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gungo wrote:
I mean your list screams bloodaxe..
Deffskulls encourage kommandos or stormboys for obj secured units
Freebooters wants you to go in heavy on freebooters and load up on Dakka shooting.
And bloodaxes if mostly for buggyspam using fallback and charge or shoot.

My kommandos and stormboys are all in my Deathskulls patrol for the ObSec, and that bit's non-negotiable at the moment

I think Freebootaz isn't working out for me because I need to double down on it and load up on Mek guns, jets, etc to force the kulture to go off rather than it being kind of self contained like it currently is.

Deathskulls and Blood Axes both add durability, but I think I prefer Blood Axes for the hit penalty and fall back and shoot/charge over the save against mortals

Ya I was talking about the outrider detachment that’s already bloodaxe.. that detachment is designed for bloodaxe.
All your points regarding freebooters etc I agree with.

What are your guys thoughts on a kultur to run a list centered around using trukk boyz (4 x 12), a battle wagon filled with 20 boyz and 3 dreads?

 owni wrote:
What are your guys thoughts on a kultur to run a list centered around using trukk boyz (4 x 12), a battle wagon filled with 20 boyz and 3 dreads?

How do you get four detachments? Isn't that only for 3k games?

 JNAProductions wrote:

 owni wrote:
What are your guys thoughts on a kultur to run a list centered around using trukk boyz (4 x 12), a battle wagon filled with 20 boyz and 3 dreads?

How do you get four detachments? Isn't that only for 3k games?

Yeah, I was about to mention that myself. Unless he means boyz in trukks in general, which I find unlikely. Either way, a mechanized list is hard to run with Orks right now that doesn't have a buggy base to soak up the fire. I'd say Blood Axes are pretty decent for the redeploy strat, otherwise I'd say generally most of the other Klanz don't synergize that well with transport heavy Orks, especially for the units you currently have.

Sorry didn't mean specialists, used to just calling boyz I'm taking in trukkz that name.

Okay, so you think blood axes over deffskullz? I am not a huge fan of the way the buggies look for some reason.

 Blackie wrote:
Blood Axes' list has the 25 points Mek as Warlord, absolutely brilliant .

oh yea he does. So i guess he wont cast any Waaaghs at all. that or he cheated and did it anyway

 owni wrote:
Sorry didn't mean specialists, used to just calling boyz I'm taking in trukkz that name.

Okay, so you think blood axes over deffskullz? I am not a huge fan of the way the buggies look for some reason.

Blood axes are about fall back and shoot, deathskull about spamming obj sec specialists. Your list seems to be melee oriented, I'd definitely suggest going Goffs. At least for the detachment involving the units you mentioned.

Agree, the only way to make non-specialist boyz do anything is by running them as goff.

 Jidmah wrote:
Agree, the only way to make non-specialist boyz do anything is by running them as goff.

While I would never call myself a competitive player (if only because I don't participate in tournaments), I would agree with that statement. My current ork list uses four squads of Goff boyz mounted on trukks for a turn 2 assault and it has been working fairly well. Without Goff though, the charge would lack some serious punch. The extra point of strength and the exploding hits on 6s (or fives for 2cp) really helps to carry a squad of boyz from astoundingly meh to actually pretty darn good against anything but the toughest infantry or vehicles. If you have non-specialist boyz, either you are paying "the troop tax" or you a are gimping yourself on purpose.

This may be a very stupid newbie question but I’m seeing lots of these army lists that don’t run Boyz but do run StormBoyz or more often than not Kommandos. I’m guessing these are usually 2000pt list with and they always have 2 detachments but it never says what type of detachment. Are they vanguard detachments that allow people 2 run 3 units of Kommandos?

DoktaRoksta wrote:
This may be a very stupid newbie question but I’m seeing lots of these army lists that don’t run Boyz but do run StormBoyz or more often than not Kommandos. I’m guessing these are usually 2000pt list with and they always have 2 detachments but it never says what type of detachment. Are they vanguard detachments that allow people 2 run 3 units of Kommandos?

