Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So yesterday i had the pleasure of trying Kult of speed for the first time in 10th edition. This was against an unfortunate Drukhari player.

The list was just a mix of things i knew were good (warbikers/deffkoptas) and buggies i wanted to try. All in all i think the best kult of speed lists has some more melee from units in trukks or something but i decided to forego it this time.

I had:
18 warbikers
18 deffkoptas
3 squig buggies
3 Boosta blasta
3 scrapjets
3 Snazzwagons
10 grots
Snikrot + Wartrike

The deployment itself was hammer and anvil and i decided to put 1 scrapjet in reserve and 12 deffkoptas in deepstrike. But im not sure how to field all this in a search and destroy deployment. At least many of my units will be open to be shot turn 1.

In our game i had turn 1 however, and while i made a lot of mistakes it ended with a 75-55 victory to me. Advance/fallback and shoot/charge is nice to have, but you really dont deal a lot of damage, and ork CP economy isnt great, so finding 2 CP for Blitza fire/dakka storm + reaction moves can be a bit rough.

Even in to drukhari you dont just instantly destroy them because you have no detatchment bonus to damage like sustained hits, so fighting in to Knights, imperial guard or even vehicle heavy other lists can probably be very rough.

Damage is a bit lacking (but drukhari saves arent amazing either) but you can trade very well. Especially when the deffkoptas came up carnage really unfolded. And Warbikers are so annoying for them to kill, given they have anti vehicle units and anti infantry, but the grey zone of toughness 6 mounted units, they cant deal well with those.

However, i do think maybe Kult of speed is a very good counter to Aeldari, Drukhari, and maybe Admech, which are all very strong armies these days. Just if you want to try something different that might actually counter your local strong armies.

With all that said, buggies need a complete overhaul

 Afrodactyl wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
I honestly can't tell. My kill rig is a friggin' monster because I kind of overdid the kitbashing. It ended up being just slightly smaller than a gargantuan squiggoth.

It is literally impossible for it to not cause a traffic jam

Mine is made from the old FW Squiggoth, so it's not too far off of yours by the sound of things

Our crusade is done, and I'm currently firing up the mek workshop to get the orks ready. In the process I've managed to take some pictures of the kill krusha rig, see for yourself:



(wartrike and gargantuan squiggoth for scale)

Offical base size should be 170x109mm, mine is about 280x180mm

 Jidmah wrote:

 Afrodactyl wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
I honestly can't tell. My kill rig is a friggin' monster because I kind of overdid the kitbashing. It ended up being just slightly smaller than a gargantuan squiggoth.

It is literally impossible for it to not cause a traffic jam

Mine is made from the old FW Squiggoth, so it's not too far off of yours by the sound of things

Our crusade is done, and I'm currently firing up the mek workshop to get the orks ready. In the process I've managed to take some pictures of the kill krusha rig, see for yourself:

Spoiler:

(wartrike and gargantuan squiggoth for scale)

Offical base size should be 170x109mm, mine is about 280x180mm

Unfortunately I can't see the pics thanks to cursed UK internet

Huh, is UK blocking imgur now?

edit: ok, apparently imgur refuses to play along with UK's censorship policies and decided to blocking UK users to avoid fines. Internet tells me this imagehost is more friendly to the home of warhammer:



Automatically Appended Next Post:
I guess the balance update is a big "nothing" for us.

 Jidmah wrote:
Huh, is UK blocking imgur now?

edit: ok, apparently imgur refuses to play along with UK's censorship policies and decided to blocking UK users to avoid fines. Internet tells me this imagehost is more friendly to the home of warhammer:

Spoiler:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
I guess the balance update is a big "nothing" for us.

That looks mega. Makes my Squig-Rig look tiny in comparison

Very cool rig!

So!...

No changes to orks i guess. But then again this is what i feared. At least War Horde still works

Beardedragon wrote:
So!...

No changes to orks i guess. But then again this is what i feared. At least War Horde still works

No rules or pont changes. Nothing. Actualy, I like. At least no need to redisgn my lists.

I 'm fine with it. War Horde works in various combinations. You can see the Green Tide, Bully Boyz in CI regularly. We are not strong we are not weak. Dataslate impacts to other factions reshape the meta somehow so there will be some kind of the impact on us this way. But I have no idea what kind of the impact.

There is a lot of Rigs that needs to be pianted and lot of games needs to be played. No need for endles list redesigning and new rule study.

