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Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
Kanluwen wrote: This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.
Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...
tneva82 wrote: You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling.
- No reason to keep this here, unless people want to use it for something...
What the heck does a phoenix lord need with Ynnari for resurrection? That’s their whole thing already. Stick another exarch in there and they power up again.
"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran
Army building fairly straight forward. Everything loses <Saedath>, <Kabal> and <Wych Cult> keywords and gains the Ynnari faction keyword which replaces the <Craftworld> keyword, so Ynnari are by default a de facto 'Craftworld.'
Craftworlds: Anything EXCEPT Corsairs (because.. reasons), Avatar of Khaine (obviously) or special characters that aren't the Ynnari Three (So no phoenix lords, Yriel or whoever)
Dark: any wych or kabal units plus incubi and scourges (but you have to pay extra for those two, because... reasons). No haemonculi stuff, or named characters. But also no Lords of Comorragh or Favored Retinue upgrades (so no trueborn)
Clowns: any except Solitaires (for the same reason as the Avatar of Khaine, essentially- wrong god), but no Pivotal Roles.
If you _don't_ include Dark or Clowns, you get Strands of Fate.
However, adding _any_ clowns or dark elfs turns off Strands of Fate. And Power from Pain. And Luck of the Laughing God. You... just don't get faction 'doctrine' at all.
Oddly, Travelling Players is still in play, so if you take clowns as a separate patrol detachment (and no dark elfs), you can keep Strands of Fate. Because... reasons.
Also no one can take Runes of Fate, and get Ynnari Rune powers instead (mostly..? Warlocks might not get the option to take Ynnari rather than Battle)
Really, Ynnari losing the big Army Doctrine rule seems a bit much. Less book keeping, but losing any measure of auto-successes, rerolls or toughness really hurts the army.
Transports are restricted to keywords (only Asuryani models in Asuryani transport, etc), except the two special Ynnari characters. Given all the keyword changes... a little weird. I know nothing loses Asuryani, Darkuryani or Clownuryani, but still... they're crossing all sorts of lines uniting in their new god of death, but touching someone else's ride is just right out. I mean, sure, Fire Dragons in open-topped boats would be oppressive (or... a useful way to use them), but it feels 100% gamey rather than fluffy (and most of this feels like a Ynnari player is making a fluffy decision)
I'm afraid I can only award you a B-, Voss.
Mostly a good breakdown but you missed the crucial rule wherein each Dark Eldar or Harlequin unit you take has to be balanced with a Craftworld unit in the same slot.
But don't let this discourage you - I'm sure with a little more revision you can get an A in the final exam.
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
Voss wrote: If you _don't_ include Dark or Clowns, you get Strands of Fate.
However, adding _any_ clowns or dark elfs turns off Strands of Fate. And Power from Pain. And Luck of the Laughing God. You... just don't get faction 'doctrine' at all.
Oddly, Travelling Players is still in play, so if you take clowns as a separate patrol detachment (and no dark elfs), you can keep Strands of Fate. Because... reasons.
Also no one can take Runes of Fate, and get Ynnari Rune powers instead (mostly..? Warlocks might not get the option to take Ynnari rather than Battle)
Really, Ynnari losing the big Army Doctrine rule seems a bit much. Less book keeping, but losing any measure of auto-successes, rerolls or toughness really hurts the army.
Thanks for the breakdown - tbh its this bit that causes me to go crosseyed.
So my reading is you can take a fully CWE army (with the somewhat random restrictions, but you get Yvraine+friends) using Ynnari effectively as your craftworld. Its the same as playing say Ulthwe and you keep Strands of Fate. You can also slot in a Harlequin patrol (I wasn't sure on this so thanks for clarifying).
If you do anything else however, the rules fall into little bits. So its very hard to see why anyone would run the multi-faction detachment outlined in the book even with the restrictions. And DE are basically impossible to include without severely hurting yourself. (I.E. is an Incubi who can fight first but loses power from pain worth 22 points? I think the answer is no.)
Mr_Rose wrote: What the heck does a phoenix lord need with Ynnari for resurrection? That’s their whole thing already. Stick another exarch in there and they power up again.
Basically:
Jain-Zar herself is bisected and then dragged away by the returning mandrakes to a forgotten realm, which is a smart move on his part as it forbids anyone ever finding her armour again. But luckily for the Craftworlders, Yvraine hears/feels her soul’s death wail and does the same trick she had done to her back when she was in the arena to a Banshee Exarch, who awakens from her death sleep, finds the armour and the eaten remains of the old wearer nearby. She puts on the armour, Jain-Zar now awoken once more with not only her original alignment to Khaine, but to Ynnead too.
Army building fairly straight forward. Everything loses <Saedath>, <Kabal> and <Wych Cult> keywords and gains the Ynnari faction keyword which replaces the <Craftworld> keyword, so Ynnari are by default a de facto 'Craftworld.'
Craftworlds: Anything EXCEPT Corsairs (because.. reasons), Avatar of Khaine (obviously) or special characters that aren't the Ynnari Three (So no phoenix lords, Yriel or whoever)
Dark: any wych or kabal units plus incubi and scourges (but you have to pay extra for those two, because... reasons). No haemonculi stuff, or named characters. But also no Lords of Comorragh or Favored Retinue upgrades (so no trueborn)
Clowns: any except Solitaires (for the same reason as the Avatar of Khaine, essentially- wrong god), but no Pivotal Roles.
If you _don't_ include Dark or Clowns, you get Strands of Fate.
