40k 9th edition, : App released page 413

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**H.B.M.C.**

Smellingsalts wrote:
So really, no reason not to try.

Were it just a general rule of combat/falling back, you'd be right. But it's not. It's a 1CP strat. That's reason enough not to try.

**the_scotsman**

Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

**Red Corsair**

ClockworkZion wrote:
Red Corsair wrote:
ClockworkZion wrote:
I feel like people are overlooking the numbers game hordes play.

First off, the more expensive a model is the less valuable secondaries that require actions are to that model's army. Which has a higher opportunity cost to no shoot or fight: 16 cultists or 5 Intercessors?

Intercessors hands down. 100 pts of Marine is at a greater disadvantage not engaging enemy units than 96pts of Cultists.

Horde units can cap more points with cheap troops units and quickly max secondaries in a game meaning it can be a lot harder for an Elite player to catch up, especially if the horde can deny easy secondaries for Marines by keeping their scoring units away from the Los and charge range of the Marines early game.

40k is also a game that favors weight of dice. Forcing elite units to take more saves than they can kill models wins games.

This has to be the worst cost to value assessment I have ever read.

You just compared two things of equal cost and claimed the one that provides less value is somehow more effective because the other unit isn't using it's advantage to do a similar role.

Heres a better way to look at your argument here.

You can buy one of two watches.
Both are $100.00 but one is just a time piece while the other is also a dive rated water proof watch.
According to your logic the generic watch is better value because on land the dive watch would be wasting it's dive capability.
Sorry, but I'll always take the dive watch, even if I never go into the water. Because at least I have the capability and it costs me nothing more.

100 points of cultists is not better then 100 points of intercessors. Your still spending 100 points either way, regardless of use. We don't need to worry about opportunity cost in rules because we have a better more measurable standard. Points. And the points tell me that the intercessor is more durable, requires no baby sitting and also has more offensive potential. You defeated your own argument.

BTW the cultists can't be on more then one objective either, they come in minimum units of 10. That means 16 or 17 of them all need to be in the one unit and the leak already told us a unit can only hold one objective.

Best case you can make is that MAYBE and HOPEFULLY this isn't indicative of anything else and it's an edge case. But even if so, what a terrible example to lead a marketing campaign with out of hundreds of data slates.

Opportunity cost means those points weigh out differently for the units involved.

No, no it doesn't lol.

100 points IS the measure. Either way your dedicating 100 points. Your trying really hard to make the better value look worse. Marines in your example at least have options the cultists don't. But that won't stop you from banging your head against the wall trying to claim the marines are wasted.

**small_gods**

the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

**H.B.M.C.**

small_gods wrote:
Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

5 mortal wounds? That's 5 6's. That means you need 30 dice to get that result. How many units in HTH combat are going to have 30 models after getting up the table, charging into combat, and surviving return attacks?

Frankly if you're spending CP on 'Cut Them Down' you're helping me win the game by wasting your CP.

**Latro_**

small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

what he said above this post XD

**the_scotsman**

small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Sure. I'll be sure to use this one when I have 30 ork boyz within Engagement Range of a leviathan dreadnought, didn't remember to use any of them to surround it so it can't fall back, and my opponent chooses to fall back and give up his shooting with the leviathan dread to fall back instead of just shooting me in close combat which we know he can now do.

**Shadenuat**

Why would Levi shoot into cc? It's not a tank or monster?

**Red Corsair**

ClockworkZion wrote:
Abadabadoobaddon wrote:

Opportunity cost means I give up one thing in order have some other mutually exclusive thing. I can't swap my cultists for intercessors, so I don't see how this is relevant at all.

Your argument basically boils down to this:

Armies that have better units should pay less for them because their pts are worth more than armies with worse units.

I hope we can all see why this is wrong on its face. My fear is that someone in the design studio decided this reasoning was sound.

That's not what I was trying to say at all. I was saying a points hike impacts an elite army more than a horde army. But go on and bang that gong I guess.

