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 Grimtuff wrote:

Dai wrote:
"Pieces of gak"? How is this getting people so riled up??

So, to keep count- I've now been called (directly and indirectly) "a gatekeeping douche" and "an elitist piece of gak" (probably others too, but those I've reported). Yet the mods do nothing...

Untrue. Plus, please stay on topic — that’s Rule Number Two. Thanks!

 Jidmah wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Kithail wrote:

 Pyroalchi wrote:
On a more general "mechanics" point: I'm not really a fan of a bineric "10 points or non" and I have the impression I'm not alone with that.
An easy fix (that would also adress the "but I only have 1 model unpainted!" issue) would be something like:
"For every 10% of the armies models that is painted to battle ready standards, you receive 1 VP".
=> a fully painted army vs. a grey plastic horde would still be +10 VP for the first one
=> an almost complete army with only up to 10% unfinished modles would loose out only 1 VP. I think that should mostly be acceptable.

On an additional note I personally would also advocate for "Bases are considered battle ready if they are:
a) transparent
b) one clean color without paint spots (so the standard black, but at least take care that it doesn't look dirty
c) painted/textured etc.

Dude honestly I think you nailed it. I honestly think you did a /thread on this one. I agree you fixed the issue.

He literally Made the rule pretty much somewhat workable .

Impressive

Yeah, I can get behind that as well. I'd probably lose 1 VP on average to this instead of losing the game because I chose sleep over painting.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It's also funny how half the people with the holier-than-though attitude about their painted army are playing marines which are ridiculously easy and faster to paint compared to most other armies. You literally just have to prime them in the color of your choice, highlight weapons and shoulder pads and you are battle ready. And if that weren't enough, you also have half the model count of most other armies.

i do have to admit, that painting my CSM was certainly faster then my hordes of R&H, however, when even i a medicore lazy slug painting wise , manage to paint 50 + models in a weekend, it isn't as clear cut.
also i must have missed ccs temper tantrum it seems.
my issues with it stem from the wierd duality that painting should influence score, but score not painting aswell as the questionable line GW crossed into, with the fact what is painted battleready. Further, i feel like the complete binarity of the rule does itself a massive disservice, as allready pointd out, so the rule is not even well thought out...

I also call BS on the "everyone has 30 minutes to paint". It takes me 15 minutes to get ready for painting and another 15 minutes to store everything away, assuming my daughter doesn't decide to join the painting fun and adds another 15 minutes to get her ready as well. Unless I have at least one and a half hour of spare time, there is no sense in even trying to start to paint. On top of that, my eyes are fairly terrible, so at around 11 PM I simply have to stop painting because I can't see the fethin' miniature anymore because my eyes are tired.
The only reason I get to paint at all is because I put a once a week 3 hour blocker in my schedule that is reserved for nothing else. It still takes me five weeks to finish a miniature like Thrakka or an ork buggy.
Oh, and good luck getting any painting done at all if you are stuck at home with your kids because child care was locked down due to COVID-19 (luckily those times are over).

perfectly understandable, everyone paints diffrently at differing speeds to differing qualities.
I stopped long ago painting regularly preciscly because it felt like a chore, vice versa i bulk paint a huge ammount if i feel the need to.
That is incompatible with this rule kinda.

For my enjoyment of a game of 40K it's more important to see painted armies than to win. So I guess I'm okay with the rule.
If you don't like it, don't use it, just like with every rule in 40K. GW even encourages you to do so. But the people who like to stick to the letter and follow the rules as close as possible and argue about "one point over" (hilarious if you ask me) like to ignore the same pages of GW where it says talk to your opponent how you want to play. GW gives us a framework to start with, nothing more, nothing less.

Sgt. Cortez wrote:
For my enjoyment of a game of 40K it's more important to see painted armies than to win. So I guess I'm okay with the rule.
If you don't like it, don't use it, just like with every rule in 40K. GW even encourages you to do so. But the people who like to stick to the letter and follow the rules as close as possible and argue about "one point over" (hilarious if you ask me) like to ignore the same pages of GW where it says talk to your opponent how you want to play. GW gives us a framework to start with, nothing more, nothing less.

i mean, let's not kid ourselves, this will be very much a rule, that will only be enforced in certain communities and groups, and or when gak hit the fan.

