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I like alot of army painter paints.
Some I hate.
Some I love
Some speedpaint I enjoy, but some I don't.

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:

Swapping to that gel medium for their non-airpaint range

woot!?

Their mixing medium is some kind of transparent resin now. It doesn't seem to seriously impact all colors that I have tried, but enough to turn me off. For me, it has increased the separation, and even when you shake it to hell and back, still has a gross mucus like quality and many colors have poor coverage even over white. You can't drybrush or edge highlight with them. Normally I would chock it up to a bad batch, but I've purchased from multiple places over time, so I think that's just how they are now.

Yup. This is a SPONSORED video for their "standard" line, known as Warpaints. The best this YouTuber could say about their paints while being paid to work with them is "Paint Brand DOESN'T MATTER?!"

https://youtu.be/HeX7ijTBuGM

 Albertorius wrote:
Not seeing any appeal at all, TBH. I use Vallejo metal colors, which are similarly easy to apply, and look significantly better, and yes, as said above, it makes more sense to shade or tint it afterwards.

This is what I was thinking. A solution looking for a problem as what's available looks better and takes way less time.

Now what would interest me is the color shift paints done similarly where the color shifted based off of the amount of paint coverage.

 Azazelx wrote:

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:

Swapping to that gel medium for their non-airpaint range

woot!?

Their mixing medium is some kind of transparent resin now. It doesn't seem to seriously impact all colors that I have tried, but enough to turn me off. For me, it has increased the separation, and even when you shake it to hell and back, still has a gross mucus like quality and many colors have poor coverage even over white. You can't drybrush or edge highlight with them. Normally I would chock it up to a bad batch, but I've purchased from multiple places over time, so I think that's just how they are now.

Yup. This is a SPONSORED video for their "standard" line, known as Warpaints. The best this YouTuber could say about their paints while being paid to work with them is "Paint Brand DOESN'T MATTER?!"

https://youtu.be/HeX7ijTBuGM

That was such a cringey video. Like, sure, if you're willing to put in the time you could just use craft store fingerpainting paints... doesn't mean anyone should actually do that though

Well, if something is crap or not can only be said if tested and not just because it looks different to what you are used to in a video

and for the metallic Speed Paints they look good for a niche technique that not many miniature painters are using and therefore is not available in the miniature painting range
artist brands are the only source I know and considered "bad" because they don't have a 100% coverage no matter how many layers

painting metallic this way is the opposite of the "trick" with contrast/tamiya clear/etc, were you have a bright metallic base add the colour as layer, and here you use a dark coloured base and add a metallic layer (it does not work with a white base)
I have painted dark/black silver/bronze/gold this way for more than 20 years now
hence I don't need the new AP paints as I have the brands that work best for me already but it is not crap be default just because the painting technique is different


that said I have not used any of the newer Warpaints so just know the old paints and the air range and those are fine
for the Speedpaints, those that I have are fine for what I use them too

the only thing I find very important is to never buy into a Brand or a full range
I know the different companies offer the large boxes and they often look like the best deal
but you will always end up with colours you don't like, don't use or not be happy with how they work

no matter if this is the Citadel, Vallejo, Army Painter, or even the Artist Brands, any set with more than 10/15 different paints is never worth it and you would be better of buying the individual colours from different brands than going

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
That was such a cringey video. Like, sure, if you're willing to put in the time you could just use craft store fingerpainting paints... doesn't mean anyone should actually do that though

Yeah, cringe aside, the fact that "work with what you've got" and "if you're willing to put the time and effort into learning to work with these paints in a completely different way to all other paints" is the best "recommendation" that he can put into a sponsored video, then maybe the product isn't actually all that amazing. Compare his review of Duncan's paints and how you can work with them as a contrast - no pun intended - (despite his rather douchey shot at Stahly and others who give us colour chits - something actually useful to the rest of us when using new paints and colour checking).

I've said this a bunch of times but it bears repeating - no fething idea why AP changed their medium from very similar to Citadel/Vallejo to the trash gel medium. Their paints used to be really good and interchangably useful with everyone else's rather than a box of basically expensive landfill that's unsellable and not worth giving away to anyone I actually like...

I still like their shades, though.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:
Not seeing any appeal at all, TBH. I use Vallejo metal colors, which are similarly easy to apply, and look significantly better, and yes, as said above, it makes more sense to shade or tint it afterwards.