Orks will be some kind of openinng faction in next books /edition + we have already some new models confirmed on the way - new warboss in mega armour with the klaw, new beastboss char + video showing a fight between these two kinds of orks = there will be a lot of new stuff and new rules for us in the future.

Those videos are for Dawn of War 4 and the klaw boss is Gorgutz, a well established DoW character. The two others are just a wurrboy and a beastboss, literally nothing confirms that there are any new models to go along with the game.

Though I would not be too surprised of Gorgutz did get a real model, even though it might be legends only like Ufthak.

I guess I'll take nothing happening to getting nerfs, but it is a glaring issue that our competitive rate is largely dependent on a Ghazzy wombo combo with an Ere We Go Big Mek and Boyz, or Nobz/Breaka Boyz in Battlewagon.

Doesn't address how the Kult of Speed is still fundamentally broken with how the buggy datasheets are basically unusable in their current state, nor other units in our army that really need AP-2 baseline like Squighog Boyz.

I know it's a bit of a meme at this point, but I still wish they just dropped the Stompa a couple hundred points, especially after they made a big fanfare of the Stormsurge dropping in points.

Based on how they've been nerfing other factions in ways that don't seem to warrant it (and make it very obvious its to sell certain new units like the new ancient for Black Templars), it feels like this update is pretty meh for everyone. I know my Eldar friend is spinning in his sick bed with how crapped on his mobility survival options are.

If anything it was a big swing and miss when they started selling that stompa box and still kept the stompa at its current points.

I mean if you DONT want to sell any boxes, i guess thats how you do it

 Grimskul wrote:
I guess I'll take nothing happening to getting nerfs, but it is a glaring issue that our competitive rate is largely dependent on a Ghazzy wombo combo with an Ere We Go Big Mek and Boyz, or Nobz/Breaka Boyz in Battlewagon.

Doesn't address how the Kult of Speed is still fundamentally broken with how the buggy datasheets are basically unusable in their current state, nor other units in our army that really need AP-2 baseline like Squighog Boyz.

I know it's a bit of a meme at this point, but I still wish they just dropped the Stompa a couple hundred points, especially after they made a big fanfare of the Stormsurge dropping in points.

Based on how they've been nerfing other factions in ways that don't seem to warrant it (and make it very obvious its to sell certain new units like the new ancient for Black Templars), it feels like this update is pretty meh for everyone. I know my Eldar friend is spinning in his sick bed with how crapped on his mobility survival options are.

This... is so true, i discussed the same with my opponent last game. If Ghaz whiffs it is so brutal it's not worth playing. Rolled 7 dice, 5 freaking 1's, followed by another 1. On a hit 2, Wound 2, he only succeeded once. Not worth continuing there and then, it's just a slow loss.

Cripling other faction and no changes on us = boost for us.

There is no way something relevant happen to speedfreaks any time soon. These strategies are businesse oriented and the put a lot of affort to buggies for couple of years. Now there is a time to push the infantry and snagga line.

There will be at least one more wave of another setting (walkers or whatever…) and after that after years of desperation, afterr all owners of buggies are out of the hobby and new players own no buggies at all, after drive the buggies back with the roaring engines in smoke and dust.

… unless they swith to be EV but I hope not

So, I'm back to playing orks and absolutely crushed my AdMech opponent yesterday. Thrakka with boyz and follow me mek is such an awesome combo, it just feels right. My opponent was so terrified of him sprinting op the center of the board, he pulled back his infantry rather than moving forward to movement block which pretty much cost him the game.

I also like bringing koptas again, at their current cost they really feal like they contribute appropriately to the game. I don't think that they are OP, but I also didn't spam them.

 Jidmah wrote:
So, I'm back to playing orks and absolutely crushed my AdMech opponent yesterday. Thrakka with boyz and follow me mek is such an awesome combo, it just feels right. My opponent was so terrified of him sprinting op the center of the board, he pulled back his infantry rather than moving forward to movement block which pretty much cost him the game.

I also like bringing koptas again, at their current cost they really feal like they contribute appropriately to the game. I don't think that they are OP, but I also didn't spam them.

Do you go for a block of 3 or 6 for Koptas when you run them? I assume there's not much incentive to make them to too big in warhorde since not that many strats are relevant for them in that detachment.

Units of 3. They more or less took an all-round problem solver role. They cleared deep strikers of a backfield objective, added some rokkits to a target tankbustas failed to kill and helped blow up some 3W infantry. It was nice to have a unit which can do pretty much anything with high enough movement speed to switch flanks each turn.

