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 Prometheum5 wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Now release that terrain separately damn it!!!

For 40k 3e that took another what, month to get the terrain boxes?

Command Edition Battlefield Expansion (board+scenery) was released at the same time as starter sets. Battlezone: Manufactorum: Vertigus (big set with another exclusive terrain piece) was released month and a half later.

Why would you think that Yndrasta would be on this?

I have to say that her head part is a fail; her back rod broke and now I might need some kind of pin because she just won't fit correctly.

I am surprised that the orc boss on mutant xoloitzcuintle (mexican "naked" dog breed, google it, they are just the same) is not included on the biggest kit.

 CMLR wrote:
Why would you be surprised that Yndrasta would be on this?

I have to say that her head part is a fail; her back rod broke and now I might need some kind of pin because she just won't fit correctly.

I am surprised that the orc boss on mutant xoloitzcuintle (mexican "naked" dog breed, google it, they are just the same) is not included on the biggest kit.

Seems like both fancy centerpiece models would be destined for individual box releases, so not in the starters.

 Prometheum5 wrote:

Seems like both fancy centerpiece models would be destined for individual box releases, so not in the starters.

This was known from the moment Dominion contents were revealed as it became obvious that Dominion would mimic Indomitus release.

Considering she is on the front cover of the main core book and clearly a center piece faction model - if not the face of 3rd Edition itself, it seems a bit naff that Yndrastra is stuck on one of those horrible, overpriced "court" sprues. Which is a shame as for Soul Wars we were treated to the wonderful Astreia Solbright for only £25...

I suppose one could take the current ETB Sequitor Prime( with a similar hair style ), a new Vindicator, wings and some left over Stormcast pieces and kitbash an alternative model for less?

 CMLR wrote:
I am surprised that the orc boss on mutant xoloitzcuintle (mexican "naked" dog breed, google it, they are just the same) is not included on the biggest kit.

Why? It's the exact same model as Indomitus. Small starter has least HQ model in it, medium starter has the medium HQ model, big starter is medium one + some terrain, while the big, heavy hitting HQ + elite minions sprue will be available separately for insane amounts of money. It's so copy paste I am surprised anyone didn't saw this coming.

Also, is small starter has sane price, it might become the most popular purchase of people wanting to bulk up new ork armies, 11 'big' bodies if you can find spare 40k ork heads somewhere

Cronch wrote:
Great value for money, but not as good as the Dominion starter box.

Meh, nothing will beat 8th edition 40K/2nd edition AoS in this regard. I bought Tempest of Souls with Dominion and was shocked to see ToS being the same size (if thinner) for 1/3 of the money Dominion cost. Hell, the big starters both were the same size and cost like 60% of Dominion

 Irbis wrote:

 CMLR wrote:
I am surprised that the orc boss on mutant xoloitzcuintle (mexican "naked" dog breed, google it, they are just the same) is not included on the biggest kit.

Why? It's the exact same model as Indomitus. Small starter has least HQ model in it, medium starter has the medium HQ model, big starter is medium one + some terrain, while the big, heavy hitting HQ + elite minions sprue will be available separately for insane amounts of money. It's so copy paste I am surprised anyone didn't saw this coming.

Also, is small starter has sane price, it might become the most popular purchase of people wanting to bulk up new ork armies, 11 'big' bodies if you can find spare 40k ork heads somewhere

Cronch wrote:
Great value for money, but not as good as the Dominion starter box.

Meh, nothing will beat 8th edition 40K/2nd edition AoS in this regard. I bought Tempest of Souls with Dominion and was shocked to see ToS being the same size (if thinner) for 1/3 of the money Dominion cost. Hell, the big starters both were the same size and cost like 60% of Dominion

That's not the apples to apples comparison. Soul Wars was the 2.0 flagship starter, the closest product to Dominon. Tempest of Souls was the mid-range offering, closer to the new "Harbinger" kit they just announced today.

Wake me when the hobgrots are available separate. That's the only unit that really grabs me.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/07/12/broken-realms-fiction-the-scales-of-victory/
A nice story about Seraphon reviving the dragon race that fought cranknos, leaving absolutely no doubt that Stormcast are getting new models because of that.

Ha ha stinky seraphon, you thought you'd get new models to replace your ancient saurus cavalry? Peasants.

Starter sets look like what I expected. Glad to see the three-level system is continuing; I think that is a great way to offer multiple price points. Also glad to see a full fold-out plus terrain in the large one. I personally prefer that to straight miniatures as it better represents the complete package of what Warhammer is.