Thats also not true at all. Like demonstrably false. You pay the hike on a per model bases which means the inverse is more likely. If I have 100 models that all go up a point or 10 models that go up a point I just spent 10 times more based on volume. The only way to combat that is by making the adjustments proportional to cost. Two problems arrise from that, the first one assumes the initial data points were balanced, which is something we KNOW is not true. Cultists are objectively worth far less using current point levels in 8th as of now. The secodn issue is that GW DID give an example and they inverted the percentages. Somehow they managed to make the worse unit with higher numbers increase by double the percentage of the lower model count, better value unit.

Your digging that hole awfully deep mate.

**JNAProductions**

ClockworkZion wrote:
Abadabadoobaddon wrote:

Opportunity cost means I give up one thing in order have some other mutually exclusive thing. I can't swap my cultists for intercessors, so I don't see how this is relevant at all.

Your argument basically boils down to this:

Armies that have better units should pay less for them because their pts are worth more than armies with worse units.

I hope we can all see why this is wrong on its face. My fear is that someone in the design studio decided this reasoning was sound.

That's not what I was trying to say at all. I was saying a points hike impacts an elite army more than a horde army. But go on and bang that gong I guess.

If I have 30 guys, who go up by 3 points each, I need to drop 90 points from elsewhere to make them fit still.

If I have 50 guys, who go up by 2 points each, I need to drop 100 points from elsewhere to make them still fit.

Hordes are hit HARDER by points increases, since they have more models.

**Pickled_egg**

So, cut them down.

Let me get this straight in my head.

If I flee a unit of 30 Gretchin or Termagants I take potentially 5 Mortal wounds, If I flee a unit of 6 Assault Centurions I take 1 mortal wound?

Who is signing off on this terrible design?

And in what world do you ever get 30 Ork boyz intact into an enemy and all in engaged anyway??

This has been extensively play tested by people who know the game and this is the end result?

I'm not pooping on the whole edition as i like a lot of what I'm hearing but how do things like this still slip through?

**Red Corsair**

Nah Man Pichu wrote:
Red Corsair wrote:
small_gods wrote:
Nah Man Pichu wrote:
It's almost like the internet's full of people determined to be angry/miserable!

It's not like dakka to be overwhelming negative about a game that many people enjoy is it?

Yet here you both are, funny that.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ The forums not full of people committed to being perpetually miserable and angry have rules against certain leaks, so I pop in, check the scoop, and laugh at people hating the thing they "love".

Glass houses mate. Your painting every one with a differing opinion to yours as an other. If you think so poorly on the forum, maybe showing up to point and laugh to get your rocks off is not the healthiest activity. I mean, if only there were a community page directly provided by the source to get all your information from with no other outside opinions. If only right? Oh wait

Get off that horse.

**ERJAK**

Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Nothing is ever really 'free'. You have to deal with opportunity cost. Using that CP on cut them down means you can't use it on anything else. That said, in a critical moment against an important target, it may make up it's value just by peeling a few wounds off an important target.

**Latro_**

Pickled_egg wrote:
So, cut them down.

Let me get this straight in my head.

If I flee a unit of 30 Gretchin or Termagants I take potentially 5 Mortal wounds, If I flee a unit of 6 Assault Centurions I take 1 mortal wound?

Who is signing off on this terrible design?

And in what world do you ever get 30 Ork boyz intact into an enemy and all in engaged anyway??

This has been extensively play tested by people who know the game and this is the end result?

I'm not pooping on the whole edition as i like a lot of what I'm hearing but how do things like this still slip through?

no mate its the other way round. It does not matter what you flee with, if you flee FROM 10 boyz they get 10d6 chances, if you flee FROM 5 marines they get 5d6 chances.
Its just a crap useless strat allround. which worries us CC players because it means they have accounted it as a + for CC when they consider their balance vs shooting when in reality no one is ever going to use it.

**small_gods**

the_scotsman wrote:
small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Sure. I'll be sure to use this one when I have 30 ork boyz within Engagement Range of a leviathan dreadnought, didn't remember to use any of them to surround it so it can't fall back, and my opponent chooses to fall back and give up his shooting with the leviathan dread to fall back instead of just shooting me in close combat which we know he can now do.