One thing that would make me happy is to see Vallejo expand the Metal Colours range.

Me too! They are absolutely fantastic, but there's a lack of golds there.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Monkeysloth wrote:
This is what I was thinking. A problem looking for a solution as what's available looks better and takes way less time.

Now what would interest me is the color shift paints done similarly where the color shifted based off of the amount of paint coverage.

Ohhh yes, that would be cool. Not needing to whip out the airbrush to use colorshift paints properly would be very cool.

 kodos wrote:

the only thing I find very important is to never buy into a Brand or a full range
I know the different companies offer the large boxes and they often look like the best deal
but you will always end up with colours you don't like, don't use or not be happy with how they work

no matter if this is the Citadel, Vallejo, Army Painter, or even the Artist Brands, any set with more than 10/15 different paints is never worth it and you would be better of buying the individual colours from different brands than going

I got given the AK "suitcase" earlier this year for my birthday and I'm incredibly happy with it and would have happily paid the price out of my own pocket. Every paint I've used has been great, and every new paint I've used from the range has been great - much more so than other "cases" I've gotten (Mecha Colour, Model Air). Have I used every colour? Nope, but I've got lots of options and I've used colours I would not have otherwise purchased because they were available to me to go grab at the exact moment I was painting a specific thing.

I think to an extent it depends on how much of a variety of models you paint (I paint a wide variety), and also how much you can afford to spend on these things (not an issue for me). I'm not saying that I'm rich, but painting is my primary hobby, and so while others won't baulk at the cost of a Jetski or a set of golf clubs, that's how I feel about paints and models. So, I can afford it and I'm ok with it. It's also a one-off purchase, rather than a recurring one. If you're painting within narrower boundaries - say, 3-4 armies, some gangs and a few warbands, then the range of colorus in larger sets may well be much more of something you'll never use.

 legionaires wrote:
Glad to see Dakka doesn't change. Still gaking on AP.

Well. If they don't provide quality product can hardly expect praise?

Basic paints good. Speed paint less so.

Questionable did they fix reactivation here and of course...24h? Thanks. I can do base+shade+highlights with regular paints faster than 24h so this is hardly "speed" paint now does it? Point of "speed paint" is kind of be faster method...You trade off quality for speed...Except here you take longer.

Guess what? Just because producer name is army painter doesn't mean quality is 100% automatically no matter what white knights like you might think.

 Azazelx wrote:
(despite his rather douchey shot at Stahly and others who give us colour chits - something actually useful to the rest of us when using new paints and colour checking).

I have visited Stahly's site so many fecking times to use those colour swatches, so useful, I've often found myself in the hobby store flicking through Stahly's reviews deciding what to buy.

tneva82 wrote:

 legionaires wrote:
Glad to see Dakka doesn't change. Still gaking on AP.

Well. If they don't provide quality product can hardly expect praise?

Basic paints good. Speed paint less so.

Questionable did they fix reactivation here and of course...24h? Thanks. I can do base+shade+highlights with regular paints faster than 24h so this is hardly "speed" paint now does it? Point of "speed paint" is kind of be faster method...You trade off quality for speed...Except here you take longer.

Guess what? Just because producer name is army painter doesn't mean quality is 100% automatically no matter what white knights like you might think.

The reactivating is a quality of the type used in the paint supposedly and likely couldn’t be changed without the resin itself being changed, which is also what gives its quality’s with the product itself.
They have said they are looking at different blends to lessen it as a possibility.

So many people don’t want it changed and like and use the product as is without issue, as well as possible environmental issues.
Sometimes you do just have to learn and understand the paints.
Long drying times for best quality isn’t even uncommon, depending on a lot of factors.


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AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
(despite his rather douchey shot at Stahly and others who give us colour chits - something actually useful to the rest of us when using new paints and colour checking).

I have visited Stahly's site so many fecking times to use those colour swatches, so useful, I've often found myself in the hobby store flicking through Stahly's reviews deciding what to buy.

