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Bubonicus... it isn't there.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/12/10/death-guard-rules-preview-part-4-disgustingly-resilient/

Lets see how long this thread lasts for!

No more rolling a D6 for each point of damage inflicted, but instead a -1 to a minimum of 1? I wonder how that works with mortal wounds.

Nurglitch wrote:
No more rolling a D6 for each point of damage inflicted, but instead a -1 to a minimum of 1? I wonder how that works with mortal wounds.

It doesn't.

They're going to be extremely resilient to the likes of plasma though

Psychic phase mortal wounds bypass the Necron reanimation protocols, as well, so there is definitely a move towards these being automatic wounds.

Which I think is a good way to go about it since most MW sources do D3 wounds and that was made worse with a lot of things gaining a wound.

There will be a similar problem that is seen with reanimation protocols, though, which funneled lists into single wound models. I think the same will happen towards DG terminators.

Has there been any word or rumor if Chaos Dreadnoughts will be getting the Reduce Damage taken by 1 to min 1 like Loyalists?

The fact that my imperial flashlights and Punisher Gatling Guns just went up 33% in efficiency against Death Guard gives me a huge schadenfreude boner.

Then I also realize that my Plasma guns and Heavy Bolters went down 50% and it shrinks again.

I think it's absolutely fine. DR is too good in its current form, this is more balanced after Plague Marines received an extra wound.

Less FNP in the game and not allowing units to ignore mortal wounds are good things.

The hysterical reaction I'm seeing from DG players on Reddit (and possibly here?) is ridiculous.

Lasguns and bolters are worse against plague marines thanks to the change to 2W, but they became better against vehicles and other things that previously had Disgustingly Resillent FNP-version. Plasma guns and heavy bolters are going to cry if they face DG though.

 Thadin wrote:
Has there been any word or rumor if Chaos Dreadnoughts will be getting the Reduce Damage taken by 1 to min 1 like Loyalists?

the FW ones do have it, unknown if its gonna stack with DG ones

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Thadin wrote:
Has there been any word or rumor if Chaos Dreadnoughts will be getting the Reduce Damage taken by 1 to min 1 like Loyalists?

the FW ones do have it, unknown if its gonna stack with DG ones

Well, if they do have it on FW ones, it should stack right? Unless there's some exception put in place.

Being Death Guard may not give Disgustingly Resilient by itself and it could be based off the unit entry. Dreadnoughts taking -2 damage to min 1 would be pretty good, if it ends up shaking out that way.

Either way, I'm a fan of this change. Less mountains of dice to roll every single phase, and while it doesn't protect from small arms fire, it makes them much tougher against the current meta of taking marine-killer weapons.

I wonder how they'll change models that altered Disgustingly Resilient, like the Surgeon. Predictions? I'm also betting they'll have a Strat to turn on FNP for a unit.

 Thadin wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Thadin wrote:
Has there been any word or rumor if Chaos Dreadnoughts will be getting the Reduce Damage taken by 1 to min 1 like Loyalists?

the FW ones do have it, unknown if its gonna stack with DG ones

Well, if they do have it on FW ones, it should stack right? Unless there's some exception put in place.

Being Death Guard may not give Disgustingly Resilient by itself and it could be based off the unit entry. Dreadnoughts taking -2 damage to min 1 would be pretty good, if it ends up shaking out that way.

Either way, I'm a fan of this change. Less mountains of dice to roll every single phase, and while it doesn't protect from small arms fire, it makes them much tougher against the current meta of taking marine-killer weapons.

I wonder how they'll change models that altered Disgustingly Resilient, like the Surgeon. Predictions? I'm also betting they'll have a Strat to turn on FNP for a unit.

GW's army builder has "Deathguard Contemptor Dreadnought" & co. as possible units, i don't know if they get DR since i don't have the app myself. And i also don't know if the app is correct or if GW messed up again.

It's definitely a general overall buff to the models that got the extra wound bump, but a pretty significant nerf towards vehicles and monsters that use it. It'll be interesting to see how this translates over to Nurgle Daemons in general when they redo the Chaos Daemons codex. Will that mean they give a 2W bracket to Plaguebearers?

Esmer wrote:The fact that my imperial flashlights and Punisher Gatling Guns just went up 33% in efficiency against Death Guard gives me a huge schadenfreude boner.

Against actual Marines, not even, since they're now W2. Before it took an average of 1.5 lasgun wounds to kill a Plague Marine, now it'll take exactly two.

Plague Marines are now more durable against everything D1 or D2, and against mortal wounds. Vehicles are now more vulnerable to D1 and D4+, but are more resistant to D2 and just as durable against D3 as before.

Poxwalkers are the biggest losers, since they get no benefit. But we don't know what else they might be getting.

My usual DG opponent is stoked about this change. It benefits his Plague Marines significantly, is the perfect counter to an increasingly D2-focused meta, and most importantly reduces the amount of rolling needed.

all rules that reduce damage do not stack atm. Dont expect that it will.

Cynista wrote:
I think it's absolutely fine. DR is too good in its current form, this is more balanced after Plague Marines received an extra wound.

Less FNP in the game and not allowing units to ignore mortal wounds are good things.

