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Forceride wrote:
Fantastic description SemperMortis!

Out of curiosity, have you seen any holes on your list so far? I am really interested how you would face against something similar or maybe like Tyranid stampede or lots of fight first , I think from Slanesh, would do to your list?
I am also curious how your list would handle something like Custodes or death guard where melee engagement isn't favourable because of all the shenanigans they can pull?
Also, have you had a chance to play the new tau, do you have any thoughts?

I hope you could share some light on that discussion since i would be very interested to hear your thoughts.

Biggest hole is the same as its always been. This is a tempo list, so if my opponent is able to counter turn 1 and turn 2 somehow its GG for me. I've been trying to "sneaky" play to the objectives as well to give myself some leeway in terms of VPs. For instance, Kommandos start the game on the objectives usually which means if I do go second I start the game holding 4 objectives which puts the onus on my opponent to shift my green butt off them. Likewise, Turn 1 as everything moves forward I have started to aim my Trukkz at those objectives as well which allows me to continue to hold them with cheap/throwaway units while pushing into their area. Generally speaking this helps in that turn 1 I hold 4, turn 2 I hold at least 3 and turn 3 i'm still on all 3 or possibly 4 which means my opponent never has a chance to catch me up on Primaries. What absolutely sucks for me is the secondaries. Behind Enemy lines is a given since my army likes to be "Behind enemy lines" after that its a toss up for Nachmund and mission secondary.

1 thing I have noticed about Trukk Meganobz though is that while yeah they are definitely better than Trukkboyz as far as putting out dmg on tougher targets, they do seem ....rather mediocre still. Giving them a 4th attack in their profile would have been nice, or making Ork Powerklaws not -1 to hit, but something has to be done to offset their rather lackluster CC abilities for their price. I mean, Kommandos out perform Meganobz with relative ease against all targets. 4 Meganobz against a T7 3+ target get 12 attacks, 6 hits, 4 wounds and 6.7ish dmg. 9 Kommandos and a PK Nob cost about the same and they do 27 attacks, 18 hits, 9 wounds for 4.5dmg and the PK nob does 4 attacks, 2 hits and 1.66 wounds for 2.8ish dmg. So those Kommandos average 7.3ish dmg against the Meganobz ideal target. Against cheaper chaff units its much worse for the Meganobz. The only saving grace in my opinion is that those Meganobz aren't competing against Kommandos for a spot, they are competing against Boyz which are just god awful this edition.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Hunta rig has no reason to exist.

Its not a variant build, like completely different loadout but same frame and backbone abilities (snagga rules and the squig melee the same but otherwise different). Instead its exactly the same as the Kill Rig except the Kill Rig gets more stuff, and the stuff it gets is the main reason that frame is rude.
Had the Harpoon been an actual powerful weapon and only the Hunta Rig had it i could argue using it but right now its horrendous compared to the killrig and/or wagons with a rolla.

Tbh, 3 Kill rigs, 2 Hunta Rigs, with 50 Snaggas in a Bat / Patrol is actually a pretty stylish army, even if it would probably get dunked on pretty hard.

But yeah, the character keyword and 2 cast psyker for 50 points as well as a d3 autohitting lascannon? There's no reason to not ever just pay the 50 points.

I had two more games with Orks yesterday.
First one a rematch against Tau, this time i wanted to see how Ghazgkull would fare in a Goff pressure list and added 2 Squigbuggies for good meassure.
4 Trukk MA nobs were in the fun as well, to cut points i reduced the commandos to 5 - 5 - 6 and the Warbikers.

This time i went second, the Kroot took over the midfield and i lost about 400 points worth of stuff. It`s impossible to hide from all that indirect shooting.
My first turn i killed all the Kroot and managed to charge one squad of Crisis, but no real damage here. My Meganobs failed their 6" charge on his Bodyguard, which did not solely cost me the game but had a big importance.

After that it was an uphill battle, but 1 flank was completely gone which meant i couldn`t get ahead in scoring while i failed to hold foot in his deployment zone as well.

We played the same mission and almost the same lists as yesterday, and it feels like that matchup heavily depends on who goes first.

You can`t hide from all that out of LOS dakka.
Kroot will movement block your Kommandos and Trukkboys so it`s really really tough to get in some early charges.
All the stuff that ends up midfield will die. Fast. The pressure list has really poor staying power and Tau have the tools to deal with it.
Honestly i really think Speedmob is the better choice against Tau. Hell even a pure Green Tide supported by KFf and Dok might work better.

