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 Duskweaver wrote:
I'd expect a SM to weigh somewhere in the region of 500kg naked

Wat?
Seems a lot!

 Duskweaver wrote:
Sororitas power armour is noted as being more lightweight than the Astartes version, and it is obviously much less bulky, but even so 80kg seems far too light. Like SM, Sisters who lose power to their armour find it very difficult and exhausting to move in it.

It seems exhausting to walk around with more than your own weight on yourself, especially when you have to push the servos yourself to make the armor move rather than just carry it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

A.T. wrote:
That suggests to me it must weigh 200kg or so at least.

The FFG books puts power armour at 180kg for marines, 35kg for sisters

 Insectum7 wrote:
And how many tons of marine can a Rhino carry? It should be faster without it's cargo

Thats not really how torque works.

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
And how many tons of marine can a Rhino carry? It should be faster without it's cargo

Thats not really how torque works.

Pretty sure you can slow a vehicle down by adding weight to it. Mass being a part of those equations.

 Mistresspaige wrote:
Hi guys forgive my ignorance on the lore but I’ve looked up Sisters of battle and from my understanding they’re supposed to be the equivalent of female space marines correct? Curious how do they compare? Are they biologically enhanced like the space marines are? Do they have power armour? How do they work exactly?

The Sisters of Battle have the same equipment as Space Marines.

They are also near-on-par with Space Marines in training, but are not genetically engineered. They'll get you far enough mechanically, for all intents are purposes. Some of the Sisters units are also canonically used to hunt rogue space marines, and supposedly very successfully.


That said, I wouldn't call them the female equivalent of Space Marines. They're TO&E is pretty much identical, and they're elite units, but they're role and character are very different. Even the orders militant do way more suppression and show-the-flag operations to keep the populace in check, and their purpose for existing is to give the church and ordo hereticus a very well equipped and trained good squad of enforcers to get their way.

The Space Marines are elite self-contained expeditionary and rapid-response task forces.
The Sisters of Battle are elite political troops and enforcers for the church.

 Insectum7 wrote:

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
And how many tons of marine can a Rhino carry? It should be faster without it's cargo

Thats not really how torque works.

Pretty sure you can slow a vehicle down by adding weight to it. Mass being a part of those equations.

Only if it's a low torque engine. A high torque one may slow a bit but won't really. I'd suspect a machine designed to carry said weight will be very torque-y.

Lookit the M1 Abrams. Powered by a Honeywell AGT1500 with ~4000 ft/lbs of torque. The M1A had a cross country speed of 48kph while weighing 57t. The M1A2 weighs in at 66t, 10 tons more, but can still do 40kph. Slower while heavier yes, but the lighter one is not a drag racer by any stretch of the imagination.

An empty Rhino won't be much faster than a full one.

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
And how many tons of marine can a Rhino carry? It should be faster without it's cargo

Thats not really how torque works.

Pretty sure you can slow a vehicle down by adding weight to it. Mass being a part of those equations.

Only if it's a low torque engine. A high torque one may slow a bit but won't really. I'd suspect a machine designed to carry said weight will be very torque-y.

Lookit the M1 Abrams. Powered by a Honeywell AGT1500 with ~4000 ft/lbs of torque. The M1A had a cross country speed of 48kph while weighing 57t. The M1A2 weighs in at 66t, 10 tons more, but can still do 40kph. Slower while heavier yes, but the lighter one is not a drag racer by any stretch of the imagination.

An empty Rhino won't be much faster than a full one.

Also, a Rhino's weight is mostly in the Rhino, not the Marines onboard. And, of course, unless it's engine governors are removed they are keeping it's speed back in both cases.

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
And how many tons of marine can a Rhino carry? It should be faster without it's cargo

Thats not really how torque works.

Pretty sure you can slow a vehicle down by adding weight to it. Mass being a part of those equations.

Only if it's a low torque engine. A high torque one may slow a bit but won't really. I'd suspect a machine designed to carry said weight will be very torque-y.

Lookit the M1 Abrams. Powered by a Honeywell AGT1500 with ~4000 ft/lbs of torque. The M1A had a cross country speed of 48kph while weighing 57t. The M1A2 weighs in at 66t, 10 tons more, but can still do 40kph. Slower while heavier yes, but the lighter one is not a drag racer by any stretch of the imagination.

