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 Sasori wrote:
While everything depends on points costs and the statline, these do not look like they are worth taking right now, even in a vacuum. It gets worse when you look at the hammerfall bunker.

I'm hopeful the statlines and points will balance these out, but it's really starting to get hard to not be annoyed when comparing to the new stuff the primaris is getting.

I seem to remember someone saying that these can teleport your forces around the board, so judging them by their profile alone might be a bit premature. The article also hints at this function calling them "part pylon and part waystone" and thus showing they possess features not listed in the article. My bet is they are mini eternity gates (the teleporter on the monolith), and they will be able to use dimensional corridor and deploy units from Tomb world deploy. So you set them up, teleport them to where they need to be, and then start pulling units around the board.

You can imagine all sorts of use cases, with 3 or more durable and (hopefully) reasonably priced exit points, tomb world deployment becomes less of a suicide run. The buff to leadership is useful for blobs and I can think of two blobs that would really benefit from moving around the board, reaper equipped warriors, and flayed ones. The only drawback would be the fun doesn't start until turn three, which is in line with monoliths.

 Grimgold wrote:

 Sasori wrote:
While everything depends on points costs and the statline, these do not look like they are worth taking right now, even in a vacuum. It gets worse when you look at the hammerfall bunker.

I'm hopeful the statlines and points will balance these out, but it's really starting to get hard to not be annoyed when comparing to the new stuff the primaris is getting.

I seem to remember someone saying that these can teleport your forces around the board, so judging them by their profile alone might be a bit premature. The article also hints at this function calling them "part pylon and part waystone" and thus showing they possess features not listed in the article. My bet is they are mini eternity gates (the teleporter on the monolith), and they will be able to use dimensional corridor and deploy units from Tomb world deploy. So you set them up, teleport them to where they need to be, and then start pulling units around the board.

You can imagine all sorts of use cases, with 3 or more durable and (hopefully) reasonably priced exit points, tomb world deployment becomes less of a suicide run. The buff to leadership is useful for blobs and I can think of two blobs that would really benefit from moving around the board, reaper equipped warriors, and flayed ones. The only drawback would be the fun doesn't start until turn three, which is in line with monoliths.

No, people just misinterpreted the first article as maybe allowing people to transport their forces around, when it was talking about the terrain itself. I know I was hopeful for that as well.

Not sure if it was mentioned yet, but Necron Warriors now re-roll 1's for Reanimation Protocol.

punisher357 wrote:

 Kharne the Befriender wrote:
I agree that the CoD rules seem rather lackluster, but if the points are cheap enough I could actually see some use for these.

They give a pretty massive foot print of no deepstrike for the enemy. If one were to take 3 sets of them you could secure your entire board edge and flanks.

You could teleport them forward and block pathways and such

I get that you're looking for a silver lining, but I don't see it. The fact that the starsteles have to leave the board for a turn really cuts their balls off.
Honestly, we shouldn't be surprised. Of course the "Supreme Marines" have to be blatantly better than everything. I wouldn't mind if it were just an edge that GW was giving to the marines, but it's way past that. Space marines = gun
Everyone else = knife

Unless I misunderstsnd the rules they don't have to leave for a full turn to deepstrike back in, they leave at the end of your turn and come back in the reinforcement phase of your next turn so they can avoid anti tank shooting in your opponents turn and still have opportunity to shoot in your next turn

 Aza'Gorod wrote:
Unless I misunderstsnd the rules they don't have to leave for a full turn to deepstrike back in, they leave at the end of your turn and come back in the reinforcement phase of your next turn so they can avoid anti tank shooting in your opponents turn and still have opportunity to shoot in your next turn