Goff pressure IS fun to play though, and i have the luck(?) to have some great (tournament) players in my hobby club, so i get to play a lot against different meta lists.


My second game yesterday was against new Eldar. Again i slightly changed my list:


His list looked odd at first, but oh boy.


We had a lot of terrain, but guess what - all his stuff wants either to shoot without LOS, get in close combat or do both.^^
Deployment as usual, Kommandos in cover, trukks hiding and the rest hiding between as far forward as possible.

He went first, put all his big dudes midfield and his indirect fire killed about 600 points of orks.
Good thing was, i had all units in charge range, so i could throw everything besides the Mek Guns and grot in close combat.
In my turn i managed to kill 1 Wraithseer, 1 Wraithlord, the 5 Rangers, 1 Farseer and got his Avatar down to 1 wound - soo close. :(
My left flank has been a giant moshpit that must have started with over 1500 points total while the right side was more about skirmishing and his dudes walking up slowly.

I lost another 300 points with him fighting back.
Objectives were mostly in my hand, but his second turn the Avatar killed everything besides the MA Warboss and 10 Boys who finally knocked him down.
On my other flank i lost all the other stuff and by the end of his turn i was down to MA Warboss, 10 Boys, 2 Bikes, 3 Mek Guns and gretchin.
Together they tried to do some final scoring and got off some charges, but i killed nothing and was tabled his turn 3. Score 97:20

You thought the Tau were good at shooting without LOS - get ready for this as you might face them soon.

Night Spinners each 48" 2D6 S7 AP2 D2
Wraithseers have the same D-Cannon as the Weapon Platform, so D3 shots 24" S12 AP4 and D2 + D6

They could add more but i guess thats what we will see most with indirect fire.

Lots of damage reduction, so bring the big guns or lots of S5 D1.


Strands of Fate are a miracle dice similar mechanic that will give the Eldar auto 6s on certain roll like charge, hit, wound and psi. Also saves which can be mean to tank your one Wazbom wound that got through and they still have a 6++ against.
Can make those D-Cannons very annoying.


Overall there seems to be a lot we can expect with the Eldar book but it`s not like Custodes were you basically have 1-2 builds with a little difference so keep an eye out for elfish trickery. (Harlies look nasty too, especially against Speed Mob).

Why did people stop using the exploding kff big Mek? It seems like it is ideal for protecting a goff pressure list that fails to go first. I mean it was better before when you stacked that 5++ with -1to hit from cloud of smoke… but it is still decent at protecting that backfield when everything is still in your deployment zone.
Since goff pressure is also getting into mega armor nobs as well it’s not bad taking the megaarmor bigmek either and just having him jump in the trukk after and help out.

 Grotrebel wrote:

His list looked odd at first, but oh boy.
Eldrad + 2 other Psyker HQ`s (2 Farseers i think)
Avatar
5 Ranger
3 Nightspinner
3 Wraithlords
3 Wraithseers

I love Wraith units but man that list seems a little cheesy. Wraithseers used to be an HQ unit so you could bring them with the D-Cannon and the character sniping warlord trait and really ruin someone's day. 3 of those plus Eldrad and other Psykers sounds positively painful. With only 5 Rangers I'm guessing he had a patrol so the other two Psykers were probably Warlocks. I think the Avatar is going to be difficult for many melee heavy armies to deal with.

gungo wrote:
Why did people stop using the exploding kff big Mek? It seems like it is ideal for protecting a goff pressure list that fails to go first. I mean it was better before when you stacked that 5++ with -1to hit from cloud of smoke… but it is still decent at protecting that backfield when everything is still in your deployment zone.
Since goff pressure is also getting into mega armor nobs as well it’s not bad taking the megaarmor bigmek either and just having him jump in the trukk after and help out.

The 6++ isn't super relevant on the MANz. If you're sitting in cover you're taking 4s and 5s a lot, and out of cover 5s or 6s against most weapons.

Frankly I just find the Big Mek with KFF of either variety way too expensive for what he brings. If you're bringing a ton of kanz and wagons it can be alright for turn 1 to pop the 5++, but the aggro style of ork list often starts with so little CP I'm not sure the 5++ is better than taking a few more bodies.

