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2021/09/08 17:08:52
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Another thing I have been thinking about for a few days is Ghazghkull.
While he got worse, can no longer be healed and is quite expensive for what he does I see some reasons to bring him.
For one mixed lists with different clan detachments are what most armies are bringing anyway and Goffs are still seeing some play - so he might just roll with it.
His big Waaagh can make our vehicle shooting quite dangerous but he would also buff all those Kommandos, Stormboys and Squig units.
You could even take him in a Death Skull or Freebooters Detachment and take a killy Goff Warboss / Trike if you feel like it.
But well, if you take Ghazzi I see no real reason not to swap the Wartrike for a Beastboss on Squiggosaurus.
I am also trying to figure where to put Ghazz, the problem i have with him is, he does not fit anywhere in my current lists, he is too slow with a M:7 while costing 300points. So all your army is really fast and he is left behind. For 300 points it is difficult to justify with out building a list around him? Not sure how to put him, he is a good deterrent, but feels niche? Not sure how to think about him.
There is enough high value targets in that list that ghaz will mostly be ignored first turn. Problem is even with him move, adv turn 1, and move, adv, and charge turn 2 he’s still limited enough with movement your opponent can control who ghaz can engage with. Furthermore his weapon change makes it worse when ghaz needs to advance each turn to get in range of melee. It’s better just to make the same list without ghaz in the end.
Spoiler:
Battalion- klan: Goff
Beastboss on squig- warlord trait:Brutal but kunnin, relic1:headwompa choppa
Mega bigMek- tellyporta blasta, relic2:da shiny shoota -1cp
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
10x boys (nob w/pk)- trukk boys specialist
3x squigriders
3x squigriders
3x squigriders
Killrig- frazzle, spirit of gork
Killrig- frazzle, squiggly curse
Dedicated transport: trukk
Outrider-deathskulls -3cp
Warboss on bike- relic3:killaklaw, bigboss trait:ard as nails, -2cp
Grotrebel wrote: Well he can still put up to 9 Buggies in strategic Reserve for free while deploying, so if he runs out of space he can just go for that.
What baffles me more is how he got his hands on 9 Squigbuggies.
Probably conversions of some sort, that or he looted it from unsuspecting players. You can do it IRL even if you can't do it in game as a strat anymore!
2021/09/08 20:11:53
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
they could be kitbashes, or 3d prints if thats allowed there. I mean, a squigbuggy is literally a trukk with squigs on it lol. Lop off the overhead bars that go over the trukk bed, add some squigs (bomb squigs, attack squigs, or just greenstuff toothy things) and change the bigshoota to be more of a small kannon.
I actually used my squigbuggy as a trukk in the past because for a joke list i wanted 4 trukks and didnt feel like building a 4th one lol
Personally, i hate it when people spam a single unit to the max. Especially when theyre expensive enough to take a large chunk of the list in the process. All it does is draw attention to that model and eventually get it nerfed. Even if the only reason it was that strong was because of the sheer numbers on the field.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/09/08 20:17:03
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys
2021/09/08 20:18:50
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Its interesting that Blood Axe seems to be the most popular kultur by a fair margin. A second Deathskull detachment for ObSec also seems quite meta:
For example, see this list that Darren Jac got 2nd with at Alberta GT:
No wonder - how else are you gona deal with elf mellee that's so dominant in high comp meta. Heck, even grey knights and some other Marines are aiming for t1 charge.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Freebootas are also a bit wasted on squigbuggies. And they tend to spam specifically out of Los shooting variants.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/09/08 21:44:03
2021/09/09 01:24:08
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Grotrebel wrote: Well he can still put up to 9 Buggies in strategic Reserve for free while deploying, so if he runs out of space he can just go for that.
What baffles me more is how he got his hands on 9 Squigbuggies.
But dont he need to deploy them first before he can put them in strategic reserve for free with blood axes?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
OOTN wrote: So, is it legal to put a non trukkboy character in a trukk with trukkboys?
as it stands now? sure. because the trukk doesnt change keyword, the trukkboys do.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/09 04:58:39
Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.
- About Dawn of War 3
2021/09/09 08:50:26
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Another thing I have been thinking about for a few days is Ghazghkull.
While he got worse, can no longer be healed and is quite expensive for what he does I see some reasons to bring him.
