Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The final piece of the puzzle, lads.

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/comments/hqccy4/xenos_point_values_9th_edition_40k/
https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/comments/hqc191/new_chaos_points_9th_edition/

https://www.warhammer-community.com/faqs/#warhammer-40000

Before the inevitable flood of "What where they thinking?! My unit X went up Y points, the faction is trash tier now and Warhammer is doomed anyway" comments, please keep in mind that it is not just your army or your unit.

Everybody is getting adjustments and we have to look at the whole picture.

Guardsmen 5 points
Grots 5 points.

That says everything about the balance update.

a_typical_hero wrote:
Everybody is getting adjustments and we have to look at the whole picture.

Nah. We already know that cultists are six points each while guardsmen are only five. That alone justifies a good half dozen pages or so of vicious frothing.

Don't forget intercessors are 20 and CSM are 14.

In 9th edition, seven intercessors are matched by 10 CSM. CSM must've gotten really good...

eldar rangers are 15 pts. Intercessors 20 and guardsmen 5....

So eldar ranger is more expenisve than an old marine? In what fudgin universe..

I guess all of my troops are on the bench sitting this edition out then lol..

There will be a lot of justifiable anger and annoyance at the lack of balancing, as people line up like Groundhog Day hoping this will be the time when they will finally get it right. This time. After 30 years.

And when they see the game will still be as imbalanced and busted as ever... will still fork over the cash so that it can put the lotion on its skin. Or else it gets the nerf again.

I'm against the assumption that equal points means equal capability among different armies.

Orks use Grots in a completely different way than AM uses their Guardsmen. Too many variables in wargear, stratagems, army choices and army tactic approach in general, to compare these two.

Yes, in a vacuum Guardsmen are better. Better profile and equipment. But it is not Guardsmen against Grots.


I'm not saying that the points are (un)balanced, yet.
I want to get some games in before judging for myself.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
The final piece of the puzzle, lads.

Not quite; we don't yet have the FAQs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

a_typical_hero wrote:
I'm against the assumption that equal points means equal capability among different armies.

Orks use Grots in a completely different way than AM uses their Guardsmen. Too many variables in wargear, stratagems, army choices and army tactic approach in general, to compare these two.

Yes, in a vacuum Guardsmen are better. Better profile and equipment. But it is not Guardsmen against Grots.


I'm not saying that the points are (un)balanced, yet.
I want to get some games in before judging for myself.

So being so reasonable, you're barely even frothing at the mouth.

Guardsman 5 was a given. I honestly wonder why they didn't adjust this last year, seeing how they had already done it in Kill Team the year prior.
At least Conscripts make some sense again now...

Anyone else annoyed that dam is misspelled in the title?

I'll go through this when I can read it on a computer and not my phone.

Where are the Imperial point changes btw? I only see Chaos and Xenos.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Platuan4th wrote:
Anyone else annoyed that dam is misspelled in the title?

I'll go through this when I can read it on a computer and not my phone.

Methinks that's intentional.

 Platuan4th wrote:
Anyone else annoyed that dam is misspelled in the title?

I was....but then I saw the points hikes on Coven stuff. This was a bad week to give up heroin.

Just for a point of comparison, my collection changed from 2658 to 3002 pts as AdMech, a 13% increase. How about your armies ?

 Platuan4th wrote:
Anyone else annoyed that dam is misspelled in the title?

you just posted cringe.

- - - -

I'm doing the calculations for death guard now. so far I did get hit too bad, with the notable exception of plague burst crawlers and Leviathan dreadnoughts. Butcher array Levi's are all but unusable in my 1500 point lists now going forward me thinks.

I love the inadvertent pun in the title.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw I just thought I would point out: the source for these are the SS82 videos right? I would not be suprised if there were a couple of errors in there. Reading numbers off for over an hour, with no mistakes, is pretty difficult. Now I'm not saying that there are mistakes, just that I wouldn't be shocked if like 2% of things are wrong.

Okay, forget what I said about Conscripts. They are still the same cost as infantry squads.

Syka Blyat, GW! *Curses in Valhallan*

There are multiple sources at this point. Goonhammer has put up an article as well although I don't know if he has the explicit point costs listed.

Kitane wrote:
Guardsmen 5 points
Grots 5 points.

That says everything about the balance update.

In my limited experience grots are really good at holding objectives. As will any such chaff. IS require CC.

And the 'nonsensical comparisons in a vacuum' began immediately...
Didn't expect anything else from Warsee...I mean Dakkadakka.

Personally I'm "glad" that units across the board, including those in my own armies are getting a point increase.

What was 1750 pts in 8th will now (roughly) be 2000 pts in 9th, and I'm absolutely fine with it.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

Kitane wrote:
Guardsmen 5 points
Grots 5 points.

That says everything about the balance update.

In my limited experience grots are really good at holding objectives. As will any such chaff. IS require CC.

I think we may see some more platoon commanders too, as slots are more limited now. A brigade has only 5 HQ slots after all, you can't bring 3 CCs and 3 TCs any more without spending CP.

 Esmer wrote:
Okay, forget what I said about Conscripts. They are still the same cost as infantry squads.

Syka Blyat, GW! *Curses in Valhallan*

This is and will always continue to be the issue with Conscripts' mere existence continuing to be "Infantry Squads Lite".
This is and will always continue to be why I've argued why Guard need a complete redesign.

Grots were inevitably going to get hit.

 MinscS2 wrote:
And the 'nonsensical comparisons in a vacuum' began immediately...
Didn't expect anything else from Warsee...I mean Dakkadakka.

Personally I'm "glad" that units across the board, including those in my own armies are getting a point increase.

What was 1750 pts in 8th will now (roughly) be 2000 pts in 9th, and I'm absolutely fine with it.

Pts going higher is fine but saying that comparing pts cross army in a vacuum is nonsensical is a low blow.

Overall i'll wait to play my models before judging the effect the new pts will have, but seeing the pts difference between a chaos leviathan and a loyalist leviathan is one of the changes i just cant get behind

Any leakes for Forge World? Did the hellforged super heavys go up again?

 Trickstick wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

Kitane wrote:
Guardsmen 5 points
Grots 5 points.

That says everything about the balance update.

In my limited experience grots are really good at holding objectives. As will any such chaff. IS require CC.

I think we may see some more platoon commanders too, as slots are more limited now. A brigade has only 5 HQ slots after all, you can't bring 3 CCs and 3 TCs any more without spending CP.

I mean, what else are you going to use Elite choices on right now?

Weapons in line with marines. All force weapons to 0.

 MinscS2 wrote:
And the 'nonsensical comparisons in a vacuum' began immediately...
Didn't expect anything else from Warsee...I mean Dakkadakka.

Personally I'm "glad" that units across the board, including those in my own armies are getting a point increase.

What was 1750 pts in 8th will now (roughly) be 2000 pts in 9th, and I'm absolutely fine with it.

Exactly. It's perfectly fair and balanced that Space Marines went up 10% on average, while Drukhari up went up 16%.

The issue is not all were hit equally.

I have to agree with goonhammer this does feel very much like someones taken an excel file written a formula and applied it to everything blanket and then gone through to touch a few units randomly selected.

Kitane wrote:Guardsmen 5 points
Grots 5 points.

That says everything about the balance update.

Cultists 6 points.

GW really does not want Chaos using Cultists.

Aaranis wrote:Just for a point of comparison, my collection changed from 2658 to 3002 pts as AdMech, a 13% increase. How about your armies ?

My Black Legion gunline went from 1,995 to 1,800.

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Any leakes for Forge World? Did the hellforged super heavys go up again?

Yes and SS82 has all the FW in 1 video