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Unknown, not many. But you wouldn't even need that powerful of a psyker. Just a few average grade psykers falling to daemonic influence would be sufficient to cause utter ruin. Maybe not totally wipe them out, but it would reduce them to no longer being worthy of being considered a major player.

Yes, the nids are definitely a more pressing threat overall. Its not like the T'au actually have any control over the chances of a rogue psyker falling prey to daemons. But it will happen eventually if they keep incorporating humans/other psychic races into their Empire and they don't fall to anything else.

Which really just shows the T'au continue to exist by plot armor alone. The Tyranids should have totally munched them, but they mysteriously turned away for unknown reasons at the last minute. The T'au will eventually come face to face with the horrors of psychic powers, but unlike humanity during the DAoT/Age of Strife they don't have the advantage of being a galaxy spanning civilization where you can lose 90+% of the population to rogue psychic horrors and still have enough survivors to continue.

I’ll just mention the Nicassar again. There are no details of how their psychic powers manifest, but they are described as a highly psychic race. It’s not too hard to see that they have shared protective devices or training patterns with the Tau, or just form the core of Hunter-killer squads in the Tau version of Ordo Hereticus.

 morganfreeman wrote:
I don't remember the exact source (maybe the 3rd / 4th edition BRB?), but IIRC it's stated that a big problem helping to fuel / throughout Old Night was that very permissive / rights driven societies were effectively wiped out by psykers falling prey to demons. Where as those that survived were the ones that bypassed rights / said they had none, and rapidly disposed of them and kept doing so.

I believe this was also narration rather than an in-universe document. And while there are obviously exceptions, it seems pretty cut-and-dry that psykers are a massive and dangerous problem even in utter utopias.

I think such cases are emphasized by in-universe propaganda about Why Freedom Is Bad And Fascism Is Good.

 Grey Templar wrote:
I would presume that the T'au, if they do have any number of human psykers in their population, have been lucky enough not to have any of them go nuclear. Yet.

Because if and when that does occur, realistically it will doom them. If an Omega+ class psyker gets born in T'au space and loses control(which is the most likely thing to happen without them knowing proper containment and training), it would destroy the T'au Empire. This won't happen because of their plot armor of course, but if we ignore that then it is a ticking time bomb. The only saving grace is that due to the low population of psychic races within the T'au empire the chance of a psyker being born is very very low.

I don't think anyone born with Omega potential lives long enough to come into their full power without training (either formal or self-taught).

If a toddler gets a hold of a loaded gun with the safety off, the most likely scenario is that he shoots himself. There's also a high chance that he shoots someone else, after which steps are taken by the adults to ensure it does not happen again. The toddler going on a shooting spree that ends with 20 people dead is the least likely scenario.

.

Bad analogy. A toddler with a gun is, while certainly dangerous to themselves and anyone nearby, still a fairly minimally dangerous in terms of collateral. An untrained psyker is more akin to a toddler crawling around a room with a bunch of buttons, one of which detonates a nuke.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Bad analogy. A toddler with a gun is, while certainly dangerous to themselves and anyone nearby, still a fairly minimally dangerous in terms of collateral. An untrained psyker is more akin to a toddler crawling around a room with a bunch of buttons, one of which detonates a nuke.

It's possible, but it's by no means a given. There's just not THAT many omega psykers causing widespread multiplanetary extinctions across the last 10,000 years given how many plots involve re-absorbing planets that had been unattended for generations, let alone the 5,000 before in which there was no Imperium doing its thing. The possibility remains open that Imperial propaganda continues because, just like everything else in the Imperium, it's by unthinking repetition - even if the possibility ALSO remains open that it's actually one way of resolving a real problem that would otherwise occur.

 Flinty wrote:
I’ll just mention the Nicassar again. There are no details of how their psychic powers manifest, but they are described as a highly psychic race. It’s not too hard to see that they have shared protective devices or training patterns with the Tau, or just form the core of Hunter-killer squads in the Tau version of Ordo Hereticus.

We can’t know due to lack of reference material if their tech would even be compatible with the human brain, or whatever it is that makes someone psychic.