I've been using a single block of three koptas and I'm thoroughly enjoying them. They support my Stormboys in nabbing objectives, support Tankbustas in crippling armour, and support Flash Gits in clearing screens. They're probably one of the best Swiss army knife units we have.

Hmmm Koptas.. sweet memories. You guys inspires me. We gonna play on Sat and this could add a some new wibe to my list.

Long tim since I chopped some guardsmans with kopta rottors

I play 2 warhord lists right now.

First one is double Boyz blob and double Wagon BreakaBoyz ride + support. I love the symetry of the list, just one Burnas are missing to be this a úerfect list:-)



And than I' m playing with the second list, where the second Boyz pack and some other stuff is replaced by my belowed super converted Robo-Snaga-Riders I call the Dread Riders

Add there some Koptas could be a very nice swing….

I really like both lists, especially the one with the hog-blob

My only issue is that there's nothing I would want to remove from either for koptas

2x Thrakka? Sound illegally awesome

I've started dropping burna boyz for 5x flash gits as transport buddies. Somehow works better for me, but I'm not sure why exactly.

 Jidmah wrote:
2x Thrakka? Sound illegally awesome

I've started dropping burna boyz for 5x flash gits as transport buddies. Somehow works better for me, but I'm not sure why exactly.

2xGhazzy - pffff this shocked me for a minute fortunately its some crazy export tweak saying “2 models =ghazzy and makari prety stupid way

Flashgitz are definitely better. But cost more. Burnas are good ablative wounds ready to die in case of emergency disembark

Yeah, but I use flash gits the same. Their job is to die to keep tank bustas safe, but since they are slightly more durable than burnas, they also can do things like act as a screen after disembarking or tie up some unit which would otherwise charge into the tankbustas. Unlike burnas, many deep strikers also struggle to shift them off objectives. I also like their ability to reliably gun down lone operative characters.

I got the idea from a youtube video and just wanted to try it. Yes, they cost more points, but they simply worked better for me. Looking back at my list, it feels like I got a bunch of units which act as swiss army knives (koptas, flash gits, trukks, beast snagga wagon) to support my hard hitters (tank bustas, nobz, thrakka boyz).
I also had some mek guns which didn't do anything beside advancing onto objectives and stay there, KMK don't work well when the opponent is mostly trying to get away to not have their entire army charged turn 2.

So you run basicly the shooting trukks full of bustas and 5 flashgitz? Or do you press them in open top battlewagon?

Have you given a try to small Meks to improve the shooting performance of the guntrucks?

As you see from my previous post, I run Breaka Boyz withc Warboss as a anti tank hitters, but they are fragile in CC and the biggest issue I have is a traffic jam. All melee army simply stucks. It is har to get all CCs to get in the right fight in a single turn.

Having a second layer which shoots and is protected in transports makes a lot of sence. Less trafic jam, no degradation of the power after waaagh.

Btw. Flashgitz are definitely not the same as burna boyz. They are simply much more better. The price rise is lower than effectivtiy rise. It is all about the points


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Opponent that who s trying to get away not to be charged is imho opponent who gonna lost on points. The way how to beat us is the screening, let us charge, as close to our deploy as possible and than just roadblock.

Toady one IG guy smashed me this way pretty hard with the clever combination of guardsman, bulgrins and horseriders…

 Jidmah wrote:
Yeah, but I use flash gits the same. Their job is to die to keep tank bustas safe, but since they are slightly more durable than burnas, they also can do things like act as a screen after disembarking or tie up some unit which would otherwise charge into the tankbustas. Unlike burnas, many deep strikers also struggle to shift them off objectives. I also like their ability to reliably gun down lone operative characters.

I got the idea from a youtube video and just wanted to try it. Yes, they cost more points, but they simply worked better for me. Looking back at my list, it feels like I got a bunch of units which act as swiss army knives (koptas, flash gits, trukks, beast snagga wagon) to support my hard hitters (tank bustas, nobz, thrakka boyz).
I also had some mek guns which didn't do anything beside advancing onto objectives and stay there, KMK don't work well when the opponent is mostly trying to get away to not have their entire army charged turn 2.

I use Flash Gits the same way. They ride in my wagons along with Tankbustas and Snagga Boys.

Mass disembark, Gits clear screens or chip hard targets, Bustas kill hard target or soften hard target, Snaggas move in to kill whatever's left standing and nab objectives.