They leave at the end of the movement phase, so they lose at least one shooting phase but they probably won't be in range anyway. You also lose shooting from the Cryptek, that's not a big deal unless you play a Plasmancer. If i also read this correctly, as the Action of moving the Starstele is completed at the end of the turn, a Cryptek will regain his auras at this moment, so they will still be effective for your opponent's turn and your next turn command phase for a Cryptek with Chronometron or a Canoptek Cloak.
So the "cost" of moving a Starstele in the first turn is not extremly high. Trying to analyse with what we know :
- Even if you move a Startele T1, you still have two Starstele doing nothing in your deployment zone and depending of the matchup they won't be able to shoot all game.
- Startele could be used to protect your backline against Strategic Reserve or drops
- Fortifications don't take objectives, but they seems to be able to count for "Linebreakers" and "Engage on all fronts" secondaries.
- Their gun is quite depressingly undewhelming we won't take them for damage
- Fortifications don't protect Characters for Look Out Sir. Seeing some battle report in 9th, Thunderfire canons and other ordnance are very efficient to snipe characters.

If they are really tough and cheap (max 25-30 pts per Starstele) i can see them used just for secondaries and board deny against reserves. Even in this scenario, scarabs may just be far better. I think they will be MVP of the edition for us.

Shaelinith wrote:

 Aza'Gorod wrote:
Unless I misunderstsnd the rules they don't have to leave for a full turn to deepstrike back in, they leave at the end of your turn and come back in the reinforcement phase of your next turn so they can avoid anti tank shooting in your opponents turn and still have opportunity to shoot in your next turn

They leave at the end of the movement phase, so they lose at least one shooting phase but they probably won't be in range anyway. You also lose shooting from the Cryptek, that's not a big deal unless you play a Plasmancer. If i also read this correctly, as the Action of moving the Starstele is completed at the end of the turn, a Cryptek will regain his auras at this moment, so they will still be effective for your opponent's turn and your next turn command phase for a Cryptek with Chronometron or a Canoptek Cloak.
So the "cost" of moving a Starstele in the first turn is not extremly high. Trying to analyse with what we know :
- Even if you move a Startele T1, you still have two Starstele doing nothing in your deployment zone and depending of the matchup they won't be able to shoot all game.
- Startele could be used to protect your backline against Strategic Reserve or drops
- Fortifications don't take objectives, but they seems to be able to count for "Linebreakers" and "Engage on all fronts" secondaries.
- Their gun is quite depressingly undewhelming we won't take them for damage
- Fortifications don't protect Characters for Look Out Sir. Seeing some battle report in 9th, Thunderfire canons and other ordnance are very efficient to snipe characters.

If they are really tough and cheap (max 25-30 pts per Starstele) i can see them used just for secondaries and board deny against reserves. Even in this scenario, scarabs may just be far better. I think they will be MVP of the edition for us.

The action starts in the movement phase but you don't actually remove it until the end of your turn, so you can still shoot it and then take it off the board before your opponent can.

Im still not saying they're good with a 12 inch range but the timing is interesting. Maybe with how lacking the majority of our range is we are just better off going 2nd whenever we can. Let then come to us get in range of our guns and try and RP/heal any damage we've received

Translocation Protocols: While there are any STARSTELE units from your army on the battlefield, CRYPTEK units in your army can attempt the following action, as described in the Warhammer 40,000 Core Book: 'Activate Translocation Protocols (Action): At the end of your Movement phase, one friendly CRYPTEK unit from your army that is within 3" of any friendly STARSTELE units can start to perform this action. The action is completed at the end of your turn. Once completed, select one of those STARSTELE units and remove it from the battlefield; in the Reinforcements step of your next Movement phase, set that STARSTELE unit back up on the battlefield, anywhere that is more than 9" away from any enemy models. If the battle ends and that Starstele unit is not on the battlefield, it is destroyed."

Yeah. I don't see the Terrain as being worth taking. I would love to be wrong and I hope I am.

In an edition where killing units is so important, these just don't help with anything worthwhile. If they have other abilities or great stats, then maybe that will change, but I just don't see that happening.

Maybe it wouldn't look as bad if we didn't compare to what the space marines are getting, but i feel like they would still be lackluster

punisher357 wrote:
Yeah. I don't see the Terrain as being worth taking. I would love to be wrong and I hope I am.

In an edition where killing units is so important, these just don't help with anything worthwhile. If they have other abilities or great stats, then maybe that will change, but I just don't see that happening.

