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Since their intended use is apparently to just dunk the whole model in a single colour, I assume this will be Rainbow Speedpaint, with all pigments in one bottle. Anyone who doesn't like the result is just using it wrong.

Unless the big reveal includes the fact that they've fixed the reactivation issue, it's difficult to be too excited about it now that there are seemingly better alternatives on the horizon, to be honest.

I miss the days when there was actually a new paint out and the news & rumors was "new paint is out, you should try it!"

Now we have months-long announcements that some new revolutionary paint is in developement and you too can buy it in just 6 months time! And now we have announcements for announcements, because we can't announce anything just yet. For paint. For PAINT!!!

Just release the new fething paints so we can try em, I'm so tired of companies trying to hype up paints like this

 Kalamadea wrote:
I miss the days when there was actually a new paint out and the news & rumors was "new paint is out, you should try it!"

Now we have months-long announcements that some new revolutionary paint is in developement and you too can buy it in just 6 months time! And now we have announcements for announcements, because we can't announce anything just yet. For paint. For PAINT!!!

Just release the new fething paints so we can try em, I'm so tired of companies trying to hype up paints like this

When attention span economics is what makes the money, and not actually buying the product is what makes the money, then we end up where we are.
And because attention spans are so short these days, in order to sell enough units on launch day, they can’t let anyone forget for even a second. I don’t like this modern marketing approach either, but just like any other advertising or hype, it’s pretty easy to ignore.
If you miss the days of going to your LGS and finding out about new stuff, then simply stop looking for new games, paints, miniatures or whatever online.
It’s what I’ve begun doing, and man does the LGS feel like a place worth visiting again.
I have the advantage of online prices being no cheaper for me, so supporting my local store as become much easier. So ignore the hype and find out about stuff in the real world when its released. It’s making my hobby experiences much more refreshing and invigorating. And this helps me stay invested in the hobby too.
Sorry to take it so off topic but I had to respond to this since I felt the same way just a short time ago.
Unplug and ignore the hype, and discover what it feels like to find new stuff in a store again. It feels great.

As for the Speedpaints? I’ll wait for the Vallejo ones. Contrast is $9.50 a pot up here, and I just don’t like Army Painter products, aside from dark and strong tone washes so they’re an easy pass for me. I know Vallejo will be reasonably priced, and droppers work so much better to washes and inks.

Apparently there they are looking to expand the Speedpaint range, in consultation with a gaggle of painters. I only got two minutes into the video before losing interest, so no idea if there is any actual detail on what's planned in there...

 insaniak wrote:
Apparently there they are looking to expand the Speedpaint range, in consultation with a gaggle of painters. I only got two minutes into the video before losing interest, so no idea if there is any actual detail on what's planned in there...

A lineup of faces that will endorse a bad product for money, huh

Only know 3 of those and errr not exactly quality painters... more like entertaining content creators so errrr ok?

Before someone says " you dont need to be an experienced good painter to identify good and bad properties of paints...."
Well you kind of do.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

A lineup of faces that will endorse a bad product for money, huh

I think there's a mention in the video that they're not being paid, just providing feedback. Hopefully some of that feedback is 'Fix the reactivation issue'...

Yeah I'm not the biggest fan of goober, ninjon or Dana.
They fall into minitainment and not really anything informative.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Yeah I'm not the biggest fan of goober, ninjon or Dana.
They fall into minitainment and not really anything informative.

I did like Ninjon's review of the new Citadel shades (and would totally steal his paint scheme if I were to do some Kruleboyz).

They mentioned in the video that they came up with a new resin that reduces/removes the reactivation issue, so fingers crossed.

 insaniak wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

A lineup of faces that will endorse a bad product for money, huh

I think there's a mention in the video that they're not being paid, just providing feedback. Hopefully some of that feedback is 'Fix the reactivation issue'...

Regardless of paid endorsements, I think we'll only be hearing positive things about the paints/Army Painter from those YTers, and if there's an issue similar to the reactivation, it's more likely just going to be strategically not mentioned or downplayed - as a number of them did in the past...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Update - regarding "paid" - the first line of the description is:

We've hired 5 of your favorite painters, from 4 of your favorite channels to help us make Speedpaint even bigger, and better than ever! Go behind-the-scenes for our first group meeting.

 stahly wrote:
They mentioned in the video that they came up with a new resin that reduces/removes the reactivation issue, so fingers crossed.