The hysterical reaction I'm seeing from DG players on Reddit (and possibly here?) is ridiculous.

That’s why Iron Hands lost their FNP right?

 kirotheavenger wrote:
They're going to be extremely resilient to the likes of plasma though

I see it as an indirect if small buff to enemy plasma actually. Since it now does not matter to overcharge or not against our infantry they can always choose the safe option and never fry their models.

yayyy, they shouldn't have been able to use DR on MW anyway.

Good change. Free 5+ FNP on all your units is broken. It always has been broken. -1 Damage is an incredible ability. Which is also borderline broken at least it has counters and will actually give the 2 wound profile some usefulness and loading your list with flat 2 damage weapons would mean you just get rolled by DG.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 evil_kiwi_60 wrote:

Cynista wrote:
I think it's absolutely fine. DR is too good in its current form, this is more balanced after Plague Marines received an extra wound.

Less FNP in the game and not allowing units to ignore mortal wounds are good things.

The hysterical reaction I'm seeing from DG players on Reddit (and possibly here?) is ridiculous.

That’s why Iron Hands lost their FNP right?

To be fair it is only a 6+ but it is also BS. IMO free army traits probably should not be defensive. Defensive bonus is always going to be the best option.

Oh no... First time i see this and well its not pretty looking rule even for death guard in their pestilent glory but lets hope it won't be worse right?... Right?

Agrabasz wrote:
Oh no... First time i see this and well its not pretty looking rule even for death guard in their pestilent glory but lets hope it won't be worse right?... Right?

This is actually much better than the old FnP in most cases. Its also much less annoying since you don't have to slow down the game even more with dice rolling.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

Agrabasz wrote:
Oh no... First time i see this and well its not pretty looking rule even for death guard in their pestilent glory but lets hope it won't be worse right?... Right?

This is actually much better than the old FnP in most cases. Its also much less annoying since you don't have to slow down the game even more with dice rolling.

It isn't better except against D2, which admittedly is a fairly commonly found Damage for weapons. It does nothing against D1, is a wash at D3 and strictly worse for mortal wounds and everything D4 and up. Even the "wash at D3" only holds for multi wound models since it will still kill our PM's outright now.

Yay, a buff to Keepers of Secrets (or rather a buff compared to DG going to two wounds with the old FNP).

I think 3 flat damage will be the new standard in 9th, what with Heavy Intercessors coexisting with these Death Guard. That said, DG terminators look juicy even in that environment.

The problem with slow rules leaks is that a 2W plague marine with 5+++ never existed but is being used as a comparison.

 Castozor wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

Agrabasz wrote:
Oh no... First time i see this and well its not pretty looking rule even for death guard in their pestilent glory but lets hope it won't be worse right?... Right?

This is actually much better than the old FnP in most cases. Its also much less annoying since you don't have to slow down the game even more with dice rolling.

It isn't better except against D2, which admittedly is a fairly commonly found Damage for weapons. It does nothing against D1, is a wash at D3 and strictly worse for mortal wounds and everything D4 and up. Even the "wash at D3" only holds for multi wound models since it will still kill our PM's outright now.

if theyre shooting damage 3 at my PM and 4 at my termies, i'm happy with it.
Don't forget that this is coming with +1 wound to most of our infantry, so D1 weapons are already weakened compared to before when we had the 5+++.

Just because you roll less dice with this version i love it more, makes the game go quicker with less downtime.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Oaka wrote:
The problem with slow rules leaks is that a 2W plague marine with 5+++ never existed but is being used as a comparison.

yeah, there is no way that they wouldve made their way into the game.

Considering the durability relative to tactical marines, Death Guard are now in the hilarious position of being:

More durable than tactical marines against heavy weapons (e.g. lascannons, antitank missiles, plasma guns)

And exactly as durable against small arms (the plethroa of 1 damage weapons out there).

I personally find it amusing that they are no more durable than regular marines against lasguns or autoguns or knives, but hit them with an anti-tank missile and suddenly they've a solid (33%) chance of survival where a regular marine has a 16% chance (provided their armor fails in both cases).

Not exactly as durable against small arms, PM still have their T5, and a chunk of their unique vehicles tend to be high T than the Loyalist/Spiky equivalents.

I still think a lot of people were expecting 20 point 2 wound t5 3+/5+++ with an increase in offensive output for some reason. There is a lot of angry knee jerking happening.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Considering the durability relative to tactical marines, Death Guard are now in the hilarious position of being:

More durable than tactical marines against heavy weapons (e.g. lascannons, antitank missiles, plasma guns)

And exactly as durable against small arms (the plethroa of 1 damage weapons out there).

I personally find it amusing that they are no more durable than regular marines against lasguns or autoguns or knives, but hit them with an anti-tank missile and suddenly they've a solid (33%) chance of survival where a regular marine has a 16% chance (provided their armor fails in both cases).

This actually kinda makes sense, as the DR is supposed to simulate how they don't give a feth if a lucky missile hit or Plasma load rips out a huge chunk of their body. The way I see it, the Nurgle boys, both Daemons and Marines, never were extraordinarily tough (and why would they, they're mostly rotten tissue in rusty armor) but completely indifferent to being torn to shreds.