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 Mr. Burning wrote:

 Londinium wrote:
Official now:

https://investor.games-workshop.com/2022/12/16/agreement-in-principle-to-develop-film-and-tv/

Not sure what to make of this. It'll be good (if only in the short term) for GW but Amazon butchered Lord of the Rings and Wheel of Time by not really respecting the source material and trying to make their own thing rather than adapting the actual content.

This being said it'll have a decent budget and GW have been notoriously picky over their IP, so may have retained more control than other licensees do.

I'm going to throw up a little in my mouth by defending Amazon here. Amazon were essentially only granted the rights to produce a series based upon the Appendices at the back of LOTR. And that was further narrowed by allowing very limited or no reference to other published works of Tolkien and their estate.

Really, the studio had their hands tied, their mouths sewn shut and their eyes blinded. No wonder they produced trash.

That's true but then don't try adapting a well belove and well supported IP with that limitation on what you can use.

Even noting that, you could have created something good with what's in the Appendices and building upon them. ROP is not that, it's riven through with bad characterisation, fan fic creations and god awful writing - for instance much of the first season's storyline hinges off someone jumping off a boat into the ocean dressing only in some light linens, hundreds if not thousands of miles away from land, then accidently bumping into the exact person the plot requires, in the middle of the bloody ocean, while not managing to die from exhaustation beforehand. Elves are cool but they're not able to swim for weeks on end in the open ocean. That's only the very tip of just poor poor writing.

Amazon did good stuff like the boys.


HBO did amazing stuff like GOT 1-4 seasons and House of the Dragon and horrible stuff like GOT 6-8 seasons.

At this points its a wait and see. The Witcher Season 1 was not great but palatable, but it went downhill fast.

 GaroRobe wrote:
I'm not going to hold my breath. I don't care that Henry is a huge fan. He was a huge Witcher fan, and look what happened. He left the show because the showrunners weren't faithful.

It is amazing how this has come to be accepted when there is not a lick of evidence that it actually happened.

Cavill left The Witcher because DC drove a truck load of money up to his house to do Superman instead, and then changed their minds leaving him with the truckload of money. May all my disappointing work engagements in life be as such.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Galas wrote:
Amazon did good stuff like the boys.


HBO did amazing stuff like GOT 1-4 seasons and House of the Dragon and horrible stuff like GOT 6-8 seasons.

At this points its a wait and see. The Witcher Season 1 was not great but palatable, but it went downhill fast.

Ultimately people lose sight here that the shows are not made by whomever shows them.

The Boys was made by Sony Pictures for example, Amazon commissioned it. But Sony Pictures also made Wheel of Time for Amazon, and opinions on that seem more mixed.

 Mr. Burning wrote:

 Londinium wrote:
Official now:

https://investor.games-workshop.com/2022/12/16/agreement-in-principle-to-develop-film-and-tv/

Not sure what to make of this. It'll be good (if only in the short term) for GW but Amazon butchered Lord of the Rings and Wheel of Time by not really respecting the source material and trying to make their own thing rather than adapting the actual content.

This being said it'll have a decent budget and GW have been notoriously picky over their IP, so may have retained more control than other licensees do.

I'm going to throw up a little in my mouth by defending Amazon here. Amazon were essentially only granted the rights to produce a series based upon the Appendices at the back of LOTR. And that was further narrowed by allowing very limited or no reference to other published works of Tolkien and their estate.

Really, the studio had their hands tied, their mouths sewn shut and their eyes blinded. No wonder they produced trash.

It wasn't even trash though. I mean, I've not seen it, I may not like it, reaction has certainly been mixed, and some people seem to *really* hate it, but there have also been a large number of positive reviews too, and it did well enough to get a second season...

Honestly if a 40K series got the same response as that did, it'd be the biggest publicity coup for GW ever.

Also, the quality isn't dependant on how close they stay to the source material. You can make a good show which veers off wildly from the source material (Preacher, Battlestar Galactica reboot). You can make a bad show that sticks too closely to the source material.

And lets be honest, the source material really isn't *that* good. Most of Black Library's output is "fine" but it's not exactly Wheel of Time or Lord of the Rings.

Tsagualsa wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
https://investor.games-workshop.com/

Agreement Reached on Commercial Terms. Contracts yet to be signed.

Given Amazon get the Merch Rights, sounds like the Contract Signing may be all but a formality.

As ever Not An Expert, Almosf Certainly Waaaay More To It Than This Idiot Thinks.

It's basically an initial declaration of mutual interest, with a round of preliminary offers on both sides what they'd put on the table for further negotiations. That's not nothing, but it's also still at a stage where it could be cancelled pretty easily and without significant costs to either party. Contract negotiations is where the meat of the legal action will happen, especially negotiations about the licensing schemes, the way profits are split and so on. That can take quite a lot of time, mostly because ''Hollywood acounting'' is notorious for being somewhere between deliberately obscure and outright predatory. Look for news about GW bringing in a law firm that specializes in that kind of stuff as a sign that the negotiations have begun in earnest, probably around 3-6 months from now, when preliminary scouting for potentially interested actors, writers and staff has finished the first round.