However, adding _any_ clowns or dark elfs turns off Strands of Fate. And Power from Pain. And Luck of the Laughing God. You... just don't get faction 'doctrine' at all.
Oddly, Travelling Players is still in play, so if you take clowns as a separate patrol detachment (and no dark elfs), you can keep Strands of Fate. Because... reasons.
Also no one can take Runes of Fate, and get Ynnari Rune powers instead (mostly..? Warlocks might not get the option to take Ynnari rather than Battle)
Really, Ynnari losing the big Army Doctrine rule seems a bit much. Less book keeping, but losing any measure of auto-successes, rerolls or toughness really hurts the army.
Transports are restricted to keywords (only Asuryani models in Asuryani transport, etc), except the two special Ynnari characters. Given all the keyword changes... a little weird. I know nothing loses Asuryani, Darkuryani or Clownuryani, but still... they're crossing all sorts of lines uniting in their new god of death, but touching someone else's ride is just right out. I mean, sure, Fire Dragons in open-topped boats would be oppressive (or... a useful way to use them), but it feels 100% gamey rather than fluffy (and most of this feels like a Ynnari player is making a fluffy decision)
I'm afraid I can only award you a B-, Voss.
Mostly a good breakdown but you missed the crucial rule wherein each Dark Eldar or Harlequin unit you take has to be balanced with a Craftworld unit in the same slot.
But don't let this discourage you - I'm sure with a little more revision you can get an A in the final exam.
Designer's Note: Since their introduction, we have failed to truly utilise the Ynnari as a proper fighting force. Their rules have gone back and forth between detailed and scarcely there.
With the release of the new Aeidlelererrii Codex, we decided it was finally time to change how they are represented.
Now putting a Ynnari army together is so overly complicated that we are certain people will just give up and stick to regular Aieirldlerrir or just do a Sade... Sethh... Sadie... whatever we're calling Harlequins now. That army.
Kanluwen wrote: At least it makes army building fairly easy...
Your mandatory troop choices go quick!
It does make the question of whether they want or don't want you to play Ynnari more complicated.
The whole package feels like an over-reaction to their old power level. They're probably fine but not amazing as a pure 'Craftworld,' and you can sneak in a Clown patrol with no trouble (but you have to pay CP, in an army that wants them), but one stray clown in the main detachment or any dark eldar shuts down the army's primary gimmick. That's a really high price for... whatever you're souping for. Open transports and wyches? Disintegrators? (There are plenty of native platforms for bright lances across multiple FOCs and even transports). Overpriced independents? Are any of the DE options better than just taking the improved craftworld units? (Honest question, I don't really know one way or the other)
It feels like a 'you can but why would you want to?' Just play pure Craft.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/02/28 14:41:56
Wait, you can't use the Corsairs with the Ynnari? That's super infuriating, as visually they go together super well; they both mix Craftworld and Drukhari aesthetics.
Crimson wrote: Wait, you can't use the Corsairs with the Ynnari? That's super infuriating, as visually they go together super well; they both mix Craftworld and Drukhari aesthetics.
Using Corsairs at all is randomly a challenge. The troops version gets ObSec, but can't be used for mandatory slots.
Some options (including the psyker) are reserved for the elite slot version, and it has a _lot_ of competition (in addition to everything that was already there, warlocks, dire avengers and even wraithlords got jammed in there sideways).
But no, Ynnari just can't take them at all. Which has fluff people a bit cranky, since apparently Corsairs were among the first recruits Yvraine picked up.
----
Yikes at the combat patrol. That's really committing hard to bikes.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/02/28 16:16:54
Aren't corsairs not available to Ynnari? Or did I miss something? I hope it's one of those things that will get FAQ-ed if it's the case...
Work in progress p&m blog :
United Colors of Chaos , Relating my ongoing battle with grey plastic...
2022 hobby running tally: bought: 71, built: 45, painted: 17, games played: 3
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zamerion wrote: i tried looking for it but i couldn't find it.
Ah, found it: You can't use any Phoenix lords, no Anhrathe (the corsairs' fancy name...), no Avatar, no solitaire, and no non-Ynnari named character in an Ynnari detatchement.
Work in progress p&m blog :
United Colors of Chaos , Relating my ongoing battle with grey plastic...
2022 hobby running tally: bought: 71, built: 45, painted: 17, games played: 3
10000pts 4000pts 5000pts 1500pts
Seriously WTFGW! You publish a picture of Corsairs with Yvraine, and they make perfect sense together both visually and fluff wise, yet the rules don't allow it.
I am so done with all the idiotic restrictions about how I can build my army or equip the models. This is really killing my fun.
Crimson wrote: Seriously WTFGW! You publish a picture of Corsairs with Yvraine, and they make perfect sense together both visually and fluff wise, yet the rules don't allow it.
I am so done with all the idiotic restrictions about how I can build my army or equip the models. This is really killing my fun.
It feels like something they will FAQ.
Maybe I should actually email to indicate I vaguely care.
Crimson wrote: Seriously WTFGW! You publish a picture of Corsairs with Yvraine, and they make perfect sense together both visually and fluff wise, yet the rules don't allow it.
I am so done with all the idiotic restrictions about how I can build my army or equip the models. This is really killing my fun.
It feels like something they will FAQ.
Maybe I should actually email to indicate I vaguely care.
Just like that they'll FAQ the Autarch loadouts?
You'd think a multi-billion-pounds company would be able to afford a proofreader.
Oh wait then they'd have to pay him, reducing their profits, nevermind.
"Tabletop games are the only setting when a body is made more horrifying for NOT being chopped into smaller pieces."
- Jiado
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