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Total noob question. I bought Dark Imperium and have been sticking figures on the bases as they recommend in those instructions. I noticed I have a 65mm base instead of a 60mm base for the foetid bloat drone? Does it matter? Which made me think of the general question of whether base size matters in this game?
Yes and no. So the general idea is that you use the bases provided and characters or big models have bigger bases. For the most part no reasonable person will call you out on something like that. Unless you put your captain on a knight base to cheat out auras
For the drone not a whole lot, for a buffing unit like Guilliman yes quite a bit, If I moved him to a 100mm base his aura would be significantly more powerful.
Blood for the bloo... wait no, I meant for Sanguinius!
Somewhat but it's not going to be huge difference(provided differences are small) and have different good and bad sides. With 25mm and 32mm bases for example you can get about half a rank more with 25mm bases vs 32mm but you will cover less of a board with same model count.
65mm vs 60mm and if somebody complains odds are you wouldn't want to play with them. And besides GW's official stance is you got the base with the models, it's okay now even if these days they would come with different base so the opponent would actually be cheating if he insist you can't use base you got with the model.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/02 21:39:11
More so when it comes to units of models, and board control.
For example, a 1” round base, x 5 models can be stretched 13” long in a straight line, and maintain coherency. When it comes to denying deep strike effects, you get an oval-ish shape 31” long, and 19” deep.
Changing to 2” bases, you could have a line 18” long, and a deep strike denial area in an oval-ish shape 36” long and 20” deep.
Strictly hypothetical, the same models on larger bases for the same points cost have greater defensive value, right? Individual squads, maybe not a big deal but added up over several squads, the larger bases might only need 4 units to create a “safe zone” where the smaller bases might need 5 units to generate the same amount of area for a “safe zone”.
I wouldn’t say it’s game breaking, more than the game already is, but in general, a larger base for the same points gives a player more board control, and board control (or denying it to your opponent) is one of very few defensive tactics afforded by the rules of 40k. Tactics I employ ruthlessly as a Guard player.
If I could put my grunts on 32mm bases, and was in-it-to-win-it, it would notably increase the effectiveness of that strategy / tactic.
I think the drones by design is supposed to be a floating model befitting a 60mm clear flying base, but somewhere along the line the model was desined to fit onto "60 mm solid base" which is actually 64mm - this is probably where the discrepency comes in.
Seeing as it was the base the box came with it should not be a problem. Same reason people should not complain about my boyz on 25mm bases. What you get extra in CC effectiveness you lose in area control and it's not the players fault GW did not include the "proper" base in the set.
What about things like attack bikes? Mine aren't on bases because I bought them from eBay and they didn't come with them. The gw store page has both based and unbased though the Ultramarines one looks like the official one and isn't based. Is it an advantage to base it because of the bigger footprint?
kingheff wrote: What about things like attack bikes? Mine aren't on bases because I bought them from eBay and they didn't come with them. The gw store page has both based and unbased though the Ultramarines one looks like the official one and isn't based. Is it an advantage to base it because of the bigger footprint?
bikes need to be based. you can IIRC buy a pack of bases pretty cheap
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
I regularly play with my RT beakies & they're on 25's. The only players who question why they're not on 32's are people that were not born when I first played with them.
Now if you buy brand new models and put the incorrect bases on, that would generally be considered modeling for advantage.
kingheff wrote: What about things like attack bikes? Mine aren't on bases because I bought them from eBay and they didn't come with them. The gw store page has both based and unbased though the Ultramarines one looks like the official one and isn't based. Is it an advantage to base it because of the bigger footprint?
bikes need to be based. you can IIRC buy a pack of bases pretty cheap
Well the gw store page has two unbased bikes, one on a round base, and one on a custom base so they seem to handwave the issue.
kingheff wrote: What about things like attack bikes? Mine aren't on bases because I bought them from eBay and they didn't come with them. The gw store page has both based and unbased though the Ultramarines one looks like the official one and isn't based. Is it an advantage to base it because of the bigger footprint?
The old attack bike models didn't have bases, and I'm fairly certain that the 2012 box doesn't, either. So that eBay seller you got the attack bikes from probably didn't give you any because they didn't get any.
To be frank, when GW changed the Ork and Space Marine base sizes from 25mm to 32mm, that probably killed off a chunk of the "We have to keep up with the official base size changes" crowd. Because rebasing a squad is one thing, rebasing your entire collection is another.