Ehh, if they have an agreed term sheet it is generally a bit better off than that. Obviously nothings binding until signed though.

If I were GW I wouldn't actually be that concerned about the back end really. I'd be focusing more on Amazon's marketing commitment for the show. If it got anything like the push WOT or ROP got (imagine every parcel Amazon sent out for a month having Warhammer branded tape?) that's actually worth more to GW than the money from the show.

 The Phazer wrote:

 GaroRobe wrote:
I'm not going to hold my breath. I don't care that Henry is a huge fan. He was a huge Witcher fan, and look what happened. He left the show because the showrunners weren't faithful.

It is amazing how this has come to be accepted when there is not a lick of evidence that it actually happened.

Cavill left The Witcher because DC drove a truck load of money up to his house to do Superman instead, and then changed their minds leaving him with the truckload of money. May all my disappointing work engagements in life be as such.
.

Not true, he never had a contract to return as Superman, that's why Gunn has managed to drop him so quickly. Even if he did, he could have worked around both of them at the same time, it's been done before and Netflix aren't as bound to releasing one season a year of their shows as traditional TV networks. His return to Superman and then getting dumped only a few months later is indicative of the shambles the DCEU is in currently, it's the kind of shambles that results in an actor without a contract announcing their return to a role, only to be dumped a month later.

We don't actually know why he left The Witcher, the idea that he was pissed off with the production/writing is based upon the fact that he's a massive Witcher fan, actively chased after the role and proposed himself to the showrunner when he wasn't being considered, repeatedly said he'd be willing to do 10 seasons of The Witcher before the release of the second season, repeatedly stated that during production he was constantly giving advice on how the character actually should be protrayed (showing his commitment) and never gave any indication that he was looking to only do the role temporarily. People have just added that history of behaviour and beliefs, to the increasingly divergent second season which got mixed reception, reports that writers don't actually like the source material and have made a decent theory as to why he suddenly left a series in a very contradictory way to all his previous behaviour and statements.

 The Phazer wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
https://investor.games-workshop.com/

Agreement Reached on Commercial Terms. Contracts yet to be signed.

Given Amazon get the Merch Rights, sounds like the Contract Signing may be all but a formality.

As ever Not An Expert, Almosf Certainly Waaaay More To It Than This Idiot Thinks.

It's basically an initial declaration of mutual interest, with a round of preliminary offers on both sides what they'd put on the table for further negotiations. That's not nothing, but it's also still at a stage where it could be cancelled pretty easily and without significant costs to either party. Contract negotiations is where the meat of the legal action will happen, especially negotiations about the licensing schemes, the way profits are split and so on. That can take quite a lot of time, mostly because ''Hollywood acounting'' is notorious for being somewhere between deliberately obscure and outright predatory. Look for news about GW bringing in a law firm that specializes in that kind of stuff as a sign that the negotiations have begun in earnest, probably around 3-6 months from now, when preliminary scouting for potentially interested actors, writers and staff has finished the first round.

Ehh, if they have an agreed term sheet it is generally a bit better off than that. Obviously nothings binding until signed though.

If I were GW I wouldn't actually be that concerned about the back end really. I'd be focusing more on Amazon's marketing commitment for the show. If it got anything like the push WOT or ROP got (imagine every parcel Amazon sent out for a month having Warhammer branded tape?) that's actually worth more to GW than the money from the show.

To add to the intrigue? Warhammer Community just confirmed the project, and that Mr Cavill is Executive Producing and starring.

Now to my idiot mind (remember. Not an expert) that suggests a specific production has been worked on, agreed and now it’s just hammering out the legal side.

 Mr. Burning wrote:
Really, the studio had their hands tied, their mouths sewn shut and their eyes blinded. No wonder they produced trash.

Nah, they produced trash because they wrote Marvel (badly) instead of Tolkien. They get no excuses for that.

 Londinium wrote:
His return to Superman and then getting dumped only a few months later is indicative of the shambles the DCEU is in currently, it's the kind of shambles that results in an actor without a contract announcing their return to a role, only to be dumped a month later.

I'm 99% sure he had a signed contract when the story went public. WB simply chose to pay the break fee over forging ahead with a project they didn't want to make.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 BertBert wrote:
If Cavill will indeed act as an executive producer, we might be looking at a show that *gasp* respects its source material. This is genuinely exciting news.

Executive Producer means they sourced, secured, or provided financing.

"In films, the executive producer generally contributes to the film's budget and their involvement depends on the project, with some simply securing funds and others being involved in the filmmaking process."