An empty Rhino won't be much faster than a full one.

You just made my point, man. A 20% increase in speed is a 20% increase in speed.

Not sure we know how heavy a Rhino is. I think the quoted weights are generally not great to begin with. Iirc the Land Raider is supposed to be 70 something. But some of the numbers in the thread seem nuts. 500kg marine plus near 200kg for armor, add some more for kit and you have a full squad weighing 7-8 tons. If a Rhino is 30 tons that's a 25% increase in weight when a squad mounts up, which looks like a significant decrease in speed by your Abrams example.

An M113 (Rhino for rl people) is 13ish tons, for reference.

Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:The Space Marines are elite self-contained expeditionary and rapid-response task forces.
The Sisters of Battle are elite political troops and enforcers for the church.

I like that description.

 Insectum7 wrote:
a Rhino is 30 tons that's a 25% increase in weight when a squad mounts up, which looks like a significant decrease in speed by your Abrams example.

An M113 (Rhino for rl people) is 13ish tons, for reference.

A 20% increase from 40khp to 48kph isn't very much.

Even a Bugatti Vayeron on 400kph a 20% increase isn't blisteringly faster. You can get a better increase by painting it red.

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
a Rhino is 30 tons that's a 25% increase in weight when a squad mounts up, which looks like a significant decrease in speed by your Abrams example.

An M113 (Rhino for rl people) is 13ish tons, for reference.

A 20% increase from 40khp to 48kph isn't very much.

Even a Bugatti Vayeron on 400kph a 20% increase isn't blisteringly faster. You can get a better increase by painting it red.

If that's an Ork joke the last I recall Red Paint Job added an extra inch to a 12" move, for a mere 8ish %.

 Insectum7 wrote:

Kayback wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
a Rhino is 30 tons that's a 25% increase in weight when a squad mounts up, which looks like a significant decrease in speed by your Abrams example.

An M113 (Rhino for rl people) is 13ish tons, for reference.

A 20% increase from 40khp to 48kph isn't very much.

Even a Bugatti Vayeron on 400kph a 20% increase isn't blisteringly faster. You can get a better increase by painting it red.

If that's an Ork joke the last I recall Red Paint Job added an extra inch to a 12" move, for a mere 8ish %.

So explain this year's Ferrari F1 car to me...

^You'll have to enlighten me, as I have no knowledge base around F1 racing. I'll look at links if you post 'em though.

Can someone settle a debate for me? SoS are to SoB what Custodes are to Astartes. That was my understanding but I seem to be wrong. Obviously we have to go to the wildly inaccurate fluff on this, but if the SoB are supposed to be the best of human training and genetics, then the SoB have to be a step higher right? They do things that even the Cannonesses can't do. Aleya takes down hordes of daemon invasions with just her flamer in Watchers of the Throne. In the SoB books cannonesses and entire companies of sisters get taken to town by a single daemon invasion. I understand this is arguing who's better Krillin or Ten Shin Han, but the lore is pretty clear, the SoS are the pinacle of base human females. The pincale of male base humans have to be Catachans.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Can someone settle a debate for me? SoS are to SoB what Custodes are to Astartes. That was my understanding but I seem to be wrong. Obviously we have to go to the wildly inaccurate fluff on this, but if the SoB are supposed to be the best of human training and genetics, then the SoB have to be a step higher right?

Sisters of Silence are pariahs - psychic nulls, that is all that matters as far as there genetics go. They are anathema to daemons and psykers but a regular power armoured sister would likely kick the stuffing out of them (SoS have very high quality carapace style armour, not powered armour, and are highly specialised).

Sisters are selected from the top candidates of the schola progenium, before the administratum, guard, etc get their pick (because it is an Ecclesiarchy run organisation), and then they are trained based on the sisterhoods traditions. Strictly speaking they are not better in that sense than the candidates taken for the tempestus (who do get enhancements and more focussed training/brainwashing, and are not eliminated from contention due to gender or less than absolute faith).