Does stahly do them over different paints? One reason I don’t use those is rarely people do them over different base colours and styles. So i rarely find them as useful as just watching painting using specific paints.

 kodos wrote:
and for the metallic Speed Paints they look good for a niche technique that not many miniature painters are using and therefore is not available in the miniature painting range

I'd argue that it's a "niche technique" because it's wrong

hence I don't need the new AP paints as I have the brands that work best for me already but it is not crap be default just because the painting technique is different

I'd say it's crap because the final result doesn't look like a satisfying metal finish. Surely that's the first benchmark of a metallic paint (or technique for painting a metallic)?

The edges look dull, the finish is uneven, they look grainy, almost like a sandblasted finish but not in a satisfying way. Kind of like when I was a kid and painted metal with excessively thinned enamel paint and didn't realise it needed a 2nd coat or that I should probably just be using acrylics.

But we'll see, I don't think it's right to render final judgement until we see the final product in the hands of painters outside of AP... it's just what we have seen leaves me unimpressed.

I could see maybe using them over the top of a bright silver? Not sure the result would be better than just doing a Black/Brown/Flesh wash over the same metallic though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Apple fox wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
(despite his rather douchey shot at Stahly and others who give us colour chits - something actually useful to the rest of us when using new paints and colour checking).

I have visited Stahly's site so many fecking times to use those colour swatches, so useful, I've often found myself in the hobby store flicking through Stahly's reviews deciding what to buy.

Does stahly do them over different paints? One reason I don’t use those is rarely people do them over different base colours and styles. So i rarely find them as useful as just watching painting using specific paints.

Nah he doesn't, I'd love it if he did. Maybe we can petition him next time he's floating around in this thread

There's a facebook page of a GW store somewhere that did them over different bases, but I can never find it when I want it (like right now).

One thing that can be deceptive about watching videos is these paints almost always look nicest when they're still wet, it's when they dry that's important, and videos often don't show off the finished product as well as a single high quality still image in controlled lighting (Stahly does photograph his colour swatches under a specific coloured lighting for consistency).

AllSeeingSkink, it would be a big change for me for sure. But also hard ask since there is a bunch of painting styles common use now.

The people I watch in video tend to give photo as well, so that I hasn’t been a big issue for what I am interested in learning with a new paint.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:


Nah he doesn't, I'd love it if he did. Maybe we can petition him next time he's floating around in this thread

I'm sorry, but just doing these paint swatches over white takes such a ... amount of time! I promise, once I become a full time Youtuber/Content Creator, I'll make swatches all day long

Apple fox wrote:


So many people don’t want it changed and like and use the product as is without issue, as well as possible environmental issues.
Sometimes you do just have to learn and understand the paints.
Long drying times for best quality isn’t even uncommon, depending on a lot of factors.

I guess I'm just lucky then. SpeedPaints has been a game changer for me and workswith how I paint. I have been enjoying the painting process more now in the last 2 months using SpeedPaints than I have in the last 5 years.

People can keep feeling free to not use AP just like I will never use AK.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
There's a facebook page of a GW store somewhere that did them over different bases, but I can never find it when I want it (like right now).

That would be the Warhammer Chelmsford Facebook page.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:I'd argue that it's a "niche technique" because it's wrong

of course it is, same as painting with Inks and Washes was wrong instead of base/layer/highlight until GW said it is right (but only if you use Contrast, it is still wrong if you use an Ink)

but more serious, this really depends on how people learned to paint and what they are used to
I cannot make metallic look good if they are opaque or or too tense yet I would not say the GW metalics are crap just because I have no use for them and not see the advantage in changing my technique to make them work for the same result

hence I can see how those metallic can be useful and speed up painting (speed up as in low afford rather than a time thing)

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
But we'll see, I don't think it's right to render final judgement until we see the final product in the hands of painters outside of AP... it's just what we have seen leaves me unimpressed.

I could see maybe using them over the top of a bright silver? Not sure the result would be better than just doing a Black/Brown/Flesh wash over the same metallic though.

would need to see how they look over black rather than a bright colour to make a decision if they are worth testing them or not
from the vid it is hard to tell of the metallic or the base is the problem

Azazelx wrote:.....

I also paint a lot but tend to mix the colours rather than using different shades out of a bottle and also go for a project with the 4-6 basic colours I want to use and mix everything else
but YMMV

I feel like army painter has a bad rap tbh.
The only real problem I have is the glossyness, but that fan be fixed with some medium and a matte varnish later.

