How does the game feel to play?

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**Ishagu**

Sim-Life wrote:
So then don't sell it. Pack it away and maybe in 10 years Karol will be back asking the same question as OP amd he can be told that 11th Edition is literally the worst edition ever and everything is an unbalanced mess, as is tradition on Dakka.

Truth

**Melissia**

I'd say that, while not perfect, 8th is some of the best 40k's ever been. Maybe early-mid fifth edition was better, before flyers and such. But only maybe, and likely only for some metas.

**Crispy78**

Karol wrote:

Crispy78 785592 10720556 wrote:

If you're OK, then OK. But you've always sounded so unhappy for so long.

Remember, 40K is not a permanent life decision. You don't have to live with it forever now you've decided to play. If it starts making you that unhappy again, you may be better off just selling your army.

Take some decent photos, write a detailed description, find out how much international postage would cost, and stick it up on ebay. Give your army a reserve price of what you paid for it at least, I'm sure someone will buy it. Hell, if I was in the market for a new 40K army at the moment I'd consider it myself - always liked Grey Knights.

ph trust me, the GK rule set combined with the models I have made for a horrible game expiriance. aint afraid to say that. I wouldn't really sell the army either, put too much in to it, to get maybe 75$ for it all, and probably still be left with stuff people won't buy. PA4 made GK, even as unoptimised as my a lot more fun. now if this means they are fun to play, am not sure, for that one has to be smarter or play for longer. The rules do look fun.

That's why I was suggesting to put in a reserve price of what you paid for it. If you make your money back, you've not lost anything other than time.

I don't know how much you have, but I'd have thought you'd be able to get way more than $75. Maybe not from a local buyer - that's why I mentioned international postage. e.g. This for instance isn't a massive army and it has multiple bids taking it way over $75...

**Ishagu**

I recently sold a GK army for over £250.

....I kinda wish I hadn't. The rules are pretty spicy now

**Icegoat**

I wouldn't bother getting into this game the game is nearly dead right now. The lore changes and the endless primaris trash we are getting bombarded with means give it two years and the lore and the world of 40k will be entirely ruined. Gw pooed the franchise with the primaris they are a narrative black hole that pretty soon is going to swallow the entire franchise. I'm enjoying the death throes but tlruly 40k is dead.

**Melissia**

Icegoat wrote:
I wouldn't bother getting into this game the game is nearly dead right now.

By number of players and hobbyists in general, 40k is more active than it's ever been.

**Trickstick**

That's why you need more to an army than just the rules. If you like the models and lore, you can enjoy them no matter where in the tier-list they fall. I guess that depends on what you want out of the game though. If you want to stay on the bleeding edge of the meta, I guess that attachment to your army could be seen as a detriment.

I've never really been that bothered about my armies relative power though, usually trying to make them the best they can be within the limits of the style I want to play. I even started collecting Guard in their original 3rd edition codex, which was probably the lowest point of their power.

**AnomanderRake**

Melissia wrote:
Icegoat wrote:
I wouldn't bother getting into this game the game is nearly dead right now.
By number of players and hobbyists in general, 40k is more active than it's ever been.

Doesn't mean it's more active everywhere or for everyone. Maybe in Icegoat's group it's nearly dead. I've seen groups disintegrate or stop playing 40k because of 8e, just because the statistics say lots of people are playing doesn't mean every single person who plays is enjoying it and hasn't quit.

I will say it feels to me like the general mood on Dakka was pretty optimistic and a lot happier early in 8e, and right now it sounds a lot more like it did in 7e, so at least this community's attempt to have faith in GW and give them a second chance has been pretty shaken.

**Melissia**

AnomanderRake wrote:
Doesn't mean it's more active everywhere or for everyone..

No, but he wasn't talking about his community from how he worded it.

**Trickstick**

Icegoat wrote:
The lore changes and the endless primaris trash we are getting bombarded with means give it two years and the lore and the world of 40k will be entirely ruined.

It's really easy to just ignore. 40k canon is so loose that you can disregard whole swathes of it. Personally, I ignore most of the Hesersy and m42 stuff, To me, Primaris are just updated marine sculpts, like they were originally planned to be. Necrons use inertialess drives, Tau skim off the warp, and so on. Not like it really matters to others which bits of the fluff I choose to enjoy. 90% of the fluff is "unreliable narrator" territory anyway.