If you don't have a base for the attack bike, you end up having to measure to the hull of the vehicle, obnoxious irregular shape and all. If you want to prevent the model getting chipped, and don't want to deal with fiddly measurements, put it on the smallest round base it'll fit on.
kingheff wrote: What about things like attack bikes? Mine aren't on bases because I bought them from eBay and they didn't come with them. The gw store page has both based and unbased though the Ultramarines one looks like the official one and isn't based. Is it an advantage to base it because of the bigger footprint?
The old attack bike models didn't have bases, and I'm fairly certain that the 2012 box doesn't, either. So that eBay seller you got the attack bikes from probably didn't give you any because they didn't get any.
To be frank, when GW changed the Ork and Space Marine base sizes from 25mm to 32mm, that probably killed off a chunk of the "We have to keep up with the official base size changes" crowd. Because rebasing a squad is one thing, rebasing your entire collection is another.
If you don't have a base for the attack bike, you end up having to measure to the hull of the vehicle, obnoxious irregular shape and all. If you want to prevent the model getting chipped, and don't want to deal with fiddly measurements, put it on the smallest round base it'll fit on.
60mm round ('Dreadnaught base') is probably about right, might hang off a 50mm round and it's too wide to use one of the ovals.
I got the one special Commissar (Severina Raine?) released earlier this year, and have her as a Lord Commissar. I still use her original base, but as the terrain is roughly 25mm, I typically measure from the edge of the terrain to be fair.
greatbigtree wrote: More so when it comes to units of models, and board control.
For example, a 1” round base, x 5 models can be stretched 13” long in a straight line, and maintain coherency. When it comes to denying deep strike effects, you get an oval-ish shape 31” long, and 19” deep.
Changing to 2” bases, you could have a line 18” long, and a deep strike denial area in an oval-ish shape 36” long and 20” deep.
Strictly hypothetical, the same models on larger bases for the same points cost have greater defensive value, right? Individual squads, maybe not a big deal but added up over several squads, the larger bases might only need 4 units to create a “safe zone” where the smaller bases might need 5 units to generate the same amount of area for a “safe zone”.
I wouldn’t say it’s game breaking, more than the game already is, but in general, a larger base for the same points gives a player more board control, and board control (or denying it to your opponent) is one of very few defensive tactics afforded by the rules of 40k. Tactics I employ ruthlessly as a Guard player.
If I could put my grunts on 32mm bases, and was in-it-to-win-it, it would notably increase the effectiveness of that strategy / tactic.
It also decreases offensive power, though.
In general, I'd say being on a small base is better than being on a big one, since you can fit places you'd otherwise not and pack more models in to make range/rapid fire range/get in melee/fit between enemy models on the charge/etc.
Guardsmen, hear me! Cadia may lie in ruin, but her proud people do not! For each brother and sister who gave their lives to Him as martyrs, we will reap a vengeance fiftyfold! Cadia may be no more, but will never be forgotten; our foes shall tremble in fear at the name, for their doom shall come from the barrels of Cadian guns, fired by Cadian hands! Forward, for vengeance and retribution, in His name and the names of our fallen comrades!
When I bought Namarti Thralls to serve as count-as Mandrakes, I put them on 25mm bases instead of the 32mm bases they came with, in order to reflect official Mandrakes' base size. In this case, base size matters, as Mandrakes can be deployed anywhere more than 9 inches away from the enemy, and sometimes the spot where you want to put them is very small.
Since GW is inconsistent on Base sizes (see for example different Bases for the two Lords of Contagion) I wouldn't care. People have Terminators that came on 25mm Bases originally. Taking the base that comes with the model is recommended but if you take a different one only a real TFG in a tournament setting might comment on that.
Sgt. Cortez wrote: Since GW is inconsistent on Base sizes (see for example different Bases for the two Lords of Contagion) I wouldn't care. People have Terminators that came on 25mm Bases originally. Taking the base that comes with the model is recommended but if you take a different one only a real TFG in a tournament setting might comment on that.
That or the TFG who tried to run Guilliman on a knight base at a tournament I went to, I would say that’s a legitimate complaint.
Blood for the bloo... wait no, I meant for Sanguinius!
With Guard, the lasguns don’t matter. It’s all about the upgrades, and space they take up as a unit.
Other armies will be different, but in my case, bigger footprint is all bonus. The heavy killing is done by my tanks and artillery. The infantry are there to prevent my tanks from being tied up.
They do contribute, of course, to the overall killing but their primary purpose is to be a ten-wound Plasmagun + Heavy Weapon that keeps things away from the shootier things.
Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote: In general, I'd say being on a small base is better than being on a big one, since you can fit places you'd otherwise not and pack more models in to make range/rapid fire range/get in melee/fit between enemy models on the charge/etc.