Apple fox wrote:

The reactivating is a quality of the type used in the paint supposedly and likely couldn’t be changed without the resin itself being changed, which is also what gives its quality’s with the product itself.
They have said they are looking at different blends to lessen it as a possibility.

So many people don’t want it changed and like and use the product as is without issue, as well as possible environmental issues.
Sometimes you do just have to learn and understand the paints.
Long drying times for best quality isn’t even uncommon, depending on a lot of factors.

The 'long drying time' isn't really the issue though. It's the fact that the long drying time is an attribute of paints marketed as 'speedpaints'. AP retroactively trying to reframe it as the 'speed' coming from them being quick to apply doesn't really change that. If they had instead called them 'Onecoat' or something, and had been upfront about the reactivation in the original marketing (and even more ideally leaned into it and showed the ways it can be beneficial), I feel opinions on the range would be much less negative.


For the metals, if they have to be left for 24 hours or more to cure properly, it's difficult to see how they're a better option than a coat of regular metal and a wash unless they give outstanding results... and that doesn't appear to be the case.

Have we seen any thing on release date yet?

 kodos wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:I'd argue that it's a "niche technique" because it's wrong

of course it is, same as painting with Inks and Washes was wrong instead of base/layer/highlight until GW said it is right (but only if you use Contrast, it is still wrong if you use an Ink)

Nah, that's not a good simile I know you're jesting, but yeah, painting with washes and inks is a technique that predates GW, it just saw a renaissance among wargamers when contrasts came out. I can show you some models in my gallery that were painted with inks from before the existence of GW's contrasts.

but more serious, this really depends on how people learned to paint and what they are used to
I cannot make metallic look good if they are opaque or or too tense yet I would not say the GW metalics are crap just because I have no use for them and not see the advantage in changing my technique to make them work for the same result

hence I can see how those metallic can be useful and speed up painting (speed up as in low afford rather than a time thing)

I'm not really judging the technique, I'm judging the final result.

What technique are you planning to use that you think will give a good result? What metallics do you currently use that you don't like metallics that have a good opacity?

If I'm trying to paint a metal fast I generally slop on some Leadbelcher, Retributor Armour or Balthasar Gold and then throw a wash over it. I have also used Vallejo Metal Colours but not in the context of speed painting, I think they're maybe too runny and would end up where you don't want them, but perhaps it'd be interesting to try slopping on a Vallejo Metal Colour and see if that's a good speed painting option.

I'm all for speed painting techniques, but they still have to look somewhat decent, if you can get a much better result for very little extra effort then I don't think the speed painting technique is worth it. e.g. If your speed painting technique takes you from a 60 minute paint job to a 10 minute paint job, awesome, but if it's only taking you from a 15 minute paint job to a 10 minute paint job and looks much worse, I don't really see the value in that.

Currently I have various artists/studio (Schmincke, Kreul or Marabou) quality metallics, depending on what the local store as on stock

Usually I paint a dark base (black, dark brown or dark blue) and a single layer of 1-2 metals (not fully mixed so that you get a light colour shift or marble)

This is from my desk (WIP) with the metal as above:
https://www.tabletopwelt.de/uploads/monthly_2022_08/IMG_20220806_114136905.jpg.5dcd579a6293b9ae87ebe0719a5e39dd.jpg

Here I tried to paint the red ones the "GW" way (metallic base and highlights/wash) while the blue ones are as above
https://www.tabletopwelt.de/uploads/monthly_2022_08/IMG_20220806_114130657.jpg.6cc052bbfa1d356d8a89903b166247fd.jpg

It is fast, but needs to try, so I usually do it last before I go to bed so it gets almost a day until I continue

 kodos wrote:
Currently I have various artists/studio (Schmincke, Kreul or Marabou) quality metallics, depending on what the local store as on stock

Usually I paint a dark base (black, dark brown or dark blue) and a single layer of 1-2 metals (not fully mixed so that you get a light colour shift or marble)

This is from my desk (WIP) with the metal as above:
https://www.tabletopwelt.de/uploads/monthly_2022_08/IMG_20220806_114136905.jpg.5dcd579a6293b9ae87ebe0719a5e39dd.jpg

Here I tried to paint the red ones the "GW" way (metallic base and highlights/wash) while the blue ones are as above
https://www.tabletopwelt.de/uploads/monthly_2022_08/IMG_20220806_114130657.jpg.6cc052bbfa1d356d8a89903b166247fd.jpg

It is fast, but needs to try, so I usually do it last before I go to bed so it gets almost a day until I continue

Got a link to one of the metallics you use? When I've tried artists paints that were metallics, they were more fussy and had larger metallic flakes than most of the hobby-grade stuff I've used. So are the ones you're using thin and transparent out of the bottle?