I mean it’s 5++ for that one crucial turn.. it was more prevalent for buggies pre-speedmob But they were worth more. But it seems alpha ork and goff pressure is crucial turn 1 and there really isn’t much else to do to protect them. You are right though the 2+ save likely means manz and trukks have at least some armor save.

im tempted to try running a tellyporta blasta bigmek. Ded Shiny Shoota is surprisingly lethal, but the tellyporta is only 12" so......and also assault so no badmoonz boost annoyingly.

Pre Speed Mob I used to run the MA Mek all the time, but right now neither Speed Mob nor Alphork can / want to take him.
Only lists I would take him is a Blood Axe utility force, Freebooters Speed Mob without actual Speed Mob and Green tide, all of which are kinda b Tier lists.


With the Custodes, Tau and soon Eldar being a big factor to consider I think the gap between our 2 main builds and those lists is a little closer. Speed Mob is good against Tau but Custodes is a real problem, especially if they run the banner. Alphork depends heavily on first turn against Tau and can't to real damage against Custodes, so it has some really bad maps that makes it hard to score good.
Eldar are kinda hard to predict, as they have multiple good units that hurt us a lot and good utility, but are really expensive. Depends what kind of list establishes here in the Tau / Custodes meta and which of out lists will be better against them.

I'd love to try a MAN & Kill Kan heavy list, but that's the one build I absolutely lack models for.


I have another tournament upcoming and about 2/3 of the armies will be Tau, Custodes or variances of pointy elves.
I decided to skip Alphork for the above reasons.
My Speed Mob had lots of games, so I feel kinda confident playing it.
But it is mediocre at scoring so I need to relay on doing enough damage.
Custodes Banner is a nightmare for them and Eldar might be ok.
Tau are a mixed bag. Speed Mob can do solid damage but Tau hit back hard. Crisis and Broadsides spam can be pretty hurtfull as well, and with the Kroot they have the edge on us in scoring unless Speed Mob goes first.
Our Bikes are the main angle on scoring here, but Tau can handle them pretty good as well as everything we throw there for engage, which will lead to a massive grind.


So I think I'm gonna go wild and go for Green Tide in the upcoming tournament.
I have 150 Grots and Boys each, 45 Komandos, 15 Stormboys and all the Characters needed.

General plan was 3 x 10 Kommandos, 3 x 5 Stormboys, 1 Squad of 30 boys for da jump, KFF, Dok, Warboss, Wyrdboy, maybe 1 Runtherd and the rest filled with Boys and Grots.

Not sure about 2 things:

Which Clan: Goffs help a little bit with Damage, ES help with getting those boys forward faster + advance & charge trait, DS give me lots of obsec and BA offer utility, especially neat tricks from the new book like tactical awareness.

2nd thing is Mob size. Multiple squads of 10 would help with all the indirect blast from Tau and Eldar but are harder to protect with KFF and Dok, which will on the other hand mostly be relevant for turns 1-2.

The characters are kinda bait for assassinate, as you could play them very passively and in an emergency place most of them in Reserve with a few Grot to deny points.
Squads of 10 would make TTL a real consideration if I skip the boy mob of 30 and take 3 expensive characters, which will reduce the amounts of bodies though.

Thoughts?

New Competitive Innovation are out. Orks score very well and have really above average number of armies in top 5 in compare to other armies*

Three in top 5 and one mighty victory!

Attrition Grand Tournament - 5th Luke Vincent with ES Speed Mob with 16 deffkoptas



Leodis February 2022 GT - 4th – Chris Taylor - ES Speed Mob with 3 Snazzwagons!


Broadsword Wargaming ITC Winter Major - 5th – Mark Morrow -Goff preasure list


Kent Wargames Feb GT - Ross Law 1st Place!§!! - and even comented on Goonhammer - FB Speed Mob



* I ignore Tau and Custodes for the pourpose of this statistic

I mean competitive innovation basically said there are only 5 armies that are above 50% win rate now… tau, custodes, tyranid, drukari and genecult…. Which is odd because outside of tau, custodes, Tyranids (crusher stampede) and forces of hivemind (leviathan/genecult) orks did well in placings compared to the rest.

But I appreciate someone at goonhammer finally admitted that the ork codex was absolutely mauled.

Yeah

Anyway, any win rates are now totaly screwed statistics, because of the masive Tau&Custodes domination. So skip it at all.

