Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Irbis wrote:

deano2099 wrote:
I can see them going as far as releasing another set of expansions for BSF. The core game is still in print, it's proven the more popular game, no need to make another sci-fi version, just go back to that.

I can't see them doing so when BSF storyline is pretty much complete, anyway. And honestly, I'd prefer GW to do something new, boardgame based on Inquisitor or Rogue Trader scouting unknown frontier, perhaps, something that would give them excuse to explore fringes of the universe further. Or base the game during the Great Crusade and show how pre-primarch early Imperium looked like. Or hell, do pre-unification Terra as setting. Imperium Nihilus. That abandoned Second Imperium storyline from FW. War of the False Primarch. Anything, just something original...

An expansion to BSF doesn't necessarily mean still being set on a Blackstone Fortress with that storyline. Most of the heroes and enemies could be reused, throw in some tiles for a new setting, some appropriate gear cards.

It seems to me like there's a reason they've kept the base game around so long and reprinted it even after releasing and selling out of all the prior expansions.

I think they'd benefit from the very un-GW thing to do and create a solid core ruleset that they can reuse over the years so tiles, characters and campaigns are all interchangeable and old ones can still be used when they release a new box. Then it wouldn't be a question of whether you get a new game or an expansion of Blackstone Fortress. You could just use your favorite Ratling tag team in the new game or grab some new characters to replay the old campaign. Shame that's not something we can expect from GW.

 KidCthulhu wrote:
Not unless there's multiple suspects to paint and a mechanic that makes the killer unknown each game. Clue 40,000?

Was it the Acolyte in the Librariam with a Plasma Pistol ?

 Geifer wrote:
I think they'd benefit from the very un-GW thing to do and create a solid core ruleset that they can reuse over the years so tiles, characters and campaigns are all interchangeable and old ones can still be used when they release a new box. Then it wouldn't be a question of whether you get a new game or an expansion of Blackstone Fortress. You could just use your favorite Ratling tag team in the new game or grab some new characters to replay the old campaign. Shame that's not something we can expect from GW.

It is a shame as the hero and monster cards from Silver Tower and Shadows over Hammerhal were pretty interchangeable.

 KidCthulhu wrote:
Not unless there's multiple suspects to paint and a mechanic that makes the killer unknown each game. Clue 40,000?

Yeah there could easily be a rule set and mechanic that did something along these lines.


Or anything based in the Crime or Horror type setting would be good.

Although the BSF storyline is “done” I’m sure they could easily move into a bit more with it. Add new characters but make all the prior ones usable too with a new WHQ box (maybe even put out the old models in an expansion as a booster for your crew you make or whatever, money an all that..)

 laam999 wrote:

 Geifer wrote:
I think they'd benefit from the very un-GW thing to do and create a solid core ruleset that they can reuse over the years so tiles, characters and campaigns are all interchangeable and old ones can still be used when they release a new box. Then it wouldn't be a question of whether you get a new game or an expansion of Blackstone Fortress. You could just use your favorite Ratling tag team in the new game or grab some new characters to replay the old campaign. Shame that's not something we can expect from GW.

It is a shame as the hero and monster cards from Silver Tower and Shadows over Hammerhal were pretty interchangeable.

That's the worst part in my opinion. We know GW's designers aren't oblivious to the idea, but whoever calls the shots doesn't see merit in it.

From the point of view of the customers Cursed city has been a bit of a s***show but from GW's point of view it's been a massive hit. The biggest problem they have had with the game is it's massive popularity. Even an expansion that is extremely expensive for it's contents, requires you to own the other expansion and a bunch of expensive minis sold separately, still managed to sell out in no time at all.

Fantasy Warhammer Quest is not going anywhere. Do a Skaven themed box and people will come in droves to buy it all over again.

Chikout wrote:
From the point of view of the customers Cursed city has been a bit of a s***show but from GW's point of view it's been a massive hit. The biggest problem they have had with the game is it's massive popularity. Even an expansion that is extremely expensive for it's contents, requires you to own the other expansion and a bunch of expensive minis sold separately, still managed to sell out in no time at all.

Fantasy Warhammer Quest is not going anywhere. Do a Skaven themed box and people will come in droves to buy it all over again.

So why is this the last expansion, when clearly the base game was setting up for other expansions?

