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You understand now why I told you to minimize troops?

 Thairne wrote:
You understand now why I told you to minimize troops?

yes. and I did as you told me. but with less troops (like 3x5 prosecutors) I think it would have been very, very hard to hold the board. Maybe 3x3 standard guard with spear will be the standard. better than 3x5 prosecutors and the cheapest troop tax outside if sisters. for 45 more you get shields.

honestly, im a bit lost on were to go from this. I checked the LVO lists too. staple units seem to be: Trajan, 2x3 bikes, galatus/archillus and either plate cap or bike cap. I run all that too.

I would also say don't dismiss units or styles in a vacuum. Over 500 games, I bet you Wardens would earn more points back than troops.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I would also say don't dismiss units or styles in a vacuum. Over 500 games, I bet you Wardens would earn more points back than troops.

yeah, probably. they saved the vex and Trajan for a lot of trouble today. I dont regret taking them.


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ok so if we go cheap on troops (we can only buy one prosecutor squad if we have 2 guard) it looks like this.

trajann
bike cap

2x3 spear guard
5xprosecutor

galatus
galatus
3x warden
vex

2x3 bikes

that leaves around 190 points. were do we go from there?

- fill the last 2 eliteslot with squads of 1 and 2 allarus?
- buy I third dreadnaught
- buy a plate cap
- buy a second vex. maybe the light cover one.
- Something else?

Hmm....... actually for your list I'd pick up a caladius with blaze cannon.


You can drop the wardens and pick up another spear guard squad to put you dead even on points.

Blaze cannon in EC isnt bad at all with the reroll.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
Hmm....... actually for your list I'd pick up a caladius with blaze cannon.


You can drop the wardens and pick up another spear guard squad to put you dead even on points.

Blaze cannon in EC isnt bad at all with the reroll.

Why does he need a caladuis though? With 2 bike squads and the dreadnoughts he has a pretty reasonable amount of shooting already. With new missions favoring mid-board presence 2 single terminators and another prosecutor squad seems like a nicer choice.

There’s also the fact that dropping the wardens down to spear guardians is a massive downgrade. Wardens after all are a unit people want at least 1 of, while guardians are a unit most take as a tax.

downgrading to wardens gets him the caladius, and the caladius gives him something he lacks (str9 shooting).

The caladius has an additional benefit of being fairly mobile.

Currently he only has the 2 bike squads to hit the flanks quickly, which your gonna mostly want to do on the same side.

He can send the caladius to the opposite side of the field if nessecary to grab a point and will require some dedication to remove.

With the new fall back and shoot strat, the tanks are much more useful for the midfield than they were before.

Scoundrel80 wrote:

 Thairne wrote:
You understand now why I told you to minimize troops?

yes. and I did as you told me. but with less troops (like 3x5 prosecutors) I think it would have been very, very hard to hold the board. Maybe 3x3 standard guard with spear will be the standard. better than 3x5 prosecutors and the cheapest troop tax outside if sisters. for 45 more you get shields.

honestly, im a bit lost on were to go from this. I checked the LVO lists too. staple units seem to be: Trajan, 2x3 bikes, galatus/archillus and either plate cap or bike cap. I run all that too.

Friendly reminder that you cant use 3x5 prosecs as troops anyway. 2 Custodian Guard/Sags are the minimum anyway. I usually run 2x Guard and 2x Prosecs for the case that I run into a 2/3 more mission.

I wonder what value the Caladius has now with it's cost, it's easy to kill T7 platform, degrading. It's got all the problems of the hammerhead, with weaker shooting. No, I'd rather just take two more bikers, so 2x4 bikes. Better for AT and better for ablative wounds. If you drop the Wardens, you are basically giving the enemy a really easy way to Trajann.

The FW update just dropped with the following changes:

Page 83 – Custodian Guard with Adrasite and Pyrithite Spears
• Change the Damage characteristic of the Adrasite spear (melee) profile to ‘2’.
• Change the Damage characteristic of the Pyrithite spear (melee) profile to ‘2’.

Page 83, 84, 85, 86 – Custodian Guard with Adrasite and Pyrithite Spears, Sagittarum Custodians, Aquilon Custodians, Agamatus Custodians, Venatari Custodians
• Add the following ability to the Abilities section of these units:
‘Martial ka’tah (see Codex: Adeptus Custodes)’
• Change the Leadership characteristic of models in these units to ‘11’.