**Sim-Life**

Icegoat wrote:
I wouldn't bother getting into this game the game is nearly dead right now. The lore changes and the endless primaris trash we are getting bombarded with means give it two years and the lore and the world of 40k will be entirely ruined. Gw pooed the franchise with the primaris they are a narrative black hole that pretty soon is going to swallow the entire franchise. I'm enjoying the death throes but tlruly 40k is dead.

Sorry but what reality do live in?

**Klickor**

I joined a club about a year ago and 40k was growing really fast in the area then but the last few months people are trying to look everywhere for a replacement.

For the first 6months I was there I only saw 40k being played except for the RPG kids. This sunday we had people playing AoS, KoW, Blood Bowl, MtG, some Marvel miniature game and 1 single 40k game. Also people painting warcry stuff and other games. Every day I see people looking for other games than 40k and deciding what game to invest in next.

Reminds me of 7th edition wfb when everyone jumped ship and started playing BB, WM/H, FoW, Malifaux and other games since GW killed the game with the new releases.

**Sim-Life**

Klickor wrote:
I joined a club about a year ago and 40k was growing really fast in the area then but the last few months people are trying to look everywhere for a replacement.

For the first 6months I was there I only saw 40k being played except for the RPG kids. This sunday we had people playing AoS, KoW, Blood Bowl, MtG, some Marvel miniature game and 1 single 40k game. Also people painting warcry stuff and other games. Every day I see people looking for other games than 40k and deciding what game to invest in next.

Reminds me of 7th edition wfb when everyone jumped ship and started playing BB, WM/H, FoW, Malifaux and other games since GW killed the game with the new releases.

Thats honestly just the cycle of the hobby. Generally what happens in the new games don't get traction or the group os too small to sustain it or the company release a new edition and screws it all up and people go back to 40k because 40k is simple to get back into if you already played before because everyone knows that everyone else has a 40k army. Life is also an issue as people get older they have less time and money to invest in new games and they know they can get a 40k game but finding a pick up game of Buishido or Dropfleet Commander can be harder.

I've seen it happen multiple times to multiple groups.

**AnomanderRake**

Sim-Life wrote:
Klickor wrote:
I joined a club about a year ago and 40k was growing really fast in the area then but the last few months people are trying to look everywhere for a replacement.

For the first 6months I was there I only saw 40k being played except for the RPG kids. This sunday we had people playing AoS, KoW, Blood Bowl, MtG, some Marvel miniature game and 1 single 40k game. Also people painting warcry stuff and other games. Every day I see people looking for other games than 40k and deciding what game to invest in next.

Reminds me of 7th edition wfb when everyone jumped ship and started playing BB, WM/H, FoW, Malifaux and other games since GW killed the game with the new releases.

Thats honestly just the cycle of the hobby. Generally what happens in the new games don't get traction or the group os too small to sustain it or the company release a new edition and screws it all up and people go back to 40k because 40k is simple to get back into if you already played before because everyone knows that everyone else has a 40k army. Life is also an issue as people get older they have less time and money to invest in new games and they know they can get a 40k game but finding a pick up game of Buishido or Dropfleet Commander can be harder.

I've seen it happen multiple times to multiple groups.

I wonder if part of this phenomenon is just that 40k's been around for fifteen or twenty years longer than most of the competition and has much more infrastructure and breadth of minis. Maybe in ten years' time someone else will have the breadth and variety in plastic that Warhammer has and the market will open up to the idea of letting something not made by GW start to gain traction. Or maybe the pressure and possibility of competition will force GW to start paying more attention to their rules.

**JNAProductions**

I enjoy playing it... But I acknowledge that's more in spite of the rules than because of them.

I play at a local GW, where the people are really good-the manager is an awesome dude, the substitute managers are too, and the general crowds there are fun, awesome people. While I'm pretty critical of the rules and the state of the game (I have Space Marines, for instance. I don't play them at all, because they're far too good.) I ultimately do enjoy the game, because I play with cool people.

I'd recommend getting to know your local gaming group before investing heavily into the hobby-maybe buy a Kill Team or something, but don't get a whole army unless you know your group is the kind to make the game fun.