I like battle ready models and I can not lie!
You other painters can’t deny!
When a playa walks in with a little bit a grey
No primer on that thing, You get sprung!

Wanna pull up tough ‘cause that one model
Ain’t got tufts.

On the base it’s standing.
I’m mad and I can’t stop staring.
Oh maybe, I wanna strip ya,
better paint than this pic’cha.

My clique they try to warn me
But that paint so thick
Makin’ me so thorny.

Oh, that’s not smooth skin
Say you didn’t thin that paint?
Well no gak, no doubt
Cause it looks like sponged on dookie

I’ve seen them playin’
Having fun with grey men
They move, they shoot
Sorry, I let a little toot.

I’m tired of old neckbeards,
Saying three colours is the thing!
Take an average gamer and ask bout that?
They don’t give no craps.

So gamers (yeah?) gamers (yeah?)
You got battle ready paint? (Uh... no)
Well shake that, (shake that), shake that,
(Shake that,) shake that contrast pot
Or give it up.

(Won the game
But lost on VP?)
Still beat their play!

I like em all paint-eed
Who don’t like these?
I gotta ask myself
Am I acting like an animal?
Now Here’s my sample.

I wanna play the game,
And roll - double that! Roll, roll!
Roll a bunch of dice
Cause artwork ain’t meant to be a toy!

On the table, they’re just game bits
So stop throwing all of those fits
Great Big Tree’s in trouble,
Mods, please don’t burst my bubble!

So I’m watching paint videos,
Knocking these a-holes painting like pros!
You can keep them a-woads,
I’ll keep in painting like I’m slow.

A word, to the working class heroes,
I wanna game with ya,
I won’t cheat or dis ya.

But I gotta be straight when I say
I ain’t gonna...
Give no pause to the thought of a
Game being decided by a
Colour on or not on a

Lot of simps won’t like this song,
Cause them ‘leetists like droning on and on,
But I’d rather just sit and play,

Cause I’m a Dad, and Hus-bond,
Just want to get my wargame on!

So painters (yeah) painters (yeah?)
Do you wanna get this game on? (Yeah!)
Then models down, roll it out,
I gotta give yo models a shout.

That paint looks SNAP!
That paint looks SNAP!

Yeah player,
When it domes to painting?
Basic bitch is my selection.
You spent how many hours on yourhighlighting?
I wouldn’t even if you paid me.

So you say you won a Daemon,
Painting till your brush was steaming?
That don’t matter, unless you game I’m leaving.

My gaming don’t want none unless you’ve got game, son!
(Sexist assumption, but it fits the rhyme...)

You can focus on your highlights,
But please let’s get a game on.

Some painters wanna play that hard goal,
And tell you your grey can’t roll,
So they deny ten, and grieve it.
So I speak up quick, let’s leave it.

So the game now takes your ten,
Well I don’t think that’s zen.
Cause your fun to play,
And the game is kicking,
Now I’m thinking bout sticking...

That rule somewhere the sun don’t shine
That might just be the thing.
Give me a game I can’t resist it,
Scored only by how we played gak.

Some neckbeards try to dis,
Cause paint’s at the top of their list,
They want a better game-score cause they paint ‘em,
But you see I just don’t get them.

So gamers if your paint ain’t sound,
But you still want to throw down?
Call (beep-boop-blank-re-dact) a-lot,
And kick them nasty combos.

Lose ten points is just whack!
Let’s go get a snack!

 Jidmah wrote:

 jhnbrg wrote:
This thread will soon be locked again i suspect.

People acting like the painting bonus will decide every game. There is nothing in the rules about toning down your list to be on the level with your opponent but that is still done to have an enjoyable game.

Noone is being locked out of the game or being forced to paint even a single miniature. Not having the latest meta hotness is a bigger handicap then missing the bonus.

10 VP will decide most games. You just chose to close your eyes to that because it happens to fit your agenda.

My agenda?

I just find it amusing that its perfectly fine to tell people to "learn to play" or that their listbuilding sucks or to go out and buy better miniatures. That is also gatekeeping in that case. Not to mention how useless and virtue signaling you are if you use power level in a game.

I think people need to calm down a bit. I am still convinced that listbuilding and power combos will win you more games than having a battle ready army.

