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 Tiberius501 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Aren't there more on these new ones?

I assume so, but I haven't seen any images of them leaked. My comment was more that the updated Nurglings are a massive improvement over what came before and what we currently have for Scarabs.

You can see them in the space marine half of the starter set image that was leaked, down in the bottom left. And they do seem to have more Scarabs per base, seems like maybe 6 or more now.

You're right, completely missed them and even zooming in barely helps. Looks like 6 with actual legs now. The key stands are probably still a thing too.

Honestly I was hoping for more, like a crashing wave of little bodies but oh well. If we're getting these guys in a box sinve you can cram so many on a sprue I'd assume it'd be boxes of 5. That or we get a base worth in every kit. Or maybe both.

If Scarabs are their own Box depends on how the Core Box sprues will look like
I guess that the starter set ones will be the only source for a long time if they are not coming together with another Box

AngryAngel80 wrote:Black Reach was such an exciting time for 40k to be there for it. So many new players got in with that box. It sold like hot cakes around here. The time period was one of the most excited I remember being for 40k I got to witness close up.

a Starter with Necrons + Primaris for 60 instead of 120 would give a huge push to 40k and see much more people going for a new pure Primaris Army
the higher the price the more exclusive the game will be

But another possibility is that with the ne Edition having Missions/rules for 4 different point values, that the new game/event/torunament standard won't be the maximum but something in between.

(like 1000-1500 points for ITC, I know that they won't do that and rather increase to 2500-3000 points if there is the chance but one can dream)

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Tiberius501 wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Aren't there more on these new ones?

I assume so, but I haven't seen any images of them leaked. My comment was more that the updated Nurglings are a massive improvement over what came before and what we currently have for Scarabs.

You can see them in the space marine half of the starter set image that was leaked, down in the bottom left. And they do seem to have more Scarabs per base, seems like maybe 6 or more now.

You're right, completely missed them and even zooming in barely helps. Looks like 6 with actual legs now. The key stands are probably still a thing too.

Honestly I was hoping for more, like a crashing wave of little bodies but oh well. If we're getting these guys in a box sinve you can cram so many on a sprue I'd assume it'd be boxes of 5. That or we get a base worth in every kit. Or maybe both.

I like it, they become a crashing wave when you put more bases together. And it seems like each base has a few more or less. One looks like it has 8 on it. And yeah I agree they’ll do a box of 5 instead of them being part of the warriors. Means they can add the second gun option on the warrior sprue, sell them for more money, and then also make more money on Scarabs.
Some random wish listing added on, it’d be cool if Scarabs had some more special rules. Stuff like being able to repair and doing more attacks or dmg or something with more in a unit.

Bdrone wrote:
on this Command point thing, my idea for a knight lance benefits, but my pure Tempestus idea gets a serious run around and a potential removal of command instead of a gain.

whats got me wondering is the changes to strategic reserves, and how both GSC and tempestus use rules around that so heavily. how will they change?

yay for being on standby with all of this.. and valkyries are about t'go up.

Odds are if you have reserve rule in datasheet you get to do it for free. If not you can pay CP. Sounds like they want to INCREASE use of reserves. Making previous free version cost CP doesn't increase really.


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Wakshaani wrote:

 CKO wrote:
How many command points do you think you will start with in a 2000 point game? I wish I could be like Las Vegas and gamble with the odds.

My gut says 20, since they stated that "You get more" and they're adding a bunch of generic strats to the core book. I really think that the 1 Cp per 100 pts is going to be the rule, but, we'll see.

They have 4 game sizes in chart. I would dare to make a guess each is x->y points and X command points.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Imateria wrote:
[
This just suggests you don't know anything about either of the those 2 armies. For starters Sunny Side Up was talking about Genestealer Cults only, so one codex, and how the only way that army really works is by taking multiple detachments and giving them different Cult traits thanks to some really bad rules design on GW's part, which I hav eno doubt was intentional but was really, really stupid. This is not soup in the Rusty 17/ Imperial Knights/ Guilleman manner at all which is where most problems with soup lie, this is literally trying to make a single codex work.

Orks benefit from using multiple klans either rather than say evil sun as mono(+1 move/advance/charge to shooty unit that doesn't want to get into melee! Goff lootas! Extra attacks in melee! Wee!). You should be rewarded for taking suboptimal units by staying mono rather than having your cake and eating it.

Tradeoff rather than getting everything with no drawbacks

The changes to Command Points sound great! In fact, they should expand Command Points even further. Like not only stratagems and detachments and reserves, but units themselves could cost Command Points too. Of course they would need to rebalance the costs of all the current stratagems relative to the costs of the units and probably adjust the starting amount of Command Points you have to work with too. Like maybe in a 2,000 point game each player could get, oh I don't know, let's say 2,000 Command Points.