Usually it depends on the context. A lot of lists run a vanguard detachment followed by two patrols. Or it's 3 patrol detachments since then you have more than enough slots to max out the FA and Elites slots for Kommandos and Stormboyz. If you are using a buggy list, then you want at least a vanguard to go with a patrol, since you're more likely than not going to use up all 6 slots on buggies and then the remaining 2 slots from the patrol on Stormboyz.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Jidmah wrote:
Agree, the only way to make non-specialist boyz do anything is by running them as goff.

If you're going Goff Heavy, is worth bringing Ghazzy at all? Or is it safer just to rely on Squigosaur Beastbosses and the Warboss on Warbike?

I mean you can bring ghaz for fun but he’s objectively worse then a beastboss on squig. He’s like almost decent but his lack of fast movement, no sweep atk, and almost reliance on dual Waagh makes it hard to fully utilize him. But he’s still a beat stick that usually last 2 turns even if focus fired by most armies.

DoktaRoksta wrote:
This may be a very stupid newbie question but I’m seeing lots of these army lists that don’t run Boyz but do run StormBoyz or more often than not Kommandos. I’m guessing these are usually 2000pt list with and they always have 2 detachments but it never says what type of detachment. Are they vanguard detachments that allow people 2 run 3 units of Kommandos?

At 2000 points you can field two patrols and an outrider detachment, which is one of the most common combinations you see in tournaments. 10 Fast attacks and 6 Elite slots available in total. A single battallion also allows 6 Elites, so the vanguard detachment is something that is never considered for orks.

gungo wrote:
I mean you can bring ghaz for fun but he’s objectively worse then a beastboss on squig. He’s like almost decent but his lack of fast movement, no sweep atk, and almost reliance on dual Waagh makes it hard to fully utilize him. But he’s still a beat stick that usually last 2 turns even if focus fired by most armies.

Well, I approach this from the other side - if your melee focused goff army has enough things that benefit from a speedwaaagh, like scrapjets, warbikers, dreads, koptas, killrigs or a gorkanaut, then he worth running Thrakka.

From a purely competitive point of view, he went back to being way too expensive for what he brings to the table. Even if you optimize an army to make best use out of Thrakka, that very same army often ends up better when run as a different clan with a squigboss or bikerboss.

 Jidmah wrote:

gungo wrote:
I mean you can bring ghaz for fun but he’s objectively worse then a beastboss on squig. He’s like almost decent but his lack of fast movement, no sweep atk, and almost reliance on dual Waagh makes it hard to fully utilize him. But he’s still a beat stick that usually last 2 turns even if focus fired by most armies.

Well, I approach this from the other side - if your melee focused goff army has enough things that benefit from a speedwaaagh, like scrapjets, warbikers, dreads, koptas, killrigs or a gorkanaut, then he worth running Thrakka.

From a purely competitive point of view, he went back to being way too expensive for what he brings to the table. Even if you optimize an army to make best use out of Thrakka, that very same army often ends up better when run as a different clan with a squigboss or bikerboss.

Keep in mind the triplle Killtank list few weeks old. This was based on synergy of the units + goff + Ghazzy.

Similar synergy list could be made with the killrigs… maybe…

I honestly still think kill rigs are overhyped and they benefit nowhere nearly as much from a speedwaaagh as a killtank does.

People are finishing up their kill rigs rigs right about now, this and next week they should be hitting tournaments in force. We'll see if they make a splash then.

If you use brutal but kunning on a squigosaur boss, and you miss all 3 hits with the jaw attacks of the squig, do you get 3 extra attacks with the squig, or 3 extra attacks with the normal attack profile of the ork?

Beardedragon wrote:
If you use brutal but kunning on a squigosaur boss, and you miss all 3 hits with the jaw attacks of the squig, do you get 3 extra attacks with the squig, or 3 extra attacks with the normal attack profile of the ork?

No matter how many attacks you roll, you can never make more than 3 attacks with the jaw.

 Jidmah wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:
If you use brutal but kunning on a squigosaur boss, and you miss all 3 hits with the jaw attacks of the squig, do you get 3 extra attacks with the squig, or 3 extra attacks with the normal attack profile of the ork?

