Might makes Right! - Codex Orks 2021 Tactics

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**Mangoblin**

So I just played a 2k game last night, my first game with the Nephilim changes and the new Ork buffs. I gotta say, the new buffs were really, really useful, and I'd just like to share a few things I learned. I was playing a version of Goff pressure that I can make with the models I actually have, while my opponent was playing Black Legion with the new CSM codex. Brief overview of the lists in the spoiler box below.

Spoiler:

Result: my opponent conceded on turn 3.

Some things I learned:

- 5+ invuln on the WAAAGH is so good. It makes your guys so much more survivable. Even if it only lasts a turn, your WAAAGH turn is probably the turn you're going to get attacked the most, so it comes up huge in most situations.

- Grots are AMAZING. No serious Ork list should leave home without at least 3 squads of ten. GDGB is free points a lot of the time and even if it isn't, they're still great at gumming up your opponents' charges. Just be careful as they're easy targets for No Prisoners and Grind Them Down if you expose them too much.

- Burna boyz are actually OK. They're pretty cheap, and the amount of flamer shots even a small squad can put out makes them a danger even to armoured infantry, plus you can give them AP in melee. I don't know if there's room for them in an ultra-competitive list, but for a semi-casual game like this they're a lot of fun.

- Regular boyz are honestly OK. You do probably just want beast snaggas most of the time, but w/ the free invulns from WAAAGH the boyz are honestly not that bad of an option, and with a small buff might become a serious consideration in competitive lists (maybe a slight points reduction?)

- The Wazbom jet is a great distraction. I've always complained that all its random damage and random shots make it kind of inconsistent, but this game I just plopped it in front my middle mob and my opponent spent his entire first turn shooting it down. It's great because it makes your opponent choose between thinning out your horde and taking the risk that the jet will blow up one of his big units, or dedicating his firepower to the jet and leaving the horde (mostly) untouched.

- Honestly disappointed with the Big Choppa nobz. I used to really like these guys, but AoC really did a number on them; they barely managed to kill a squad of legionaries, with the warbosses help mind. You probably just want more meganobz instead.

- Deff dreads are great; the WAAAGH invuln is amazing on them, and backed up by a big mek repairing them they're really a nuisance for your opponent to remove.

- Warboss in mega armor is for surviving, not killing. Take a killa klaw boss if you want him to kill things (probably on a bike).

- Mega armor on the mek felt useless. It makes him more survivable and deadly, but with his spot smack dab in the middle of my deff dread/ boyz blob he didn't even get touched. Even da ded shiny shoota isn't great in a post-AoC world. Save the points and take the regular mek w/ kff if you want one, which I think is far from necessary in a world where we get free invulns for a couple turns anyways.

- SAG mek is funny, but in an ultra serious list I'd leave him at home.

**tulun**

Tomsug wrote:
tulun wrote:
How many players were those GTs?

I took anything with 5+ rounds and 30 people plus…. Aaand I failed, one of the dudes is 8 people “GT” with very bad scoring. I take him out.

Hell, why people call the tournament with 8 people “GT”? In such way i can play GT every weekend at home with my budies….

Fair. Summary post is appreciated -- might be worth posting # of players too, the larger the GT the more convincing the list, as even in 30 person tournaments there's a good chance you can luck out of a couple bad matchups.

**flaming tadpole**

@mangoblin ya pretty much has been my takeaway so far after about 4-5 games.

I tried a big blob of deff dreads backed by kff mek and makari, it was fun as hell and super tough, granted I was playing against gsc. The -2 ap scorchas on the waaagh are actually super solid too.

**gungo**

If kustom jobs are free the SaG Mek and kmb big Mek are better…

**tulun**

If you can finagle *not* using a KFF mek (and the reactive 5++) that's likely optimal -- it allows you earmark yourself down to 0 CP pregame if you want, and save yourself 85 points which does go a long way in Orks (say.. 2 Mek guns).

If what's mostly exposed in your list is a 5++ wagon and 1-2 6++ Kill Rigs it's probably ok but I imagine totally meta dependent, as some armies will light you up hard without a proper invul. Using the waaagh solely to get a 5++ kind of feels bad, though, if you aren't also connecting several units into combat.

I still wish Orks did not feel like an army that wants to go first in every game, just to get a chance to position before getting shot at.

**Blackie**

Mangoblin wrote:

- Mega armor on the mek felt useless. It makes him more survivable and deadly, but with his spot smack dab in the middle of my deff dread/ boyz blob he didn't even get touched. Even da ded shiny shoota isn't great in a post-AoC world. Save the points and take the regular mek w/ kff if you want one, which I think is far from necessary in a world where we get free invulns for a couple turns anyways.