I don't really think the GW metallics are the be all and end all, but the specific ones I mentioned I like for their ability to apply quickly and roughly without too much thought in the context of speed painting.

Your pics are a little too small for me to see, are they going for a true-metallic finish (i.e. where you can't see the metal flakes and it looks like a continuous metal)?

There's a lot of ways to paint metallics, I'm always happy to hear new techniques. If the new AP thingos work well in a different technique then I'll be happy to give it a go. Currently I'm just going off their promotional material where they look like something I would have painted as an 8 year old back in the 90's using my good ol' Testors enamel metallics

They are thinner out of the bottle than GW ones and half-transparent
I don't apply the like a Wash or AP did in the promo but more like a wet dry-brushing (if this makes sense)

Pigments are for sure larger than GW ones but not in a way that you see the flocks afterwards
Going for a true-metal but more as shiny colour rather than a chrome like look

PS:
https://www.gerstaecker.at/SCHMINCKE-AKADEMIE-Acryl-Color-Feine-Kuenstler-Acrylfarben.html
https://www.c-kreul.de/kreul/produkte/produkte/kuenstler/kuenstler-acrylfarben/solo-goya-acrylic/solo-goya-acrylic-20-ml-8er-set-effect-colors

 TalonZahn wrote:
Army Painter Speed Paints - Best Results after waiting 24 hours for each application.

There is a certain Onion/BabyonBee element of satire to that statement, lol. I hope they don't actually say that in the official promo video!

 warboss wrote:

 TalonZahn wrote:
Army Painter Speed Paints - Best Results after waiting 24 hours for each application.

There is a certain Onion/BabyonBee element of satire to that statement, lol. I hope they don't actually say that in the official promo video!

Nah, that's more one of those "hide in the fine print" things, lol.

2 hours. They say 2 hours in the video before adding additional washes and highlights. 24 hours is for a full cure.

Not that I intend to buy them. I really really like AP speedpaints but these metallics look awful. I'll stick to regular metallics and a wash+highlight, these just don't look like a good effect, the "silver" just looks like sparkly grey and the gold and bronze are only moderately less-bad.

Like somebody said upthread, AP is very hit and miss, and these 3 metallics are complete miss

 warboss wrote:

 TalonZahn wrote:
Army Painter Speed Paints - Best Results after waiting 24 hours for each application.

There is a certain Onion/BabyonBee element of satire to that statement, lol. I hope they don't actually say that in the official promo video!

They literally do say that in the promo video, around 3:30

In unrelated news, I sold my Speed paint Mega Set this week to someone who enjoy them, I kept the monster brush, which is good and reduces the loss I made on it.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 warboss wrote:

 TalonZahn wrote:
Army Painter Speed Paints - Best Results after waiting 24 hours for each application.

There is a certain Onion/BabyonBee element of satire to that statement, lol. I hope they don't actually say that in the official promo video!

They literally do say that in the promo video, around 3:30

In unrelated news, I sold my Speed paint Mega Set this week to someone who enjoy them, I kept the monster brush, which is good and reduces the loss I made on it.

The Monster Brush is the most used part of the Starter set for me, use it way more than the actual paints


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kalamadea wrote:
2 hours. They say 2 hours in the video before adding additional washes and highlights. 24 hours is for a full cure.

Not that I intend to buy them. I really really like AP speedpaints but these metallics look awful. I'll stick to regular metallics and a wash+highlight, these just don't look like a good effect, the "silver" just looks like sparkly grey and the gold and bronze are only moderately less-bad.

Like somebody said upthread, AP is very hit and miss, and these 3 metallics are complete miss

I will openly admit I didn't actually watch the video through. I hate videos, lol. I just fast forwarded through to see the application and results, as you say, they look awful.

I still like the sped paints. These are done almost completely with them and I like the results









Since I started using them I've gotten a LOT more stuff painted.