Thumbs up from me unless they screw us over with the prices.

Not in a hurry to buy anything, but the terrain in the big set speaks to me. And I like that the Sigmarine bodyguard unit is in the kit. Was worried it was going to be the fat guys.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Starter sets look like what I expected. Glad to see the three-level system is continuing; I think that is a great way to offer multiple price points. Also glad to see a full fold-out plus terrain in the large one. I personally prefer that to straight miniatures as it better represents the complete package of what Warhammer is.

Thumbs up from me unless they screw us over with the prices.

I know raising prices is GW's favorite pastime, but I can't see this release that so predictably mirrors 40k's to come at higher prices. Not for starter sets.

 Geifer wrote:
Not in a hurry to buy anything, but the terrain in the big set speaks to me. And I like that the Sigmarine bodyguard unit is in the kit. Was worried it was going to be the fat guys.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Starter sets look like what I expected. Glad to see the three-level system is continuing; I think that is a great way to offer multiple price points. Also glad to see a full fold-out plus terrain in the large one. I personally prefer that to straight miniatures as it better represents the complete package of what Warhammer is.

Thumbs up from me unless they screw us over with the prices.

I know raising prices is GW's favorite pastime, but I can't see this release that so predictably mirrors 40k's to come at higher prices. Not for starter sets.

From sprue distribution it was easy to see fat guys, banner and yndrasta will be separate 70-80 pound sprue ala necron/marine in indomitus

No doubt, but I wasn't so invested in the release to follow it that closely. Big box with big price tag that only has two models I like was a quick write off to me.

tneva82 wrote:

 Geifer wrote:
Not in a hurry to buy anything, but the terrain in the big set speaks to me. And I like that the Sigmarine bodyguard unit is in the kit. Was worried it was going to be the fat guys.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Starter sets look like what I expected. Glad to see the three-level system is continuing; I think that is a great way to offer multiple price points. Also glad to see a full fold-out plus terrain in the large one. I personally prefer that to straight miniatures as it better represents the complete package of what Warhammer is.

Thumbs up from me unless they screw us over with the prices.

I know raising prices is GW's favorite pastime, but I can't see this release that so predictably mirrors 40k's to come at higher prices. Not for starter sets.

From sprue distribution it was easy to see fat guys, banner and yndrasta will be separate 70-80 pound sprue ala necron/marine in indomitus

80? Try 110.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Geifer wrote:
Not in a hurry to buy anything, but the terrain in the big set speaks to me. And I like that the Sigmarine bodyguard unit is in the kit. Was worried it was going to be the fat guys.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Starter sets look like what I expected. Glad to see the three-level system is continuing; I think that is a great way to offer multiple price points. Also glad to see a full fold-out plus terrain in the large one. I personally prefer that to straight miniatures as it better represents the complete package of what Warhammer is.

Thumbs up from me unless they screw us over with the prices.

I know raising prices is GW's favorite pastime, but I can't see this release that so predictably mirrors 40k's to come at higher prices. Not for starter sets.

From sprue distribution it was easy to see fat guys, banner and yndrasta will be separate 70-80 pound sprue ala necron/marine in indomitus

80? Try 110.

Necron sprue 68,marine 89. There's limit even my pessimism.

 Irbis wrote:

Why?

Because I expected there to be at least one *big* model for the starter set, and obviously Yndrasta is just too good for that.

GW has put out a great guide for how to have a wholesome tournament experience: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/07/15/metawatch-a-beginners-guide-to-the-tournament-scene/

The caveat being that following their advice one will lose (lol that SGL list). But it is likely to be an enjoyable experience anyways and maybe that is the point they are trying to make.

GW has never really, in all its years, been serious about the competitive side. The fact that their core rules changes every edition suggests they take much more of a "dnd" style approach toward rules instead of the Magic the Gathering approach.

 Overread wrote:
GW has never really, in all its years, been serious about the competitive side. The fact that their core rules changes every edition suggests they take much more of a "dnd" style approach toward rules instead of the Magic the Gathering approach.

Reason why MTG works this way is because they sell cards, not rules. They have only value with a game - unlike miniatures you can just buy for the pleasure of building / painting them. That's why all the rules are "free" with their decks.

Also, the turnover between each edition in MTG is way faster than GW. You would lose your players if your core rules changed as often.

Sarouan wrote:
Also, the turnover between each edition in MTG is way faster than GW. You would lose your players if your core rules changed as often.

Long time since I played MtG. Type 2 used to rotate every 2 years. That isn't much different to GW's churn and burn cycle with it's printed material.

