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Isn't it clearly defined in the Constitution that the Power rest with the State Governors and not with Federal Government (PROTUS)?
As in dealing with something of this nature (Corona spread)

nfe wrote:

 Overread wrote:

nfe wrote:

 queen_annes_revenge wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Poor scotland not getting masks and other PPE from english companies as they are focusing only to england now. Hardly surprising.

Scotland has a devolved government who are constantly trying to gain independence, but soon as it goes south they want special treatment.

that is based off your evidence-less point though. I'd be surprised if that was actually the case.

Dr Donald McCaskill, chief of Scottish Care (that's the voice of the private care sector, nothing to do with the SNP [quite the opposite!] or the Scottish NHS) said this morning on BBC radio Scotland that the four largest UK PPE suppliers are refusing to sell them PPE.

Rather than the Scottish government wanting special treatment, they've stepped in to sort it out.

Are they specifically refusing Hospitals in Scotland or hospitals that happen to be within Scotland. I can see that it might be the PPE is being pushed toward places like London and Manchester etc.... - ergo the very big urban centres that already have a massive spike in cases. Ergo that Scotland isn't being pushed out, but rather its there with other regions that have currently got lower pressures.

Said they were prioritising English hospitals and English carers. Very little detail.

Yeah it just seems odd to specifically target Scotland like this for no reason other than "they are scots". I'd find it more plausible that its simply a supply and demand situation whereby Scotland's lesser (current) outbreak compared to more populated southern cities means that its getting less prioritising in comparison. Likely a pattern seen in English counties that lack a major city.

 Alpharius wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
Speaking of Trump, after weeks spent insisting that the states are responsible for responding to the crisis individually/on their own (a talking point echoed by a few here on dakka), Trump is now arguing that he is the sole decision-maker when it comes to re-opening the economy: https://www.axios.com/trump-coronavirus-reopening-governors-states-3ce510ff-cd94-4b4a-89b8-58d8bca5d69f.html

He says that, and he may or may not believe it (he probably does), but ultimately he doesn't have the final say - the state Governors do.

Should be interesting times in the USA soon...

Even lower, County Public Health gets a say in the closures too.

 Kilkrazy wrote:
I went to Lidl...

You poor man, these truely are dark times
I've been doing my shopping at the local butchers or farm shop, got to keep these smaller places going after all! The supermarket bosses are already raking it in under the guise of 'doing their bit for Britain'...

The issue with PPE for Scotland may well turn out to be that central government got in first (after all London was spiking far in advance of the rest of the UK) with large (or even unlimited) capacity orders before the Scotish Parliament got round to trying to order extra themselves

(and central government is buying PPE on behalf of all 4 nations so Scotland is going to be getting their 'fair' share of it anyway, it's not as if care homes, hospitals, health visitors in England & wales aren't screaming out for more too)

I've also seen the same basic story being run with wales saying they're not being sold PPE because England is buying it all

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/care-homes-ppe-wales-testing-18067236

Father in law has it. Considering he lives in rural East Texas thats a surprise.

 Kilkrazy wrote:
I went to Lidl in Wallingfor today, a regular haunt of Dakka colleague Queen Anne's Revenge.

There was no queue to get in, but inside there were couplesm and a serious degree of anti-social distancing. I got really scared, the way people were behaving. Complete selfishness and stupidity.

At least I was able to get nearly everything I wanted. Out of the absolute basics, only eggs and flour were out of stock.

But the queues at the checkouts were so long! They only had two tills open. Everyone wasn't obeying distancing rules in the queues.

I decided I never want to go back there unless it's a very quick dive to get prunes and smoked salmon. I can't get them at Aldi where the social behaviour is much better.

I havent had any issues there. had to queue behind 3 others on thursday night but it was only about 5 minutes which I can deal with. havent noticed any particularly bad behaviour there myself, but then maybe I have too lax an attitude about it to judge. it really doesnt bother me, I've just been shopping the same as usual.

 Frazzled wrote:
Father in law has it. Considering he lives in rural East Texas thats a surprise.

Frazz!!!

Whew!

We hadn't heard from you in a while - I was getting worried!

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
The issue with PPE for Scotland may well turn out to be that central government got in first (after all London was spiking far in advance of the rest of the UK) with large (or even unlimited) capacity orders before the Scotish Parliament got round to trying to order extra themselves

Again, the story was about the private sector in Scotland. Scottish NHS procurement appears to be fine and they had enough available to help the private sector when they struggled to source more from their suppliers who are now prioritising facilities in England.

 Alpharius wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
Father in law has it. Considering he lives in rural East Texas thats a surprise.