I haven’t had any issue with it, so I just hope if they do change it up it behaves the same way still.
Other than reactivating some people seem to get.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 insaniak wrote:
Apparently there they are looking to expand the Speedpaint range, in consultation with a gaggle of painters. I only got two minutes into the video before losing interest, so no idea if there is any actual detail on what's planned in there...

A lineup of faces that will endorse a bad product for money, huh

Dana is the one who said you can fix reactivation by using their medium... so I bought their medium and had the same problems... I want my $9 back thanks Dana

I mostly like Goober... but also don't trust him in the slightest as he focuses on the positives and not the negatives which makes his reviews and commentary skewed.

Ninjon, I dunno, I like his painting, but I don't like his videos, and he did that cringe video for AP that could be summarised as "well, sure, AP Warpaints suck, but you can still paint a good model if you try I guess".

I don't think I've watched anything from the other two.

Juan (mostly) fixed reactivation - with Citadel's Contrast medium.

Goober is a chemist and has several videos discussing paints and resin in-depth. In addition to being a positive dude who clearly explains why he makes certain content decisions.

I understand the kneejerk reaction of "ugh they got some dumb INFLUENCERS on board" if you've not watched their videos, but hey guess what... "influencers" who are actually very reasonable, sincere and entertaining people exist. It's not all quick-cut shrieking minecraft videos and you have to have actually watched a video or two to find out for yourself.

 RustyNumber wrote:
Goober is a chemist and has several videos discussing paints and resin in-depth. In addition to being a positive dude who clearly explains why he makes certain content decisions.

I understand the kneejerk reaction of "ugh they got some dumb INFLUENCERS on board" if you've not watched their videos, but hey guess what... "influencers" who are actually very reasonable, sincere and entertaining people exist. It's not all quick-cut shrieking minecraft videos and you have to have actually watched a video or two to find out for yourself.

The ones I personally commented on (Goober, Dana and Ninjon) are the ones for whom I have watched their videos.

Of those, Goober is the one I'd be most likely to watch, but also not one I'd listen to for advice on products.


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 Azazelx wrote:
Juan (mostly) fixed reactivation - with Citadel's Contrast medium.

Spoiler:

I had seen that video, but hadn't tried it yet. TBH, when I'm using Speedpaints/Contrasts, I'm usually using them neat because I am using them from the perspective of painting quickly. Though I understand Juan uses his for more advanced painting techniques where thinning is more useful.

Dana's suggestion was to use the AP medium for thinning instead of water for thinning and it'd solve the reactivation issue, but it didn't seem to change it in the slightest, so I dunno if it was lying or maybe AP sent Dana a different product to the one I bought of the shelf at my FLGS.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

Dana's suggestion was to use the AP medium for thinning instead of water for thinning and it'd solve the reactivation issue, but it didn't seem to change it in the slightest, so I dunno if it was lying or maybe AP sent Dana a different product to the one I bought of the shelf at my FLGS.

I suspect that Dana was only getting the reactivation when she was thinning them, and so using medium instead of water 'fixed' it.

That's the biggest frustration with the reactivation... it seems to be completely random. I'm still guessing it's related to temperature and humidity, but the line between 'reactivates' and 'doesn't reactivate' seems to be very thin and wobbly, and differs for different Speedpaints.

Nevermind.

 RustyNumber wrote:
Goober is a chemist and has several videos discussing paints and resin in-depth. In addition to being a positive dude who clearly explains why he makes certain content decisions.

I understand the kneejerk reaction of "ugh they got some dumb INFLUENCERS on board" if you've not watched their videos, but hey guess what... "influencers" who are actually very reasonable, sincere and entertaining people exist. It's not all quick-cut shrieking minecraft videos and you have to have actually watched a video or two to find out for yourself.

With Goobs being a chemist, I have high hopes for a good reformulate. As for it being influencers, who else would folks want? Juan has tied his anchor to Vallejo, we don't know if there are contracts in place. I would have liked to have seen Stahly but I don't make the business decisions.

Hopefully review bottles will be sent out to the most critical voices.

 legionaires wrote:

 RustyNumber wrote:
Goober is a chemist and has several videos discussing paints and resin in-depth. In addition to being a positive dude who clearly explains why he makes certain content decisions.