Guess it depends on the details of the contract then. Given the context, I don't see why Cavill would be involved in the financial aspect though. As an outspoken fan of the setting he is much more likely to have some sort of creative oversight.

I think this will be a small scale detective 6 episode show to start with. It's testing the waters and I suspect won't have a comparatively huge budget behind it.

That's also the smart way to go, making it all about Space Marines would be a mistake.

 His Master's Voice wrote:

 Londinium wrote:
His return to Superman and then getting dumped only a few months later is indicative of the shambles the DCEU is in currently, it's the kind of shambles that results in an actor without a contract announcing their return to a role, only to be dumped a month later.

I'm 99% sure he had a signed contract when the story went public. WB simply chose to pay the break fee over forging ahead with a project they didn't want to make.

https://thedirect.com/article/henry-cavill-superman-contract-dc-new he signed a deal for a cameo in another movie, I won't mention what it is, in case it spoils people. He wasn't under contract for a hypothetical Man of Steel 2. It was all very weird.

Anway back onto Warhammer, the Warhammer Community article has Cavill saying this, which seems like he's been VERY involved in all aspects of it. Makes me somewhat optimistic:

“I have loved Warhammer since I was boy, making this moment truly special for me. The opportunity to shepherd this cinematic universe from its inception is quite the honour and the responsibility,” said Henry Cavill. “I couldn’t be more grateful for all the hard work put in by Vertigo, Amazon and Games Workshop to make this happen. One step closer to making a nigh-on lifelong dream come true.” 

“It’s great news and we’re absolutely thrilled; we’re working with a fantastic triumvirate in Henry, Vertigo, and Amazon. Henry’s well-known love of Warhammer 40,000—and his passion as a world-builder and storyteller—will serve us all well in the coming years. Finally, Warhammer will make it to the screen as the fans have hoped, and as they deserve. Exciting times!” said Andy Smillie, creative director of GAW. 

Vertigo Entertainment’s Roy Lee and Natalie Viscuso (Barbarian, The Lego franchise, the It films, The Departed) partnered with Henry Cavill early on to secure the coveted IP and deliver it to Amazon Studios. Vertigo will executive produce with Cavill and GAW’s Andy Smillie and Max Bottrill alongside Amazon Studios. 

If it's not Eisenhorn, I'd be very surprised. It's basically tailormade for a TV based introduction to the GW universe. Before anyone says it - no they're not going to adapt the Horus Heresy, let's not even go there.

Interesting also that it seems like Frank Spotnitz and Big Light Productions aren't involved anymore. I assume they either failed to get the project progressing far enough or Cavill/Vertigo rocked up and that combination was too good for GW to pass up and they switched partners.

I’m hoping should they find an excuse to show a Space Hulk on-screen, we see the Event Horizon secreted among the greeblies.

Natalie Viscuso is dating Cavill, so that makes sense as to why Vertigo was chosen.

 The Phazer wrote:

 GaroRobe wrote:
I'm not going to hold my breath. I don't care that Henry is a huge fan. He was a huge Witcher fan, and look what happened. He left the show because the showrunners weren't faithful.

It is amazing how this has come to be accepted when there is not a lick of evidence that it actually happened.

Cavill left The Witcher because DC drove a truck load of money up to his house to do Superman instead, and then changed their minds leaving him with the truckload of money. May all my disappointing work engagements in life be as such.

Except Henry wasn't meant to cameo in Black Adam. It was originally meant to be a headless cameo, like in Shazam. Dwayne pushed for an actual appearance. There was no reason for Henry to leave the Witcher solely for Superman. There wasn't even a Man of Steel 2 script written yet, so it's not like he needed to commit to one project over the other.

Excellent news IMO - invested lead/Exec Producer and money to make a good show - Amazon can and do do them. Looking forward to it!

BBC article https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-63998585

My main take away here is that Mr Cavill played a role in obtaining the rights. That’s something important to note, as it may translate to him and Vertigo having the rights, and Amazon fronting cash and marketing stuffs?

I hear the working title is Fists of Power

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Would this be the long-gestating Eisenhorn series?

I'd want Mark Strong to play Eisenhorn. I'd also want Mark Strong to play Gulliman.

Basically cast Mark Strong for every character except whomever Cavill is playing.

Does that included Mark Strong's love interest?

edit: String to Strong.

 Londinium wrote:
https://thedirect.com/article/henry-cavill-superman-contract-dc-new he signed a deal for a cameo in another movie, I won't mention what it is, in case it spoils people. He wasn't under contract for a hypothetical Man of Steel 2. It was all very weird.

Huh, you might be right and there was no actual contract beyond the cameo one. That is weird.

DarkTogashi wrote:
Does that included Mark String's love interest?

The last names are different, so we're in the clear, right?

