Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

changemod wrote:
In addition, the model is smaller than the old monolith despite the box it comes in being double sized and priced as a superheavy.

Wait, what?

Do we have comparison pics?

From /tg/

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

changemod wrote:
In addition, the model is smaller than the old monolith despite the box it comes in being double sized and priced as a superheavy.

Wait, what?

Do we have comparison pics?

From r/Necrontyr:



And a size comparison of the Canoptek Doomstalker and a Starstele...

So much for the 'ThE pRicE is jUsTifIed beCaUSe it'S So bIG!' claims...

 Lord Damocles wrote:
So much for the 'ThE pRicE is jUsTifIed beCaUSe it'S So bIG!' claims...

in fairness no one has claimed that, they've claimed it's a size/complexity thing. and it is a much more COMPLICATED kit then the original one (weather you think that's an improvement is entirely subjective)

I assumed it was bigger, and would therefore be more expensive because of that and because it was a newer kit. What I did not expect is for it to be smaller.

Lord of War my ass...

Thanks for the pic, Ghaz.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I assumed it was bigger, and would therefore be more expensive because of that and because it was a newer kit. What I did not expect is for it to be smaller.

Lord of War my ass...

Thanks for the pic, Ghaz.

Remember you're comparing an empty plastic box to a plastic box with a fully detailed interior as well.

And you're welcome...

well except for some minor details (like the weapons) I like the old one more

The new is much cooler. Not double the price cooler but...

I think I prefer the original design, but the new one certainly benefits from 20 years of tech improvement leading to better detailing.

There’s pros and cons to both. I’d have preferred a more solid or less visible interior and for the canoptek model to be optional (I like canoptek, but it’s pretty visually distracting and replaces the central strut from the top of the old monolith).

It being slightly smaller rather than slightly larger absolutely strikes me as silly though.

My only problem with all the interior of the new one is the amount of staged building and painting you basically need/want/have to do. Sometimes a lot of GW's older models at least let you build them up and then paint when you want. Quite a lot of the newer designs are approaching high complexity, but at the same time are blocking off large areas to get the brush in easily.

Y'know, price concerns aside - it's actually refreshing that a new model hasn't invalidated the old one on the basis of size alone. Everyone that already had a Monolith will have absolutely no issues continuing to use it.

That gate is an amazingly unimpressive thing. It looks... cheap.

The detail overall is obviously an improvement, but I just don't like the design. The layers, the giant bug, the golf ball, I just don't see the point.

Certainly not cost-worthy or worth the LoW penalty.

I personally love it, but even with 20% off I paid £80 odd, so basically double the price of what the original one cost by the end of its retail life.

How many sprues was the old one? The old one also had those green transparent bits. The new Monolith is 4 big ones ( of those 4 it is 2 of the same sprues repeated twice) and a smaller one to build the Canoptek construct on the rear of the Monolith.

I did say that when we first saw it I dreaded the price, and that came to pass. I am wondering if the LOW classification came before or after the price was worked out within GW?

Anyone care to explain this?

GW decided to cut the Gordian Knot of whether to try to sell people more expensive FW resin or less expensive GW plastic...by just selling them GW plastic at FW resin prices?

That's about what I got.

I'm normally not one to complain about prices, I've been buying a ton of Necron stuff lately, but it sure does seem like GW has really escalated their prices on stuff this year.

The new Combat Patrol is a great example of that.

Hounds of Morkai are $45, Ragnar's $40, Ghazghkull is $65, both DW+SW supplements are $30 each. Outriders are, from what I'm seeing, $60 not $55.

As for why those two boxes are different...Apothecaries are $35 or $47.50 for the Deathwatch version that came with a DW upgrade sprue.

SC: Wolves comes out to:
-$35 for the Battle Leader
-$50 for the Aggressors
-$60 for the Intercessors
-$14 for the upgrade sprues...unless it was being counted as part of the Wolf Aggressor or Intercessor boxes when they first packaged everything.

So either $145 or $159, depending on that bit.

Deathwatch one is:
-$35 for the LT
-$35 for the Apothecary
-$50 for the Aggressors
-$60 for the Intercessors
-$14 for the upgrade frames...although in their case I think it's actually two sets of frames rather than just one set(which is one sprue duplicated), which would put it at $28.

Comes out to
$194 if just one set of upgrade frames, $208 if two sets of upgrade frames.

For sake of argument though, the Combat Patrol for Wolves is:
-$35 for Battle Leader
-$60 for Intercessors
-$45 for Wolves of Morkai
-$60 for Invictor
-$14 for Intercessors' upgrade frame

Comes out to $214 individually.

The now defunct Start Collecting Deathwatch was:
-Artemis at $30
-Venerable Dreadnought at $59
-2x Deathwatch Veteran boxes at $38 each.
Came out to $165 if bought individually for 2 min sized squads, an overpriced Dreadnought that was showing its age, and a Special Character that kills you wanting duplicates.

Duplicate Artemis is easy to use elsewhere.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Hounds of Morkai are $45...

I was comparing the Wolf Start Collecting and the DW Combat Patrol. Don't even try to move the goalposts here in your endless attempts to defend GW.