Speaking of battle ready, i wonder if having the correct base will be a requirment for that?

 jhnbrg wrote:
I just find it amusing that its perfectly fine to tell people to "learn to play" or that their listbuilding sucks or to go out and buy better miniatures. That is also gatekeeping in that case. Not to mention how useless and virtue signaling you are if you use power level in a game.

It's never fine to reduce someones enjoyment of their hobby for any reason. The people you are describing are in no way acceptable.
On top of that It's also a false analogy, as bad list building does not prevent you from enjoying painting. Slow painting, however, now prevents you from enjoying gaming.

I think people need to calm down a bit. I am still convinced that listbuilding and power combos will win you more games than having a battle ready army.

I gave you quite a few example of what you have to do to score 10 VP. This will very much make as much difference as bringing a top tier list compared to just bringing a coherent army out of models you happen to own.

 greatbigtree wrote:

Spoiler:

I like battle ready models and I can not lie!
You other painters can’t deny!
When a playa walks in with a little bit a grey
No primer on that thing, You get sprung!

Wanna pull up tough ‘cause that one model
Ain’t got tufts.

On the base it’s standing.
I’m mad and I can’t stop staring.
Oh maybe, I wanna strip ya,
better paint than this pic’cha.

My clique they try to warn me
But that paint so thick
Makin’ me so thorny.

Oh, that’s not smooth skin
Say you didn’t thin that paint?
Well no gak, no doubt
Cause it looks like sponged on dookie

I’ve seen them playin’
Having fun with grey men
They move, they shoot
Sorry, I let a little toot.

I’m tired of old neckbeards,
Saying three colours is the thing!
Take an average gamer and ask bout that?
They don’t give no craps.

So gamers (yeah?) gamers (yeah?)
You got battle ready paint? (Uh... no)
Well shake that, (shake that), shake that,
(Shake that,) shake that contrast pot
Or give it up.

(Won the game
But lost on VP?)
Still beat their play!

I like em all paint-eed
Who don’t like these?
I gotta ask myself
Am I acting like an animal?
Now Here’s my sample.

I wanna play the game,
And roll - double that! Roll, roll!
Roll a bunch of dice
Cause artwork ain’t meant to be a toy!

On the table, they’re just game bits
So stop throwing all of those fits
Great Big Tree’s in trouble,
Mods, please don’t burst my bubble!

So I’m watching paint videos,
Knocking these a-holes painting like pros!
You can keep them a-woads,
I’ll keep in painting like I’m slow.

A word, to the working class heroes,
I wanna game with ya,
I won’t cheat or dis ya.

But I gotta be straight when I say
I ain’t gonna...
Give no pause to the thought of a
Game being decided by a
Colour on or not on a

Lot of simps won’t like this song,
Cause them ‘leetists like droning on and on,
But I’d rather just sit and play,

Cause I’m a Dad, and Hus-bond,
Just want to get my wargame on!

So painters (yeah) painters (yeah?)
Do you wanna get this game on? (Yeah!)
Then models down, roll it out,
I gotta give yo models a shout.

That paint looks SNAP!
That paint looks SNAP!

Yeah player,
When it domes to painting?
Basic bitch is my selection.
You spent how many hours on yourhighlighting?
I wouldn’t even if you paid me.

So you say you won a Daemon,
Painting till your brush was steaming?
That don’t matter, unless you game I’m leaving.

My gaming don’t want none unless you’ve got game, son!
(Sexist assumption, but it fits the rhyme...)

You can focus on your highlights,
But please let’s get a game on.

Some painters wanna play that hard goal,
And tell you your grey can’t roll,
So they deny ten, and grieve it.
So I speak up quick, let’s leave it.

So the game now takes your ten,
Well I don’t think that’s zen.
Cause your fun to play,
And the game is kicking,
Now I’m thinking bout sticking...

That rule somewhere the sun don’t shine
That might just be the thing.
Give me a game I can’t resist it,
Scored only by how we played gak.

Some neckbeards try to dis,
Cause paint’s at the top of their list,
They want a better game-score cause they paint ‘em,
But you see I just don’t get them.

So gamers if your paint ain’t sound,
But you still want to throw down?
Call (beep-boop-blank-re-dact) a-lot,
And kick them nasty combos.

Lose ten points is just whack!
Let’s go get a snack!

i appreciate the effort, but spoilers, please!