I hope that his status as an executive producer will help the show stay on focus and consistent with the core material. Not everything that Amazon produces is garbage so there is hope.

The logo that went with the Warcom announcement:

Vin Diesel is a massive 40k fan, hopefully he will be in it as well.

Is the logo specific to any Imperial subfaction there or is that just a cool stylised Imperial Eagle?

 warboss wrote:
I hope that his status as an executive producer will help the show stay on focus and consistent with the core material. Not everything that Amazon produces is garbage so there is hope.

GW are also pretty hot on keeping on top of the presentation of the lore. I think its one reason some bigger studios in video games don't sign with them for the IP, because GW 100% would be breathing down their necks the whole time. Same reason we've likely never seen a Hollywood spacemarines film. GW know that a big part of the draw of their core business is the lore and that if they abuse that too much it will break and that destroys a huge area of returning customers and attracting new customers.

 Olthannon wrote:
Vin Diesel is a massive 40k fan, hopefully he will be in it as well.

Vin D is definitely a nerd, but I'm not sure if it's official he's a 40k fan. There was a rumor he tried to pay to close a GW store down for a private game but not sure if that' true.

Ansel Elgort is a big 40k fan, and I think he even placed in a Golden Demon once (but since there's a lot of allegations around him, I don't think he's getting cast much these days).

One of the dwarves in Peter Jackson's the Hobbit also does warhammer, since they made a huge community post during the second movie about it.


I know Henry has made it clear he wants to play a custodes, but I can't imagine we'll ever see them in live action

 Overread wrote:

 warboss wrote:
I hope that his status as an executive producer will help the show stay on focus and consistent with the core material. Not everything that Amazon produces is garbage so there is hope.

GW are also pretty hot on keeping on top of the presentation of the lore. I think its one reason some bigger studios in video games don't sign with them for the IP, because GW 100% would be breathing down their necks the whole time. Same reason we've likely never seen a Hollywood spacemarines film. GW know that a big part of the draw of their core business is the lore and that if they abuse that too much it will break and that destroys a huge area of returning customers and attracting new customers.

Hence my theory regarding Warhammer+. A sort of Expo to demonstrate Acceptable Use. Also a way for GW to actually figure out what they feel is acceptable and presentable.

Adding deeper “information”, once upon a time I was told by an unreliable source that GW had been approached in the past, but always wanted to keep Marketing Rights, scotching any interest quite quickly. Almost certainly not true, but putting it out there in case others might be able to corroborate or even confirm.

 Olthannon wrote:
Vin Diesel is a massive 40k fan, hopefully he will be in it as well.

Vin Diesel as Inquisitor Fahm Lee.

 Olthannon wrote:
Vin Diesel is a massive 40k fan, hopefully he will be in it as well.

Is the logo specific to any Imperial subfaction there or is that just a cool stylised Imperial Eagle?

I think it's quite specifically the variant that is associated with the loyalist side in the heresy:



It's also associated with the Custodes - it's the pre-Heresy 'Palatine' Aquila that only the Custodes and the Emperors Children were allowed to wear iirc.

 His Master's Voice wrote:

 Londinium wrote:
https://thedirect.com/article/henry-cavill-superman-contract-dc-new he signed a deal for a cameo in another movie, I won't mention what it is, in case it spoils people. He wasn't under contract for a hypothetical Man of Steel 2. It was all very weird.

Huh, you might be right and there was no actual contract beyond the cameo one. That is weird.

DarkTogashi wrote:
Does that included Mark String's love interest?

The last names are different, so we're in the clear, right?

That should teach me to proof read my post. Editing now.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:


Hence my theory regarding Warhammer+. A sort of Expo to demonstrate Acceptable Use. Also a way for GW to actually figure out what they feel is acceptable and presentable.

What's telling about WH+ though is that, as far as I can tell, everything they've made for it has been an original story. No adaptations. It's why I think this is likely to be an original work, rather than Eisenhorn.

Because "Eisenhorn" isn't going to sell the show to anyone that wouldn't otherwise watch it. You can tell a similar story if you want, but you may as well write something actually original for TV, and then you cut out large swathes of the "it needs to be closer to the source material" complaining.

Having Cavill on board makes that more likely to me - he knows the IP enough to know that reducing those sort of issues would be "helpful".

Tsagualsa wrote:

 Olthannon wrote:
Vin Diesel is a massive 40k fan, hopefully he will be in it as well.

Is the logo specific to any Imperial subfaction there or is that just a cool stylised Imperial Eagle?

I think it's quite specifically the variant that is associated with the loyalist side in the heresy:



It's also associated with the Custodes - it's the pre-Heresy 'Palatine' Aquila that only the Custodes and the Emperors Children were allowed to wear iirc.

Take a look at the right hand side of the logo. It's all battered and broken. I have a bad feeling we'll be getting something tied to Horus Hearsay.