Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hello! Im a new player, or not even that. Ive painted a few models for fun.

Thinking about buying a codex soon. Even though im not sure Im ever going to play game. Still like to read a little bit about the background etc.

The question is, what codex should I buy? I have painted the "Imperius Reavers", which is an official Ultramarine chapter. Should I buy the Space marine codex or the Ultramarine codex?

If I cant ever use Gullman it was a mistake not to paint em blue, right?

Im getting conflicting information on this.

/Staffan

StaffyStar wrote:
Hello! Im a new player, or not even that. Ive painted a few models for fun.

Thinking about buying a codex soon. Even though im not sure Im ever going to play game. Still like to read a little bit about the background etc.

The question is, what codex should I buy? I have painted the "Imperius Reavers", which is an official Ultramarine chapter. Should I buy the Space marine codex or the Ultramarine codex?

If I cant ever use Gullman it was a mistake not to paint em blue, right?

Im getting conflicting information on this.

/Staffan

it depends on what army you want to play. if you want to play space marines and different chapters then get the space marine codex if you want to just play ultramarine then get ultramarine codex

StaffyStar wrote:
If I cant ever use Gullman it was a mistake not to paint em blue, right?

Paint color does not matter to the rules.

Keywords are the only thing that matters.

You can have Blue Blood Angels or Red Space Wolves if you want to.

 DeathReaper wrote:
Paint color does not matter to the rules.

Unless you're playing at Warhammer World or or a tournament using the ITC Rules.

StaffyStar wrote:
Hello! Im a new player, or not even that. Ive painted a few models for fun.

Thinking about buying a codex soon. Even though im not sure Im ever going to play game. Still like to read a little bit about the background etc.

The question is, what codex should I buy? I have painted the "Imperius Reavers", which is an official Ultramarine chapter. Should I buy the Space marine codex or the Ultramarine codex?

If I cant ever use Gullman it was a mistake not to paint em blue, right?

Im getting conflicting information on this.

/Staffan

If you painted them up as Imperius Reavers it would be best to get both. The standard Space Marines codex has a lot generic SM fluff, rules for all but the named characters, all the successor chapter rules and the other rules. The Ultramarines supplement as all the extra stuff an Ultramarines successor can get and some more fluff about them.

You can still use G dowg but if you do I would suggest running your marines as <Ultramarines> to give them maximum benefit. This shouldn't be a problem outside of offical tournaments and even then having The Big G still would have a lot of benefits.

 Ghaz wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
Paint color does not matter to the rules.

Unless you're playing at Warhammer World or or a tournament using the ITC Rules.

That ruling says nothing about having to use "official colour schemes".

It only says that you must use the same scheme for the same chapter of marines in your army. Any different chapters should either use a different scheme or another unique identifying mark so that an opponent can easily tell which marines are which. AGain it makes no mention of what those colour schemes should be; only that they be uniform for the same army that you deploy.

for example, <Iron Hands> (or whatever faction) must be painted in a coherent fashion. This means that visually, your opponent must be able to identify which models are <Iron Hands> (or whatever faction).

Which is basically the same as the rules that Warhammer World has (i.e., models painted as Ultramarines can only be used as Ultramarines, as that is what anyone familiar with the background would identify them as). A homebrew paint scheme can be used to represent any one chapter of your choosing, but not multiple chapters in a single game.

 Ghaz wrote:

for example, <Iron Hands> (or whatever faction) must be painted in a coherent fashion. This means that visually, your opponent must be able to identify which models are <Iron Hands> (or whatever faction).

Which is basically the same as the rules that Warhammer World has (i.e., models painted as Ultramarines can only be used as Ultramarines, as that is what anyone familiar with the background would identify them as). A homebrew paint scheme can be used to represent any one chapter of your choosing, but not multiple chapters in a single game.

We are getting dragged off topic here somewhat but; you have to read the whole rule not just quote out one bit. The line right after that one clarifies very clearly that the intention of the rule has nothing to do with using official schemes for any army. It's purely about not having multiple different armies used together under the same paint scheme; or using a single army but with random coloured marines. You can use any paint scheme you want for your Ironhands - or any other marine or army group - so long as you use the same colour scheme for the ENTIRE Ironhand force. They even state that if there are one or two models that are painted differently within a single force that its fine.

Again this has nothing to do with having to use official schemes and everything to do with simple clarity of information at their events; which unless the OP clarifies, isn't an issue for them at present.

Again, you don't have to use the official scheme for the army you're playing. What it does do is prevent you from using the official paint scheme for an army with the rules for a different army because visually, your opponent would identify them as belonging to the chapter that they're painted as. That is the rule that Warhammer World has and it looks to me that the ITC are following suit.

From page 3 of the Grand Tournament USA Rules Pack:

If you have painted your models in a specific way, we expect you to use the rules relevant to that scheme. For example, if you have painted your models as Salamanders, your army must have the SALAMANDERS keyword.