Maybe it wouldn't look as bad if we didn't compare to what the space marines are getting, but i feel like they would still be lackluster

It doesn't help that their leadership buff doesn't actually do much. For MSU, it does nothing, leadership 10 or 12 doesn't matter. 4 casualties +d6 = pass, either way.

For warrior blobs, it shifts the numbers a little but not enough. The change to morale attrition means the unit has to be killed to (unit size -1) regardless, if the opponent wants to be certain of the kill (and, currently, prevent RP).
I guess if you really want to take immortal or lychguard units of 7 without worrying about morale (as long as the stele is around), you can do that.

We get to see the new Necron paints in action this week...

Voss wrote:

punisher357 wrote:
Yeah. I don't see the Terrain as being worth taking. I would love to be wrong and I hope I am.

In an edition where killing units is so important, these just don't help with anything worthwhile. If they have other abilities or great stats, then maybe that will change, but I just don't see that happening.

Maybe it wouldn't look as bad if we didn't compare to what the space marines are getting, but i feel like they would still be lackluster

It doesn't help that their leadership buff doesn't actually do much. For MSU, it does nothing, leadership 10 or 12 doesn't matter. 4 casualties +d6 = pass, either way.

For warrior blobs, it shifts the numbers a little but not enough. The change to morale attrition means the unit has to be killed to (unit size -1) regardless, if the opponent wants to be certain of the kill (and, currently, prevent RP).
I guess if you really want to take immortal or lychguard units of 7 without worrying about morale (as long as the stele is around), you can do that.

Exactly! I don't know why GW keeps giving lame aura benefits like this or the anti-psyker one for Szeras. They act like it's a big bonus or something.

Meanwhile, Space Marines keep getting over-buffed. Honestly, if it keeps going this way, I wouldn't be surprised to see people refuse to play against them. Obviously I'm not talking tournaments.

So, I doubt these points will last very long (with an upcoming codex), but it seems like Necrons got off relatively easily.

I'll grant my perspective may be slightly warped by not having CA2019 (never got around to it, and then it didn't matter), but based on the codex and 2018.... Necrons often, even largely, went down in points.

Even stuff that looks bad like lychguard and destroyers actually aren't, because their weapons got zeroed out.

Immortals did get bumped up, but not by a huge amount.

Voss wrote:
So, I doubt these points will last very long (with an upcoming codex), but it seems like Necrons got off relatively easily.

I'll grant my perspective may be slightly warped by not having CA2019 (never got around to it, and then it didn't matter), but based on the codex and 2018.... Necrons often, even largely, went down in points.

Even stuff that looks bad like lychguard and destroyers actually aren't, because their weapons got zeroed out.

Immortals did get bumped up, but not by a huge amount.

The only real confusion inducing change from these was the Obelisk.. going up by 40.

I'm not sure why they think immortals are worth 18 ppm... that one is a bit baffling.

That being said, I doubt I'm even going to get in any games with these points values. The new dex is right around the corner and everything is likely to change.

Immortals going to 18 is the nearly-across-the-board 1 point increase plus a bit extra for MSU immortal spam and ignoring warriors for pretty much all 8th.

I'm not the least bit surprised by it (or particularly believe it will change anything).
5 Tesla immortals for 90 will still be the troops present in a lot of necron armies.

9th edition CODEX: NECRONS Indomitus Version 1.0 FAQ has been posted.

 Ghaz wrote:
9th edition CODEX: NECRONS Indomitus Version 1.0 FAQ has been posted.

Nothing earth shattering that I can see. They're basically just updating the wording of some abilities to match 9th ed terminology. Though they did seem to effectively make Monolith/Night Scythes transports. Not sure if that's new or not. I haven't followed 40k updates since I stopped playing in early 8th.

 EnTyme wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:
9th edition CODEX: NECRONS Indomitus Version 1.0 FAQ has been posted.