Page 84 – Aquilon Custodians, Keywords
Add the ‘Teleport Homer’ keyword.

Page 84, 85 – Contemptor-Galatus Dreadnought, Contemptor-Achillus Dreadnought
• Add the ‘Core’ keyword to the Keywords section of these units.
• Change the Leadership characteristic of models in these units to ‘11’.

Page 86 – Pallas Grav-attack
Change the Leadership characteristic of models in this unit to ‘11’.

Page 88, 89, 90 – Caladius Grav-tank, Coronus Grav-carrier, Orion Assault Dropship, Ares Gunship
• Add the ‘Machine Spirit’ keyword to the Keywords section of these units.
• Change the Leadership characteristic of models in these units to ‘11’.

So this just in: FW Compendium FAQ went up and nothing really changed. Leadership updates and the melta spears and adrasite spears went to dmg2 in melee.

No auric weapon keyword on anything.

Edit: beat me by a minute.


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The balance datalsate also didn't affect anyone besides Dark eldar? Strange.

Also there seems to be no FAQ for our codex.

Thank god they updated our Vehicles to Ld 11!

And I think it's hilarious that they waited until now to update the spear damage, and then forgot to update Agamatus spear damage, which is still d3. Clown show.

At least we know now that our FW infantry get Katas, including Venetari!

Pretty disappointed that the A&P spears didn’t get the auric weapons keyword.

Machine spirit on our tanks is nice though, at least they get the option to use top profile for 1CP

The Achillus and Galatus being core isn’t new, right?


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FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
! And I think it's hilarious that they waited until now to update the spear damage, and then forgot to update Agamatus spear damage, which is still d3. Clown

Sometimes I get the impression, that GW is unconfortable to have FW models around so they do a half-arsed job of supporting their rules.

Anyway, they should make Agamatus spears damage 3, so at least this unit would be worth a consideration

We knew they were losing core, I think. It was in the leaks. But more importantly, we had hoped they would gain Katas. I'm actually not surprised Pyrite and other spear didn't get Auric. Wouldn't want Guardians running around double shooting Meltas in everyone's face at 16" in Salvus.

Still, kinda hilarious that they gave it to Trajann's axe, and Ser Walken's spear.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
We knew they were losing core, I think. It was in the leaks. But more importantly, we had hoped they would gain Katas. I'm actually not surprised Pyrite and other spear didn't get Auric. Wouldn't want Guardians running around double shooting Meltas in everyone's face at 16" in Salvus.

Still, kinda hilarious that they gave it to Trajann's axe, and Ser Walken's spear.

Nobody lost CORE. They said they were adding CORE to the Galatus/Achillus, but that was silly because I think they already had CORE.

Audustum wrote:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
We knew they were losing core, I think. It was in the leaks. But more importantly, we had hoped they would gain Katas. I'm actually not surprised Pyrite and other spear didn't get Auric. Wouldn't want Guardians running around double shooting Meltas in everyone's face at 16" in Salvus.

Still, kinda hilarious that they gave it to Trajann's axe, and Ser Walken's spear.

Nobody lost CORE. They said they were adding CORE to the Galatus/Achillus, but that was silly because I think they already had CORE.

Correct, the Achillus and Galatus already had the CORE keyword.

I mean this "update", if you even want to call it that, is not terrible but it really feels half arsed by GW.

That's disappointing that none of the FW models received the Auric weapons keyword

 The Red Hobbit wrote:
That's disappointing that none of the FW models received the Auric weapons keyword

At this point I’m not sure whoever wrote that FAQ knows that this keyword exists

At least they did the basics and sprinkled machine spirit on top

Tiberias wrote:

Audustum wrote:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
We knew they were losing core, I think. It was in the leaks. But more importantly, we had hoped they would gain Katas. I'm actually not surprised Pyrite and other spear didn't get Auric. Wouldn't want Guardians running around double shooting Meltas in everyone's face at 16" in Salvus.

Still, kinda hilarious that they gave it to Trajann's axe, and Ser Walken's spear.

Nobody lost CORE. They said they were adding CORE to the Galatus/Achillus, but that was silly because I think they already had CORE.

Correct, the Achillus and Galatus already had the CORE keyword.

I mean this "update", if you even want to call it that, is not terrible but it really feels half arsed by GW.

Quell surprise!.

They messed up alot of stuff. This was a pretty lazy update.

They forgot to bring the telemon to Ld11.

They forgot to bring the spears up to str7.