 Jidmah wrote:
Slow painting, however, now prevents you from enjoying gaming.

How does exactly a tiny Vp bonus, totally irrelevant in 90% of cases and also doubly irrelevant when the result of he battle is of no consequence whatsoever constitute "preventing someone from enjoying the game" ?

Do you spent the entire 2 or 3 hours of such a game feeling miserable because at the end of it your opponent will get some ilusory points that will affect nothing ?

10 VP is not tiny. You have to hold an objective for two turns, destroy 5 dreadnoughts, land speeders, ork buggies, daemon princes, three LRBT or a knight to gain the same amount of points.

Do you want to tell me that holding an objective for two additional turns is not deciding games?

You get more points from painting than you do if you select and complete Slay the Warlord. At 10% of your total available points and worth more than some Secondaries, the painting VP is NOT a "bonus" and definitely not "tiny".

 Jidmah wrote:
10 VP is not tiny. You have to hold an objective for two turns, destroy 5 dreadnoughts, land speeders, ork buggies, daemon princes, three LRBT or a knight to gain the same amount of points.

Do you want to tell me that holding an objective for two additional turns is not deciding games?

So thats how much GW values painting i guess, if winning is the only way people can enjoy 40k, painting has become more important.

I still think people are over reacting. Painting and modelling has always been important aspects in miniature wargaming.

As a sidenote, it looks like you need painted minitarues to claim the wobbly model rule too...

 jhnbrg wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
10 VP is not tiny. You have to hold an objective for two turns, destroy 5 dreadnoughts, land speeders, ork buggies, daemon princes, three LRBT or a knight to gain the same amount of points.

Do you want to tell me that holding an objective for two additional turns is not deciding games?

So thats how much GW values painting i guess, if winning is the only way people can enjoy 40k, painting has become more important.

I still think people are over reacting. Painting and modelling has always been important aspects in miniature wargaming.

As a sidenote, it looks like you need painted minitarues to claim the wobbly model rule too...

So where are my bonus points for this lovingly converted and daemonengified Basilisk i have for my R&H army?


I thought modeling was important.

See that is my issue.
It's a badly thought out rule and extremely arbitrary...

Oh lawd, we're back to the needless pedantry again are we?

Dakka and needless pedantry. Name a more iconic duo.

 Grimtuff wrote:
Oh lawd, we're back to the needless pedantry again are we?

Dakka and needless pedantry. Name a more iconic duo.

excactly how was that pedantry or semantics?

Not only lacks the rule ovbious granularity, or enters terrain it shouldn't it also is extremely arbitrary by what counts and what not.

 Grimtuff wrote:
Oh lawd, we're back to the needless pedantry again are we?

Dakka and needless pedantry. Name a more iconic duo.

We need pedantry when people like you are in favor of a rule that heavily punishes people despite them making an honest effort to get their miniatures painted.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 jhnbrg wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
10 VP is not tiny. You have to hold an objective for two turns, destroy 5 dreadnoughts, land speeders, ork buggies, daemon princes, three LRBT or a knight to gain the same amount of points.

Do you want to tell me that holding an objective for two additional turns is not deciding games?

So thats how much GW values painting i guess, if winning is the only way people can enjoy 40k, painting has become more important.

I still think people are over reacting. Painting and modelling has always been important aspects in miniature wargaming.

As a sidenote, it looks like you need painted minitarues to claim the wobbly model rule too...

So where are my bonus points for this lovingly converted and daemonengified Basilisk i have for my R&H army?

Spoiler:

I thought modeling was important.

See that is my issue.
It's a badly thought out rule and extremely arbitrary...

Bonus points for conversions could be fun, not sure what you are after.

 jhnbrg wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

 jhnbrg wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
10 VP is not tiny. You have to hold an objective for two turns, destroy 5 dreadnoughts, land speeders, ork buggies, daemon princes, three LRBT or a knight to gain the same amount of points.

Do you want to tell me that holding an objective for two additional turns is not deciding games?

So thats how much GW values painting i guess, if winning is the only way people can enjoy 40k, painting has become more important.

I still think people are over reacting. Painting and modelling has always been important aspects in miniature wargaming.

As a sidenote, it looks like you need painted minitarues to claim the wobbly model rule too...

So where are my bonus points for this lovingly converted and daemonengified Basilisk i have for my R&H army?