One victory and couple of nice places are great. We krump if we want, but we' re already under the radar for any other nerfs. That is good.

 Tomsug wrote:
Yeah

Anyway, any win rates are now totaly screwed statistics, because of the masive Tau&Custodes domination. So skip it at all.

One victory and couple of nice places are great. We krump if we want, but we' re already under the radar for any other nerfs. That is good.

Yeah, hopefully this means that GW can actually focus on relevant stuff for Orks that need updates, like the glaring issues for Nob Warbikerz not being updated and how currently specialist mobz can't ride in transports like squiggoths or battlewagons. Even an update to how kustom jobs currently work would be really ideal if they're still obsessed with keeping the one buggy unit per army limit.

No, I think you miss the point. GW is comming to the phase of ignoring Orks. For couple of years. What we have is what we have. That is it.

We just had beast snagga releases though

The Ross Law FB Speed Mob is interesting. Obsec Warbikers strugle to get enough bodies on objective. Huge bases and simply not enough models. But if you combine them Obsec-Off aura, they start to be really good in controling the objectives. Say hello to obsec-count-as-4-models Custodes dudes…

They do not hold it for the log time but this combination Obsec-Off + obsec bikers is very good for scoring Stranglehold.

So he can play

TTL - Squigbuggies behind the wall, disappearing Koptas and Scrapjets. Hold them back and you can score 15VP.
Stranglehold - see above
Bitz - on one objective too far away of anything and it can be done by the unit, that support Stranglehold in the same time.

That is definitely good build.



What makes me sad is, that obviously all of the Speed Mob lists play the Attack out of tha Sun strictly RAW. I don ' t want to play it like this…

I mean attack out da sun is getting to the point it will never get faqd considering they already did the faq for the 2 codexs that came out a month later… I don’t know if a faq ever came out this late. Critical mass came out in early December. We are already in march..


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Beardedragon wrote:
We just had beast snagga releases though

I don’t think he meant ignoring orks by not getting more models releases.. I think he means ignoring orks by never changing any of thier rules to fix anything. Which is usually true.. things like nob warbikers usually won’t get fixed, critical mass is well beyond any timeline for normal errata and faq, they really should have fixed the 1 unit buggy rule, beyond our codex Strats mostly being overpriced we still have a Strats in our codex that references beastsnagga monster units that don’t even exist. Just lots of sloppy stuff that I don’t expect to change.

gungo wrote:
I mean attack out da sun is getting to the point it will never get faqd considering they already did the faq for the 2 codexs that came out a month later… I don’t know if a faq ever came out this late. Critical mass came out in early December. We are already in march..


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Beardedragon wrote:
We just had beast snagga releases though

I don’t think he meant ignoring orks by not getting more models releases.. I think he means ignoring orks by never changing any of thier rules to fix anything. Which is usually true.. things like nob warbikers usually won’t get fixed, critical mass is well beyond any timeline for normal errata and faq, they really should have fixed the 1 unit buggy rule, beyond our codex Strats mostly being overpriced we still have a Strats in our codex that references beastsnagga monster units that don’t even exist. Just lots of sloppy stuff that I don’t expect to change.

I understand the cynicism born from existing patterns, but let's not forget the sign of change we've had lately in how GW does things: the balance dataslate didn't just nerf buggies, it also buffed a 9e army that was well past that perceived timeline cutoff, Necrons. With that precedent, late-game changes become a potential reality for us too, hopefully for the better.

The issues with Orks are well beyond just minor patches, though.

Weak strats, many pretty bad datasheets (Tau saw 79%! Of their total datasheets show up in competitive play this past weekend), super constricting list construction.

Only hope Orks have is our stuff gets dirt, dirt cheap if we want to compete against the power level of the top armies. Like put boys back to 7 ppm as a baseline again.

Attack o' da Sun should eventually get nerfed, and when it does, Speed Mob's ability to compete at the top tables disappears with it. It's too clutch a strat when you can keep 300 (or 600 with Evil Suns) points of copters safe a turn.

Yea, big point drops is what I’m hoping for too. Still, 7ppm boyz would be so prone to leadership problems. If we see a big point reduction armywide I think that killa kans/meganobz would be the way to go.

Madjob wrote:


I understand the cynicism born from existing patterns, but let's not forget the sign of change we've had lately in how GW does things: the balance dataslate didn't just nerf buggies, it also buffed a 9e army that was well past that perceived timeline cutoff, Necrons. With that precedent, late-game changes become a potential reality for us too, hopefully for the better.