They didnt update the weapons that needed updates.

Piss poor.

Wow they didn't even bother making the spears S7? Seems like an afterthought update, shame.

On the topic of FW spears has anyone had success with the Pyrithite spears?

Can the argument be made, that GW doesn't care at all about FW updates? If only through a business expectation, FW books don't sell nearly as well as GW books, so they put in less effort? When you crack these books, does it say who wrote the rules? Is there an about the team section or anything? Is it always the same people?

Is there any reason to even buy the physical books, because we know it'll be invalidated on the first update when they have to correct mistakes and update words?

Do we know if the GW 40k app has properly updated yet for custodes?

Nope, that's why you wait for Battlescribe to update LOL

Battlescribe already entered the Custodes dex, they just haven't done the CA yet.

Also, didn't I hear that BS is shutting down, and it's going to be completely run by non-paid peoples? So no more on time updates then?

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Battlescribe already entered the Custodes dex, they just haven't done the CA yet.

Also, didn't I hear that BS is shutting down, and it's going to be completely run by non-paid peoples? So no more on time updates then?

The core software isn't getting updated, the programmer has gone dark for over a year. Its basically a time bomb before a update to the phone operating system breaks battlescibe

im playing vs DG now. does tanglefoot get hosed by inexorable advance ability? also, they ignore forests -2 to move, right?

Scoundrel80 wrote:
im playing vs DG now. does tanglefoot get hosed by inexorable advance ability? also, they ignore forests -2 to move, right?

I also just played against DG (and also have an army of them on the shelf right now). You are correct that models with inexorable advance ignore tanglefoot and forests. This does not include poxwalkers though.

That said we absolutely crush DG as I won easily despite numerous misplays (although neither of us where playing optimized lists, he was running Typhus, a min plague marine unit, and a 5 man blightlord terminator unit, while I ran 4 terminators and upgrades over a 2nd salvo bike squad)

Is anyone else worried about the next codexes?
It seems like just like d3 was turned into 2D, now it seems like D6 is being turned into D3+3.
And weapons like that usually have ap-2 or better.
That means that a single failed roll of a 4++ will kill any non-HQ infantry model and has enough power to dismantle any non-telemon dreadnought with 2 hits.
It looks like Custodes may actually be up to be the next victim after Marines now that 2D is oversaturated and 4D is becoming the minimum value for big guns as well.
Paying for defense you just dont get to use is one of the worst things that can happen to you-

Scoundrel80 wrote:im playing vs DG now. does tanglefoot get hosed by inexorable advance ability? also, they ignore forests -2 to move, right?

You are correct. Inexorable advance ignores the tanglefoot penalty.

Thairne wrote:Is anyone else worried about the next codexes?
It seems like just like d3 was turned into 2D, now it seems like D6 is being turned into D3+3.
And weapons like that usually have ap-2 or better.
That means that a single failed roll of a 4++ will kill any non-HQ infantry model and has enough power to dismantle any non-telemon dreadnought with 2 hits.
It looks like Custodes may actually be up to be the next victim after Marines now that 2D is oversaturated and 4D is becoming the minimum value for big guns as well.
Paying for defense you just dont get to use is one of the worst things that can happen to you-

Not particularly. We have so many threats on the board now that it's really difficult for an opponent to deal with everything until we get close enough to munch them.
We have to think about our units a bit differently, especially custodian guard. They are no longer an immovable object that can hold an objective forever. They are literally throw away troops that you shouldn't waste your stratagems on. If they roll hot on their 4+ invuln, nice...if they die, they die *insert Ivan drago meme*
Our survivability is now very closely tied to our stratagems and those have to be used on bikes, terminators or other more valuable stuff.

Also, we are codex herohammer now anyway, so who cares if more of our stuff does as long as the characters are bonkers enough to pull a lot of weight.

I'll take the D3+3 shift anyday. I'm so glad they killed the swinginess of anti-tank weapons. Paying for all that LC firepower and then rolling a 1 for damage was brutal. I think you should get hurt when getting hit with big weapons. That being said, they went overboard with a few weapons, turning them from assault platforms into heavy AT, mostly Melta grade stuff. That I think is a big failing of 9th.

But Tanks should be afraid of Fire dragons, and LCs. Now they are.

People seem to think 4+ is not good enough. 4+ is still 50%. With a reroll, it's even better. Also, if your opponent is wasting AT on your infantry, that means they aren't wasting it on your giant golden death bots.