Frazz!!!

Whew!

We hadn't heard from you in a while - I was getting worried!

Still alive, still working in the budding metropolis of Austin. Hoping this dies down as the Boy is getting married in August, and as he's marrying up we can't let this one get away.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 ValentineGames wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Poor scotland not getting masks and other PPE from english companies as they are focusing only to england now. Hardly surprising.

You have to make sacrifices.
If you can't help everyone then you have to help someone.
I'd rather 100 deaths isolated to Scotland than 1000 to the entire UK.
It's gak... But its maths.

As a Scot, I find your comment highly offensive, with its inference that Scots are somehow more disposable.

I shall hold my tongue now.

You are the one reading an inference I never made.
You're offending yourself by creating a fictional narrative.
which I hold no responsibility for.

 Jihadin wrote:
Isn't it clearly defined in the Constitution that the Power rest with the State Governors and not with Federal Government (PROTUS)?
As in dealing with something of this nature (Corona spread)

Not to throw shade at you, and as intense as this thread seems to be getting I wanted to make that clear, but when the constitution was written there was more or less nothing that could be done during a plague except pay some guy a helluva lotta money to drive the cart yelling "Bring out yer dead! Bring out yer dead!" and bury or burn the bodies ASAP.

Today we have the technology and resources to at least significantly mitigate a plague, and in that a state can't do a lot by itself the fed needs to be able to.

This assumes a leader that actually cares about anything but himself, unfortunately.

 Frazzled wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
Father in law has it. Considering he lives in rural East Texas thats a surprise.

Frazz!!!

Whew!

We hadn't heard from you in a while - I was getting worried!

Still alive, still working in the budding metropolis of Austin. Hoping this dies down as the Boy is getting married in August, and as he's marrying up we can't let this one get away.

In a similar boat. My step sister is getting married at the end of august. Worried for the chances of weddings happening. Stay safe, Fraz, and I hope your FIL recovers quickly. The amount of age jokes you’ve made about yourself, I’m assuming he’s not a young’in!

In a similar boat. My step sister is getting married at the end of august. Worried for the chances of weddings happening. Stay safe, Fraz, and I hope your FIL recovers quickly. The amount of age jokes you’ve made about yourself, I’m assuming he’s not a young’in!

I shall. Its hard with the FIL as, at his age, anything could get him, and frankly with his dementia it wouldn't be that bad.
I can't make that argument too strongly though as the wife and kids already think most of the screws fell off my wagon some miles back.

I think August will be substantially more opened up for weddings.

 Hulksmash wrote:
Considering that California's governor has already said he'll do what he wants and help other states as well i wouldnt be shocked by any non trump governor following the white houses direction.

Minnesota is going to do what it wants and thinks best. Same with Texas. Trump can say what he wants but states will do what they do. You dont get to start leading once all the hard work and decisions already got done.

I think the risk is that the guy with the biggest soapbox and the largest platform is going to go out on national TV and say "everyone back to work" while the governors say "no stay at home" through the much more limited media airtime that is generally afforded to them.

Its just a lot of confusion that people are going to have to sort through and with conflicting information being presented, a lot of people are going to have to make a decision, and I'm not convinced that the average American is properly equipped with the facts to make that decision. I would wager that most people think of the government in strictly hierarchal terms and automatically assume that federal actions automatically supercede state actions - even if they know better they will feign ignorance if it suits their personal interests to follow the advice of the President contrary to their governor.

Isn't it clearly defined in the Constitution that the Power rest with the State Governors and not with Federal Government (PROTUS)?

I don't know that anything is clearly defined enough in the Constitution that they won't try to argue that it means something else entirely.

Also, why do you keep using PROTUS instead of the more common and accepted POTUS? Literally never seen or heard PROTUS before, what does the R stand for?

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 ValentineGames wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Poor scotland not getting masks and other PPE from english companies as they are focusing only to england now. Hardly surprising.

You have to make sacrifices.
If you can't help everyone then you have to help someone.
I'd rather 100 deaths isolated to Scotland than 1000 to the entire UK.
It's gak... But its maths.

As a Scot, I find your comment highly offensive, with its inference that Scots are somehow more disposable.

I shall hold my tongue now.

With you on that one.

I went to the grocery store yesterday because I was desperate for ice cream. I've been working remote, so this was the first time I've left the house in about a week.

The good news, not only was there good stock of Haagen Das, it was $4 each. I haven't seen it that low in a while.

There was still absolutely no toilet paper. There were 2 rolls of overpriced paper towels - not price gougey, just normal overpriced brand.