For one mixed lists with different clan detachments are what most armies are bringing anyway and Goffs are still seeing some play - so he might just roll with it.
His big Waaagh can make our vehicle shooting quite dangerous but he would also buff all those Kommandos, Stormboys and Squig units.
You could even take him in a Death Skull or Freebooters Detachment and take a killy Goff Warboss / Trike if you feel like it.
But well, if you take Ghazzi I see no real reason not to swap the Wartrike for a Beastboss on Squiggosaurus.
I am also trying to figure where to put Ghazz, the problem i have with him is, he does not fit anywhere in my current lists, he is too slow with a M:7 while costing 300points. So all your army is really fast and he is left behind. For 300 points it is difficult to justify with out building a list around him? Not sure how to put him, he is a good deterrent, but feels niche? Not sure how to think about him.
There is enough high value targets in that list that ghaz will mostly be ignored first turn. Problem is even with him move, adv turn 1, and move, adv, and charge turn 2 he’s still limited enough with movement your opponent can control who ghaz can engage with. Furthermore his weapon change makes it worse when ghaz needs to advance each turn to get in range of melee. It’s better just to make the same list without ghaz in the end.
Spoiler:
Battalion- klan: Goff
Beastboss on squig- warlord trait:Brutal but kunnin, relic1:headwompa choppa
Mega bigMek- tellyporta blasta, relic2:da shiny shoota -1cp
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
10x boys (nob w/pk)- trukk boys specialist
3x squigriders
3x squigriders
3x squigriders
Killrig- frazzle, spirit of gork
Killrig- frazzle, squiggly curse
Dedicated transport: trukk
Outrider-deathskulls -3cp
Warboss on bike- relic3:killaklaw, bigboss trait:ard as nails, -2cp
Yeah, thx for the lists . But it's like your saying, the moment you remove gaz you realise you don't need him in the first place. Really sad, love the model, probably use for 1k games though.
2021/09/09 09:05:49
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
koooaei wrote: No wonder - how else are you gona deal with elf mellee that's so dominant in high comp meta. Heck, even grey knights and some other Marines are aiming for t1 charge.
How do we deal with T1 charges? There seems to be a couple of strategies:
Blood axe kultur
Midfield screening with kommandos
Rezmekkas redder paint on a squigboss
Supercharging the KFF turn 1 for a 5++ save
Deploying further back, if you have a higher threat range (trukk boyz for example)
Ragequitting and flipping the table if you dont get first turn
2021/09/09 09:22:44
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
But 5++ KFF in melee is a good point, in my recent games I've completely forgotten that this is a thing.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/09/09 10:06:17
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Deploy fully in back, screening units in front (of my deploy or kommandos) and 5++ invu.
Screeing in your deploy or kommand style depends on enemy.
Typical situation are Mortarion/Big Tyranids/Big Deamons - simply the bastards that FLY. Because they don 't care about you kommandos in front. Jump over them and charge. Important is to position you units such way, there is no space for their base between your protected units and screening units. Use the terrain into your adventage. Two grots on the Container deny this dudes a place to sit there. Plus you need to have the front of the screening units in front enough, bastards cannot pile in into your protected units.
So you need build a move blocking wall 4+” in front with no holes big enough for the Bastards base.
And be care about the tricks with 6” consolidation
Sometimes, it could be a really hard puzzle.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/09/09 10:14:02
Vineheart01 wrote: they could be kitbashes, or 3d prints if thats allowed there.
Personally, i hate it when people spam a single unit to the max. Especially when theyre expensive enough to take a large chunk of the list in the process.
All it does is draw attention to that model and eventually get it nerfed. Even if the only reason it was that strong was because of the sheer numbers on the field.
Yes I agree, I think scrapjets and sguigbuggies were already on the radar for a nerf next chance GW gets. With that sort of list getting top three positions in tournaments, the ping on the radar only gets stronger. This is just bad news for us.
Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh
2021/09/09 13:50:32
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Yes I agree, I think scrapjets and sguigbuggies were already on the radar for a nerf next chance GW gets. With that sort of list getting top three positions in tournaments, the ping on the radar only gets stronger. This is just bad news for us.
Nothing like this happen. Such build is not strong enough. Look at the GT results. Well, some orks there or there. Mostly players known for years for beeing good with orks.