Spoiler:

I thought modeling was important.

See that is my issue.
It's a badly thought out rule and extremely arbitrary...

Bonus points for conversions could be fun, not sure what you are after.

two things really:
First: This thing due to base, is not GW battleready TM.
Secondly: Even though i probably invested more time into building it that many great painters took to paint their minis i'd get nothing whilest they'd get the pts, regardless of effort actually put in. Which exemplifies the issue further that it goes into territorry that is extremely subjective.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 jhnbrg wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

 jhnbrg wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
10 VP is not tiny. You have to hold an objective for two turns, destroy 5 dreadnoughts, land speeders, ork buggies, daemon princes, three LRBT or a knight to gain the same amount of points.

Do you want to tell me that holding an objective for two additional turns is not deciding games?

So thats how much GW values painting i guess, if winning is the only way people can enjoy 40k, painting has become more important.

I still think people are over reacting. Painting and modelling has always been important aspects in miniature wargaming.

As a sidenote, it looks like you need painted minitarues to claim the wobbly model rule too...

So where are my bonus points for this lovingly converted and daemonengified Basilisk i have for my R&H army?

Spoiler:

I thought modeling was important.

See that is my issue.
It's a badly thought out rule and extremely arbitrary...

Bonus points for conversions could be fun, not sure what you are after.

two things really:
First: This thing due to base, is not GW battleready TM.
Secondly: Even though i probably invested more time into building it that many great painters took to paint their minis i'd get nothing whilest they'd get the pts, regardless of effort actually put in. Which exemplifies the issue further that it goes into territorry that is extremely subjective.

But the rule is not subjective, its not a painting contest. Regarding the base, i suspect that a simple coat of paint would be enough.

Every new edition forces changes but the amount of buthurt is getting silly.

But the rule is not subjective, its not a painting contest. Regarding the base, i suspect that a simple coat of paint would be enough.

so you are fine with this arbitrary ruleset? That randomly rewards some for the "hobby spectacle" whilest other, equally important parts of the hobby e.g. modelling doesn't?

And i sure as hell am not going to base this so feth me i guess for not wanting to be 2 full secondaries behind my opponent from the get go?

The rule is absolutely subjective as it doesn't generically say "painted", but "battle ready". The image of the "battle ready" SM posted by GW is also way above the tipycal level of full painted armies at tournaments, where many of them are just painted in 3 colors.

Full painted armies could easily be not "battle ready" at this point, and no one but a TO has the autority to say what counts as "battle ready" and what doesn't. In a pick up game between people that don't know each other it could be a problem.

Not Online!!! wrote:

But the rule is not subjective, its not a painting contest. Regarding the base, i suspect that a simple coat of paint would be enough.

so you are fine with this arbitrary ruleset? That randomly rewards some for the "hobby spectacle" whilest other, equally important parts of the hobby e.g. modelling doesn't?

And i sure as hell am not going to base this so feth me i guess for not wanting to be 2 full secondaries behind my opponent from the get go?

Why won't you base it? Do they not have sand in Switzerland? It is you that is making a conscious decision to not finish the mini (FWIW, I think a plain black base is fine as an artistic choice. I don't care for it, but it is a "finished" mini. See literally every Rackham model for example.) yet you're railing against it when it is quite obvious what needs to be done to get the "reward" so to speak.

 Grimtuff wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

But the rule is not subjective, its not a painting contest. Regarding the base, i suspect that a simple coat of paint would be enough.

so you are fine with this arbitrary ruleset? That randomly rewards some for the "hobby spectacle" whilest other, equally important parts of the hobby e.g. modelling doesn't?

And i sure as hell am not going to base this so feth me i guess for not wanting to be 2 full secondaries behind my opponent from the get go?

Why won't you base it? Do they not have sand in Switzerland? It is you that is making a conscious decision to not finish the mini (FWIW, I think a plain black base is fine as an artistic choice. I don't care for it, but it is a "finished" mini. See literally every Rackham model for example.) yet you're railing against it when it is quite obvious what needs to be done to get the "reward" so to speak.

Not a reward if the max pts are only achievable with battleready TM army.
I allready gave reason as to why i don't do it respectively rarely, you not reading or understanding that point doesn't invalidate it and shows a basic lack of curtesy.
statements that add 0 to your overall argument. see underlined part.
Even you agree that a black base is ok, then why should i do so even in your arguments logic? I prefer for most of my Minis a black bases, it's my artistic choice, yet that now influences how i play, respectively the score and is not fine by GW standards?