**Gnarlly**

As someone who has also played on and off since 2nd edition the post below nails the pros and cons of 8th. I would also add that the OP take a serious look at the newer Kill Team for very small games and Apocalypse for larger-sized games, including 1500-2000 point regular 40k sized armies; both rulesets have advantages over regular 8th edition. If you don't mind giving up on some minutiae and flavor of the various factions, Apocalypse offers a much better gaming experience IMO.

Aelyn wrote:
Having played since 2nd edition:

The good:

- The core rules are the most streamlined they've ever been. This does come with some oddities (how Line of Sight is handled, for example) but it does mean the game mechanics are very easily picked up.

- Blast markers, templates, vehicle-specific rules, range guessing etc are all gone. These were thing that added a lot of minutiae to the game, and frankly I'm glad to see them go.

- Stratagems can add extra interest and subtlety to the game, especially where they're a limited amount of risk mitigation (e.g. command re-rolls and insane bravery).

- Having each character be it's own unit, often with an aura buffing nearby units, feels a lot better to me than having characters join units.

The bad:

- The aforementioned oddities that come with the streamlined rules. Line of Sight, the lack of quality terrain rules, and the overwatch mechanism are... not the best.

- The game leans far too heavily on re-rolls, which can slow things down and make it feel like things have a forgone conclusion.

- The psychic rules are pretty shoddy to be honest, way too simple and with a tendency to be a bit all-or-nothing. They also scale very badly.

- Some combos can be a bit ridiculous, especially when they involve stacking relics on traits on auras on stratagems on sub-faction rules.

The ugly:

- Super heavies. I just don't like them.

- Way too many rules and benefits on way too many pages. There's too much flicking back and forth mid-gme, and this can be overwhelming.

- New rules are coming out all the time, so it can be hard to stay on top of everything.

- The balance is not great, especially when playing against highly competitive armies.

Overall:

I think that 8th edition can be great fun, when playing with like-minded people. Personally, it's probably my favourite edition (with 5th being the other candidate), and I'm generally a fan of how they finally got rid of some 0f the sacred cows that were holding the system back.

I would recommend trying it out in smaller games (1000 points, no super-heavies) to begin with, and would also suggest leaving out stratagems, warlord traits, sub-faction rules, and so forth - start off playing with just the rules on the data sheets themselves.

I'd also recommend taking the most rabid opinions in this thread (looking mainly, but not entirely, at vipoid here) with a hefty pinch of salt. The best way to tell how it feels is just to give it a shot. Maybe ask if your local store/ group has someone who can show you the ropes.

**Jimbobbyish**

After playing for one year, it has been a good experience so far. The only issue I've had is LOS punishing my creativity, I gave my TWC flags that gives them a cool flair but they can rarely be put out of LOS. The other issue is playing against armies that have no reason to move or leave their deployment zones because of their long range weapons.

**Karol**

Ishagu wrote:
Just sell your army. If this hobby isn't making you happy don't imprison yourself in it.

Happens with everything - jobs, mmos, tv shows, etc

Am not going to sell it because A no one wants to buy it localy B I would never get as much as I paid for it. Would be wasted money, people would make fun of me. And I have problem with that, I sometimes don't act properly when people laugh at me. That is why my therapists told me that getting a hobby would be a good idea. I wouldn't have started w40k without him saying it was a good idea.

not talking about that you will never get your money back, but to find someone who will take it at all

I did try to sell it a few time, but now everyone warns new player to not buy them. I know the store owner couldn't sell his GK models for multiple editions, from what later people told me.

So then don't sell it. Pack it away and maybe in 10 years Karol will be back asking the same question as OP amd he can be told that 11th Edition is literally the worst edition ever and everything is an unbalanced mess,

well they are stashed at the store. I don't have a good place to store them at home, plus it would be hard to explain to my mom.

by the way I do think that GK after PA4 are going to be more fun to play then before it, although that is kind of a easy to achive, I have no idea if they are going to stand up the test of time and will stay fun in 3 or 6 months. With something like marines am sure they are going to be fun, at my level of play, for long time. While something like Inari will suck, although no one plays them at my store anymore, so that is easy to imagine.

**Trickstick**

Can't you just play your GK as marines if you fancy a change of rules? I guess that depends on how open to the idea your opponents are.