I brought a mask and a bunch of gloves in the car with me, but decided I was stupid to wear the mask so just wore the gloves. When I got in the store, half the shoppers and most of the employees were wearing masks.

I know a lot of people have said not to wear gloves, that hand washing is better, but for me, I trust gloves: I don't wear them very long (I tossed them when I left the store, and put a fresh pair on for the post office, then tossed those and washed my hands when I got home). The other thing for me and gloves is that I wear them all the time normally - I don't handle the 3d printing resin without them on. It's a skin irritant. As a result, I am super, super good about not touching my face when I have gloves on. I probably have at least 200 gloves left, so I should be good for a while there. I've stopped printing nonessential resin 3D stuff for now to preserve my glove supply.

Looks like that 5G nonsense isn't dead yet. Eamonn Holmes a presenter on the IMO bafflingly popular daytime TV show "This Morning" giving it more exposure.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-52270736

More mast attacks in Birmingham too (although whether this is actually by people who thing 5G = virus, or just people who want the masts gone it's hard to tell)

 ValentineGames wrote:

And my answer to your self created fictional inference is the same as I already gave.
You are the one reading an inference I never made.
You're offending yourself by creating a fictional narrative.
which I hold no responsibility for.

You can claim all you like. But it's got nothing to do with being Scottish. Simple as.
Wouldn't matter if you were Scottish, Welsh, Irish or pigmy goat.
Your weak efforts to find a hidden meaning are silly and pointless and you're relying on the biased mods to take your sides in a falsehood of your own creation.

How very open minded of you.

If people are taking offense to something you say, it's always a good idea to stop and ask yourself why. You are responsible for the things you say, whether they come out how you intended or not.

While I can see what you intended to say, the way you said it does make it easy to read as being a comment against Scottish people. Let's chalk it up as poor phrasing, learn from it and move on, hmm?




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
More mast attacks in Birmingham too (although whether this is actually by people who thing 5G = virus, or just people who want the masts gone it's hard to tell)

Yeah, I would think that the attacks are more likely linked to the more common, general '5G is bad because someone on the internet said so' movement than the Coronavirus thing specifically.

Heard an interesting theory on toilet paper. It’s not so much hoarding, but supply and demand. With supply being part of it.

There is a difference between the TP most offices use, and home use. Big rolls, crappy quality. You know the stuff. You used it during the 8 hours a day you were at work.

But now you are working from home. You are using the normal, decent quality stuff. All those mid-day trips you used office TP for? Now you are using your home stuff. As an individual, your consumption just doubled.

And they can’t just shuffle the industrial rolls of TP over to Walmart of whatever shop to sell to home users. Not normal sized rolls, not in inventory system, etc.

So as a nation (planet? not sure if other countries have similar work/home styles of TP) we just doubled our use of the kind of TP that’s sold in stores to regular people. And wonder why they can’t keep it in stock.

They are going to have to re-tool the factory from that one-ply snadpaper to charmin.

Eh I think that's likely got an impact on supplies; but far less than the fact that everyone went out and bought multiple loads more than they normally do all at the very same time. What ran those supplies low is the same thing that ran all the rest of the food low.


Especially in urban environments where people are more used to shopping ad-hock when they need it every day; rather than planning for a week or two weeks in advance and doing one big shop up. So suddenly you have a huge number of people buying a month or more's worth of toiletroll in a day or two.

Plus once news got out that supplies were low everyone went into silly panic mode and even more people bough extra even if they didn't need any. Once the supply was drained out it remained so because whenever it gets back into stock some people go nuts buying it.



Food was the same, though unlike food you don't need freezers to store toiletroll - the only limit is how much space you have. I think this further made the situation worse because some people did hoard it up at insane volumes. Food they could only store so much of before they ran out of space to keep it long term (and even then a two week period later and a lot of bread and other products are being thrown out because it went bad - people didn't have 20 freezers at home)

chaos0xomega wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
Considering that California's governor has already said he'll do what he wants and help other states as well i wouldnt be shocked by any non trump governor following the white houses direction.

Minnesota is going to do what it wants and thinks best. Same with Texas. Trump can say what he wants but states will do what they do. You dont get to start leading once all the hard work and decisions already got done.

I think the risk is that the guy with the biggest soapbox and the largest platform is going to go out on national TV and say "everyone back to work" while the governors say "no stay at home" through the much more limited media airtime that is generally afforded to them.

Its just a lot of confusion that people are going to have to sort through and with conflicting information being presented, a lot of people are going to have to make a decision, and I'm not convinced that the average American is properly equipped with the facts to make that decision. I would wager that most people think of the government in strictly hierarchal terms and automatically assume that federal actions automatically supercede state actions - even if they know better they will feign ignorance if it suits their personal interests to follow the advice of the President contrary to their governor.