Mate, you're the one that is expressing concern over it despite myself and numerous other people ITT telling you a plain black base is fine. If you think it isn't then you know what you have to do. It's not difficult.

TBH my issue isn't with the rule, it's that GW have codified discrimination into the rules themselves. Whereas before, when it was a house rule, it was on the players/organisers to be donkey-caves, now it's GW sanctioned "Oh, you have a disability that makes it hard for you to paint? You lose!"

Yes, you could just "house rule" it away for that player, but that is just patronising.

I thought Warhammer was for everyone? I guess not.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
TBH my issue isn't with the rule, it's that GW have codified discrimination into the rules themselves. Whereas before, when it was a house rule, it was on the players/organisers to be donkey-caves, now it's GW sanctioned "Oh, you have a disability that makes it hard for you to paint? You lose!"

Yes, you could just "house rule" it away for that player, but that is just patronising.

I thought Warhammer was for everyone? I guess not.

It's a game rule. It's not any more or less discriminating against people that cannot paint than a rule that requires you to add/substract modifiers from a dice roll is discriminating towards people with dyscalculia / acalculia.

If paining rules are removed due to possible discrimination, so should all rules involving numbers, figures and mathematical operators.

Sunny Side Up wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
TBH my issue isn't with the rule, it's that GW have codified discrimination into the rules themselves. Whereas before, when it was a house rule, it was on the players/organisers to be donkey-caves, now it's GW sanctioned "Oh, you have a disability that makes it hard for you to paint? You lose!"

Yes, you could just "house rule" it away for that player, but that is just patronising.

I thought Warhammer was for everyone? I guess not.

It's a game rule. It's not any more or less discriminating against people that cannot paint than a rule that requires you to add/substract modifiers from a dice roll is discriminating towards people with dyscalculia.

The game portion should be isolated from the hobby portion. If you want to play with a base that has only marine legs glued to it, you shouldn't be penalised as a function of the game rules. Imagine if you were playing Chess and you got a time penalty for not bringing in your own hand carved and painted set.

Against a beginner obviously no, but otherwise yes.

And I'll most likely loose this 10VP myself more often than not, so I don't feel being a prick by doing so.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
TBH my issue isn't with the rule, it's that GW have codified discrimination into the rules themselves. Whereas before, when it was a house rule, it was on the players/organisers to be donkey-caves, now it's GW sanctioned "Oh, you have a disability that makes it hard for you to paint? You lose!"

Yes, you could just "house rule" it away for that player, but that is just patronising.

I thought Warhammer was for everyone? I guess not.

I can hear that one disagrees with any rule, but I'm really not on board the discrmination part.
Having a disability that prevent you to paint most likely prevent you to play (without help at least) and to practice countless other hobbies, you can absolutely not call this discrimination which is a conscious choice to restrict access to a percieved group of people.
Are the high prices discriminating against poors ?
Is the lot of reading necessary discriminating against thoose with a reading disability ?
Is being a physical vs game discriminating to people with social disabilities ?
Are some space marines chapters colour schemes discriminating to people with good taste ?
I mean, I could go on and on.

I know you're an absolutely RAW kind of guy, and I'll never blame you for that (love your threads BTW) but I think we can all agree that enforcing such a rule against someone with a disability is just being an horrible person.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
The game portion should be isolated from the hobby portion. If you want to play with a base that has only marine legs glued to it, you shouldn't be penalised as a function of the game rules. Imagine if you were playing Chess and you got a time penalty for not bringing in your own hand carved and painted set.

No. It shouldn't.

Building, Painting, Lore and Gaming are clearly and openly advertised as a whole. Participating in it requires you to partake in all of them. If you don't like that, you can always play chess.

Triathlons don't need to skip the swimming section just because other sports don't include swimming.

Sunny Side Up wrote:

No. It shouldn't.

Building, Painting, Lore and Gaming are clearly and openly advertised as a whole.

If all of these are supposed to be equally important even in game, then why is painting not codified into the rules but lore isn't?

If anything, the indication seems to be that lore is utterly irrelevant. It's not even worth a measly 1VP.