I understand the kneejerk reaction of "ugh they got some dumb INFLUENCERS on board" if you've not watched their videos, but hey guess what... "influencers" who are actually very reasonable, sincere and entertaining people exist. It's not all quick-cut shrieking minecraft videos and you have to have actually watched a video or two to find out for yourself.

With Goobs being a chemist, I have high hopes for a good reformulate. As for it being influencers, who else would folks want? Juan has tied his anchor to Vallejo, we don't know if there are contracts in place. I would have liked to have seen Stahly but I don't make the business decisions.

Hopefully review bottles will be sent out to the most critical voices.

Goobs is a chemist, but unless his thesis was on paints, I doubt he knows more about paint chemistry than the people actually making the paints. At best it might equip him to talk about his experiences in a language that another chemist might understand.

As to the influencers thing, honestly, to me, getting influencers on board just makes me more suspicious than if they didn't. Maybe that sort of marketing works for other people, but to me, your product should be able to stand on its own two feet instead of getting influencers involved at all.

If the product is good, the influencers will praise it without them being tied to the product.

From a product development perspective, an influencer's input is just one person's input, I don't see it as any more valuable than any other hobbyist with demonstrated ability. Choosing influencers over any other random hobbyist is purely an exercise in marketing.

Its funny that no one has been over in the Vallejo thread about their contrast paints complaining about them hiring influencers to help "develop" the line including the one that's very active in that thread.

There's no difference between that and this. Just people paid to convince you their corporate overlords product is the one you should be buying.

 Monkeysloth wrote:
Its funny that no one has been over in the Vallejo thread about their contrast paints complaining about them hiring influencers to help "develop" the line including the one that's very active in that thread.

There's no difference between that and this. Just people paid to convince you their corporate overlords product is the one you should be buying.

Vallejo have released actual information with their influencer grifting, so we have actual things to talk about on that thread. The first video I saw was Juan actually talking about the product and using it on a model, and Juan is actually on the thread answering questions. I'll still be judging them for myself both when wider reviews come out and when I get to try them myself.

AP just seems to be grifting without much information, they released a video to announce that they are listening to people, then they released a video to announce that there'd be an announcement, and now they released a "paint dev team" video which I stopped watching after a couple of minutes of nothing meaningful (if there's meaningful stuff later in the video, my apologies).

It's a lot easier to accept influencers selling/being involved when the product works (or at least isn't recognised as not working right)

influencers trumpeting the brilliance of a product with faults (or worse pretending the faults are a good thing) is not fun

Crucially, as time since I got the Speed Paint pots go by, I've started to notice them behaving differently over time, much clumpier and much less smooth.

Which is REALLY not good.

 Albertorius wrote:
Crucially, as time since I got the Speed Paint pots go by, I've started to notice them behaving differently over time, much clumpier and much less smooth.

Which is REALLY not good.

Interesting. In the past I noticed some of my GW shades changing and degrading, but that was after years of use.

 RustyNumber wrote:
Goober is a chemist and has several videos discussing paints and resin in-depth. In addition to being a positive dude who clearly explains why he makes certain content decisions.

I understand the kneejerk reaction of "ugh they got some dumb INFLUENCERS on board" if you've not watched their videos, but hey guess what... "influencers" who are actually very reasonable, sincere and entertaining people exist. It's not all quick-cut shrieking minecraft videos and you have to have actually watched a video or two to find out for yourself.

I watch a lot of Ninjon's stuff, and still watch Goober from time to time. The fact that they might be reasonable, "sincere" and/or entertaining doesn't mean they're above bias or ...strategic omission or reframing of what consumers might view as important information. EoB describing the reactivation as a "feature" would be an example.

Because the YT thing is their living. Biting the hand that feeds, either by burning a bridge that gives you those pre-release products so you can be first to get your videos out, long before the people who need to purchase them from retail gets you more clicks, and more revenue from google/adsense - or more literally by pissing off a company that's literally paying you for your "consultancy". We know that at least some of them will be compromised in how they frame their public opinions. Regardless of how "reasonable, sincere and entertaining" they might be. Whatsisname? Scott? Ninjon's mate Miniac. He can perhaps be "reasonable, sincere and entertaining" but we saw how he behaved regarding the GW NDA for HH - both in terms of hiring a commission painter to paint the troops and then instagramming a bunch of NDA'd content at the GW event because he "forgot" and used the "Wrong camera/phone/whatever."