Isn't it clearly defined in the Constitution that the Power rest with the State Governors and not with Federal Government (PROTUS)?

I don't know that anything is clearly defined enough in the Constitution that they won't try to argue that it means something else entirely.

Also, why do you keep using PROTUS instead of the more common and accepted POTUS? Literally never seen or heard PROTUS before, what does the R stand for?

Binged Robotech….4 times now over ten yrs

 Nevelon wrote:
Heard an interesting theory on toilet paper. It’s not so much hoarding, but supply and demand. With supply being part of it.

There is a difference between the TP most offices use, and home use. Big rolls, crappy quality. You know the stuff. You used it during the 8 hours a day you were at work.

But now you are working from home. You are using the normal, decent quality stuff. All those mid-day trips you used office TP for? Now you are using your home stuff. As an individual, your consumption just doubled.

And they can’t just shuffle the industrial rolls of TP over to Walmart of whatever shop to sell to home users. Not normal sized rolls, not in inventory system, etc.

So as a nation (planet? not sure if other countries have similar work/home styles of TP) we just doubled our use of the kind of TP that’s sold in stores to regular people. And wonder why they can’t keep it in stock.

They are going to have to re-tool the factory from that one-ply snadpaper to charmin.

I really can't see that. There used to be a giant wall of toilet paper at my local Dollar General, with at least a dozen of each kind available. Even the crappiest stuff that was barely above truckstop quality. But lo and behold, two weeks before my state even announced the Stay At Home order, everything was gone in a matter of maybe two-three days after the online rumor of a shortage of it was going to happen, and every time they get a truck in, the ladies there say it's gone the same day. Also, the other even larger Supermarket in the other direction has been out of everything from toilet paper to napkins the three times I have gone there in the last three weeks. So is the other Family Dollar across the street from THAT supermarket. None of those stores are more than 4 miles from my house.

Thousands and thousands of rolls in my rural county are being used? No, that's hoarding. No one craps that much. I am sheltering in place with my Wife and two kids (5 and 3). We had a thirty-roll pack from Costco that was bought at the end of February, and we still have nearly 15 rolls left and we haven't even been cutting back on how much we use. I repeat, no one craps that much.

The shortage if from families of two people having 50 rolls in their basement, if not more.

 Irbis wrote:
One potentially nice thing about Covid is nature recovery - when you look about news about clear Venetian channels, endangered turtles in Brazil surviving hatching in much greater numbers thanks to empty beaches, and other stories that would be impossible a year ago because powerful lobby funded by rich screamed MUH ECONOMY when someone proposed temporary limits to give animals some space when they are most vulnerable I hope we can repeat that in next years even without prompting. Humans can live with beach closed for a week when turtles need to lay eggs, forests being off limits in mating season. But who I am kidding, greed and lack of empathy will probably mean business as usual in 2021 and following, better cut every single tree down and concrete every last single bit of ground, think of profits and the economy, eh?

Hell, just look at this:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/apr/11/positively-alpine-disbelief-air-pollution-falls-lockdown-coronavirus

.. if you;re going to tell me to look on the bright side I'm going to hit you in the head with a peanut butter sandwhich

Did anyone see Trumps rant in his press conference it was quite the thing,

I am concerned and watch with bated breath the countries that are releasing measures , as they still have many cases and am concerned they ramp up again. I hope not I really do.

There’s a group on Facebook ( was? It’s been reported) claiming covid doesn’t exist , it’s just an excuse for nhs workers to kill people .... got a few thousand members somehow

dalezzz wrote:
There’s a group on Facebook ( was? It’s been reported) claiming covid doesn’t exist , it’s just an excuse for nhs workers to kill people .... got a few thousand members somehow

OK......


Last time i checked you don't kill off the hand that feeds you.....

dalezzz wrote:
There’s a group on Facebook ( was? It’s been reported) claiming covid doesn’t exist , it’s just an excuse for nhs workers to kill people .... got a few thousand members somehow

An excuse for NHS workers to kill people... in China???

The toilet paper situation is due to psychology.

In general, people fear being out of control of their lives. The virus creates a terrible feeling of being out of control, so we search for something we can do that makes us feel we are getting some contril. Buying supplies helps with that.

TP is special because once we are potty trained, we fear loss of bowel control as one of the most disgraceful, unfortunate things that can happen to us. It's strongly associated with dirt and disease.

The psychological link with the virus is obvious.