It's been a "hit" but seems like it massively underperformed compared to Blackstone Fortress (and was critically far less acclaimed)

deano2099 wrote:

Chikout wrote:
From the point of view of the customers Cursed city has been a bit of a s***show but from GW's point of view it's been a massive hit. The biggest problem they have had with the game is it's massive popularity. Even an expansion that is extremely expensive for it's contents, requires you to own the other expansion and a bunch of expensive minis sold separately, still managed to sell out in no time at all.

Fantasy Warhammer Quest is not going anywhere. Do a Skaven themed box and people will come in droves to buy it all over again.

So why is this the last expansion, when clearly the base game was setting up for other expansions?

It's been a "hit" but seems like it massively underperformed compared to Blackstone Fortress (and was critically far less acclaimed)

Botched launch only reignites with every new expansion. They are probably going to shelve the idea for a couple of cycles (could be months, years, hours depending upon need), and then bring it out under a new name later once the tarnished reputation has had a chance to fade.

Honestly I'd say the problem isn't on the consumer side, the problem with any continuation is why CC failed on so many fronts from GW and why GW has felt the need to mothball it. The reasons for those fail points is critical to if they will revisit it again.

It could really have just been a series of mistakes, problems and covid issues that plagued it and CC was something that took a fall to allow other things to go ahead as planned. So GW might be really annoyed with the disaster and that means a good chance they will revisit the idea.
It could be internal politics in GW that didn't like the idea or wanted it to stick with 40K (marines) or other franchises or something. At which point continuation might be hard
It might be internal battles for resources and whoever is in charge of CC just can't secure resources and production slots and such and thus their project has had more issues and thus might die off.


There's a host of potential reasons for why CC has failed, but its pretty much all on GW's side of things (even if its not their fault its on "their" side of the relationship, not the customers side).

If anything I'd say that big demands for most stock and its expansions (messed up as they were) selling out as well as they have, strongly suggests that there was a healthy amount of consumer interest.

100% it all falls on GW.

But, they need that failure to stop stinging before they will return to the plan. They can try and rebrand it, again, but let the initial hate dissipate. I say hate as there are some people out there still very angry that they didn't get a copy in the first go around, and then too butthurt to order it with the rerelease.

Modern GW seems to want to develop a product, manufacture enough of it to ensure a sufficient profit at launch, but not so much that it will sit in warehouses (eating into profitability) or on store shelves (which eats into the percieved demand). Thereby furthering the FOMO mindset that will drive pre-orders of the next product so they can sell out of it as soon as possible.

Get it at launch or you probably won't get it at all.

Years ago GW realized that they make the biggest chunk of profit off their products in the first few weeks of release. This is the perfection of that model.

I don't think modern GW can actually afford to have production overproduce to hold stuff in storage in warehouses. I don't think they are opposed to longer term products and such (esp since GW's products typically don't devalue over time and if anything increase in value); its just that they really don't have the spare machines and production time to allow them much over-production without it impacting other currently in production products.


A combination of their market growing very suddenly; Covid and the power supply problems at their factory mean that their production system is only just keeping up in general and that's without considering them adding more lines of production and models.

So I think GW today is more open to a project that lasts longer on the shelf, they just really can't afford to lean into that kind of production very much.

Just to check, has anyone's order of Nemesis been despatched/delivered yet? Mine still says pending...

 Overread wrote:
I don't think modern GW can actually afford to have production overproduce to hold stuff in storage in warehouses. I don't think they are opposed to longer term products and such (esp since GW's products typically don't devalue over time and if anything increase in value); its just that they really don't have the spare machines and production time to allow them much over-production without it impacting other currently in production products.


A combination of their market growing very suddenly; Covid and the power supply problems at their factory mean that their production system is only just keeping up in general and that's without considering them adding more lines of production and models.

So I think GW today is more open to a project that lasts longer on the shelf, they just really can't afford to lean into that kind of production very much.

On this? Last time I worked for them (around 12-14 years ago) they’d moved from manual orders to stores, to it being centrally determined. Not only did that save staff a job, and a headache of trying to predict what stock you need, it simplified production demands.

I mean, you’ve got 400 stores (number not intended to be accurate). And you know you want each to have a stock of say, 5 Space Marine Tactical Squads. You’ve come to that number by analysing sales data over a wide period and from every store. So every week, you ensure your production facilities are churning out 5x400=2,000 Space Marine Tactical Boxes.

