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What will make this even more horrendous is that if they were already in combat then they wouldn’t count as moving and would get the +1 to hit from their chapter tactic

the_scotsman wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
And all of a sudden, Mortarion with all his nerfing auras is not so bad...



Probably far easier said than done tbh though.

so it is vox scream, except it's a psy power, has more reach, has a cheaper pricetag, has no CP cost and actively screws over auras like the new DG stuff but also GSC things etc...

Spoiler:

what was the joke? "and they shall know no unfavourable rules?"

Vox scream is automatic, close to unblockable, has the same range and turns off ALL aura abilities, this turns off ONE aura ability.

So what , it's the encroaching on other factions that's really annoying, that and the fact there's no cp tax associated with it.

Jeez do we need 10th Ed already to sweep away the rising absurdity?

Not Online!!! wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
And all of a sudden, Mortarion with all his nerfing auras is not so bad...



Probably far easier said than done tbh though.

so it is vox scream, except it's a psy power, has more reach, has a cheaper pricetag, has no CP cost and actively screws over auras like the new DG stuff but also GSC things etc...

Spoiler:

what was the joke? "and they shall know no unfavourable rules?"

Vox scream is automatic, close to unblockable, has the same range and turns off ALL aura abilities, this turns off ONE aura ability.

So what , it's the encroaching on other factions that's really annoying, that and the fact there's no cp tax associated with it.

And you can only target one model with it per turn, and it fails a good 40% of the time, and you need an HQ model within spitting distance of theirs.

It's not all bad, points are still a thing. To use this effectively, DA players will be giving up Ravenwing and Deathwing goodness. It is good, but you are giving up solid DA characters elsewhere. Best to wait and see the whole picture.

I think this is fine tbh. It's a psychic power, so can be denied and has a decent chance to fail with no casting bonus.

It is a decent power, but nothing gamebreaking or even top tier.

 Sasori wrote:
I think this is fine tbh. It's a psychic power, so can be denied and has a decent chance to fail with no casting bonus.

Ezekiel does have +1 to cast Interromancy

 bullyboy wrote:

 Sasori wrote:
I think this is fine tbh. It's a psychic power, so can be denied and has a decent chance to fail with no casting bonus.

Ezekiel does have +1 to cast Interromancy

Which will cost more points but he will also suffer from the affliction most librarians have, especially SC ones, they're usually quite squishy with no amazing ways to upgrade their durability.

endlesswaltz123 wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:

 Sasori wrote:
I think this is fine tbh. It's a psychic power, so can be denied and has a decent chance to fail with no casting bonus.

Ezekiel does have +1 to cast Interromancy

Which will cost more points but he will also suffer from the affliction most librarians have, especially SC ones, they're usually quite squishy with no amazing ways to upgrade their durability.

Usually the case, but zeke does have a 4+ invuln and is Inner Circle. A decent Librarian overall.

 bullyboy wrote:

endlesswaltz123 wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:

 Sasori wrote:
I think this is fine tbh. It's a psychic power, so can be denied and has a decent chance to fail with no casting bonus.

Ezekiel does have +1 to cast Interromancy

Which will cost more points but he will also suffer from the affliction most librarians have, especially SC ones, they're usually quite squishy with no amazing ways to upgrade their durability.

Usually the case, but zeke does have a 4+ invuln and is Inner Circle. A decent Librarian overall.

He has a 4++? I missed that, though, I haven't looked at running him for ages. And correct, assuming all inner circle do in fact get auto transhuman he may be quite tough, especially with a DWK or just DW bodyguard of some sort to soak damage/screen.

Interesting.

He became quite a beast in the Index, which is great as he was always one of my favourite DA characters.

I'm assuming the inner circle all get transhuman as that is when they make their true pacts with the chaos Gods and begin their route to daemonhood?

It's not super powerful, but it's pretty boring game design to have a power that just negates the cool stuff your enemy can do. Fine for a super tactical and fast card game or something, but not much fun for a game that might take a couple of hours and where your cool dude with the cool powers might have taken another 20 hours to paint up.

Any power or rule that isn't "Kill more" or "Kill better" is a good power or rule for me.

cant sm librairnas get the master librarian trait for additional +1 to cast / relics to help casting?

At best its actualy a 6+ and at worse its a 5+.
No auras.
No ob sec.

Gotcha!
GG and good night for you sir...

Sounds thrilling to play against.

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
And all of a sudden, Mortarion with all his nerfing auras is not so bad...



Probably far easier said than done tbh though.

Morty only has 3 auras. Contagions are specifically unaffected by things that shut down aura abilities per the DG codex.


Side note, can someone explain how that Crozius relic works? The rules of that seem pure GW. I cannot make head nor tail of it. It reads to me, if you roll a 4+ to wound and instead of them making saves they just take two MWs instead. Or are the MWs in addition to whatever damage?

 Grimtuff wrote:

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
And all of a sudden, Mortarion with all his nerfing auras is not so bad...



Probably far easier said than done tbh though.

Morty only has 3 auras. Contagions are specifically unaffected by things that shut down aura abilities per the DG codex.


Side note, can someone explain how that Crozius relic works? The rules of that seem pure GW. I cannot make head nor tail of it. It reads to me, if you roll a 4+ to wound and instead of them making saves they just take two MWs instead. Or are the MWs in addition to whatever damage?