 Gimgamgoo wrote:
Type 2 used to rotate every 2 years. That isn't much different to GW's churn and burn cycle with it's printed material.

Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader 1st 1987 6 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 2nd Edition Rulebook 2nd 1993 5 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 3rd Edition Rulebook 3rd 1998 6 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 4th Edition Rulebook 4th 2004 4 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 5th Edition Rulebook 5th 2008 4 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 6th Edition Rulebook 6th 2012 4 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 7th Edition Rulebook 7th 2014 2 Yr

Sauce

8th was 2017 so 3 years. Still only one 2 year period for 40k but the time between editions is certainly shrinking. For AoS it has been three years between each: 2015, 2018, and 2021. I'd be happy with at least four years between editions but doubt that is going to happen.

 Ahtman wrote:

 Gimgamgoo wrote:
Type 2 used to rotate every 2 years. That isn't much different to GW's churn and burn cycle with it's printed material.

Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader 1st 1987 6 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 2nd Edition Rulebook 2nd 1993 5 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 3rd Edition Rulebook 3rd 1998 6 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 4th Edition Rulebook 4th 2004 4 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 5th Edition Rulebook 5th 2008 4 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 6th Edition Rulebook 6th 2012 4 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 7th Edition Rulebook 7th 2014 2 Yr

Sauce

8th was 2017 so 3 years. Still only one 2 year period for 40k but the time between editions is certainly shrinking. For AoS it has been three years between each: 2015, 2018, and 2021. I'd be happy with at least four years between editions but doubt that is going to happen.

If 6th was released in 2012 and 7th in 2014, thats 2 years and not 4.

It is marked as 2 years - its 4 years from 2008 to 2012

 Overread wrote:
It is marked as 2 years - its 4 years from 2008 to 2012

Which doesn't fit with Rogue Trader entry. Rogue Trader was released in 1987 and was replaced by 2nd edition in 1993 for a six year lifespan.

Warhammer 40,000 6th Edition Rulebook 6th 2012 4 Yr

So the 6th edition entry should be when 6th was released in 2012 and was replaced by 7th edition in 2014 for a two year lifespan. not a four year lifespan. Each entry should be Edition/Release Date/Lifespan, but it changes at the end of the list.

Well now I can only see the odd shift but it still doesn't change the years between editions. I wonder if it wasn't supposed to have anything after 7th edition and what was at 6th should have been the 2 so something like this:

Warhammer 40,000 5th Edition Rulebook 5th 2008 4 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 6th Edition Rulebook 6th 2012 2 Yr
Warhammer 40,000 7th Edition Rulebook 7th 2014

MTG simply isn't comparable to wargaming anyways--in all my years of playing both I've never seen an analogy between the two that actually works.

Sarouan wrote:

 Overread wrote:
GW has never really, in all its years, been serious about the competitive side. The fact that their core rules changes every edition suggests they take much more of a "dnd" style approach toward rules instead of the Magic the Gathering approach.

Reason why MTG works this way is because they sell cards, not rules. They have only value with a game - unlike miniatures you can just buy for the pleasure of building / painting them. That's why all the rules are "free" with their decks.

Also, the turnover between each edition in MTG is way faster than GW. You would lose your players if your core rules changed as often.

And gw sells miniatures. With goal of changing rules all the time that people change armies chasing best list thinking they are cunning figuring out the obvious list.

For gw rules are just way to get people buy models

tneva82 wrote:

Sarouan wrote:

 Overread wrote:
GW has never really, in all its years, been serious about the competitive side. The fact that their core rules changes every edition suggests they take much more of a "dnd" style approach toward rules instead of the Magic the Gathering approach.

Reason why MTG works this way is because they sell cards, not rules. They have only value with a game - unlike miniatures you can just buy for the pleasure of building / painting them. That's why all the rules are "free" with their decks.

Also, the turnover between each edition in MTG is way faster than GW. You would lose your players if your core rules changed as often.

And gw sells miniatures. With goal of changing rules all the time that people change armies chasing best list thinking they are cunning figuring out the obvious list.

For gw rules are just way to get people buy models

I don't think rephrasing the statement "a business exists to make money" is effectively delivering whatever point you are trying to make. Like yeah, we know. That's what businesses do.

 KidCthulhu wrote:
Wake me when the hobgrots are available separate. That's the only unit that really grabs me.

Very cool models, literally worthless rules. You'll auto lose from brining them unless the codex adds some support rules or revisions. They're below dumpster trash.

Can't wait to see the chaos dwarves. these hobgobs makes me pretty sure they are coming soon