You can also have loads more fun by expanding your hobby. Even besides all of the time you can spend painting and modelling, you can do things like set up a narrative campaign. Again though, it depends on your opponents. If you are stuck playing cut-throat pickup games, that can be more of a problem than the actual army you are using.

Some of the most memorable games I have had have been crazy, one sided matches where I have horribly lost but had loads of fun. Or long campaigns where you can have crazy in game betrayals and rivalries.

Sometimes you just need to shake things up and get out of bad routines.

**Sgt_Smudge**

Icegoat wrote: I wouldn't bother getting into this game the game is nearly dead right now. The lore changes and the endless primaris trash we are getting bombarded with means give it two years and the lore and the world of 40k will be entirely ruined. Gw pooed the franchise with the primaris they are a narrative black hole that pretty soon is going to swallow the entire franchise. I'm enjoying the death throes but tlruly 40k is dead.

Alternatively, disregard this, because it couldn't be further from the truth, as I see it.

GW's profits are at an all-time high, the range of players is phenomenal (a far wider audience, more places to play the game, more ways to enjoy it), the sculpts are, with some exceptions, pretty good, and the core rules are fairly forgiving (it's all the extra stuff and larger games that bog things down - if you start off small and basic, so literally with the core datasheets and little else, it's much tighter!).

The lore isn't anywhere near as bad as people are saying it is, mostly due to their own interpretations of what the setting should be (totally valid) and also misreading simplified explanations of the current setting. There's some name changes, some new battlefields, and new story hooks and scenarios, but the setting's still grimdark, still 40k, in my opinion.

40k is nowhere near dead. Has it changed from when I started? Yes, absolutely. For the worse? I don't think so, not by any stretch. Is it dead to certain players who want certain things? Perhaps, they're welcome to that. Is is dead/dying generally? Just let GW's profits speak for themselves.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Trickstick wrote:
Sometimes you just need to shake things up and get out of bad routines.

Can't recommend this enough.

If you're not enjoying things, try new ones. New scenarios, proxy new armies, change the size of the battles you play, the terrain, the extra rules you're using - and if the problem is the people you're around, is that really GW's fault, and not theirs?

**Melissia**

I mean, we have plastic Sisters of Battle now, something I had given up on ages ago.

**Karol**

Trickstick wrote:
Can't you just play your GK as marines if you fancy a change of rules? I guess that depends on how open to the idea your opponents are.

You can also have loads more fun by expanding your hobby. Even besides all of the time you can spend painting and modelling, you can do things like set up a narrative campaign. Again though, it depends on your opponents. If you are stuck playing cut-throat pickup games, that can be more of a problem than the actual army you are using.

nope people here are full WYSIWYG. there is no army in the entire game that is space marine with melee swords and stormbolters. Custodes are the closests, but they are not marines, so can't counts them as. Plus from what people are saying about them it wouldn't be a good switch anyway, as they require a ton of FW, and we don't use FW at the store.
I don't think I would like painting, I bought the army already painted, save for the two rhinos. I tried joing long event games, but they require people to buy new models or have limits like no +2 saves or no invs and no models with 3 wounds or more unless they are characters. Couldn't join those. But you are right that they are very fun to watch, specialy when there are 3-4 people playing.

**Melissia**

I mean, I could easily see someone justifying it as terminators (fists + storm bolters) but it would be a weird thing. But if your group's that anal about WYSIWYG, well... idk waht to tell you.

**JohnnyHell**

Icegoat wrote:
I wouldn't bother getting into this game the game is nearly dead right now. The lore changes and the endless primaris trash we are getting bombarded with means give it two years and the lore and the world of 40k will be entirely ruined. Gw pooed the franchise with the primaris they are a narrative black hole that pretty soon is going to swallow the entire franchise. I'm enjoying the death throes but tlruly 40k is dead.

Maybe dead for you, thriving most other places. Such a hilariously bad take, icegoat.

**Cryonicleech**

DarkHound wrote:
How is the game now?

The answer to this question depends on a lot of things.

As a casual game, I feel that 8th edition has a couple of positives and negatives.