But, I’m sure they, like Imperial turncoats, impress upon the Tau the importance of careful management of Psykers. Which could well include “you have to off them on sight” for all we know.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As for the rarity of any given Psyker causing an Exterminatus warranting Warp Breach?

I think you’re missing the point. For the relatively meagre price of just not tolerating it, at all, you can drastically slash the odds of that happening.

Not to mention, if it is a genetic thing which leads to psychic potential? Find them young enough, and you can remove them from the gene pool before they Sprog, further controlling the risk.

Remember. Odds are weird. Even 1 in 1,000,000,000 doesn’t mean you get 99,999,999,999 Safe Attempts. It could go wrong from the first, second, third and so on.

That’s the core of the issue with emergent Psykers.

The other issue is humankind is still becoming a psychic race. Evolution being evolution, it seems entirely possible the Eldar and other intrinsically psychic races had similar, well, growing pains, and that the antecedents of the modern races we know today can control their powers thanks to a further bit of evolution. Some oddity which made those who survived that bit more naturally resistant to possession or turning into a portal to hell, which over successive generations of Psykers became the norm, and is further enhanced with training, discipline and technology, allowing more of their potential to be, relatively, safely utilised.

 morganfreeman wrote:

 Haighus wrote:

This assumes that the Imperial methods for psyker control are the only method or even effective at all. Given the Imperium tends to generate most of its own problems, I would not be at all surprised if its draconian approach to psykers is actually counterproductive and makes psykers more dangerous.

Psychic powers (and the Warp) are effected by emotions. Mass paranoia and bigoted witch hunts plausibly destablise the local warpspace, attract warp predators, and cause psykers emotional distress that destabilises their powers.

Basically, don't take the Imperium's propaganda at face value. Lots of human worlds survived Old Night, plenty of them retained psyker traditions.

I don't remember the exact source (maybe the 3rd / 4th edition BRB?), but IIRC it's stated that a big problem helping to fuel / throughout Old Night was that very permissive / rights driven societies were effectively wiped out by psykers falling prey to demons. Where as those that survived were the ones that bypassed rights / said they had none, and rapidly disposed of them and kept doing so.

I believe this was also narration rather than an in-universe document. And while there are obviously exceptions, it seems pretty cut-and-dry that psykers are a massive and dangerous problem even in utter utopias.

The lore section in the 4th edition rulebook does indeed present this as the case, and is written as narration. However, I would posit that it is very much a narration from an Imperial perspective and written very tongue in cheek. People generally don't take other aspects at face value, so I am curious as to why the psyker threat in particular is.

For example, the Imperium is described as the greatest stellar realm the galaxy has ever seen... but we know the Eldar had a much mightier one before the Fall. Their armies are described as inexhaustible... yet fading against the enemies pressing in against mankind (i.e. being exhausted).

Lets look at some quotes:
How is "The guilt of these people cannot be disputed and their execution is rightly justified. Their betrayal of Humanity and the Emperor cannot go unpunished" anything but Imperial propaganda? It is narration, but clearly the Imperium and humanity are not synonymous and attempts to present them as such serves only the Imperium.

What about "xenotech is bartered by foolish nobles who know no better. In this way the taint of the alien spreads across the fringes of the Imperium, threatening to seep deeper into the fabric of its society until it can consume it from the inside as well as out. Truly it is said that the reward of tolerance is death." This is also straight-up Imperial propaganda about alien tech.

Even the names for the enemies of the Imperium are all "dread legions" and "the xenos threat" etc.

The whole section reads like an Inquisitor giving a lecture to their interrogators. Given the Imperial perspective, the choice of wording, and the way that everything is a grave, impure threat that can only be countered through sacrifice and loyalty to the empire and good, honest hate of the other is basically the same as how real life fascistic propaganda is presented, I am not inclined to take anything at face value.

Are psykers a potential threat? Yes. Are they the threat the Imperium claims, where the only possible counter is brutal oppression, murder, and superstition? I highly doubt it, and I think it is likely the Imperium's methods are counterproductive as they are in so many other places. Well, at least until the blind faith actually got repeatedly written as a major positive

Tolerance is nice till you have daemons chewing on your tendons.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Tolerance is nice till you have daemons chewing on your tendons.