Its not so much cynicism as its "experience". In my personal opinion, GW, as a company, does not understand or know how to play/use/write Orkz. Most of our competitive options felt more like accidents rather than intentional.

Our average to good units seem to be nerfed more frequently than top performing units in other factions. No matter how you slice it, a Squigbuggy was never OP. I literally do not own a Squigbuggy and never will because I think they look like crap, but they just weren't OP. Nobody was bum rushing them into Combat, they were sitting back and plinking away with their IDF weapons which amounted on a regular turn to 5.25 hits. Against their best target, Marines, they worked out to 2.3 dead Marines a turn. A 90pt unit killed 40ish points of Marine, good but not game breaking and definitely not in need of a massive nerf to 110pts followed by a nerf to buggies in general. Especially when you factor in the fact that its guns were only 36 and 18' range which meant you had to get close to a target to hit it.

Compare that to Las Chickens which received TOKEN nerfs and are still significantly better than a squigbuggy even after 2 different adjustments.

tulun wrote:
The issues with Orks are well beyond just minor patches, though.

Weak strats, many pretty bad datasheets (Tau saw 79%! Of their total datasheets show up in competitive play this past weekend), super constricting list construction.

Only hope Orks have is our stuff gets dirt, dirt cheap if we want to compete against the power level of the top armies. Like put boys back to 7 ppm as a baseline again.

Attack o' da Sun should eventually get nerfed, and when it does, Speed Mob's ability to compete at the top tables disappears with it. It's too clutch a strat when you can keep 300 (or 600 with Evil Suns) points of copters safe a turn.

Should attack out da sun get nerfed? Beyond the fact it cost 2x the amount of the admech version everyone uses as an example the campaign supplement came out 4 months ago (release date nov 6). Are you waiting for 10th edition to nerf it at this point? When is the last time Gw errataed a book that took this long? I was also fairly sure Gw would nerf it since we can’t have nice things even if it’s only useful on 1 unit in 1 army of renown which is Barely able to compete….. but they have completely skipped over touching the ork campaign book and just don’t care… tau and custodes got the typical 2 week release faq and Gw just moved on.

gungo wrote:

tulun wrote:
The issues with Orks are well beyond just minor patches, though.

Weak strats, many pretty bad datasheets (Tau saw 79%! Of their total datasheets show up in competitive play this past weekend), super constricting list construction.

Only hope Orks have is our stuff gets dirt, dirt cheap if we want to compete against the power level of the top armies. Like put boys back to 7 ppm as a baseline again.

Attack o' da Sun should eventually get nerfed, and when it does, Speed Mob's ability to compete at the top tables disappears with it. It's too clutch a strat when you can keep 300 (or 600 with Evil Suns) points of copters safe a turn.

Should attack out da sun get nerfed? Beyond the fact it cost 2x the amount of the admech version everyone uses as an example the campaign supplement came out 4 months ago (release date nov 6). Are you waiting for 10th edition to nerf it at this point? When is the last time Gw errataed a book that took this long? I was also fairly sure Gw would nerf it since we can’t have nice things even if it’s only useful on 1 unit in 1 army of renown which is Barely able to compete….. but they have completely skipped over touching the ork campaign book and just don’t care… tau and custodes got the typical 2 week release faq and Gw just moved on.

Do I think it makes them broken beyond belief? No.

But GW has nerfed almost every interaction like this -- be it Fire and Fade off the board (Eldar planes), into transports (Eldar again!), Pteraxi (bye bye).

A unit you basically can't attack as long as you have 2 CP (which includes psychic, indirect...) just doesn't seem to last that long, nor should it.

I just think it's lame where for Pteraxi it was just another way Ad Mech would dunk on their opponents, and for Speed Mob it's the best tool they have to fight into a meta of superior armies. Sad, but true. Bug GW to give us points cuts. About all we can hope for.

Or, enjoy the ride until they nerf it, 'cause they are taking their sweet time.

It has lasted long enough now that it probably won't get nerfed/fixed. I wouldn't make any major buying decisions based on the way it works currently, but would probably (if I was an Ork player) use it in tournaments if allowed.

I'd be salty as an Ork if they took the time to fix this but left the buggy balance dataslate untouched. That would be rude.