Nothing earth shattering that I can see. They're basically just updating the wording of some abilities to match 9th ed terminology. Though they did seem to effectively make Monolith/Night Scythes transports. Not sure if that's new or not. I haven't followed 40k updates since I stopped playing in early 8th.

Kinda, but they still don't let us disembark from tomb world in the first turn, so they still suck. The fact that Emergency Teleport specifies and normal rule doesn't means that this is intentional, which hurts me. They're deliberately making our transports suck.

Emergency Invasion beams now explicitly works in the first round regardless of other rules, that's a huge buff, for nightscythes and monoliths anyway.

With the new codex coming very soon, I wasn't expecting much more than fixes for rules that were broken by 9th edition.

 Grimgold wrote:
Emergency Invasion beams now explicitly works in the first round regardless of other rules, that's a huge buff, for nightscythes and monoliths anyway.

True, You can Deceiver a Night Scythe up in someone's face and hope they're not knowledgeable enough to ignore it. They kill it, out pops lychguard or skorpekhs (they're infantry lol). Or even just fly it up turn one and let them kill it.

 Ghaz wrote:
With the new codex coming very soon, I wasn't expecting much more than fixes for rules that were broken by 9th edition.

Agreed, I'd wager a new codex is likely going to be one of the next releases we see from GW.

Anybody who wants an indomitable box GW has e mailed to say they are doing them made to order for a limited time. I've already got mine and its 1/customer

If only they allowed enhanced invasion beams and emergency invasion beams to work together

Looks like tesla immortals may be getting nerfed. All the admech tesla type weapons were changed to only generate hits on unmodified rolls of a six

punisher357 wrote:
Looks like tesla immortals may be getting nerfed. All the admech tesla type weapons were changed to only generate hits on unmodified rolls of a six

They also nerfed the crap out of wraiths, who can no longer fall back and charge, which is what I was afraid of since the new destroyers seemed to be aimed at the same role.

Yeah, the unmodified rule on Plasma was a pretty large indicator that they were going that way.

Wraiths can charge through screens and terrain though, so while I still think it's a nerf overall, it isn't all downside.

Wraiths can also take Particle casters for free at the moment.

I'm going to need to dig through my bits box for those. I built mine basic.

This change seems to suggest our Tomb World deployment is now all upside?

“Q: Are units that are set up on their tomb world using the Invasion Beams and Eternity Gate abilities counted as Reinforcement units for the purpose of any mission rules ? A: Yes.“

If all sources of Invasion Beams are destroyed they can now still just walk onto the board—and if it’s useful, they can do all the flanking shenanigans instead of disembarking from the Nightscythes/Monolith.

With the possibility of outflank does that make flayed ones viable now?

sieGermans wrote:
This change seems to suggest our Tomb World deployment is now all upside?

“Q: Are units that are set up on their tomb world using the Invasion Beams and Eternity Gate abilities counted as Reinforcement units for the purpose of any mission rules ? A: Yes.“

If all sources of Invasion Beams are destroyed they can now still just walk onto the board—and if it’s useful, they can do all the flanking shenanigans instead of disembarking from the Nightscythes/Monolith.

Unfortunately I think the more specific rule takes effect, which says if all of your night scythes/monoliths are destroyed all units in tomb world deployment are considered to be slain. The above complicates things more than clears them up, for instance because units in TWD count as reserves do I have to pay CP to deploy things into TWD like I would other reserves? For RAW it seems like a yes, but other factions don't have to pay to put their units into transports so that's a downside. Also do units arriving from TWD activate abilities like auspex scan, and assuming you still have at least one nightscythe or monolith, can you just walk on the board without having to use an eternity gate or invasion beam?

This is one of my pet peeves of 8th and now early 9th, if GW spent 15 minutes actually thinking about TWD, they could write an update that clears the whole mess up, instead they keep firing off half baked solutions that complicate it. My hope is this half baked answer is because it's just a stop gap until we get a codex which drastically alters the rule.

Battle Ready painting tutorial for the Szarekhan Dynasty is up.




Hopefully they'll have an Advanced tutorial later in the week, because the results from the new Tesseract Glow paint is a bit disappointing in this video...