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goonhammer wrote this about the custodes in CA

TheChirurgeon: With Stranglehold and To the Last out of the picture, Custodes need some secondary help if they want to stay in the game and they get some. Auric Mortalis loses its -2 VP rider for units killed by the chosen unit and now scores you 5 VP as long as that unit is destroyed outside of your deployment zone. Might of Terra loses its ANATHEMA PSYKANA rider, so you can lose sisters and still score it, making it a better option than Grind for armies that want to bring a unit of Sisters of Silence or two. Stand Vigil remains unchanged but it’s much more useful and valuable in a world without Stranglehold.

https://www.goonhammer.com/chapter-approved-war-zone-nephilim-the-goonhammer-review/#Adeptus_Custodes

i don't get why anyone would take Might of Terra you can only max it if you only lose units in 1 turn. so how is it better than Grind?

Its better than grind IF you bring a lot of sisters.
Cause they'll be picked off very easily, bringing your own required kill count up significantly.
MIght of Terra does not have that problem, but it then requires you to not lose a Custodes unit - which is ridiculous.
Its mostly useful for custodes armies that... dont play many custodes units.
So it remains inferior to Grind for almost every occasion.

Who wants to lay odds on the new Space Dwaves with "Plasma Swords" doing more damage than a Custodes axe, or having a better overall profile?

Also, can we talk about how "Plasma Swords" sounds like a mentally weak child's first idea for a weapon? Why not just call it a light saber. Because it's licensed. Holy crap this release is getting sillier and sillier.

Sure. For a simple reason - power creep. New faction. I really didnt like 7th ed, but 9th is really taking the cake as the "worst edition" now.

GW naming has always been... a bit... uncreative.
Does it end with "or"? It's a marine.
Personally I'm surprised they didnt call it "forge weapons" or "ancestral blade" or something in the line of "wolfy mc wolfface from planet wolffang" or "bloody Hamoglove from Planet Blood Chalice"

Ok, so Warzone Nephilim: considering the standard Custodes list with Trajann, a Bike Captain with relic and two warlord traits, plus one dreadnought with eternal penitent seems reasonable.
That would leave us with...what? Two CP at the start of the game?

Seems like we have to be even more careful when to deploy stratagems. Not sure I'm on board with that change especially for Custodes.

Edit: skews internal balance even further, right? No matter what Trajann is going to cost after the points update, not taking him is not going to be an option it seems.

Jesus, take a look at the Lord of Skulls. It's like Someone ducktaped two Telemons together and forced it to have a child with a Warhound.

30W, S8/T8,WS/BS3 A6, 2+/5++

Melee Axe Profile is S16 AP4 flat 6. or TRIPLE (18) ATTACKS at S8 AP4 D2.

Oh, and it's attacks go UP when it's degraded. So that could be almost 30 attacks at S8.

Can this get any more silly? I bet it has a way to invalidate Invulns as well. Although, with 18 attacks, who cares?

I don't think it will be that good for what? 600ish points?

I think it's 547, but still. That's two Telemons. Kinda odd that the first thing I've seen that can 1 round Morty is on Morty's team.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I think it's 547, but still. That's two Telemons. Kinda odd that the first thing I've seen that can 1 round Morty is on Morty's team.

How does it one-round Mortarion?

Its sweep profile wounds on a 4+ and does 1 damage to him.
Its strike profile wounds on a 2+ and does 5 damage. So, given Mortarion has 18 wounds and a 3+/4++5+++. you'd need 6 failed saves to kill him on average. That's 12 wounds, 14.4 hits, and 21.6 attacks.

Trajann up to 200 in the recent update. He's where he should be. Zero other changes. Half our faction is worthless plastic (Contemptor Dread/Land Raider) and they leave it as is. Bikes stay at the same cost. I think this was overall not great, but it's hard to say we didn't need the nerf to Trajann. Hopefully 10th will bring us salvation quickly.

We honestly made it out like bandits from the points update. Trajann to 200 is totally reasonable and both the Achillus and Galatus up by 10 is fine in my opinion.

I am very curious what the dataslate is going to bring for us tomorrow. Maybe return obsec to wardens and terminators?

Edit: @Fezzik, considering that both the Achillus and Galatus went up, our standard ugly venerable contemptor is far from being a useless hunk of plastik. They are really not bad actually. The land raider is still trash though.

I am not saying they are Grot fodder, I'm saying that given the choice, We pay a heavy price for Elite slots. I don't want to waste any Elite slots on what is essentially the weakest member of our Elite units. Surely the Terminators or the Praetors are a better use for the points? 155ppm for a unit that doesn't do the work to earn it back is better left to Wardens, or either of the other dreads. S14 ap3 d3 just doesn't cut it. I could seriously consider it if the AC was d2.

Tiberias wrote:

Edit: @Fezzik, considering that both the Achillus and Galatus

By only 10 points. Doesn't make the standard Dread look good whatsoever

I am not saying that the ugly contemptor is suddenly better than the Achillus/Galatus, but it's as tough as the Achillus and has similar melee output as the Galatus (ugly has higher S, Galatus has more attacks) and gets a multimelta, which provides some ranged anti tank other than bikes....all for 155p. That's not bad, definitely better than being a useless hunk plastic and I'd definitely pick that over three Wardens if I had to make the choice between them

Edit: my main point being this: for folks not having access to forgeworld options, the ugly contemptor is actually a very decent substitute.