No matter how many attacks you roll, you can never make more than 3 attacks with the jaw.

alright, so those attacks gets thrown in to the ork ridings attacks? and im assuming the goff kulture giving extra hits on a 6, still gives you an extra hit for the jaws since its not an extra attack but a hit?

Correct.

Hello all, long time Ork player that just got hold of the new codex here.

My pride and joy is my Morkanaut and I have a question about using it this edition. Pic for attention!



In the old codex clan cultures affected ork detachments excluding Super Heavy Aux Detachments, in the new Codex all I can find is all ork detachments gain clans.

Both the specialist mobs and kustom jobs rules exclude Super heavy aux detachments but not the Clans rules.

This had me thinking that the Mork/Gorkanaut plus Stompa actually get Clan Cluture?

However, in the Reference section the detachment abilities section has an additional bullet point stating: This does not apply to Aux Support, Super-Heavy Aux support or Fort Network Dets.

Apart from being typically bad writing from GW what do you think takes prescendant here? The main rules or the reference section?

Cheers guys!

 Jidmah wrote:
Correct.

thanks. i only recently bought my first squig boss so its good info to have.

On a different subject, Do you guys ever have shooting armies with 2 squigbosses?

3 patrols would yield 6 fast attack slots, the slot we need for our buggies, so an outrider and a patrol would be better there (8 slots then), but you could only fit 1 squig boss then, as the other spot is reserved for the wartrike or warboss on warbike.

Im trying to think of a way to run 2 squigbosses but i always come back to speed waaaghs because i have very few kommandos and no stormboys, so a normal waaagh isnt great for what i have.

Even if i ran 3 patrols that would be 4CP spend, and most likely +3-4 extra CP for extra gubbinz and big boss stratagems for said 2 squigbosses. thats kind of CP expensive.

At the end of the day i always end up with 1 wartrike and 1 squigboss for my shooting armies with something like freebootas.


On a different note, it kind of annoys me how our army can be thrown in 4 major categories, but only 2,5 of said 4 categories are buffed by waaaghs.
- Infantry Melee --> full effect from normal waagh.(1)
- Infantry Shooting --> no buffs what so ever. I mean you could use a normal waaagh and run in to melee but if you are considering that why are you running infantry with ranged weapons? (0)
- Mechanized Melee ---> half an effect from normal waaaghs, but not super good given +1 attack for a singular model isnt super (0,5)
- Mechanized shooting --> full effect of a speed waaagh (1)

So basically infantry shooting gets nothing at all. Im not confused as to why no competitive lists run any real infantry shooting, because if you do you arent running an efficient army, and if you dont do that, you arent running a competitive list. An efficient army benefits from the waaagh you call, and infantry shooting simply dont. Which is a shame because i love to use infantry, i was never super keen on mechanized play.

I really dont know what they were thinking by leaving infantry shooting in the dirt like that, and people complain about buggy spam, when its the only way of really making an ork shooting army.

My list runs an outrider and two patrols, using a Bikerboss, wartrike and Squigboss. I could definitely replace the Bikerboss with another Squigboss if I wanted to exchange a blender for a blender.


As far as the infantry shooting goes, I think the only way to do it would be to load up on burnas and kombi skorchas and get up in their faces. We don't have enough infantry based volume to make up for the lack of vehicles, so it kind of relies on the charge after the shooting to mop up. Maybe if you went for 3x lootas, 3x flash gitz, 3x burnas, Shiny Shoota Mek, etc it might work, but then you're a gunline and can't take objectives well.


And as far as avoiding buggy spam goes, you could probably go triple kill tank with giga shootas, with kannon wagons in your heavy slots. You'd be trading off the manoeuverability of the buggies for the durability and raw firepower of the tanks, and still rely on kommandos, stormboys, etc to take objectives but I reckon it could be done as an alternative.

 Afrodactyl wrote:
My list runs an outrider and two patrols, using a Bikerboss, wartrike and Squigboss. I could definitely replace the Bikerboss with another Squigboss if I wanted to exchange a blender for a blender.