EightFoldPath wrote:
It has lasted long enough now that it probably won't get nerfed/fixed. I wouldn't make any major buying decisions based on the way it works currently, but would probably (if I was an Ork player) use it in tournaments if allowed.

I'd be salty as an Ork if they took the time to fix this but left the buggy balance dataslate untouched. That would be rude.

I'd feel better about it if they had dropped a FAQ for Octarius 2 before making that call, but RAW there's nothing stopping you, so go ham. Until it does, only thing you'd have to worry about is if a TO bans it for some odd reason, but I don't think I've heard that happening.

For Orks we'd need something along the lines of what Necrons and Imperial Guard got in terms of some units receiving a CORE keyword (still sucks that Deff Dreadz don't get it for whatever reason) or a datasheet update like how LR tanks got a 2+ save and Orders got updated for them.

EightFoldPath wrote:
It has lasted long enough now that it probably won't get nerfed/fixed. I wouldn't make any major buying decisions based on the way it works currently, but would probably (if I was an Ork player) use it in tournaments if allowed.

I'd be salty as an Ork if they took the time to fix this but left the buggy balance dataslate untouched. That would be rude.

I can see the buggy thing being drawn back in the not so distant future to a max of three of each buggy, but no cap on the units of buggies. A slight quality of life change, but not really effecting the competitive power of the units.

The only differences between taking one unit of three buggies and three units of one of the same buggy are maneuverability (singles) and stratagem efficiency (trios).

So I was made aware of the fact that our kommandos dont get a +2 to their save value when sitting in cover that dont already give a save value. They only get +1.

So in dense terrain during shooting and cc we would get a 5+ instead of a 4+ as I thought otherwise. Only light cover and heavy gives the 3+ save total it seems. Apparently theres a rule somewhere stating this.

Also i didnt think this kommando rule applied to close combat but people say it does?

MPROVING THE BENEFITS OF COVER
Some models have abilities that improve the bonus a model receives to its saving throw when it is receiving the benefit of cover — for example, ‘add 2 instead of 1 to saving throws for models in this unit while it is receiving the benefit of cover’. If a model or unit with such a rule is receiving the benefits of cover from a terrain feature with the Light Cover or Heavy Cover trait, then this rule is applied as written. If that model or unit is receiving the benefits of cover from any other terrain features with any other terrain traits, you instead add 1 to its saving throws, in addition to any other benefits of cover that are gained from those terrain features. In either case, invulnerable saves are unaffected.

Is this from Errata/FAQ ?

in any case: [‘add 2 instead of 1 to saving throws.... from any other terrain features with any other terrain trait you instead add 1 to its saving throws']
You do notice kommandos rule is 'add 3 instead of 1 to saving throw', so logically following that example it goes to 'from any other terrain features with any other terrain trait you instead add 2 to its saving throws']'

And yes, I also apply that rule in melee attack

Beardedragon wrote:
So I was made aware of the fact that our kommandos dont get a +2 to their save value when sitting in cover that dont already give a save value. They only get +1.

So in dense terrain during shooting and cc we would get a 5+ instead of a 4+ as I thought otherwise. Only light cover and heavy gives the 3+ save total it seems. Apparently theres a rule somewhere stating this.

Also i didnt think this kommando rule applied to close combat but people say it does?

MPROVING THE BENEFITS OF COVER
Some models have abilities that improve the bonus a model receives to its saving throw when it is receiving the benefit of cover — for example, ‘add 2 instead of 1 to saving throws for models in this unit while it is receiving the benefit of cover’. If a model or unit with such a rule is receiving the benefits of cover from a terrain feature with the Light Cover or Heavy Cover trait, then this rule is applied as written. If that model or unit is receiving the benefits of cover from any other terrain features with any other terrain traits, you instead add 1 to its saving throws, in addition to any other benefits of cover that are gained from those terrain features. In either case, invulnerable saves are unaffected.

Whoever told you that was incorrect. The Kommando rule is

Sneaky Gits Each time an attack is allocated to a model in this unit while it is receiving the benefits of cover, add an additional 2 to any armour saving throw made against that attack.

So if you are in dense terrain your opponent has -1 to hit and your kommandos get +2 to their save because they are "receiving the benefits of cover". So in this scenario Kommandos have -1 to hit and 4+ saves.

When they are in Light cover they get 3+ saves.