2 Illiastus Caladius + 3 MM Codex dreads give you just an incredible firebase. For 875 points in EC, you get physically big bodies on objectives, mobility through the tanks, 55 wounds on T7 chasses, half of which is non-degrading, and we also have the strat for tanks. 2+ BS, EC gives you effectively 5 rerolls, you shoot 6 MM shots, and 16 7/-3/2 across the board, plus you have 12 lastrum shots for chaff clearing, none of these are blast (good for shooting into melee), and the dread also hits similarly to the galatus (less, but bigger).

Unless they have some sort of gakky shenanigans, you will down significant chunks of an enemy force.

And half your list tied up in 1 model units, that are easily pushed aside for Core Unit points. The killer for us is that our dreads and bikes can't hold points. If our dreads and bikes had Obsec, that would be something worth looking into. Unfortunately GW hates power lists and doesn't want to see IH(ish) stompy lists anymore. It's bad for Knights. So we are the square peg being forced to play the round hole of MSU infantry based combat. Which at the very least, is accurate to Fluff for Custodes.

 Thairne wrote:
Its better than grind IF you bring a lot of sisters.
Cause they'll be picked off very easily, bringing your own required kill count up significantly.
MIght of Terra does not have that problem, but it then requires you to not lose a Custodes unit - which is ridiculous.
Its mostly useful for custodes armies that... dont play many custodes units.
So it remains inferior to Grind for almost every occasion.

Yes, hilariously, might of terra is insanely good with the 2k all sisters list since you get the points if you kill any enemy units.


Ahhh, on second thought, i think you have to kill the enemy's units with actual custodes for that one so nvm wont work.

It's a shame that Sisters can't get attached to other lists like Inquisition or Assassins. I'd love to take the Sword Sisters in a BA list.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
It's a shame that Sisters can't get attached to other lists like Inquisition or Assassins. I'd love to take the Sword Sisters in a BA list.

I mean you can take the Culexus for the same technical role...

Yeah, but it doesn't have the same shooting, abilities to snipe characters, or general all around usefulness. Also it doesn't have obsec.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Yeah, but it doesn't have the same shooting, abilities to snipe characters, or general all around usefulness. Also it doesn't have obsec.

Well you said Sword Sisters soooooo I gotta ask: what shooting?

EviscerationPlague wrote:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Yeah, but it doesn't have the same shooting, abilities to snipe characters, or general all around usefulness. Also it doesn't have obsec.

Well you said Sword Sisters soooooo I gotta ask: what shooting?

Good point. Serves me right. I submit myself to the flagellation teams. I seriously forgot I was talking in reference to the sword sisters. Wait, THEY DO HAVE A SHOOTING ATTACK. But it's the same grenade as the Culexus. Never mind. I forgot what I was talking about.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:

EviscerationPlague wrote:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Yeah, but it doesn't have the same shooting, abilities to snipe characters, or general all around usefulness. Also it doesn't have obsec.

Well you said Sword Sisters soooooo I gotta ask: what shooting?

Good point. Serves me right. I submit myself to the flagellation teams. I seriously forgot I was talking in reference to the sword sisters. Wait, THEY DO HAVE A SHOOTING ATTACK. But it's the same grenade as the Culexus. Never mind. I forgot what I was talking about.

Also the Culexus would be infinitely more survivable, which is more useful than anything else.

I still want to find a viable "counts as" for flamer SoS, so I can try a Burninate the Countryside list. FLAME ON MFers!

i know it sounds completely silly, fezzik, but I have used 7x flamegirls in a unit to advance/shoot around the table. they are pretty fast, can delete stuff and are basically unchargeable as they put 7d6 s5ap1 shots into anything. But yeah, they melt to anything shooting.

Did Basic flamer sisters get 5/1 flamers? I thought the Centura got 5/1 but the basics just got their 4/1. I still say the basic Bolter Sisters running up can out perform them the majority of the time, as the D6 is too swingy. If they did something to flamers to actually make them worth the cost, I'd be all for it, but as it is, I could end up with 7 hits on a single round of shooting, which ain't great for their cost.

Yesterday Goonhammer put out an article with Jack Harpster (of Art of War) talking about how Custodes are looking in the Nephilim season:

https://www.goonhammer.com/nephilim-faction-focus-jack-harpster-talks-adeptus-custodes/

TL;DR: The standard Venerable Contemptor (from the codex) is actually looking okay nowadays. Comp builds for Custodes will likely include those and Caladius tanks (and maybe even a Pallas or two), rather than infantry and bikes. Also Trajann at his new cost is no longer an auto-take.

Did you need anyone to tell you that? Also, Custodes are not even viable as a non infantry force. We lose 90% of our special abilities, not to mention our ability to anything with ObSec, Core, or relics. Nope count me out. I'd rather run a fluffy fun list than a competetive shitheel list of bots and tanks.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Did Basic flamer sisters get 5/1 flamers? I thought the Centura got 5/1 but the basics just got their 4/1. I still say the basic Bolter Sisters running up can out perform them the majority of the time, as the D6 is too swingy. If they did something to flamers to actually make them worth the cost, I'd be all for it, but as it is, I could end up with 7 hits on a single round of shooting, which ain't great for their cost.

Well at least theyd autohit and be ap1. you cant determine it like that. A low average would be 21. But yeah i know its not a viable choice.

I mean, if we were going with some form of ultra fluffy "Convent of the Golden Ladies" as a list, I'm 100% on board. Only problem, they are a sub-sub faction. They don't even have a faction buff. Just a thing that says they can attach to Custodes without bothering them....

Sisters need some form of individuality....