The attack ends, and you just deal 2 mortal wounds instead. You then move on to the next attack in line (as the RAW don't really account for fast rolling being a thing).

 Laughing Man wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
And all of a sudden, Mortarion with all his nerfing auras is not so bad...



Probably far easier said than done tbh though.

Morty only has 3 auras. Contagions are specifically unaffected by things that shut down aura abilities per the DG codex.


Side note, can someone explain how that Crozius relic works? The rules of that seem pure GW. I cannot make head nor tail of it. It reads to me, if you roll a 4+ to wound and instead of them making saves they just take two MWs instead. Or are the MWs in addition to whatever damage?

The attack ends, and you just deal 2 mortal wounds instead. You then move on to the next attack in line (as the RAW don't really account for fast rolling being a thing).

So that thing hands out MWs like sweeties...

Oh lovely. My main opponent has DAs and my main army is DG. Yay!

 Ian Sturrock wrote:
It's not super powerful, but it's pretty boring game design to have a power that just negates the cool stuff your enemy can do. Fine for a super tactical and fast card game or something, but not much fun for a game that might take a couple of hours and where your cool dude with the cool powers might have taken another 20 hours to paint up.

So what are your thoughts on DG rules that effectively turn off durability for certain units, or negate movement so much to the point it makes it almost pointless? Is it because you perceive it as cool as the user of said powers that it is okay even though it stops my army from functioning in the cool way it should?

I'll wait for the RW and DW before making an assessment... Right now, DA seems a little boring. I like the control abilities, but we'll see how boring and gunliney they really are

endlesswaltz123 wrote:


So what are your thoughts on DG rules that effectively turn off durability for certain units, or negate movement so much to the point it makes it almost pointless? Is it because you perceive it as cool as the user of said powers that it is okay even though it stops my army from functioning in the cool way it should?

To be honest? Not a huge fan of anything that halves enemy movement, as that makes the game less dynamic and thus less interesting, too. BUT durability is not a "cool" power, in a wargame that's about killing your enemy.

And FWIW I've fielded Dark Angels WAY more times than I have DG, and have a much bigger DA collection. It's not about who owns which army, it's about principles of good design (though I kind of despair of seeing much of that from GW's game designers).

 Grimtuff wrote:

 Laughing Man wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
And all of a sudden, Mortarion with all his nerfing auras is not so bad...



Probably far easier said than done tbh though.

Morty only has 3 auras. Contagions are specifically unaffected by things that shut down aura abilities per the DG codex.


Side note, can someone explain how that Crozius relic works? The rules of that seem pure GW. I cannot make head nor tail of it. It reads to me, if you roll a 4+ to wound and instead of them making saves they just take two MWs instead. Or are the MWs in addition to whatever damage?

The attack ends, and you just deal 2 mortal wounds instead. You then move on to the next attack in line (as the RAW don't really account for fast rolling being a thing).

So that thing hands out MWs like sweeties...

Oh lovely. My main opponent has DAs and my main army is DG. Yay!

Well, there are plenty of weapons in the game that already work that way, the reason why you probably haven't noticed is because the mechanic isn't actually that great. It's essentially just a fancy way of saying "ignore saves and excess damage is not lost".

The mortal wounds only work on Fallen and Heretic astartes also, making it fairly niche, great against DG but otherwise meh. Good relic upgrade against them, but you're left with just a power maul or crozius when not playing them with a small buff that isn't worth spending your relic on.

Well, it's great versus death guard

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
The mortal wounds only work on Fallen and Heretic astartes also, making it fairly niche, great against DG but otherwise meh. Good relic upgrade against them, but you're left with just a power maul or crozius when not playing them with a small buff that isn't worth spending your relic on.

I mean, if you use the relic instead of a normal power maul or Crozius, you're still effectively upgrading to a power fist without the accuracy penalty, so it'll be helpful against high T opponents regardless.

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
The mortal wounds only work on Fallen and Heretic astartes also, making it fairly niche, great against DG but otherwise meh. Good relic upgrade against them, but you're left with just a power maul or crozius when not playing them with a small buff that isn't worth spending your relic on.

Which since you choose relics list making turns relic into useless unless meta becomes like 90% heretic astartes.

 Dysartes wrote:

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
The mortal wounds only work on Fallen and Heretic astartes also, making it fairly niche, great against DG but otherwise meh. Good relic upgrade against them, but you're left with just a power maul or crozius when not playing them with a small buff that isn't worth spending your relic on.

I mean, if you use the relic instead of a normal power maul or Crozius, you're still effectively upgrading to a power fist without the accuracy penalty, so it'll be helpful against high T opponents regardless.

I'd personally prefer a heaven fell blade in such a circumstance but that is personal preference. Obviously if I'm only take a chaplain, your point may have some relevance.

It's a good psychic powers against other Marines, maybe Harlequins, etc..

It's notably sub-par against Death Guard as Contagions are very explicitly not Auras and unaffected by things that meddle with Auras.

I like the psychic powers as a tactical asset in game, really useful utility tool. As for the fire discipline, I was not expecting the change of the super doctrine, perhaps something simple would have been welcome. The 5+ to hit when firing into close combat should definately been a tau-thing.