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Sure! Not to say there should be no magic or mighty weapons, but there's a sliding scale and the most fantastic stuff tends to be reserved for the guys at the top. There's only one Ghal Maraz, and the Valar didn't break continents for every orc raid, or even every major battle.

I mean the whole idea around that concept art is that they are an elite bodyguard unit for the Tsarina. Honestly? I expect well see more info in regards to Kislev when Warhammer 3: Total war drops. Kislev is a playable faction in the game and there might well be some concept crossover between the two for marketing purposes.

Considering it's GW/FW I expect no cross-company communication.

If they ever get round to do doing Vampire Coast or Norscan armies I'd put money on them taking no inspiration from TWW2.

 Bosskelot wrote:
Considering it's GW/FW I expect no cross-company communication.

If they ever get round to do doing Vampire Coast or Norscan armies I'd put money on them taking no inspiration from TWW2.

The sub-teams for rules are all under the main studio now, from what I've come to understand. Hell, the main studio does the FW 40K rules now.

The new map for Old World is taken straight from the altered one from TWW2, not sure why you'd think they'd ignore it when they've already changed what we have seen to reflect what TWW has done.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Bosskelot wrote:
Considering it's GW/FW I expect no cross-company communication.

If they ever get round to do doing Vampire Coast or Norscan armies I'd put money on them taking no inspiration from TWW2.

The sub-teams for rules are all under the main studio now, from what I've come to understand. Hell, the main studio does the FW 40K rules now.

The new map for Old World is taken straight from the altered one from TWW2, not sure why you'd think they'd ignore it when they've already changed what we have seen to reflect what TWW has done.

More of a lack of faith on Boss' part, I think. What I want more than anything right now is literally ANY sort of hint about gameplay. Even if they say "Built on AOS'/6th's/8th's rules" tells us more than any little sketch or map, and will dictate a LOT of people's interest from here on out.

 Just Tony wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Bosskelot wrote:
Considering it's GW/FW I expect no cross-company communication.

If they ever get round to do doing Vampire Coast or Norscan armies I'd put money on them taking no inspiration from TWW2.

The sub-teams for rules are all under the main studio now, from what I've come to understand. Hell, the main studio does the FW 40K rules now.

The new map for Old World is taken straight from the altered one from TWW2, not sure why you'd think they'd ignore it when they've already changed what we have seen to reflect what TWW has done.

More of a lack of faith on Boss' part, I think. What I want more than anything right now is literally ANY sort of hint about gameplay. Even if they say "Built on AOS'/6th's/8th's rules" tells us more than any little sketch or map, and will dictate a LOT of people's interest from here on out.

Divulge details about rules? Not gonna happen until it's too late. 9th Age for life!

Yeah just going by past history I'm a little bit skeptical about GW's ability to cross-communicate or adequately take advantage of something.

And lets be totally clear here; this announcement is almost certainly down to Total War Warhammer and what a monumental success it has been, easily surpassing DoW. You have an entire new generation and market of people who have been introduced to Warhammer and now have no further avenues to get into it more. Most AOS-hate I see nowadays is not from ex-WHFB players. They've all moved onto AOS, KoW or 9th age and the existence of AOS is not really an issue any more. But the newer fans? They HATE AOS and mock and treat it with levels of derision that I don't think even tabletop players did back in 2015. The earlier discussion about the visual design of the Kislevites and high vs low fantasy is really important because the visual design and tone of AOS is the biggest turn-off for lots of people. You really do either love it or hate it and if GW end up "Sigmar-ing" this Old World game too much then it would be pretty disastrous.

Strg Alt wrote:Divulge details about rules? Not gonna happen until it's too late. 9th Age for life!

Nah, I'll stick with a GOOD rule set...

Bosskelot wrote:Yeah just going by past history I'm a little bit skeptical about GW's ability to cross-communicate or adequately take advantage of something.

And lets be totally clear here; this announcement is almost certainly down to Total War Warhammer and what a monumental success it has been, easily surpassing DoW. You have an entire new generation and market of people who have been introduced to Warhammer and now have no further avenues to get into it more. Most AOS-hate I see nowadays is not from ex-WHFB players. They've all moved onto AOS, KoW or 9th age and the existence of AOS is not really an issue any more. But the newer fans? They HATE AOS and mock and treat it with levels of derision that I don't think even tabletop players did back in 2015. The earlier discussion about the visual design of the Kislevites and high vs low fantasy is really important because the visual design and tone of AOS is the biggest turn-off for lots of people. You really do either love it or hate it and if GW end up "Sigmar-ing" this Old World game too much then it would be pretty disastrous.

We agree on all parts here.

 Bosskelot wrote:


And lets be totally clear here; this announcement is almost certainly down to Total War Warhammer and what a monumental success it has been, easily surpassing DoW..

I think its probably more related to the mutli-million pound license fees they recieve for games like Total War: Warhammer and demonstrating that there is still a product to license when it comes to the next round of negotiations. This could easily spend years as vapourware and then quietly get forgotten.

In the meantime, enjoy the world of warcraft magic ice ladies. I look forward to the Kung Fu Panda mercenaries next.