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Can someone settle a debate for me? SoS are to SoB what Custodes are to Astartes. That was my understanding but I seem to be wrong. Obviously we have to go to the wildly inaccurate fluff on this, but if the SoB are supposed to be the best of human training and genetics, then the SoB have to be a step higher right? They do things that even the Cannonesses can't do. Aleya takes down hordes of daemon invasions with just her flamer in Watchers of the Throne. In the SoB books cannonesses and entire companies of sisters get taken to town by a single daemon invasion. I understand this is arguing who's better Krillin or Ten Shin Han, but the lore is pretty clear, the SoS are the pinacle of base human females. The pincale of male base humans have to be Catachans.

First of all, they are unrelated organizations that both just happen to have the word “sister” in their names.

Second, the SOS are all blanks, pariahs, anti-psykers, whatever you want to call it. I don’t know if the latest fluff gives them any more spice, but their inherent powers already make them formidable against daemons.

Third, the SoS were founded by the Emperor, and have the kind of institutional support you’d expect from that backing. So yeah, at least their gear would fit your metric of SoS:SoB::Custodes:Astartes.

Fourth, Krillin is better than Tian Shin Han. How is that even a debate?

 Insectum7 wrote:
^You'll have to enlighten me, as I have no knowledge base around F1 racing. I'll look at links if you post 'em though.

Not much to tell really- they're always red, this year's is slow, last year's was fast... Not much of a joke when you explain it

So from several of the (Admittedly terrible books) lore bits, in Cadian Honour is has a troop of extremely well trained and equipped Sisters of the Rose (?) getting taken down by a horde of basicly starving peasants. Granted they gave a good fight, but no Astartes force would ever lose in a pitched battle against a rabble of drugged up cultists with knives and lasguns.

How is krillian/TSH a debate? Look at the thread topic man. Are SoB equal to Astartes? That's how it's a debate. Who would win in an arm wrestling contest, Gaz or a malnurished guardsman with no arms?

There are silly questions, but this thread takes the cake. Also, 4 SoS took down a squad of enraged Minotaur Primaris. They aren't just pariahs. They are easily the best trained female human warriors in the galaxy. No armor, just weapons, a SoS would not even break a sweat wiping the floor with a SoB. It's that far.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Granted they gave a good fight, but no Astartes force would ever lose in a pitched battle against a rabble of drugged up cultists with knives and lasguns.

Someone loved to quote a story where they did around here.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So from several of the (Admittedly terrible books) lore bits, in Cadian Honour is has a troop of extremely well trained and equipped Sisters of the Rose (?) getting taken down by a horde of basicly starving peasants. Granted they gave a good fight, but no Astartes force would ever lose in a pitched battle against a rabble of drugged up cultists with knives and lasguns.

I hate to have to do this, but:

Picture it, 2005. Ben Counter writes the definitive book on Grey Knights, the most elite space marines there ever were and would ever be, so far as we know. Real badasses. Every one of them worth a score of normal space marines.

Ben’s written himself into a corner. The Grey Knights are on a primitive feudal world, and there needs to be an action scene. Well, it’ll be a slaughter. But that’s boring. How does Ben add some stakes to this fight? Simple. A rabble or spear wielding peasants can now kill a Grey Knight Terminator...with spears. No, no, not magic spears or power spears. Just crap spears.

And there you have it. The best space marines of the best chapter are just as pathetic as Sisters or Battle.

A.T. wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Can someone settle a debate for me? SoS are to SoB what Custodes are to Astartes. That was my understanding but I seem to be wrong. Obviously we have to go to the wildly inaccurate fluff on this, but if the SoB are supposed to be the best of human training and genetics, then the SoB have to be a step higher right?

Sisters of Silence are pariahs - psychic nulls, that is all that matters as far as there genetics go. They are anathema to daemons and psykers but a regular power armoured sister would likely kick the stuffing out of them (SoS have very high quality carapace style armour, not powered armour, and are highly specialised).

Sisters are selected from the top candidates of the schola progenium, before the administratum, guard, etc get their pick (because it is an Ecclesiarchy run organisation), and then they are trained based on the sisterhoods traditions. Strictly speaking they are not better in that sense than the candidates taken for the tempestus (who do get enhancements and more focussed training/brainwashing, and are not eliminated from contention due to gender or less than absolute faith).