For +30 points the big mek gets a power klaw, +1W +2 save and a much better ranged weapons, especially with free kustom jobs. If you run him with a squad of dreads, let him join the charge. To me there's no reason to bring the naked big mek with KFF. 85 points for a slugga/choppa nob? No thanks. Drop the KFF guy entirely if you think the megarmored mek isn't worthy.

**Jidmah**

IMO the important thing the MA big mek is bringing is a decent gun (I feel like KMB+kustom job is superior to the relic) and the ability to shrug off small arms.
You simply cannot afford to have that many points do nothing after burning through the KFF.

I'd also chip in that the MA often is the exact reason why he stays unharmed in many of my games, because people are not willing to invest anti-tank into killing a low threat model and anti-infantry shooting is wasted on him. A regular big mek is often bonked by random stubbers.

**koooaei**

Blackie wrote:
Mangoblin wrote:

- Mega armor on the mek felt useless. It makes him more survivable and deadly, but with his spot smack dab in the middle of my deff dread/ boyz blob he didn't even get touched. Even da ded shiny shoota isn't great in a post-AoC world. Save the points and take the regular mek w/ kff if you want one, which I think is far from necessary in a world where we get free invulns for a couple turns anyways.

For +30 points the big mek gets a power klaw, +1W +2 save and a much better ranged weapons, especially with free kustom jobs. If you run him with a squad of dreads, let him join the charge. To me there's no reason to bring the naked big mek with KFF. 85 points for a slugga/choppa nob? No thanks. Drop the KFF guy entirely if you think the megarmored mek isn't worthy.

Megamek has 4" Move. For some reason. All the other mega armored units don't get that reduction tho, so it might be an oversight but it's like this rn.

**Blackie**

koooaei wrote:
Blackie wrote:
Mangoblin wrote:

- Mega armor on the mek felt useless. It makes him more survivable and deadly, but with his spot smack dab in the middle of my deff dread/ boyz blob he didn't even get touched. Even da ded shiny shoota isn't great in a post-AoC world. Save the points and take the regular mek w/ kff if you want one, which I think is far from necessary in a world where we get free invulns for a couple turns anyways.

For +30 points the big mek gets a power klaw, +1W +2 save and a much better ranged weapons, especially with free kustom jobs. If you run him with a squad of dreads, let him join the charge. To me there's no reason to bring the naked big mek with KFF. 85 points for a slugga/choppa nob? No thanks. Drop the KFF guy entirely if you think the megarmored mek isn't worthy.

Megamek has 4" Move. For some reason. All the other mega armored units don't get that reduction tho, so it might be an oversight but it's like this rn.

Yeah, it definitely sucks. But it's not like the +1''M for the cheaper big mek makes an actual difference.

**Afrodactyl**

Jidmah wrote:
IMO the important thing the MA big mek is bringing is a decent gun (I feel like KMB+kustom job is superior to the relic) and the ability to shrug off small arms.
You simply cannot afford to have that many points do nothing after burning through the KFF.

I'd also chip in that the MA often is the exact reason why he stays unharmed in many of my games, because people are not willing to invest anti-tank into killing a low threat model and anti-infantry shooting is wasted on him. A regular big mek is often bonked by random stubbers.

Couldn't agree more. An Extra Kustom KMB and a Tellyport Blasta is pretty gnarly firepower for the points, on a platform that has decent survivability and respectable melee output to finish off whatever survives.

Mine rides with my Trukkboys to counteract the slow walking speed, so once they jump out the Mek is right in the heart of the enemy and gets to act as a pseudo-buggy.

I've found he tends to get splatted the turn after he blows something up, but it's enough firepower diverted away from something else that I don't really care.

**tulun**

Considering this in an upcoming game vs blood angels

Only over with custom jobs which are free.

https://pastebin.com/XayrWetq

**gungo**

tulun wrote:
Considering this in an upcoming game vs blood angels

Only over with custom jobs which are free.

https://pastebin.com/XayrWetq

It’s good.. honestly goff pressure has a few units you can play with.. a lot of the variant builds might play better into certain missions. I do like the battlewagon deffrolla w forktress and 2x Killrig setup it does bleed bring it down but there is a lot of mission play in that category. Goff pressure is a fun list to experiment with and have slightly different successful setups…

The only thing I might consider changing in that list is dropping ard case of battlewagon and the pk on kommando unit to put a kff on one wazbom…
It’s up to you but The 5++ is huge on the wazbom survivability and I don’t think t7 to t8 on battlewagon is as big.