 Bosskelot wrote:
And lets be totally clear here; this announcement is almost certainly down to Total War Warhammer and what a monumental success it has been, easily surpassing DoW. You have an entire new generation and market of people who have been introduced to Warhammer and now have no further avenues to get into it more. Most AOS-hate I see nowadays is not from ex-WHFB players. They've all moved onto AOS, KoW or 9th age and the existence of AOS is not really an issue any more. But the newer fans? They HATE AOS and mock and treat it with levels of derision that I don't think even tabletop players did back in 2015.

What, people coming from computer games post-AoS?

Blimey.

Eh? I haven't really seen that honestly. Most AoS hate still comes from the same group it always has. People who are salty about WHFB getting axed....hell i'm still salty about WHFB getting axed yet I can still enjoy AoS for what it is. Besides GW had shown, over the last 2 editions, that they were too incompetent to properly fix the game anyway so the fact that they threw up their hands and nixed it was probably for the best.

Besides one of the major reasons why we never got a Total War: Warhammer game 15 years ago is because GW didn't want a video game competing with their miniature game that was already in a not-so financially stable state anyway. With WHFB axed they allowed a new hype to grow based on the game and now can slowly re-introduce it to a new audience that:

A) Got into Warhammer lore from the Video Game
B) Got rid of their old armies because they were angry GW cut their game
C) Already converted their minis to AoS and now have no WHFB army so need to buy a new one

Everyone else that went over to 9th age/Kings of War/Still playing 8th are already not the people they are going to be marketing too anyway. They still buy GW and aren't going to be where the new sales will be coming from.

 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
Besides GW had shown, over the last 2 editions, that they were too incompetent to properly fix the game anyway so the fact that they threw up their hands and nixed it was probably for the best.

Besides one of the major reasons why we never got a Total War: Warhammer game 15 years ago is because GW didn't want a video game competing with their miniature game that was already in a not-so financially stable state anyway. With WHFB axed they allowed a new hype to grow based on the game and now can slowly re-introduce it to a new audience...

That's quite a mix of incompetent and cunning.

I'm still of the opinion (based on what I pluck from my own head) that WFB was worked into a corner rather than overseen by complete idiots. I see the basic problem as "how do we fix our skirmish game without drastically changing the mechanics and still have people buy minis in three-figure numbers of models for it?"

KoW (or any mass battle game not based on WFB itself) was one direction, and one I wished they'd taken, but...

9th age/Kings of War/Still playing 8th

... based on that, it would've split the playerbase no matter what they decided to do. With that as a given, I guess the real choice was between a new(ish), more protectable IP, or blinged-up Holy Roman Empire.

And I don't pay too much attention to AoS gaming, but on occasion I see someone who's bought three-figure numbers of models for it.

Yeah they basically did write themselves into a hole with WHFB. The whole game needed an overhaul and a change in direction in how the rules played. The trouble was that WHFB wasn't making enough money to really warrant that. The paint range sold more units then WHFB did toward the end. I get why GW did what they did...I'm still upset, but I get it.

By scrapping it and releasing a new game and pulling in who they could they made the right decision...eventually. I do look back on those last 6 month of 2015, when the game was selling like crap, and I could get a Starter set for half price since no one was buying somewhat gleefully.

Taking a few years off and reassessing we'll see what they come up with. I just wish we had more to go on then a Map and a concept sketch.

Dunno if anyones seen the bear cav concept art but it certainly looks hopeful! https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/05/11/old-world-update-bearsgw-homepage-post-4/
Still pining for some Winged Lancers but this is certainly a step in the right direction.
I hope we get to see Vampire Coast and Norsca released, an undead Skirmisher faction would be fantastic

I do hope they go in the direct of "Subfactions" instead of straight factions. LIke, I want more Empire stuff in general, but if they released am Ostermark army with Province specific units that would be great.

 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
I do hope they go in the direct of "Subfactions" instead of straight factions. LIke, I want more Empire stuff in general, but if they released am Ostermark army with Province specific units that would be great.

I would have thought Kislev would be its own faction, but other subfactions could certainly be fun

 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
LIke, I want more Empire stuff in general, but if they released am Ostermark army with Province specific units that would be great.

Well let's see what the Ostermark's like... it contains the 'Gryphon's Wood' so that could mean griffon cavalry. It's bordered by Kislev so that could mean reindeer cavalry. It's bordered by Sylvania so that could mean werewolf cavalry. It's bordered by the World's Edge mountains so that could mean dwarf cavalry. What else?

North of the Brunwasser between the Worlds Edge Mountains and the end of Gryphon’s Wood are large tracts of rolling grasslands. Well-suited to raising horses...

Nah, that sounds stupid.

 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
I do hope they go in the direct of "Subfactions" instead of straight factions. LIke, I want more Empire stuff in general, but if they released am Ostermark army with Province specific units that would be great.

I liked it better when they did appendix lists. The infinite subfaction problem in 40K should NOT be ported over to WFB.

Well it depends on how big the faction is. I guess I'm coming from a different perspective then the rest of you. I don't see "the Old World" looking anything like old WHFB. With the exception of maybe a few generic units, I think anything that will be released will fall under more specific, specialized, regiments.