Not quite. A few things. Unless they’ve updated lore on the Schola Progenium with the new sister’s codex to contradict the Militarum Tempestus codex, female Progena that show both fine military skills and physical aptitude, as well as strong faith are sent off the the Adepta Sororitas convents. However, “the most talented warriors are chosen for the Militarum Tempestus and Officio Prefectus.” Scions don’t get “physical” enhancements beyond grueling training and they are psychologically girded and indoctrinated to persevere against fear of mortality and to fulfill missions.

Vratine Armor worn by the Sisters of Silence is a “powered armor,” however—its not environmentally sealed by default and it’s made for shorter operations, unlike Astartes and Sororitas power armor. It’s more similar to Ignatus in utility than something made for long campaigns.

In the only story that I know in which Sisters of Battle and Tempestus Scions do engage in battle together (‘Tempestus’) they do appear quite comprable in skill.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So from several of the (Admittedly terrible books) lore bits, in Cadian Honour is has a troop of extremely well trained and equipped Sisters of the Rose (?) getting taken down by a horde of basicly starving peasants. Granted they gave a good fight, but no Astartes force would ever lose in a pitched battle against a rabble of drugged up cultists with knives and lasguns.

How is krillian/TSH a debate? Look at the thread topic man. Are SoB equal to Astartes? That's how it's a debate. Who would win in an arm wrestling contest, Gaz or a malnurished guardsman with no arms?

There are silly questions, but this thread takes the cake. Also, 4 SoS took down a squad of enraged Minotaur Primaris. They aren't just pariahs. They are easily the best trained female human warriors in the galaxy. No armor, just weapons, a SoS would not even break a sweat wiping the floor with a SoB. It's that far.

There's also a short story where a squad of sisters purge a labyrinth of GSC with a lone Space Wolf they meet on the way who's entire squad was killed in their attempt. Writers are going to write battles that fit the narrative they are building, not answer lore questions.

Sisters are one of the few factions that have gone toe to toe with Adeptus Custodes to the point of conversation, and while that was living saint level of effort. The rank and file were effective enough against Space Marines and allies to tie things up enough for big E to get involved personally.

The SoB did not go "toe to toe" with the Custodes, that is at best a terrible reading of the text. The Custodes were slaughtering the Sisters, and they decided to end it and show what's her name to the emperor. The SoB do not compare to the Custodes in any respect. Fluff or table top. I assume you are referring to the Reign of Blood, in which the sisters were backed up by full military battalions, and the officio assasinorium.

While we are on the topic, Those are likely the pinacle of base human evolution. The assassins. They routinely take down major targets, without power armor, faith, or excluding the pariah one, unholy warp stuff. Just pure insane skill.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
The SoB did not go "toe to toe" with the Custodes, that is at best a terrible reading of the text. The Custodes were slaughtering the Sisters, and they decided to end it and show what's her name to the emperor. The SoB do not compare to the Custodes in any respect. Fluff or table top. I assume you are referring to the Reign of Blood, in which the sisters were backed up by full military battalions, and the officio assasinorium.

While we are on the topic, Those are likely the pinacle of base human evolution. The assassins. They routinely take down major targets, without power armor, faith, or excluding the pariah one, unholy warp stuff. Just pure insane skill.

It does make you sit back and think a bit. If the Space Marines are heralded as the ultimate specimens of Humanity, and then you have the Assassins which can handle marines routinely...

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
The SoB did not go "toe to toe" with the Custodes, that is at best a terrible reading of the text. The Custodes were slaughtering the Sisters, and they decided to end it and show what's her name to the emperor.

Wat?

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I assume you are referring to the Reign of Blood, in which the sisters were backed up by full military battalions, and the officio assasinorium.

WAT?

Where do you get all that info that contradicts everything I ever read about Vandire's demise? I've never read about any fighting between Brides of the Emperor (that was their name back then) and Custodes, and I have never read about the Brides being backed by assassins, during the siege of Terra.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
While we are on the topic, Those are likely the pinacle of base human evolution. The assassins. They routinely take down major targets, without power armor, faith, or excluding the pariah one, unholy warp stuff. Just pure insane skill.