The core rules are simple to learn, and while they most certainly aren't perfect (looking at you, terrain rules), there is not a large barrier to entry for a simple beer and pretzels game from a reading perspective. I think this is the strength of 8th edition, it opened the door for many new or returning players to jump in with a minimum of rules fuss on initial release. If you want to dip your toe, picking up a codex and a copy of the core rules is a great way to see if the core mechanics of the game are enjoyable, and is absolutely what I recommend. I would even advocate not buying chapter approved, as playing a couple games will determine if you want to keep going more than anything else.

As a competitive game? This is where a lot of players feel frustrated. If you plan to play in a tournament, you will need to play the rules catch-up game. Not only are there FAQs and updates which get consistently released for matched play, but often supplement books come out which are necessary to play a faction at its highest potential. While the basic core rules are easy to learn, keeping track of all the changes can be quite difficult. With the addition of the Psychic Awakening books, do expect to buy a lot of extra books if you want to stay at the competitive peak.

Ultimately, I find that, like any wargame really, what you want out of the game will determine your enjoyment. If you'd like a game that is purely beer and pretzels, which can be set up and played without a minimum of fuss without an eye towards what the most competitive strategy or list is, 40k is in a better place than ever. Supplements are optional but can provide fun for players looking to add some variety to their games, but don't hamstring players from having a fun, if basic, experience. Competitively, 40k is in a bit of a mess right now, but the growth in the playerbase can make this more enjoyable. That being said, I will agree with many here that trying to play at the height of competitiveness is a slog, and will require much more time investment than it perhaps previously ever did.

Buy a codex, try out a game or two, and see if you enjoy it from there.

**Argive**

@ Op.. This was really a wrong place to ask this question. I suggest you look up a local club and ask on their FB page and get a taster game.

**Not Online!!!**

Argive wrote:
@ Op.. This was really a wrong place to ask this question. I suggest you look up a local club and ask on their FB page.

Like i said , if the group is to your liking and plays to your liking it is great, if you intend to go competitve the ruleset starts to get wonkey imo.

**Just Tony**

How does it feel?

6th/7th was such a dumpster fire that I went back to 3rd Ed. Nothing in the current rules or "feel" of the game makes me regret that decision.

**TangoTwoBravo**

DarkHound wrote:
Hey there, I haven't been on Dakka for ages, but I've uncovered my models recently and had an itch. I played all through 5th edition and quit shortly after 6th dropped. I've skimmed the new rulebook, but I'm less interested in the specifics of the rules and which armies are strong. Rather, I want to hear opinions on how the game feels to play. What are your most and least favourite parts of actually playing the game? When does it feel like the game is moving and being engaging, and when does it drag?

As I recall, 5th felt best when you could quicky use true line of sight and area terrain rules to make decisions. It was obvious what blocked line of sight, and how you could utilize it. You could set up firing lanes and flanking routes very easily. So when your army is mostly mechanized, you can quickly make meaningful choices about navigating the terrain and executing on your plan.

The parts that felt bad were basically anything involving moving infantry. There were a lot of blast templates, so you wanted to keep your infantry spaced 2" apart to minimize exposure. You ended up with strings of infantry stretched across the battlefield, which made measuring firing ranges difficult (so you'd fiddle with movement even more to get just the perfect positioning). God help you if you got into melee, since you'd have to fiddle with piling both squads in 6" and figure out who's within 2" of the models making base-to-base contact, keeping in mind sergeants and special characters.

How is the game now?

The game is in a great, if imperfect, place. I've played since 2nd Ed, although I took a break for 7th. Regarding your questions, the removal of blast templates should remove one of your bugbears from previous editions. The core mechanics have been cleaned up. Some folks rage about the TLOS issue, but it's clean. Wound allocation is simplified with no shenanigans like w saw in 5th edition with mixed squads.

The character mechanics are a bit different in that there is no joining a squad. Otherwise melee goes quite smoothly. You might find the game more lethal. Its quite possible to get shot off the board in certain situations. You might find the normalization of Lords of War (super-heavies) and fliers a little jarring.

Welcome back to the game. I'm really enjoying 8th. Tune out the haters for now, they will still be here after you have tried a few games!

Warm regards,

T2B

**Xenomancers**

Lance845 wrote:
Nothing in 8th is even remotely close to as bad as 7th. being better than 7th does not make it good however.

This.