If you have created your own unique colour scheme, then you may give them any keyword that you wish. If you have used different keywords between Detachments, there must be a clear visual difference between each Detachment. For example, if you have a Tyranid army with Detachments from both Hive Fleet Kraken and Kronos, the models in each Detachment must be clearly distinguishable from one to another such as a different coloured carapace. If you are unsure whether something is clearly distinguishable, contact us via the details at the end of this pack

None! Don't buy any! Wait 4 months, and 9th will come out.

I made the same mistake in 7th, and my 70$ worth of books became useless.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
None! Don't buy any! Wait 4 months, and 9th will come out.

I made the same mistake in 7th, and my 70$ worth of books became useless.

But as others have said: if you're playing an Ultramarines Successor chapter, yeah, what you want is the SM codex and the UM supplement.

 Ghaz wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
Paint color does not matter to the rules.

Unless you're playing at Warhammer World or or a tournament using the ITC Rules.

Those are not 40K Rules.

Those are house deviations that are not official 40K rules.

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
Paint color does not matter to the rules.

Unless you're playing at Warhammer World or or a tournament using the ITC Rules.

Those are not 40K Rules.

Those are house deviations that are not official 40K rules.

...but they’re relevant to the question, and are ways/places the OP may end up playing, so are worth mentioning. This forum isn’t about one way to play and RAW only, as has been discussed on many occasions. Nothing Ghaz posted is untrue or irrelevant so let it stand.

Thanx for all great answers while I were asleep!

Im glad we can work efficently on both sides of the Atlantic ocean.

I will wait with buying the codexes, and will continue to call them "The Imperius Reavers", as that is what they are.

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
Paint color does not matter to the rules.

Unless you're playing at Warhammer World or or a tournament using the ITC Rules.

Those are not 40K Rules.

Those are house deviations that are not official 40K rules.

...but they’re relevant to the question, and are ways/places the OP may end up playing, so are worth mentioning. This forum isn’t about one way to play and RAW only, as has been discussed on many occasions. Nothing Ghaz posted is untrue or irrelevant so let it stand.

It really is not relevant to the question.

He did not ask or even hint at playing games " at Warhammer World or or a tournament using the ITC Rules."

Of course it is, dont be ridiculous.

There's no harm at all in mentioning the fact to better inform the OP. What's not relevant is this back and forth you've caused by challenging it.

Hello Everyone!

I Think all information above where helpful. If you ask a question its Always good to add a Little extra information regarding the topic, evin if it isnt exacly what I asked.
Im one of those people thats Always grateful for that!

Remember that the Customer doesnt Always know what he wants. Sometimes he is grateful if you Point it out for him!
Thanx all!

Right.

The real answer is that you need the Space Marine Codex if you want to play. That is where the core Space Marine rules are.

Ultramrines book is not a codex, it is a supplement. It has additional rules (such as rules for Guilliman.) This content is not just for Ultramarines, most of it is available for their for their successors too. There are similar supplements for other first founding chapters.

Now, if you want to use Guilliman, you basically need to use ultramarine rules. This doesn't mean your models need to be painted as Ultramarines, they can be painted however you like. Just make sure your opponent is not confused about what rules you're using.

Could anyone please see if there is any tactics mentioned in the codex for the Imperius Reavers?

Or if I should choose one myself. It will affect my model choosing.

StaffyStar wrote:
Could anyone please see if there is any tactics mentioned in the codex for the Imperius Reavers?

Or if I should choose one myself. It will affect my model choosing.

They are not a chapter with rules. You can run them
As ultramarines with access to all the special chars OR a generic ultramarines successor as inheritors of the primarch and run the full ultramarines rules without the set relics.

Buy the space marines coded and the ultramarines supplement.

You can also run them as an Ultramarines successor without Inheritors using custom chapter tactics, and access everything a successor with Inheritors would get except the main relics.

StaffyStar wrote:
Could anyone please see if there is any tactics mentioned in the codex for the Imperius Reavers?

Or if I should choose one myself. It will affect my model choosing.

The Imperius Reavers have no unique chapter tactics as they are a successor chapter. This gives you three options:

1. Run them as Ultramarines. 99% of people won't have an issue with this as long as you are consistent about it. The advantages of this are the use of Ultramarines characters and relics for free and there warlord traits will sync up with the tactic best. Their tactic gives them +1 to leadership and the ability to fall back and still shoot at -1 to BS.

2. Use the Inheritors of the Primarch successor tactic. By strictest RAW you would have to do this if you want the Ultramarines chapter tactic but you also lose full access to Ultramarines characters and free relics.

3. Use the other successor chapter tactics. This allows you to create custom abilities to suit your play style but again you lose full access to Ultramarines characters and free relics.

If you go for number 3 you can take two of the following:

 KingGarland wrote:

StaffyStar wrote:
Could anyone please see if there is any tactics mentioned in the codex for the Imperius Reavers?

Or if I should choose one myself. It will affect my model choosing.

The Imperius Reavers have no unique chapter tactics as they area successor chapter. This gives you three options:

1. Run them as Ultramarines. 99% of people won't have an issue with this as long as you are consistent about it. The advantages of this are the use of Ultramarines characters and relics for free and there warlord traits will sync up with the tactic best. Their tactic gives them +1 to leadership and the ability to fall back and still shoot at -1 to BS.