The Eversor are so much pumped up with combat drugs and stuff that they literally explode when killed. It's part of the reason why they are kept in stasis between deployment, their metabolism is unsustainable. The Callidus can morph into looking like an Ork. The Culexus is an extremely powerful blank.
None of those are "unaugmented humans running on pure skill". They all have skills AND augmentation. The Officio Assassinorum have 0 qualms about augmentation if that makes their agent more effective, so I really bet the Vindicare get the same kind of treatment.

The Officio Assassinorum have extensive physical, genetic, and psychological alterations. They are hardly ‘human’ in the conventional sense. Sorta like the Astartes are transhuman.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
The SoB did not go "toe to toe" with the Custodes, that is at best a terrible reading of the text. The Custodes were slaughtering the Sisters, and they decided to end it and show what's her name to the emperor

The custodes and sisters didn't fire a single shot at one another. In fact it is explicitly stated that when the Custodes did intervene their leader put down his weapons, spoke peacefully with the sisters for an hour and then left his own men as hostages before personally guided Dominica and five others (later founders of the various orders) to the Emperor.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I assume you are referring to the Reign of Blood, in which the sisters were backed up by full military battalions, and the officio assasinorium.

The sisters fought the space marine, tech guard, and the rest of Thors forces. The sisters lost 60% of their number holding the fortress, the attackers losses were unspecified.
The frateris templars may or may not have been involved in Vandires defense - they were never mentioned as present in the battle (the sisters were his personal guard after all).
While Vandire did use assassins (via his position as a High Lord) to gain power, none were mentioned present at the siege.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So from several of the (Admittedly terrible books) lore bits, in Cadian Honour is has a troop of extremely well trained and equipped Sisters of the Rose (?) getting taken down by a horde of basicly starving peasants. Granted they gave a good fight, but no Astartes force would ever lose in a pitched battle against a rabble of drugged up cultists with knives and lasguns

Alaric checked the runes projected by his autosenses back onto his retina. Dvorn's rune was flickering, he must be injured. "Any men lost?" Alaric voxed.
"Caanos is dead," said Santoro simply. "Mykros is carrying him."
- The Grey Knights Omnibus, pg. 110
Killed not by peasants with laser guns, but by medieval warriors with swords and spears.

Not to suggest that some authors have ... interesting interpretations of the lore at times. Backflipping terminators, multilaser tactical marines, razorback surfing, falcon surfing, SoS beating on primaris, that time the tau conquered a hive city with a tiny force using the cunning tactic of 'sit get shelled until the enemy tires', that time the sisters homeworld was conquered by a daemon, the primarch Rubinek and the Iron Hearts...

 Apple Peel wrote:
Scions don’t get “physical” enhancements beyond grueling training / Vratine Armor worn by the Sisters of Silence is a “powered armor,”

I think there is a degree of retcon going on with the newer lore. The sisters didn't used to have power armour until GW gave them a 3+, and IG stormtroopers have had chemical enhancements mentioned in the past but scions are the new non-stormtrooper stormtroopers.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
The SoB did not go "toe to toe" with the Custodes, that is at best a terrible reading of the text. The Custodes were slaughtering the Sisters, and they decided to end it and show what's her name to the emperor. The SoB do not compare to the Custodes in any respect. Fluff or table top. I assume you are referring to the Reign of Blood, in which the sisters were backed up by full military battalions, and the officio assasinorium.

While we are on the topic, Those are likely the pinacle of base human evolution. The assassins. They routinely take down major targets, without power armor, faith, or excluding the pariah one, unholy warp stuff. Just pure insane skill.

Custodes didn't kill any sisters, they bypassed all but six of them, because Holy Terra is theirs.

It was the Confederacy of Light with the troop battalions, Navy starships, Space Marine chapters, Mechanicus and I seem to recall Officio Assasinorium on one side. A whole galaxy's worth of support against an army of Sisters and surviving milita that wasn't lost to the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath.