 Imateria wrote:
(Ghostkeels have -1 to hit naturally and pay 20pts for drones that provide another -1, and those drones aren't optional). Not that it matters that much, the odious Chapter Master stratagem has invalidated anything less than -3 to hit anyway. We need more information on this.

I would say it's fairly safe stuff like this gets touched on day 1 errata. Maybe drones gives always in cover or some other boost instead


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Imateria wrote:

You still haven't gotten it through your head that 8th edition has proven that approach doesn't work. You've also conveniently cut out the post I was replying to that suggested they wouldn't be surprised to see the cost of taking extra detachments being 5CP. That means you're probably spending a good 10CP to run that thematic Wraith, Ravenwing or Nidzilla list which would be such a punitive cost (assuming GW doesn't do something ridiculous like give everyone 35CP as the starting point for a 2K game) that it puts them right back to where they currently are, the trash heap. Given the stated intention is to avoid that, it seems rather counter productive to then have massive costs holding such lists back.

I can fit nidzilla list on single detachment. Ravenwing/deathwing combo list would be fairly easy. Def no need for 3 det's. First free+another suits more than enough

Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

 Sabotage! wrote:
Yeah, I suppose that’s probably the case. I suppose I’m just always bummed that playing the type of army I used to play (Witch Hunters from 4th) is always made such a chore these days (for the past 4 editions at least). Well that and the other faction I used to play has been basically forgotten.

Keep in mind Inquisitor gets inside other faction detachments for free.

Grey knights, sisters, deathwatch your plan? That's 2 extra det's. Inquisitor himself doesn't take detachment.

i thought we were going to see images and details of all the models on the weekend. guess not even this week :(

SF

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

I saw that previously. It looks like someone printed it out, clipped it, and stuck it in a book.

 puma713 wrote:
Without getting into too much speculation, I think they're trying to reward those people who want to take fluffy lists like all Deathwing while changing the narrative on using other codices. Remember Stu Black described it is "requisitioning resources". So, you're spending some of your resources to bring in the Drukhari Razorwings into your Eldar army. The more I think about how they're phrasing these changes, it seems like you're going to be unlocking Codices with CP, not necessarily detachments.

Remember, detachment bonuses are gone, so having 1 detachment versus having 3 is not that big of a deal, unless you're including allies.

That would be substandard for balance. Multi clan/regiment/Etc soup would still get free bonus rules at no cost hurting mono goff, mono evil sun etc

Primaris who buffs his sides ability to cull the Old marines?

 Eldarain wrote:
Primaris who buffs his sides ability to cull the Old marines?

That's what I was thinking of as well. "Firstborn" keyword sounds like either Marinelets or daemons or something.

It would be pretty fethed up to make a unit that's specifically good at killing Marinelets though lmao.

Voss wrote:

 Mr_Rose wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

 Sabotage! wrote:
Yeah, I suppose that’s probably the case. I suppose I’m just always bummed that playing the type of army I used to play (Witch Hunters from 4th) is always made such a chore these days (for the past 4 editions at least). Well that and the other faction I used to play has been basically forgotten.

Yeah, it sucks that factions have become so granularized at this point. Just adding a few more faction keywords to inquisitors would allow them to be more cleanly fielded with their retinues in actually fluffy imperial soup armies.Deathwatch don't even get the ordo xenos keyword...wtf...like I"m willing to give up my deathwatch chapter tactic thingy just to take them with inquisitors and henchmen and stuff.

I hope they just do the sensible thing and make micro-factions like inquisition have a reduced CP cost to include as an army special rule.

That would entirely defeat the purpose.

Not really when we are talking about some specific forces. Inquisitor detachment isn't as bad for ally as marine force. And as it is biggest thing there is inquisitor himself whom you can slot in for free. Rest is more of casual stuff to have around. You don't take those for competive lists generally anyway.

So the best part of Inquisition detachment you already would get for 0 CP by slotting inside your marine/ig/sister detachment free and not even losing mono bonus with marines/sisters

the Inquisition force is REALLY limited


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Lord Zarkov wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

I am also wondering how they handle Dark Eldar. maybe the real space raiders detachment will count as one freebee? Otherwise it will drain CP in order to take wyches along with warriors from the same damned book lol.

I’m hoping they do something like errata Raiding Force to make DRUKHARI Patrol detachments free or something, otherwise the army is going to be wrecked...

Another one that's virtually quaranteed to be errata'ed day 1. You an use the 3 for freebie or get 3 patrols for price of 1 or something would be good bets.

 BlaxicanX wrote:

 Eldarain wrote:
Primaris who buffs his sides ability to cull the Old marines?

That's what I was thinking of as well. "Firstborn" keyword sounds like either Marinelets or daemons or something.

It would be pretty fethed up to make a unit that's specifically good at killing Marinelets though lmao.

Daemons are usually Neverborn. I think Firstborn has been used to describe the Oldstartes officially.