Difference is very small. Like half a rank. So with full boyz unit you might see it IF you can get all into range anyway(even with 25mm I rarely get that as opponents use this things called "positioning" to deny it). People go on about it but difference is in practice less than it might appear.
Does slow game down though to have 32mm bases. Which is good for orks as less turns you get to play the better it's for orks.
Sgt. Cortez wrote: Since GW is inconsistent on Base sizes (see for example different Bases for the two Lords of Contagion) I wouldn't care. People have Terminators that came on 25mm Bases originally. Taking the base that comes with the model is recommended but if you take a different one only a real TFG in a tournament setting might comment on that.
That or the TFG who tried to run Guilliman on a knight base at a tournament I went to, I would say that’s a legitimate complaint.
Well that's going against even GW's rules which is base model came with is fine. Guillimann has never come with knight base.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Unit1126PLL wrote: I am worried about rebasing my metal-tab sisters onto 32mm from the slotted 25s. Is necessary, in your opinion?
GW's official stance: "nope"
Gaming wise you might get biiiiiit more mileage out of them with 32mm bases.
Look wise old sisters are smaller than the new ones so might look bit empty on 32mm base.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/12/03 06:47:59
Sgt. Cortez wrote: Since GW is inconsistent on Base sizes (see for example different Bases for the two Lords of Contagion) I wouldn't care. People have Terminators that came on 25mm Bases originally. Taking the base that comes with the model is recommended but if you take a different one only a real TFG in a tournament setting might comment on that.
That or the TFG who tried to run Guilliman on a knight base at a tournament I went to, I would say that’s a legitimate complaint.
kingheff wrote: What about things like attack bikes? Mine aren't on bases because I bought them from eBay and they didn't come with them. The gw store page has both based and unbased though the Ultramarines one looks like the official one and isn't based. Is it an advantage to base it because of the bigger footprint?
The old attack bike models didn't have bases, and I'm fairly certain that the 2012 box doesn't, either. So that eBay seller you got the attack bikes from probably didn't give you any because they didn't get any.
To be frank, when GW changed the Ork and Space Marine base sizes from 25mm to 32mm, that probably killed off a chunk of the "We have to keep up with the official base size changes" crowd. Because rebasing a squad is one thing, rebasing your entire collection is another.
If you don't have a base for the attack bike, you end up having to measure to the hull of the vehicle, obnoxious irregular shape and all. If you want to prevent the model getting chipped, and don't want to deal with fiddly measurements, put it on the smallest round base it'll fit on.
60mm round ('Dreadnaught base') is probably about right, might hang off a 50mm round and it's too wide to use one of the ovals.
Actually, you want to use the 80mm round base for the AB - the AB that came in RW battleforce box was supplied with 80mm base.
60mm has alot of overhang, and it doesn't fit on 50mm at all.
AoS has a list of base sizes (for matched play), but even that says they "are suggested base sizes rather than mandatory ones". No such list exists for 40k, but the current base size is normally stated on the model's page in GW's web store.
As others have mentioned, base size in general is liberal. As long as you keep fairly close to the provided size, you shouldn't have any issues. And avoid clear modeling for advantage, like putting Characters with Auras on ridiculously bigger bases.
My rule of thumb is that you can go up to 1 base size bigger, but no more. Generally that's only about 5-10mms more. And if going smaller, I will only go as small as the smallest base ever given. Like putting Lessor Daemons BACK on 25mms, even though most are now on 32mms.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/03 16:56:40
With Guard, the lasguns don’t matter. It’s all about the upgrades, and space they take up as a unit.
Other armies will be different, but in my case, bigger footprint is all bonus. The heavy killing is done by my tanks and artillery. The infantry are there to prevent my tanks from being tied up.
They do contribute, of course, to the overall killing but their primary purpose is to be a ten-wound Plasmagun + Heavy Weapon that keeps things away from the shootier things.
Yeah, I'm aware, but that's the exception. Anything that wants to fight in melee, most vaguely elite units, and the likes whose job isn't explicitly to occupy as much space as possible generally benefit from being able to pack in as densely as possible.
Unit1126PLL wrote:I am worried about rebasing my metal-tab sisters onto 32mm from the slotted 25s. Is necessary, in your opinion?
I bought a bunch of 32mm base adapter rings for my Sisters. Local rules say to use the most current base size in competitive play.
Guardsmen, hear me! Cadia may lie in ruin, but her proud people do not! For each brother and sister who gave their lives to Him as martyrs, we will reap a vengeance fiftyfold! Cadia may be no more, but will never be forgotten; our foes shall tremble in fear at the name, for their doom shall come from the barrels of Cadian guns, fired by Cadian hands! Forward, for vengeance and retribution, in His name and the names of our fallen comrades!