Then, you link that predated demand to actual sales via electronic sales wizardry I’m poorly explaining. If Store A only sold 2, their stock order gets 2.

This allowed them to streamline and better organise warehousing, and any short stock is counter balanced by the in-store order point, so if I’m of a mood to buy day, 10 Impulsors? I can order them in-store, get them delivered for free. Customer mostly satisfied (unless I needed them quicker than that), and store retains its standard stock for others. Also works when an item has sold through in a given week.

It may have changed since those days, but I feel it’s at least an interesting, if not necessarily accurate, bit of info.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Expansions are MTO from 17th-27th December.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/12/11/sunday-preview-cursed-city-expansions-rise-again/

I’m….partially tempted. But only partially.

URGH the worst time to do a limited product made to order. I really wish they'd done a "ok so they sold out, we will do it in late January/February" instead.


Very glad they are doing it though!

 Overread wrote:
URGH the worst time to do a limited product made to order. I really wish they'd done a "ok so they sold out, we will do it in late January/February" instead.


Very glad they are doing it though!

I'm a bit more annoyed that we still have slaves to darkness AND imperial guard to get full releases. We've seen all the models, and now they're just waiting to be released. Plus then we have the world eaters, etc. I get that its the holidays and so they're not big on releasing big things, but this is a painful drip feed of releases

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Expansions are MTO from 17th-27th December.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/12/11/sunday-preview-cursed-city-expansions-rise-again/

I’m….partially tempted. But only partially.

What were the price points on the two expansions, aside from somewhat daft for just the cardboard?

 Dysartes wrote:
What were the price points on the two expansions, aside from somewhat daft for just the cardboard?

£30 each.

$84AUD each.

Free shippng starts at $85AUD.

 Azazelx wrote:
$84AUD each.

Free shippng starts at $85AUD.

Haha, oh that is hilarious. At least GW have a sense of humour... just disguised as corporate greed.

The 'Warhammer Quest' series/brand/label is too well known for GW to mothball, especially after the success that was Black stone Fortress. I imagine we'll see the next setting pop up sooner rather than later, the expansion method may be different however, but I think GW know that it (like all of their products) sells itself.

Question now is where the setting of the next one will be, my bet would be in the 30,000 setting.

Sounds like the perfect time to add a citadel water pot to your order!

I added an extra large painting handle. I needed one anyway, and it's only(!) $4 more expensive than from where I'd have otherwise purchased from, so if I look at that as my shipping fee it's a little more bearable...

For those who’ve got the expansions, or even just the first one?

Do they bring much to the base game?

I can order both next week, but £60 plus whatever models I’d need to buy in the future is a big hefty, so need informed opinions.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
For those who’ve got the expansions, or even just the first one?

Do they bring much to the base game?

I can order both next week, but £60 plus whatever models I’d need to buy in the future is a big hefty, so need informed opinions.

It's extra missions for a game I enjoy but the best thing imo is the additional enemy unit and encounter cards that can be used with the base game.

Some models are easier to proxy than others,(e.g. I'm using the sorcerer from the Khagra's Ravagers Underworlds warband as a necromancer) so you don't need all the official models for the enemies for them to still look good without being too out of place.

For me it's worth it but it is obv expensive for what you get in the boxes. Just take into account that if you you decide later on to buy them then you'll be forced to pay scalper prices!

My order also still says pending. Did anyone receive the new expansion yet?

ArminTamzarian wrote:
My order also still says pending. Did anyone receive the new expansion yet?

This order wave is made to order; so considering its cardstock and GW don't make that in house this means they will likely remain pending until the order window closes. Then GW will order it in one big batch from overseas and ship them when they arrive .

Mine has arrived from the original pre order a couple of weeks back, MTO stuff usually take a few months in my experience.

 Overread wrote:

ArminTamzarian wrote:
My order also still says pending. Did anyone receive the new expansion yet?

This order wave is made to order; so considering its cardstock and GW don't make that in house this means they will likely remain pending until the order window closes. Then GW will order it in one big batch from overseas and ship them when they arrive .

I ordered mine on December 3, right when it went up, not on the second made to order round.

ArminTamzarian wrote:
My order also still says pending. Did anyone receive the new expansion yet?

I got mine on Friday and I also didn't get a notification from GW that it had shipped. Like you I was in on the initial pre-order and not the Made to Order. I'm in D.C., so hopefully you'll get yours soon.