**tulun**

gungo wrote:
tulun wrote:
Considering this in an upcoming game vs blood angels

Only over with custom jobs which are free.

https://pastebin.com/XayrWetq

It’s good.. honestly goff pressure has a few units you can play with.. a lot of the variant builds might play better into certain missions. I do like the battlewagon deffrolla w forktress and 2x Killrig setup it does bleed bring it down but there is a lot of mission play in that category. Goff pressure is a fun list to experiment with and have slightly different successful setups…

The only thing I might consider changing in that list is dropping ard case of battlewagon and the pk on kommando unit to put a kff on one wazbom…
It’s up to you but The 5++ is huge on the wazbom survivability and I don’t think t7 to t8 on battlewagon is as big.

Yeah it's a tough call. Waaagh *does* gives you an invul which is why I think it's feasible to forego it, but I thought the same thing, at least 1 should have a KFF.

In this particular matchup I think most of what I'd see in anti tank is Melta (Eradicators) or Plasma inceptors so that T8 is definitely relevant, and there's where your best anti marine hammer is going (the mega nobs). But I'll give it a think.

**Beardedragon**

tulun wrote:
gungo wrote:
tulun wrote:
Considering this in an upcoming game vs blood angels

Only over with custom jobs which are free.

https://pastebin.com/XayrWetq

It’s good.. honestly goff pressure has a few units you can play with.. a lot of the variant builds might play better into certain missions. I do like the battlewagon deffrolla w forktress and 2x Killrig setup it does bleed bring it down but there is a lot of mission play in that category. Goff pressure is a fun list to experiment with and have slightly different successful setups…

The only thing I might consider changing in that list is dropping ard case of battlewagon and the pk on kommando unit to put a kff on one wazbom…
It’s up to you but The 5++ is huge on the wazbom survivability and I don’t think t7 to t8 on battlewagon is as big.

Yeah it's a tough call. Waaagh *does* gives you an invul which is why I think it's feasible to forego it, but I thought the same thing, at least 1 should have a KFF.

In this particular matchup I think most of what I'd see in anti tank is Melta (Eradicators) or Plasma inceptors so that T8 is definitely relevant, and there's where your best anti marine hammer is going (the mega nobs). But I'll give it a think.

But what if you dont get turn 1 and he shoots down your wazboms? You dont have your invul by the time he goes first.
Or you get turn 1 but dont want to call a waaagh, then he can shoot them down when he gets his turn as well.

I agree a Wazbom KFF is really well spent points for the survivability.

**Tomsug**

Wazbooms needs to hve the KFF. Too expensive to be shot down easily.

**gungo**

I definitely don’t think 2 kff on 2x wazboms is needed anymore mainly because of the waaagh…

But honestly even if I go first I don’t want to use waaagh until the second turn anyway which means the wazboms are just easy pickings. I do agree the ard case is decent but the forktress is mainly there just to transport and protect infantry and if your opponent is into meltagun range then you are close enough anyway to make it into charge range. Disembark 3in, move 5in, adv ~3.5in, charge ~8.
You actually want your opponent to shoot at your forktress it’s the least impactful threat. Even with 5++ on those wazboms you would be hard pressed to have them after turn3. They are such a massive shooting threat to everything that your opponent will gun for them everytime.

**Beardedragon**

no one said you needed to have two.

And if they did, then no you just need 1 on one of them

**Tomsug**

Exactly.

**theCrowe**

At the risk of incurring the wrath of the WAAAGH from all propa Orky Dakkanotzes for off-topic spamming I just wanted to invite you all to Dakka Fiction where an ork drinking game is on the go.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/804886.page
It’s a bit of story writing fun.
You just show up. Tell us who your ork is, what he’s about and importantly what he’s drinking.

Sorry, I haven’t played a game of 40k since 6th ed. My old orks are in a box in bits. Not very tactical I know.

Thanks and sorry for the interruption.

**tulun**

Beardedragon wrote:
tulun wrote:
gungo wrote:
tulun wrote:
Considering this in an upcoming game vs blood angels

Only over with custom jobs which are free.

https://pastebin.com/XayrWetq

It’s good.. honestly goff pressure has a few units you can play with.. a lot of the variant builds might play better into certain missions. I do like the battlewagon deffrolla w forktress and 2x Killrig setup it does bleed bring it down but there is a lot of mission play in that category. Goff pressure is a fun list to experiment with and have slightly different successful setups…

The only thing I might consider changing in that list is dropping ard case of battlewagon and the pk on kommando unit to put a kff on one wazbom…
It’s up to you but The 5++ is huge on the wazbom survivability and I don’t think t7 to t8 on battlewagon is as big.

