viper, loved the model, though it's design wasn't very good camo unless you were in a graffiti-riddled neighborhood. He stands out more than Naruto!

 Charistoph wrote:
As an aside, GI Joe and Cobra weren't the only two groups involved in all of their skirmishes, just the most prevalent.

Russia had their own group, but I can't remember the name, Oktober Guard (or was that their Avengers)?

It wouldn't take much to make different groups and then expand other villianous groups out from Cobra. Remember that Destro had his own force before the toy line died, the Iron Grenadiers.

Oktober Guard was the Russian Joe equivalent(a member even shows up in the G1 Transformers cartoon). There was also the Dreadnoks who worked as mercenaries for Cobra through Zartan, Slaughter's Marauders, Action Force and Red Shadow(the European equivalents of Joe and Cobra), as well as Joe Colton's original Adventure Team vs the Intruders. GI Joe Extreme also had SKAR replace Cobra, which also showed up in IDWs Retaliation.

 Charistoph wrote:
As a side note: Had Alley Viper, loved the model, though it's design wasn't very good camo unless you were in a graffiti-riddled neighborhood. He stands out more than Naruto!

Oh, no doubt, the early ones have nonsensical "camo." It's really conspicuancy marking, rather than camouflage. It's actually one reason why I like that late 80's (and some of the early 90s) aesthetic, because so many of them are just completely outlandish (looking at you, original Range Viper). However, in a way, it actually makes sense, as a sort of aposematism, you know, being Vipers and all.

It's just off the wall and I love(d) it. It's why my desired G.I. Joe is completely infeasible. I want realism and the absurd 80's unreality at the same time.

 H wrote:

 Charistoph wrote:
As a side note: Had Alley Viper, loved the model, though it's design wasn't very good camo unless you were in a graffiti-riddled neighborhood. He stands out more than Naruto!

Oh, no doubt, the early ones have nonsensical "camo." It's really conspicuancy marking, rather than camouflage. It's actually one reason why I like that late 80's (and some of the early 90s) aesthetic, because so many of them are just completely outlandish (looking at you, original Range Viper). However, in a way, it actually makes sense, as a sort of aposematism, you know, being Vipers and all.

It's just off the wall and I love(d) it. It's why my desired G.I. Joe is completely infeasible. I want realism and the absurd 80's unreality at the same time.

Have you read IDW's completely off the wall, turned up to 11 Transformers vs GIJoe?

IDW comics show up on Humble Bundle from time to time, I have a good digital run of GI Joe and Transformers that cost me like %50.

 Platuan4th wrote:
Have you read IDW's completely off the wall, turned up to 11 Transformers vs GIJoe?

No, I'm really not too interested in Transformers though.

Is the other IDW G.I. Joe worth looking into? Maybe I'll try giving both a look at some point.

 H wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:
Have you read IDW's completely off the wall, turned up to 11 Transformers vs GIJoe?

No, I'm really not too interested in Transformers though.

Is the other IDW G.I. Joe worth looking into? Maybe I'll try giving both a look at some point.

I was asking cause TFvJoe is basically 80's extreme. They even do it in the old Marvel style art.

Honestly, I'm ignorant on IDW's Joe series pre-Revolution Hasbroverse.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 H wrote:

 Charistoph wrote:
As a side note: Had Alley Viper, loved the model, though it's design wasn't very good camo unless you were in a graffiti-riddled neighborhood. He stands out more than Naruto!

Oh, no doubt, the early ones have nonsensical "camo." It's really conspicuancy marking, rather than camouflage. It's actually one reason why I like that late 80's (and some of the early 90s) aesthetic, because so many of them are just completely outlandish (looking at you, original Range Viper). However, in a way, it actually makes sense, as a sort of aposematism, you know, being Vipers and all.

It's just off the wall and I love(d) it. It's why my desired G.I. Joe is completely infeasible. I want realism and the absurd 80's unreality at the same time.

Have you read IDW's completely off the wall, turned up to 11 Transformers vs GIJoe?

That comic book is quite honestly one of the most insane things you will ever see. It's completely bonkers, and it's a damned masterpiece.

Another vote for the IDW GI Joe vs Transformers, just tons of fun.

Still waiting for the Shipwreck Space Pirate of the Solar System book

I'm sure one of the reasons there's no GI Joe game is the niche nature of the hobby and the fact you need to grow the business across borders to make real money. Look at the flags beside all the people commenting on this thread. GI Joe is very much US-centred. Much more so than Transformers.

My only knowledge or exposure to it was the 80s cartoon that I vaguely remember and the movies a few years ago that came and went without making much of an impression.

I'm surprised nobody tried to adapt a system for Joe dolls.

I mean, one could adapt something like Inquisitor quite nicely, no?

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I'm surprised nobody tried to adapt a system for Joe dolls.

I mean, one could adapt something like Inquisitor quite nicely, no?

Adapt? You could just flat out use Inquisitor rules.

 H wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
For me I'd either want some semi realistic commando type missions ala the Larry Hama comics or crazy epic battles ala the cartoon.

Or may e a two scale game with both?

Yeah, I think either something like a scope like Infinity, where you get "specialists" that each have certain skills and you have something like 10, 15, 20 people per side. So, you get your demo expert, your melee expert, your "leader" or commander, hacker/com's expert and so on. But, there could also be something like "line" troops, especially for Cobra. In fact, with all the different sorts of Cobra guys, you get all sorts of different "line" specialists. The GI Joe teams are clearer in this sort of specialist paradigm too, since each model is an sort of named, individual person and so is a unique amalgam of skills. So, broadly, it's Cobra forces of mostly narrow "line" specialists with few "unique" leaders vs. Joe forces of multi-specialists with few narrow line specialists.

Or, as you point out, a larger scope (and smaller scale, I guess) is also pretty interesting, where you get whole squads of different Vipers, for example. Then you definitely get to include vehicles too. Whole squads of different Vipers is definitely a draw here, where you get to use multiple squad types in specialist sort of ways. I think the "issue" there is that the GI Joe's themselves don't really have much in the way of line troops, but I can imagine a way to make some up, that the sort of faction mechanic would be, for example: 9 "line troops" + 1 "Joe" as a squad leader, who them offers "bonus" skill/ability/whatever to that unit based off their particular "unique" set. Cobra, on the other hand, has line troops locked in the certain skill/ability sets and "leaders" function only as command/coordination and separate "units" altogether.

But, here, I am going way too far to something that would never happen,

Hasbro is super conservative, largely to their detriment, I think. But, as someone who is not a shareholder, I'm of course not risk averse.

There's a few sets of rules I've seen - Blasters and Bulkheads is one such - where squads of mooks just count a single "character", with as many wounds/hit points/etc as there are models in the squad. Something like that would work for GI Joe. As would Warlord's 2000AD rules; they seemed to work with one or two heroes vs a load of hapless goons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, one of my club colleagues did a 28mm GI Joe game at three Scottish wargames shows this year, using various forumware and 3D-printed models. Used the Song of Blades and Heroes rules, IIRC.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:
Also, one of my club colleagues did a 28mm GI Joe game at three Scottish wargames shows this year, using various forumware and 3D-printed models. Used the Song of Blades and Heroes rules, IIRC.

Hmm, I'm just curious what aesthetic they went with. Obviously they likely can't be shared or sold, but I just wonder how they came out looking. I don't even know that I care to have a game to play with them, I mostly just would want cool looking models, haha.