I'd love it to be real. that rule is going to have the "Ahhhhhh, marines are getting squatted" folks awfully riled up.

Wakshaani wrote:

Voss wrote:

Yeah. The starter box- that's what I'm saying. Not the warrior kit itself.
The only reason to think there will be scarabs in the new warrior kit is because the current warrior sprue has scarabs.
That they're both in the starter box pic is happenstance, not evidence they'll be together in the warrior kit.

On the one hand true but on the other? That's be silly. They're just a little part that you can add to each sprue and the Warriors don't have a ton of variety... two weapons, no real options like sergeant stuff … it'd be insane to NOT have them on there.

Probably every new infantry kit will have one or three in the mix.

The necron warriors in the starter sets will be different sprues than the necron warriors in solo box. That's how GW does the starter sets. They are unique mixed sprues. Could even be marines and necrons being intermingled among in same sprue.


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StarFyre wrote:
i thought we were going to see images and details of all the models on the weekend. guess not even this week :(

SF

The FAQ itself made clear they don't show all during the saturday stream.

It's at least over month before 9th launches and then not everything comes on launch day. Several solo necron kits could be easily month or two later. They need hype for later as well.

 Dentry wrote:

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

I saw that previously. It looks like someone printed it out, clipped it, and stuck it in a book.

Looking at the special rules, wth is a FIRSTBORN?

 Tiberius501 wrote:

 Dentry wrote:

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

I saw that previously. It looks like someone printed it out, clipped it, and stuck it in a book.

Looking at the special rules, wth is a FIRSTBORN?

Allegedly the old-school, non-Primaris Marines (use with salt).

 Tiberius501 wrote:

 Dentry wrote:

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

I saw that previously. It looks like someone printed it out, clipped it, and stuck it in a book.

Looking at the special rules, wth is a FIRSTBORN?

The "Firstborn" is the term used within the Adeptus Astartes and the wider Imperium since the start of the Indomitus Crusade for the original Space Marine genetic template created by the Emperor of Mankind in the late 30th Millennium.

Is 9th about to get real in the oldstartes vs Primaris divide? Does Bobby G issue the Thunder Warrior Order 66 2.0?

 Tiberius501 wrote:

 Dentry wrote:

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

I saw that previously. It looks like someone printed it out, clipped it, and stuck it in a book.

Looking at the special rules, wth is a FIRSTBORN?

If assumed to be non-primaris marines, this may be a massive and amazing fluff turn at last.

It would be a pretty funny fake out if it was just a random debuff to Vostroyan players.

Well, it should be noted that it is probably fake. At the very least, he doesn't have the character keyword.

Dudeface wrote:

 Tiberius501 wrote:

 Dentry wrote:

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

I saw that previously. It looks like someone printed it out, clipped it, and stuck it in a book.

Looking at the special rules, wth is a FIRSTBORN?

If assumed to be non-primaris marines, this may be a massive and amazing fluff turn at last.

I just don’t get why he’d turn on them when the Imperium needs all they can get to fight the enemies of man. I guess the old marines or, “first born,” could turn on them, though that seems a little random and petty.

 Dentry wrote:

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

I saw that previously. It looks like someone printed it out, clipped it, and stuck it in a book.

Could be its the rules at the back of a assembly instruction booklet. Dont explain the weird rules though.
Why would he have rules against Vostroyan Firstborn? Talk about holding grudges

Sunny Side Up wrote:
Well, it should be noted that it is probably fake. At the very least, he doesn't have the character keyword.

Yeh. If that's legit it's about worst unit in the game. Good luck keeping lone unit freely targetable safe.

my gut feeling is that

BrianDavion wrote:
my gut feeling is that

But the internet would be such fun if it wasn't. Damn. Probably fake :(

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

Are you Spikey Bits? Even phone posting isn't an excuse for passing that off like it's a real leak.

I mean he doesn't have the character keyword, it's a mess of sloppy looking pixels, it's clearly a cut out, and GW has never used "FIRSTBORN" as a keyword meaning the model would be useless at launch.

EDIT: The Momento Mori is a Krieg peice of wargear which has different rules:

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

Please not be fake, please not be fake.

Order 66 man!

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Lord Perversor wrote:
Not sure if posted already but a photo passed along.

P.S: posting from phone

Are you Spikey Bits? Even phone posting isn't an excuse for passing that off like it's a real leak.

I mean he doesn't have the character keyword, it's a mess of sloppy looking pixels, it's clearly a cut out, and GW has never used "FIRSTBORN" as a keyword meaning the model would be useless at launch.

I'm just passing the info and asking if someone already saw/know about it.

Yes i believe it's probably a fake but some of the minor irks can be explained as be part of assembly booklet.

The firstborn key could be related to the new necron troop (with new weapon options) and it mimics Aos special rules from starter.