2. Use the Inheritors of the Primarch successor tactic. By strictest RAW you would have to do this if you want the Ultramarines chapter tactic but you also lose full access to Ultramarines characters and free relics.

3. Use the other successor chapter tactics. This allows you to create custom abilities to suit your play style but again you lose full access to Ultramarines characters and free relics.

If you go for number 3 you can take two of the following:

Spoiler:

Reroll hit rolls of one for Bolt weapons
Characters can Heroic Intervention up to 6"
In melee Infantry and Bikers when rolling a natural 6 to hit auto hit and wound *
-1 to leadership for enemy units within 3"
+1 to advance and charge rolls
Can only lose one model to failed morale rolls
Reroll 1 when taking psychic tests or deny the witch rolls
+ 3" to all range weapons
When attacking the unit can reroll a single to hit and to wound
rerolling to hits against specific models after charging/getting charged
can fire assault weapons at full BS after advancing
double wounds when using a damage table
to wound rolls of 1 or 2 against your units always fail
If outside 12" your units count as being in cover if shot at
+1 to leadership
Can charge after falling back
ignore mortal wounds on 5+
After charging/being charged a natural to hit of 6 creates an additional hit *
*these two can't be taken at the same time

Actually, "by strictest RaW" is option 1. Other than that, those 3 options are all valid options you can choose to do.

Thanx everyone!

I did however find a pdf that were part of the introduction of the Imperius Reavers.
I have attached it here.

It says that they have "prefered enemy" on "Genestealer cults" and "Tyranids".
They also "Know no fear".

But as I understand this doesnt appear in 8th edition codex, but feels stupid to ignore.

The most important thing is after all not to win, but to uphold lore.

StaffyStar wrote:
Thanx everyone!

I did however find a pdf that were part of the introduction of the Imperius Reavers.
I have attached it here.

It says that they have "prefered enemy" on "Genestealer cults" and "Tyranids".
They also "Know no fear".

But as I understand this doesnt appear in 8th edition codex, but feels stupid to ignore.

The most important thing is after all not to win, but to uphold lore.

And They Shall Know No Fear is a rule all space marines have.
For your chapter tactics you'll want to go with the successor tactic "mix and match" approach - there's an option to represent a Favoured Enemy, so you could use the second pick to match your preferred play style. To be true to your fluff (and have all the options available) you should grab the Space Marines codex and the Ultramarines supplement, although the later is optional (just adds a TON of options for Ultramarines and their successor chapters).

That would be because this PDF is from 2013, so working off 5th edition rules - now out of date. You could approximate those traits using the current ones, but either way you'll need Codex Space Marines to run them.

2013 was 5th edition??

That means a new edition every two years. This seems a Little bit to much for my taste.

Gues there is no much use going to buy 8th edition if you have an unpainted army then.

StaffyStar wrote:
2013 was 5th edition??

That means a new edition every two years. This seems a Little bit to much for my taste.

Gues there is no much use going to buy 8th edition if you have an unpainted army then.

You have to bare in mind though that 5e to 7e the rules didn't fundamentally change that much. Each edition was more of a patch that a complete change, with Codexes generally being more or less usable from the old edition to the new until they got replaced.

8e was completely different, a total overhaul of the game which made all previous rules null and void.

StaffyStar wrote:
2013 was 5th edition??

That means a new edition every two years. This seems a Little bit to much for my taste.

Gues there is no much use going to buy 8th edition if you have an unpainted army then.

GW's edition refreshes are annoying but generally speaking they are also pretty minor updates. 3-7 was just a series of refinements of the 3rd edition rules, for example. The difference between 3rd and 7th was pretty big but for anyone actually playing during that time each edition change was a relatively small incremental change. 8th edition was a very big shift in approach from GW so 9th will likely be a small update, which means someone in your position will almost certainly still need the Space Marine Codex and Ultramarine supplement to run your army in the new edition too. The current set of Codices and supplements will almost certainly be fully compatible with 9th edition. Note that it's not 100% certain that 9th is coming out this summer since GW don't officially announce edition changes that far out but the rumours are it's happening.

To summarise:

1. You'll need the Space Marine Codex. To make full use of the Ultramrines or successor chapter rules the Ultramrines Supplement is also required.
2. The colour you paint your models could have an effect on whether you can run them as "true" UM or have to run them as a successor chapter. This is very much dependent on where you intend to play. In my experience most local groups don't care what colour your army is painted but some tournaments might require official colour schemes, though this is by no means guaranteed.
3. 9th edition may come out in the summer. It's unlikely to make huge changes to the game so any Codexes or supplements you buy now will likely still be perfectly valid once 9th drops.

If you want to play warhammer 40k in 8th or 9th edition as an ultramarines successor chapter. Any old documentation about the imperius reavers is toilet paper at this point.

The ONLY option you have is to buy the space marine codes and the ultramarines supplement.

If you think this is too expensive or that the rules may change, 40K is not the game for you haha