Tolerance isn’t weakness.

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Tolerance is nice till you have daemons chewing on your tendons.

Tolerance isn’t weakness.

Again. Daemons. Eating. Your. Face.

Sure. If you define tolerance as "letting anyone do anything without so much as any pushback," then Daemons eating your face will suck. But you can be tolerant AND have armed forces or defenses or whatever you'd need to fight back. They aren't even on the same axis.

But you're less likely to GET a Daemonic incursion when psykers aren't in horrific conditions. Daemons are a reflection of the emotions of psychic races-if your default state is terrible, the default Daemon will be terrible.
Admittedly, the Imperium is more than widespread enough that Daemons will be terrible even in a society that's good, but you can respond to a Daemonic invasion in much the same way you'd respond to a Tyranid invasion.

While true on a technical level, the 40k galaxy is far beyond any attempts at pacifying warp by not being dicks to each other.

And I would argue that the conditions and how psykers are treated has zero bearing on their chances of getting possessed. Chaos has ways to worm their way in even if a psyker gets treated nicely. Pride, debauchery, hubris, etc...

 Grey Templar wrote:
While true on a technical level, the 40k galaxy is far beyond any attempts at pacifying warp by not being dicks to each other.

And I would argue that the conditions and how psykers are treated has zero bearing on their chances of getting possessed. Chaos has ways to worm their way in even if a psyker gets treated nicely. Pride, debauchery, hubris, etc...

Yes. No defense is perfect.

However, which do you think would be better at fending off a Daemonic incursion?

A society of horrifically repressed and subjugated people, with no Psykers among them save for the one who's summoning Daemons.

-or-

A society of people who live decent lives, though well-trained for defense (because 40k is dangerous as heck), with a small contingent of Psykers who were found and trained to use their abilities.

 JNAProductions wrote:

A society of people who live decent lives, though well-trained for defense (because 40k is dangerous as heck), with a small contingent of Psykers who were found and trained to use their abilities.

You have just described a Craftworld

Iracundus wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

A society of people who live decent lives, though well-trained for defense (because 40k is dangerous as heck), with a small contingent of Psykers who were found and trained to use their abilities.

You have just described a Craftworld

Which, to my knowledge, are much more capable of handling Daemonic invasions than any given Imperium world.

Grey Templar wrote:Tolerance is nice till you have daemons chewing on your tendons.

The Interex were doing just fine.

It's almost like a more permissive society without stigma and persecution for being a psyker would lead to less people going to great lengths to hide their psychic abilities and would actually make it easier to control your psychic population via softer methods that are more effective.

So yes, as usual it is the Imperium sticking the stick in its own spokes and blaming "others".

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:Tolerance is nice till you have daemons chewing on your tendons.

The Interex were doing just fine.

Is there any fluff on how the Interex dealt with psykers?

 Grey Templar wrote:
Pride, debauchery, hubris, etc...

Which are all exemplified in the Imperium's values expressed through its propaganda.

Pride? Humanity is the superior species, destined to rule over the entire galaxy alone.
Debauchery? Gee, it's like having no standard of living for billions of people would result in a craving for escape from that literal hell of an existence. Plus the "nobles can do whatever the feth they like to the underclasses and indulge their every whim unless a very select few people (Inquisitors and their agents, basically) turn up"
Hubris? Refer back to answer for pride.

Keep in mind that we as players are privy to information not widely known within The Imperium, such as the overall nature of the warp, and the scale of the Big Picture.

We might scoff at Imperial efforts and their often counter productive nature (such as driving Psykers into hiding, the effect of the abject misery of the Imperium has on the warp), but is that at all apparent to most of those making the decisions?

 Flinty wrote:

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:Tolerance is nice till you have daemons chewing on your tendons.

The Interex were doing just fine.

Is there any fluff on how the Interex dealt with psykers?