 Tomsug wrote:
So you run basicly the shooting trukks full of bustas and 5 flashgitz? Or do you press them in open top battlewagon?

Trukks. My only battlewagon is full of beastsnagga boyz with no firing deck to get that extra two toughness. Those two points have made a major difference in my last two games.

Have you given a try to small Meks to improve the shooting performance of the guntrucks?

5 Flash Gitz + 6 Tankbustas + SAG means the trukk is full. The small mek can't keep up with the trukk, plus tank bustas can just disembark if they need the +1 to hit.
Unlike the battlewagon, the trukk doesn't survive any dedicated shooting. I usually hide them from sight and only take pot shots where I can't be retaliated until I disembark and go all out with pulsa rokkit.

As you see from my previous post, I run Breaka Boyz withc Warboss as a anti tank hitters, but they are fragile in CC and the biggest issue I have is a traffic jam. All melee army simply stucks. It is har to get all CCs to get in the right fight in a single turn.

The big mek allowing Thrakka to run through terrain certainly helps this a lot, as he can (and should) take a route which would be blocked off for transports anyways.

Having a second layer which shoots and is protected in transports makes a lot of sence. Less trafic jam, no degradation of the power after waaagh.

Btw. Flashgitz are definitely not the same as burna boyz. They are simply much more better. The price rise is lower than effectivtiy rise. It is all about the points

True, I feel the same way. You pay and additional 30 points per unit, but you also gain much more per point.

Opponent that who s trying to get away not to be charged is imho opponent who gonna lost on points. The way how to beat us is the screening, let us charge, as close to our deploy as possible and than just roadblock.

Toady one IG guy smashed me this way pretty hard with the clever combination of guardsman, bulgrins and horseriders…

It was really devastating for my opponent. It allowed me to pile in Thrakka into one of his tanks and later both boyz mobs consolidated into the vehicles behind the infantry, giving me free movement, OC on an objectives, forced him to use a stratagem to fall back and shoot, and gave me free attacks on another vehicle.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Afrodactyl wrote:
I use Flash Gits the same way. They ride in my wagons along with Tankbustas and Snagga Boys.

Mass disembark, Gits clear screens or chip hard targets, Bustas kill hard target or soften hard target, Snaggas move in to kill whatever's left standing and nab objectives.

Huh, tripple surprise wagons. I like that, maybe I can get more battlewagons in my list that way.

My battlewagons are like clown cars with the amount of units pouring out of them

 Jidmah wrote:
My only battlewagon is full of beastsnagga boyz with no firing deck to get that extra two toughness. Those two points have made a major difference in my last two games.

Agree. No reason to run it open top!

Have you given a try to small Meks to improve the shooting performance of the guntrucks?

5 Flash Gitz + 6 Tankbustas + SAG means the trukk is full. The small mek can't keep up with the trukk, plus tank bustas can just disembark if they need the +1 to hit.
Unlike the battlewagon, the trukk doesn't survive any dedicated shooting. I usually hide them from sight and only take pot shots where I can't be retaliated until I disembark and go all out with pulsa rokkit.

I bring 2 flame trucks, 2x190pts, 4xKB

From the truck all buffs don't matter, so having a gun that can delete almost all infantry in the game sends chills to my oppnents, they consistently threaten damage and cause problem in objectives.

The KB provides bonus damage to elite and above.

In my games their the largest throw away threats and consistently pay themselves, once the flamers come out if transport is destroyed their even better since their applying full wound re rolls. Their also good melee with the -2 profile.

Unless their T8 your opponent will hate them. Have games i won because i deleted all scorer units.

My current issue is that i can't see any combo better then ghaz, he really empowers the waaggh.

Rest is 2xbreaka boyz with 2xflashgits and warbosses, in 2 trucks, word of advice the current ultramarines etc have a lot of -1 damage, the 3 damage is rising in value

4 SAGs?
Do you play 3k games?

Mate, flamers can bring one KB, shock attack gun per 5, it's one of the options, that's 2 at 120pts..., no i am playing 2k games.

So a flamer truck is 190pts, 70+120, 8 flamers and 2 special weapon, can be rocket, shoota or KB, i pick the KB because i can use it even if the truck is engaged, with guns never tire...

2 trucks is 4 KB... Sry if explained incorrectly.

Lootas have same profile btw... 3 options etc..

Also your focusing on the wrong thing, the KB are just flavor, the real threat is the flamers.