So you can't forsee a situation where you charge a marine gunline of 10 intersessors with a Levi dead tucked behind to be in a reroll aura. Where you kill the intersessors, pile in tag and consolidate near that Levi dread? Or fire warriors and a lion cannon riptide? Or when you play do people generally leave their key units without any screen?

**Red Corsair**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
small_gods wrote:
Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.
5 mortal wounds? That's 5 6's. That means you need 30 dice to get that result. How many units in HTH combat are going to have 30 models after getting up the table, charging into combat, and surviving return attacks?

Frankly if you're spending CP on 'Cut Them Down' you're helping me win the game by wasting your CP.

It also doesn't synergize with success. By that I mean not only did I need 30 orks to get into combat and remain in range, but they also presumably failed to kill that target. I would have much rather seen a strat to consolidate farther or back into cover etc.

**the_scotsman**

Pickled_egg wrote:
So, cut them down.

Let me get this straight in my head.

If I flee a unit of 30 Gretchin or Termagants I take potentially 5 Mortal wounds, If I flee a unit of 6 Assault Centurions I take 1 mortal wound?

Who is signing off on this terrible design?

And in what world do you ever get 30 Ork boyz intact into an enemy and all in engaged anyway??

This has been extensively play tested by people who know the game and this is the end result?

I'm not pooping on the whole edition as i like a lot of what I'm hearing but how do things like this still slip through?

This new rule was penned by DA GLORIOUS GROTVOLUSHUN.

"aha, primaris hellblasters, so you choose to flee in terror from us lowly grots. Little do you know that upon you turning your backs, our S2 Ap- fists become FACE MELTING LAZORS!"

**gorgon**

Sotahullu wrote:
Article on new art was put up:

Spoiler:

There's some freaky gak in that xenos art.

**Slayer-Fan123**

small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Vehicles can shoot in combat now. Leviathan don't need to fall back and if anything you are protecting it from being shot at by the opponent's army now!

**Red Corsair**

I hate mortal wound mechanics because they create strange situations impossible under normal condition. 30 grots charging a custodes unit won't do any meaningful damage until the custodes fall back to grab an objective, then they take wounds without the possibility of saves with all that expensive gear.

**small_gods**

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Vehicles can shoot in combat now. Leviathan don't need to fall back and if anything you are protecting it from being shot at by the opponent's army now!

A leviathan is not a vehicle or monster

**Red Corsair**

gorgon wrote:
Sotahullu wrote:
Article on new art was put up:

Spoiler:

There's some freaky gak in that xenos art.

Yea there is, I won't get my hopes up though since I remember the xenos collage in the 5th edition rulebook. Would love to see a Xenos coaltion of races as a faction. I wished that was where tau was taken, but they went with gundam light mecha instead. Maybe they will expand that way, it would make sense reading their fluff at least. I want Terrelian Dog soldiers!

Automatically Appended Next Post:

small_gods wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Vehicles can shoot in combat now. Leviathan don't need to fall back and if anything you are protecting it from being shot at by the opponent's army now!

A leviathan is not a vehicle or monster

Sure about that?

**tneva82**

Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

No reason? It costs 1 cp. I'm rarely flooding with cp and unless people start playing 2001 pts i will have less cp than before and some are at the end when game over.

I can sure use 1cp and hope for best. Or spend 1cp elsewhere for bigger impact.

**Pickled_egg**

Latro_ wrote:
Pickled_egg wrote:
So, cut them down.

Let me get this straight in my head.

If I flee a unit of 30 Gretchin or Termagants I take potentially 5 Mortal wounds, If I flee a unit of 6 Assault Centurions I take 1 mortal wound?

Who is signing off on this terrible design?

And in what world do you ever get 30 Ork boyz intact into an enemy and all in engaged anyway??

This has been extensively play tested by people who know the game and this is the end result?