Yeah it's a tough call. Waaagh *does* gives you an invul which is why I think it's feasible to forego it, but I thought the same thing, at least 1 should have a KFF.

In this particular matchup I think most of what I'd see in anti tank is Melta (Eradicators) or Plasma inceptors so that T8 is definitely relevant, and there's where your best anti marine hammer is going (the mega nobs). But I'll give it a think.

But what if you dont get turn 1 and he shoots down your wazboms? You dont have your invul by the time he goes first.
Or you get turn 1 but dont want to call a waaagh, then he can shoot them down when he gets his turn as well.

I agree a Wazbom KFF is really well spent points for the survivability.

Alright I'm somewhat convinced.

The tradeoff is a klaw (not a big deal on a squad I'm just using to screen anyway) and some survivability on the wagon for a huge durability buff on both wazboms -- I can buy that's probably a good trade.

I'm thinking the KFF on the non-Boom boy unit? Obviously they'll wanna target down the boom boy, but it gives incentive to go after the weaker one first, or if they pop the stronger one, the other one is still around with a KFF.

**CaptainO**

Rich kiltons Orks came first in a 34 person GT which is great. A sign we're in a much better place.

**Jidmah**

theCrowe wrote:
At the risk of incurring the wrath of the WAAAGH from all propa Orky Dakkanotzes for off-topic spamming I just wanted to invite you all to Dakka Fiction where an ork drinking game is on the go.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/804886.page
It’s a bit of story writing fun.
You just show up. Tell us who your ork is, what he’s about and importantly what he’s drinking.

Sorry, I haven’t played a game of 40k since 6th ed. My old orks are in a box in bits. Not very tactical I know.

Thanks and sorry for the interruption.

This essentially is the ork chat thread anyways, no worries

**Tomsug**

CaptainO wrote:
Rich kiltons Orks came first in a 34 person GT which is great. A sign we're in a much better place.

His Goff list:

Spoiler:

**Domandi**

Interesting list. Is Zagstruk worth it without a unit of stormboyz?

**CaptainO**

Interesting that Rich was able to run so many characters and still win.

**Grimskul**

Domandi wrote:
Interesting list. Is Zagstruk worth it without a unit of stormboyz?

He's actually kind of more of a fire and forget missile, rather than a unit you take to support stormboyz since most of the time you're mainly taking advantage of the fact that he has FLY to get over terrain, the auto-6" advance move for a guaranteed 18"+2D6" threat range during a WAAAGH! so you can have them take out a key character or enemy unit in the backline. His aura for stormboyz is more or less just a slight bonus if you happen to take any units of 10 with him, most of the time I see most people just grabbing min squads of stormboyz to do actions with.

**Domandi**

I see. Very interesting. I never really thought about his versatility. He could really mangle small back units, or be a huge backup boost to a combat that might not in the orks favor. Would it be worth it to give him the goff Da Iron Gob for the mortals after combat?

Sorry if this has been discussed previously.

**Grimskul**

Domandi wrote:
I see. Very interesting. I never really thought about his versatility. He could really mangle small back units, or be a huge backup boost to a combat that might not in the orks favor. Would it be worth it to give him the goff Da Iron Gob for the mortals after combat?

Sorry if this has been discussed previously.

Are you talking about the Goff relic? Just a heads up that you can't give special characters relics, so you wouldn't be able to do that.

**theCrowe**

Jidmah wrote:
theCrowe wrote:
At the risk of incurring the wrath of the WAAAGH from all propa Orky Dakkanotzes for off-topic spamming I just wanted to invite you all to Dakka Fiction where an ork drinking game is on the go.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/804886.page
It’s a bit of story writing fun.
You just show up. Tell us who your ork is, what he’s about and importantly what he’s drinking.

Sorry, I haven’t played a game of 40k since 6th ed. My old orks are in a box in bits. Not very tactical I know.

Thanks and sorry for the interruption.

This essentially is the ork chat thread anyways, no worries

Cheers. I’m just hoping if we get a few more punters in the doors on this it’ll be a lot of fun.
I might even learn something about ork tactics in the process.

**Domandi**

Grimskul wrote:
Domandi wrote:
I see. Very interesting. I never really thought about his versatility. He could really mangle small back units, or be a huge backup boost to a combat that might not in the orks favor. Would it be worth it to give him the goff Da Iron Gob for the mortals after combat?

Sorry if this has been discussed previously.

Are you talking about the Goff relic? Just a heads up that you can't give special characters relics, so you wouldn't be able to do that.

Oh! you are right! I forgot about that.