A.T. wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
The SoB did not go "toe to toe" with the Custodes, that is at best a terrible reading of the text. The Custodes were slaughtering the Sisters, and they decided to end it and show what's her name to the emperor

The custodes and sisters didn't fire a single shot at one another. In fact it is explicitly stated that when the Custodes did intervene their leader put down his weapons, spoke peacefully with the sisters for an hour and then left his own men as hostages before personally guided Dominica and five others (later founders of the various orders) to the Emperor.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I assume you are referring to the Reign of Blood, in which the sisters were backed up by full military battalions, and the officio assasinorium.

The sisters fought the space marine, tech guard, and the rest of Thors forces. The sisters lost 60% of their number holding the fortress, the attackers losses were unspecified.
The frateris templars may or may not have been involved in Vandires defense - they were never mentioned as present in the battle (the sisters were his personal guard after all).
While Vandire did use assassins (via his position as a High Lord) to gain power, none were mentioned present at the siege.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So from several of the (Admittedly terrible books) lore bits, in Cadian Honour is has a troop of extremely well trained and equipped Sisters of the Rose (?) getting taken down by a horde of basicly starving peasants. Granted they gave a good fight, but no Astartes force would ever lose in a pitched battle against a rabble of drugged up cultists with knives and lasguns

Alaric checked the runes projected by his autosenses back onto his retina. Dvorn's rune was flickering, he must be injured. "Any men lost?" Alaric voxed.
"Caanos is dead," said Santoro simply. "Mykros is carrying him."
- The Grey Knights Omnibus, pg. 110
Killed not by peasants with laser guns, but by medieval warriors with swords and spears.

Not to suggest that some authors have ... interesting interpretations of the lore at times. Backflipping terminators, multilaser tactical marines, razorback surfing, falcon surfing, SoS beating on primaris, that time the tau conquered a hive city with a tiny force using the cunning tactic of 'sit get shelled until the enemy tires', that time the sisters homeworld was conquered by a daemon, the primarch Rubinek and the Iron Hearts...

 Apple Peel wrote:
Scions don’t get “physical” enhancements beyond grueling training / Vratine Armor worn by the Sisters of Silence is a “powered armor,”

I think there is a degree of retcon going on with the newer lore. The sisters didn't used to have power armour until GW gave them a 3+, and IG stormtroopers have had chemical enhancements mentioned in the past but scions are the new non-stormtrooper stormtroopers.

Scions are the most stormtroopers-stormtroopers thing since the Inquisitorial stormtroopers. Back when there was actual 40K stormtroopers and not fluffed-up regimental OC donut-steels like Kasrkin. Scions take all the original stormtrooper lore from pre-Kasrkin stormtroopers, expand it, and they only changed regiment sizes. They brought back being an outside organization that is disliked by the regular guard.

Lammia wrote:
It was the Confederacy of Light with the troop battalions, Navy starships, Space Marine chapters, Mechanicus and I seem to recall Officio Assasinorium on one side. A whole galaxy's worth of support against an army of Sisters and surviving milita that wasn't lost to the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath.

Elements of the Imperial Fists, Fire Hawks, Soul Drinkers, and Black Templars chapter that were local to segmentum solar at that time, and an unspecified number of regiments of the Martian Tech-Guard (who were basically there to shell the place).

Thor and the Confederacy of Light were explicitly not at the siege as per the 2nd ed book, though the original fluff has been condensed and re-printed so many times that the few paragraphs that remain in the 8e book read quite differently. The sisters forces were stated to be roughly 10000 warriors.

A.T. wrote:

Lammia wrote:
It was the Confederacy of Light with the troop battalions, Navy starships, Space Marine chapters, Mechanicus and I seem to recall Officio Assasinorium on one side. A whole galaxy's worth of support against an army of Sisters and surviving milita that wasn't lost to the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath.

Elements of the Imperial Fists, Fire Hawks, Soul Drinkers, and Black Templars chapter that were local to segmentum solar at that time, and an unspecified number of regiments of the Martian Tech-Guard (who were basically there to shell the place).

Thor and the Confederacy of Light were explicitly not at the siege as per the 2nd ed book, though the original fluff has been condensed and re-printed so many times that the few paragraphs that remain in the 8e book read quite differently. The sisters forces were stated to be roughly 10000 warriors.

It's been different since 3rd/4th edition in term of who had the numbers...