What I expect to be a hell is the arrive of Killrig and Squigosaur from china to the market. That could be wild!
Vineheart01 wrote: they could be kitbashes, or 3d prints if thats allowed there.
Personally, i hate it when people spam a single unit to the max. Especially when theyre expensive enough to take a large chunk of the list in the process.
All it does is draw attention to that model and eventually get it nerfed. Even if the only reason it was that strong was because of the sheer numbers on the field.
Yes I agree, I think scrapjets and sguigbuggies were already on the radar for a nerf next chance GW gets. With that sort of list getting top three positions in tournaments, the ping on the radar only gets stronger. This is just bad news for us.
That would be a very low blow, considering the Add mech and Drukkari issue. I don't see Orks as in the top, well at least if i cared for being meta, i wouldn't be collecting orks. We have some nice toys and good stuff to play, but in a balanced position of power, funny, something that GW should aim for.. sort off...
2021/09/09 14:46:27
Subject: Re:Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
GLORIOUS NEWS FROM THE GROTVOLUSHUNARY FRONT COMRADES
Ahem. I have actually been managing to win and contest games with my grotvolushun list against quasi-competitive opponents. Well, opponents using the Drukhari and Admech codexes, if not using them in *particularly* crazy competitive configurations (my admech opponent self-limits to 10 skitarii and does take their special weaponry, and my drukhari opponent runs pure kabalites rather than the current kabal+wych cult meta setup)
This is my current 2k setup:
Spoiler:
Goffs Supreme Command Detachment
Ghazghkull Thraka 300 (Warlord, my converted 'Grotzghkull' model)
Goffs Battalion
Mek Boss Buzzgob 100 (Da Red Gobbo and da revolooshunary kommittee)
Makari 65
Beastboss on Squigosaur 145 (extra warlord trait, brutal but kunnin', relic 'eadwhoppas Killchoppa) (Loonboss on Mangler Squigs model)
10x Stormboyz 110 (Boingrot Bounderz)
4x Grot Tanks with 5x Rokkits 190
Grot Megatank with 7x rokkits 160
6x killa kanz with rokkits 330
3x Deff Dreads, 2 with 2 scorchas 275 (a looted Carnifex covered in gretchins, an old metal deff dread as a 'mega kan' and a looted venerable dread/killa kan kitbash)
1x Kustom Mega Kannon 45
Weaponry capable of efficiently destroying our redoubtable armored units most commonly resides in extravagant edifices of the excesses of the bourgeoisie known as 'Elite Units' and 'Vehicles' so we have armed our initial turn 1 fullisade with enough rokkits to blow up the moon.
on turn 2, at the sound of the whistle from the GKVD Kommissar, codename Grotzghkull will initiate "The People's Waagh" which enables the melee-capable units to advance and charge the enemy while any of our rokkit units that could inconceivably have been removed by enemy attacks will be more than made up for with a blistering AP of -3.
The primary tricks up this list's sleeves are:
-Makari's good good flag provides a FNP to all GOFFS units, including deff dreads kanz grot tanks etc, and does not just provide it to CORE, so the grots all hide and let the T7 3+ FNP-having vehicles take the turn 1 hits
-Mek Boss Buzzgob grants +1 to hit to a unit of killa kanz and also has a flat 4 repair which he generally gets to make use of at least twice over the course of the game. Most of my opponents have focused on the deff dreads initially as they are kind of the distraction carnifex (one of them more literally than the others) of the list and that has allowed the glorious rokkit fullisade to really just tear it up regardless of whether i go first or second.
-I might consider bringing a KFF mek in there? My drukhari opponent went first against me, rolled up into blaster range with the raiders and had enough firepower to remove 2 of the deff dreads cleanly, and left the third one with 2HP. on my turn i responded by popping the peoples' waagh immediately, and ghazzy, the squigoss and the last dread were all easily in krumping range of kabalites after I busted them out of their boats, I wound up just owning the midboard top of turn 2 with a whole bunch of threatening gak and ghaz went hogwild all over an opponent who basically only did damage in the shooting phase. So maybe cutting AP-3 and AP-4 firepower down even more would help keep 2 dreads alive instead of 1 but i'd basically be exchanging buzzgob for that capability and I really really liked the 3+BS killa kanz.