Also a chuckle about the AP guy telling them at the start of their zoom meeting that there's no expectation of them making a bunch of videos on it. Which is a little disingenious, because what's their job again? TY content creators? I think we can safely expect several series of the process of anything and everything that's not covered by NDA from at least several of them regardless of any public "expectations".

Point is that these people are all people. They're very fallible and their precarious position as content creators/influencers on the unstable payment platform known as YouTube makes them very vulnerable to being "influenced" by whoever is proividing them with supplementary income - certainly today and also who might perhaps tomorrow. Now let me tell you about these amazing STL files from my sponsor which you can print and then upload to your brilliant new website created on Squarespace via your secure online tunnel from ExpressVPN...

 Monkeysloth wrote:
Its funny that no one has been over in the Vallejo thread about their contrast paints complaining about them hiring influencers to help "develop" the line including the one that's very active in that thread.

There's no difference between that and this. Just people paid to convince you their corporate overlords product is the one you should be buying.

The difference is, also, that Army Painter has already released its product and we know it to be garbage, and those influencers have been revealed as grifters. Vallejo's one influencer has been open about his relationship with Vallejo, and we don't actually know yet if the product he's pushing is good or bad, so he can get the benefit of the doubt.

 legionaires wrote:

With Goobs being a chemist, I have high hopes for a good reformulate. As for it being influencers, who else would folks want? Juan has tied his anchor to Vallejo, we don't know if there are contracts in place. I would have liked to have seen Stahly but I don't make the business decisions.
Hopefully review bottles will be sent out to the most critical voices.

Goober isn't on staff, and I doubt he'd be involved in any way with creating or modifying their formulation. Or even knowing exactly what it is, because proprietary information.

But who would be the most critical voices? Juan and Stahly? Who else has been openly critical of Speedpaint who's not now on their payroll?

That'd be it aside from various bloggers or forum loudmouths like myself and I don't expect AP to reach out to me. Most other hobby YTers I've viewed have simply taken the middle ground and not said anything at all - neither endorsing nor being critical of it, simply mentioning that it's a thing that exists - from Tabletop Minions to most of the rest of them.

I'd be happier if they reformulated their actual paint, which is terrible. Adding a couple of mixing balls is not the solution. Going back to their original formula would be the best solution and it honestly baffles me that they haven't done so...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Monkeysloth wrote:
Its funny that no one has been over in the Vallejo thread about their contrast paints complaining about them hiring influencers to help "develop" the line including the one that's very active in that thread.

There's no difference between that and this. Just people paid to convince you their corporate overlords product is the one you should be buying.

The difference is, also, that Army Painter has already released its product and we know it to be garbage, and those influencers have been revealed as grifters. Vallejo's one influencer has been open about his relationship with Vallejo, and we don't actually know yet if the product he's pushing is good or bad, so he can get the benefit of the doubt.

Exactly this. Also, in Juan's demo video he demonstrates that the stuff doesn't reactivate - which is really the only sticking point with Speedpaints because they look pretty good as a product except for this one, tiny, critical flaw.

Oh, and Vallejo's track record of excellent paints, and AP's track record of ...not that.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
The difference is, also, that Army Painter has already released its product and we know it to be garbage, and those influencers have been revealed as grifters. Vallejo's one influencer has been open about his relationship with Vallejo, and we don't actually know yet if the product he's pushing is good or bad, so he can get the benefit of the doubt.

Also, Vallejo has a good reputation among painters, although I've heard criticism for their black surface primer and Game Color.

While I like the Army Painter washes, more dedicated hobbyists haven't said much for their paints. So when AP comes out with a product that has reactivation issues, of course their reputation plummets, along with anyone who endorses them.

As for "influencers", if you like that sort of thing, go ahead and watch. But "free" is never "free", and that goes for reviews. Video productions cost money, and if you're not paying for it, someone else is. Myself, if I'm looking for information, I find written reviews more helpful. For tutorials, I start with written but videos can help show a step. If I want opinions, I'll ask on a thread, since you'll have multiple opinions, typically from people who paid for the product instead of receiving it free.