As far as the infantry shooting goes, I think the only way to do it would be to load up on burnas and kombi skorchas and get up in their faces. We don't have enough infantry based volume to make up for the lack of vehicles, so it kind of relies on the charge after the shooting to mop up. Maybe if you went for 3x lootas, 3x flash gitz, 3x burnas, Shiny Shoota Mek, etc it might work, but then you're a gunline and can't take objectives well.


And as far as avoiding buggy spam goes, you could probably go triple kill tank with giga shootas, with kannon wagons in your heavy slots. You'd be trading off the manoeuverability of the buggies for the durability and raw firepower of the tanks, and still rely on kommandos, stormboys, etc to take objectives but I reckon it could be done as an alternative.

but isnt spending 5CP on detatchments even before you spend extra on big boss and extra gubbinz alot? you end up spending like 8CP before the game even starts leaving you with 4CP.

Beardedragon wrote:


On a different subject, Do you guys ever have shooting armies with 2 squigbosses?

3 patrols would yield 6 fast attack slots, the slot we need for our buggies, so an outrider and a patrol would be better there (8 slots then), but you could only fit 1 squig boss then, as the other spot is reserved for the wartrike or warboss on warbike.

With two detachments, like 2x patrols or patrol + outrider, you get 4 slots for the HQs. You can fit 2 squig bosses, a wartrike and a biker boss all together.

 Blackie wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:


On a different subject, Do you guys ever have shooting armies with 2 squigbosses?

3 patrols would yield 6 fast attack slots, the slot we need for our buggies, so an outrider and a patrol would be better there (8 slots then), but you could only fit 1 squig boss then, as the other spot is reserved for the wartrike or warboss on warbike.

With two detachments, like 2x patrols or patrol + outrider, you get 4 slots for the HQs. You can fit 2 squig bosses, a wartrike and a biker boss all together.

But aren't there limitations on taking more than one Boss per detachment?

Beardedragon wrote:

 Afrodactyl wrote:
My list runs an outrider and two patrols, using a Bikerboss, wartrike and Squigboss. I could definitely replace the Bikerboss with another Squigboss if I wanted to exchange a blender for a blender.


As far as the infantry shooting goes, I think the only way to do it would be to load up on burnas and kombi skorchas and get up in their faces. We don't have enough infantry based volume to make up for the lack of vehicles, so it kind of relies on the charge after the shooting to mop up. Maybe if you went for 3x lootas, 3x flash gitz, 3x burnas, Shiny Shoota Mek, etc it might work, but then you're a gunline and can't take objectives well.


And as far as avoiding buggy spam goes, you could probably go triple kill tank with giga shootas, with kannon wagons in your heavy slots. You'd be trading off the manoeuverability of the buggies for the durability and raw firepower of the tanks, and still rely on kommandos, stormboys, etc to take objectives but I reckon it could be done as an alternative.

but isnt spending 5CP on detatchments even before you spend extra on big boss and extra gubbinz alot? you end up spending like 8CP before the game even starts leaving you with 4CP.

I start each game with 4CP and I only really use cloud of smoke and ramming speed as my go to strats, with careen and tide of muscle being situational back ups. You get an extra every turn for rerolls, so I don't really find myself needing more.

Yeah I agree, 4-5 CP works fine for me as well.
Ramming Speed is by far my most used strat, followed by CoS & FFB.
5 CP is the sweet spot for me, because that way I can pop all 3 strats turn 1 if there is the need for it.

Otherwise 3-5 CP for detachments and another 2-4 (depending on list) for relics/ wl traits is a good investment for orks and gives us more than having 10 CP.

But aren't there limitations on taking more than one Boss per detachment?

Yeah it's one per detachment, no matter what kind of warboss.

 Grotrebel wrote:
Yeah I agree, 4-5 CP works fine for me as well.
Ramming Speed is by far my most used strat, followed by CoS & FFB.
5 CP is the sweet spot for me, because that way I can pop all 3 strats turn 1 if there is the need for it.

Otherwise 3-5 CP for detachments and another 2-4 (depending on list) for relics/ wl traits is a good investment for orks and gives us more than having 10 CP.

Until there's an expansion book giving us some more strats, we effectively only really have 3 or 4 usable ones. I don't see the need in starting with more than a handful of CP.