I'm not pooping on the whole edition as i like a lot of what I'm hearing but how do things like this still slip through?

no mate its the other way round. It does not matter what you flee with, if you flee FROM 10 boyz they get 10d6 chances, if you flee FROM 5 marines they get 5d6 chances.
Its just a crap useless strat allround. which worries us CC players because it means they have accounted it as a + for CC when they consider their balance vs shooting when in reality no one is ever going to use it.

I meant If I flee from 30 Gretchin I take on average 5 mortal wounds, If I flee from 6 Assault Centurions I take on average 1 mortal wound. Should have worded it better.

Point I was trying to make is that it seems daft to me that its just about unit size not the close combat quality of the unit you are trying to escape from.

As an Ork player Its very rare that i get a full unit of 30 Ork Lads into combat anyway, due to base size, terrain, choke points and the size of enemy units. So I don't even think its particularly good for horde players in the first place.

**addnid**

small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Sweet summer child, you really think you will get 30 models to roll these 5 "6" resulting in 6 mortal wounds ? Space on the board and charge distances will make this nigh impossiblet. Also, in 8th a riptide costs as much as 30 orks, so you will be pouring CP in losing trade between a CC unit and a shooting unit -by the time you get in CC the riptide will have already shot stuff down, so losing trade-, and acolytes are 20 max. Demons i dunno.

**tneva82**

small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Except orks don't cause 5 in average. Especially vs single models. A) casualties b) you aren"t in range. I rarely get more than 20 or so and that's vs bigger than 1 model unit. And then casualties.

Think more like 3 or less.

**Slayer-Fan123**

small_gods wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Vehicles can shoot in combat now. Leviathan don't need to fall back and if anything you are protecting it from being shot at by the opponent's army now!

A leviathan is not a vehicle or monster

Yes it is, buddy.

**tneva82**

Shadenuat wrote:
Why would Levi shoot into cc? It's not a tank or monster?

It's vehicle. Enough.

Though wether it can shoot into combat is another thing.

**Slayer-Fan123**

addnid wrote:
small_gods wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
Smellingsalts wrote:
I see all of the complaints about "Cut Them Down". While I can't argue with the math, I would just point out that this is a game of dice, that's why you roll them. You could get lucky and beat the odds, heck you could roll Yahtzee. So really, no reason not to try. As for CP, Soup is dead. Tournament players will likely be running mono armies, and 12 points is a lot of command points. Plus, you will get 1 per turn that you didn't get before, so go ahead and use "Cut Them Down", it's effectively free.

Yeah, except it's in competition with an average of like 30 strats per faction at this point. and it's one of the worst ones.

Not for Orks, daemons, genestealer cult etc. 5 mortal wounds to finish of that riptide or leviathan dread is pretty handy. So it's situational, not useless, but luckily you have those 30 other starts to use if it doesn't work for your army.

Sweet summer child, you really think you will get 30 models to roll these 5 "6" resulting in 6 mortal wounds ? Space on the board and charge distances will make this nigh impossiblet. Also, in 8th a riptide costs as much as 30 orks, so you will be pouring CP in losing trade between a CC unit and a shooting unit -by the time you get in CC the riptide will have already shot stuff down, so losing trade-, and acolytes are 20 max. Demons i dunno.

Also Marines get a Strat to give a 5+++ against Mortal Wounds.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:
Shadenuat wrote:
Why would Levi shoot into cc? It's not a tank or monster?

It's vehicle. Enough.

Though wether it can shoot into combat is another thing.

You think a Leviathan is going to care about some Orks plinking off it being wounded on 6s and having that 2+/4++? Yeah no.

**Ice_can**

Red Corsair wrote:
I hate mortal wound mechanics because they create strange situations impossible under normal condition. 30 grots charging a custodes unit won't do any meaningful damage until the custodes fall back to grab an objective, then they take wounds without the possibility of saves with all that expensive gear.

This is exactly why I wish Gw woukd stop seeing handing out mortal wounds like candy as the answer.
If you want a faster game how about ditching reroll your reroll of a reroll aura's and doubel shooting russes they take way more time to resolve.