Nothing concrete, but they had an interstellar realm and were well aware of the pernicious nature of Chaos (much more so than the nascent Imperium). That suggests at least some psychic tradition, but does not confirm it. We don't know if their tolerance of different species extended to psykers, but it is a reasonably likely position given the lengths they went to preserving overtly hostile xenoforms and doing the minimum violence possible to ensure their own survival.

I think the Interex is one of the few good things to come out of the HH novels, as they shine a spotlight on the failings of the Imperium even at its most forward-thinking and powerful. Tau and the Leagues do a similar thing, but they are much more immoral as there are no good factions by the 41st millennium.

Or they could be forcibly implanting everyone with chips at birth that if they detect any psychic happenings, blow their heads up. Just saying

 Flinty wrote:
Or they could be forcibly implanting everyone with chips at birth that if they detect any psychic happenings, blow their heads up. Just saying

Oh, very much so. I wouldn't personally use the Interex as an example of good relations with psykers. But I do think it is likely they had a better relationship with them than the Imperium does.

Flinty wrote:

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:Tolerance is nice till you have daemons chewing on your tendons.

The Interex were doing just fine.

Is there any fluff on how the Interex dealt with psykers?

Less so psykers, but my comment is more directed at "tolerance" than psykers specifically.

Like Haighus said, we know that they were aware of Chaos, were able to largely escape their predations, all whilst being a "tolerant" society (at least, by every thing we knew and saw of them).

But anything further than that, positive or negative, is conjecture.

Haighus wrote:I think the Interex is one of the few good things to come out of the HH novels, as they shine a spotlight on the failings of the Imperium even at its most forward-thinking and powerful. Tau and the Leagues do a similar thing, but they are much more immoral as there are no good factions by the 41st millennium.

Strongly agreed. It's why I prefer with Tau genuinely are depicted as moral and "good" and a beacon of light and hope, because it makes it more clear that the Imperium *are* wrong and horrible. Obviously, the current depiction of Tau are not squeaky clean, but I sure preferred when they were portrayed as such.

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
Strongly agreed. It's why I prefer with Tau genuinely are depicted as moral and "good" and a beacon of light and hope, because it makes it more clear that the Imperium *are* wrong and horrible. Obviously, the current depiction of Tau are not squeaky clean, but I sure preferred when they were portrayed as such.

They may not be 100% squeaky clean but they are a far lighter shade of gray. In the story Broken Sword by Guy Haley, the former Guardsman keeps suspecting something nefarious or bad must happen sooner or later...and nothing ever does even after years pass. The Tau may not be altruistic in their interactions and absorptions of others but it could be argued to be a win-win situation with both sides making concessions (usually the other side giving up their autonomy in return for improvement in their material standard of living).

Eh...

Squeaky-clean Tau overlooks too many things, imo. In particular, it ignores the problem of what happens when a native population just flat out says "No" to the Greater Good.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
How grim do you want you grimdark?

On one hand you have them gathering and teaching each other to safely use their powers, not being sent off to become fuel for the astronomicon. Finding their full potential as a psychic race.

On the flip side, you have heads exploding, demonic possession, and rampant warp energies leaking into realspace, until eventually it becomes a demon world, where the terrors from beyond consume the souls of every living thing on he planet.

Pretty much this, in my opinion.

We know the Tau don’t have a great understanding of it, referring to it as Mind Science. Which in turn would suggest, not being idiots, they’d know to leave psychically talented species to manage this power of incredible potential their Benevolent Overlords can’t wield, and thus will always have a limited understanding of.

And this is why you probably have emergent psykers removed "for study". The base Tau would want to understand this problem, likely treating it as a genetic defect that could be corrected.

Given that some of the expansions have run into psykers/daemons/possessed, I'm sure the top level and ethereals are aware (if they hadn't been given mysterious benefactor guidance beforehand).

Overall, my bet is that Jones just disappears from the Gue'vesa colony one night and isn't seen again (and is either in a top-secret lab or dead).

So I guess my level of Tau head canon is that most Tau are benevolent but they have darker undercurrents the farther you go up as the leaders do what is necessary to keep most of the Tau that hopeful/benevolent.