"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"
2021/09/10 01:01:38
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Jidmah wrote: A proppa ork would throw the table at the enemy.
But 5++ KFF in melee is a good point, in my recent games I've completely forgotten that this is a thing.
I am running 3 Patrols in my list right now, its a hardcore Alpha strike list, but maybe a Big Mek with KFF would be a "ok"ish addition to throw into a Trukk for that turn 2 beta strike. Have him explode his KFF for a 5++ and maybe give the Alpha striking units a chance to survive turn 2 if they need it. Only problem is that the list revolves around doing as much dmg as physically possible turn 1 to limit my opponents return strike on turn 2 and a Big Mek with KFF in Mega armor is ridiculously over priced at 115pts. If he was about 30pts cheaper he might have a place in my list, but at 115 its just too much of a liability.
Oh, so you want him without the armour, gun, CCW? I mean, there is just such a unit!
But honestly, in the games I've played the extra stuff you pay for when you upgrade to mega armour will usually come in handy at some point or another. At the very least the ability to take the DDS makes him a credible shooting threat.
2021/09/10 05:27:52
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
I expect ad mech and druk to get hit harder than us. We will get hit perhaps only on scrapjets and sguig buggies, and nowhere else, which would be ok I guess ? I hope other stuff goes down like flash gitz, who need to go down to 20 ppm
Two buggies totally overshadow the others, no one takes the others in top lists, so it is logical to reshuffle that situation imho
Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh
2021/09/10 05:47:14
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
addnid wrote: I expect ad mech and druk to get hit harder than us. We will get hit perhaps only on scrapjets and sguig buggies, and nowhere else, which would be ok I guess ? I hope other stuff goes down like flash gitz, who need to go down to 20 ppm
Two buggies totally overshadow the others, no one takes the others in top lists, so it is logical to reshuffle that situation imho
Realistically, boyz need to go down a point or two at least, given how iffy they are with all the changes they got too. I'm not sure FG are at 20ppm range, maybe 24. Tankbustas and Lootas both need to go down substantially, since the T5 is definitely overstated when it comes to adding resiliency to those units.
2021/09/10 06:51:46
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
I wouldn't expect too much from the FAQ. We already know that GW won't be doing any re-balancing unless there absolutely is a need to do so, they especially won't buff anything.
And even if Scrapjets and Squigbuggies should receive nerfs, it won't be with the first FAQ, but later this year.
Don't set yourself up for disappointment when we know exactly what's coming.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/09/10 07:00:58
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Beardedragon wrote: 20 ppm for a flash git? A loota is 17 points and only has 1 wound. But then again, Lootas are too expensive id say at even 17.
Lootas should be 15 at the very max. I would only start playing lootas at 14 ppm I think. Depending on the speeswaagh passenger AP "bonus or nos bonus" of course. FGitz yeah perhaps 22 points then, 24 still seems a bit much. We would take a deff dredd every day over 3,5 FGits no ?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/10 07:03:49
Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh
2021/09/10 07:18:27
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Flash gits should be priced around moving, not around standing still.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
2021/09/10 08:36:07
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Jidmah wrote: I wouldn't expect too much from the FAQ. We already know that GW won't be doing any re-balancing unless there absolutely is a need to do so, they especially won't buff anything.
And even if Scrapjets and Squigbuggies should receive nerfs, it won't be with the first FAQ, but later this year.
Don't set yourself up for disappointment when we know exactly what's coming.
Yeah, this. Ork codex is too new to get FAQed, I don't expect any change before 2022. Heck, it hasn't even been properly released yet.
2021/09/10 09:10:13
Subject: Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics
Jidmah wrote: Flash gits should be priced around moving, not around standing still.
Totally, and being a fairly recent kit, it is strange GW made no effort at all with these in terms of rules and in terms of PPM analysis. Their time will come though, I just know it Perhaps 2022, perhaps 2023... But their time will come !! More dakka ! (to me the most recent models are the epitome of dakka !!)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/10 09:10:49
Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh
10k p fullpaint orks ready to krump! …
An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang. 
14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
Chaos 
3000 
Daemons: 
Orks: 
IG: 
Ogres: 
TS: 2000
. But it's like your saying, the moment you remove gaz you realise you don't need him in the first place. Really sad, love the model, probably use for 1k games though.