I am comparing the Wolf SC and DW Combat Patrol because the two are the same bar an Apothecary, and the price has jumped US$45. The Apothecary is a US$35 kit. Why have they added one more miniature and a further $10?

I didn't see a defence of it, I just saw him doing the math, and he's right, more or less, the price is "Explained" by the addition of the extra mini. which is always a more expensive elite.

the new combat patrol boxes SEEM to have a formula to their contents in them.

1 HQ (so far always a Lt)
10 troops.
1 elite troops squad (reivers in the SW's case, agressors in the death watches case)
1 "special elite" eaither a character or a dreadnought.


tyhe take away from here is "the apocathary, like all 40k characters, is insanely expensive"

But the increase to the box is more than the cost of the Apothecary.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
But the increase to the box is more than the cost of the Apothecary.

Not if this was the price point they went with.

And save your freakouts about 'goalposts' for elsewhere. I posted prices for other things as I found them from a US retailer. That's why it was just those items. Hounds of Morkai are $45USD, which puts them in line with the Combat Squads which had been $35 during the initial splash release years ago if a half set of upgrades gets added.

Despite the price being higher the savings(real or imagined) are floating around the same spot, by virtue of simple number-crunching.
$66.50 on the new DW set if the DW Primaris Apothecary is the one picked out.
$68 on the new DW set if they counted the upgrade sets(of which there would be two, since it only contains 10) separately.
$64 on the old Space Wolf set...and that's with assigning a price($35) to a model that as far as I know has not been sold individually(The Primaris Wolf Guard Battle Leader)

"Buy more and save!"

Oh man, proof that particular scam never goes out of fashion.

I still don’t get how people complain to this extent about the prices on a voluntary purchase.

If I can’t afford something? I don’t buy it and move on
If I can afford it, but it’s not worth it? I don’t buy it and move on.
If I can afford it, and it’s worth it? I buy it and move on
If I can’t afford it, and have an extra kidney? I buy it and move on.

I just seems weird for this much vitriol over a voluntary luxury good. Everyone wants things to be cheaper so that arguement doesn’t really hold water since it applies to everything.

It's just a worse deal all round. You are not getting much more for the cost (especially the deathwatch one). 2 overpriced characters are not doing the box any favours. Not to mention putting the cost above the $100 threshold is not smart. I'd take the current Start Collecting Vanguard over any of these 2 every day of the week.

 Leth wrote:
I still don’t get how people complain to this extent about the prices on a voluntary purchase.

If I can’t afford something? I don’t buy it and move on
If I can afford it, but it’s not worth it? I don’t buy it and move on.
If I can afford it, and it’s worth it? I buy it and move on
If I can’t afford it, and have an extra kidney? I buy it and move on.

I just seems weird for this much vitriol over a voluntary luxury good. Everyone wants things to be cheaper so that arguement doesn’t really hold water since it applies to everything.

If you can't understand something, why don't you move on? What makes this different than the rest of your enunciated life strategy?

It's a bit ironic. Especially given that "this is too expensive" is literally the easiest complaint to understand in the whole world. What you really mean is you don't agree, not that you don't "get it."

 Leth wrote:
I still don’t get...

Yes you do. You understand completely. You are not naive, nor are you ignorant, nor are you stupid.

You know perfectly well why people would be unhappy with two boxes with almost the same content going up in price by more than the single addition to said box actually costs on its own.

So you do know. You just don't care.

"This is too expensive" is something that is effectively an opinion, seeing as people will value things differently.

I hold zero interest in these boxes as they aren't things I like for my Raven Guard. Just like if a Combat Patrol set comes out for AdMech and it's Electropriests and Kataphron with a Techpriest--I'll have no interest. Things that don't interest me have zero value.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Not if this was the price point they went with.

And save your freakouts about 'goalposts' for elsewhere. I posted prices for other things as I found them from a US retailer. That's why it was just those items. Hounds of Morkai are $45USD, which puts them in line with the Combat Squads which had been $35 during the initial splash release years ago if a half set of upgrades gets added.

Despite the price being higher the savings(real or imagined) are floating around the same spot, by virtue of simple number-crunching.
$66.50 on the new DW set if the DW Primaris Apothecary is the one picked out.
$68 on the new DW set if they counted the upgrade sets(of which there would be two, since it only contains 10) separately.
$64 on the old Space Wolf set...and that's with assigning a price($35) to a model that as far as I know has not been sold individually(The Primaris Wolf Guard Battle Leader)

I like how you're trying to sneak in bundles of both characters and squads to inflate "savings" of new box (for the record, DW Apothecary in the link above isn't even a box, just regular ass Apothecary and clam pack of DW sprue taped together). You'd maybe have a point if new box had 4 upgrade sprues it would need to have if you put said bundles on top of SW CS box, but seeing it still only has 2, you have none. Unless GW is now insane enough to inflate prices based on non-existent plastic, which would be equally bad on its own...

It's a simple metric.

Take out the Apothecary and the box has gone up in price by $10.

You can try and spin, explain away or apologise for that until the cows come home, but it is a price increase.