Like if you remember the "Uniform and Heraldry" book that came out...oh man, years ago. Inside there were examples of famous regiments, like the Deathjacks of Stirland or Grundel's Defenders from Nuln. So appendix list are also a great idea too! But I dont see the initial release of armies having more then maybe, 3 or 4 units.

I want WHFB back as well but we got to remember that it's going to return in such a way that GW can protect their IP.

 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
I don't see "the Old World" looking anything like old WHFB. With the exception of maybe a few generic units, I think anything that will be released will fall under more specific, specialized, regiments.

Like if you remember the "Uniform and Heraldry" book that came out...oh man, years ago. Inside there were examples of famous regiments, like the Deathjacks of Stirland or Grundel's Defenders from Nuln. So appendix list are also a great idea too! But I dont see the initial release of armies having more then maybe, 3 or 4 units.

Remember it? I still have it about here, somewhere.

So you see NewOld World being more like ye olde dogs of war army?

I imagine it will have a strong component of that yes. Not all, but I can't see a reason not to include a few as it serves GW's interests of IP protection as well.

Also if a few updated plastics of old Dog of War regiments came out it would finally convince me to end my GW boycott.

I have little faith in the rules, but i am excited for the new models, Bear riding Kislev models are already on my list.

 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
Eh? I haven't really seen that honestly. Most AoS hate still comes from the same group it always has. People who are salty about WHFB getting axed....hell i'm still salty about WHFB getting axed yet I can still enjoy AoS for what it is. Besides GW had shown, over the last 2 editions, that they were too incompetent to properly fix the game anyway so the fact that they threw up their hands and nixed it was probably for the best.

Besides one of the major reasons why we never got a Total War: Warhammer game 15 years ago is because GW didn't want a video game competing with their miniature game that was already in a not-so financially stable state anyway. With WHFB axed they allowed a new hype to grow based on the game and now can slowly re-introduce it to a new audience that:

A) Got into Warhammer lore from the Video Game
B) Got rid of their old armies because they were angry GW cut their game
C) Already converted their minis to AoS and now have no WHFB army so need to buy a new one

Everyone else that went over to 9th age/Kings of War/Still playing 8th are already not the people they are going to be marketing too anyway. They still buy GW and aren't going to be where the new sales will be coming from.

Hah, joke's on them. My dawi have been gathering dust in my attic since before they axed WHFB.

For someone that has been out of the loop for a while, what evidence has their been from GW that they are planning on re-visiting the old world?

I did see the square bases comment is that what this discussion is based on, or are there other things?

I assume this must be because of TW: Warhammer being a best seller? Very grateful if anyone is able to fill in the blanks for me!

there were several articles about on the Community Page

for the reason, GW might have realised that the IP itself is worth a lot and not using it a waste of money

I'm hyped for it, but I really hope it's not just a bunch of expensive resin kits on forgeworld. I would love to see some of the old, discontinued models, like maybe malekith if the DE get involved, and I would love to see some of the older multipart kits like the empire knight or a third of the O&G kits come back, and it would be awesome to see tomb kings or Bretonnia make a comeback. here's hoping.

I suppose if that is the case Misclicking Orc, as long as there are a set of rules that would be the main thing.

You still have masses of the old GW minis for sale through AoS, a lot still available 2nd hand and of course lots of other companies making fantasy proxy miniatures. In fact I think with the latter it could probably be vastly cheaper than AoS even, if you use rank fillers and minis from Mantic for instance with the odd GW or Raging Heroes character piece.

 Pacific wrote:
I suppose if that is the case Misclicking Orc, as long as there are a set of rules that would be the main thing.

You still have masses of the old GW minis for sale through AoS, a lot still available 2nd hand and of course lots of other companies making fantasy proxy miniatures. In fact I think with the latter it could probably be vastly cheaper than AoS even, if you use rank fillers and minis from Mantic for instance with the odd GW or Raging Heroes character piece.

Well, I guess if there are some new rules that would be good, but the two biggest things that drew to WHFB even though when I discovered it had already died was the lore, and the models. I didn't make the leap into WHFB and start an army until earlier this year(O&G), and I really hope that they bring back some of the old O&G sculpts, because using 40k ork bits feels a bit bland after a while. And on the talk about Mantic, they have some very good minis, and I will at some point get some of their minis, because they got some good sculpts for cheaper than GW.

For me if the rules continue to be typical GW sucktacular rules, I will be ignoring this project. As it stands, I have very little emotional investment in the old world project as I feel it will be essentially AOS reskinned for the old world, and I cannot stand AOS rules.

If they pleasantly surprise me than great.

Otherwise beautiful models don't do me much as I already have three full rooms in my house stuffed full of display cases full of beautiful models. They are useless without an equally fun game to play them in for me.

For me it more about the setting and the game rules.

If its going tobe a rank and game and they keep the setting as close as they to the original then I will be happy.

Speak in of which, if you are interested in Facebook page thats mostly about Warhammer: The Old World ( and a bit of WHFB ) the please leave a like and follow this page:

https://www.facebook.com/FANWarhamerTheOldWorld/