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Lhykhis is my new favourite Phoenix Lords.

I'm glad she's female- I believe in many species of spiders it is the females that are most dangerous.

Looking to start a Corsair army.
I have looked at the eldar index and datasheets, as well as the DE index and datasheets, but incase I missed something, are there any transports (particularly like the venom) that corsairs can embark in?

johnpjones1775 wrote:
Looking to start a Corsair army.
I have looked at the eldar index and datasheets, as well as the DE index and datasheets, but incase I missed something, are there any transports (particularly like the venom) that corsairs can embark in?

Basically, they can embark in serpents and falcons (because those transport AELDARI models) but not star weavers, venoms, raiders, or tantaluses (tantali?) because those transport HARLEQUIN and DRUKHARI models. It feels like an oversight, and many people are keeping their fingers crossed for an anhrathe detachment in the drukhari book.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 PenitentJake wrote:
Lhykhis is my new favourite Phoenix Lords.

I'm glad she's female- I believe in many species of spiders it is the females that are most dangerous.

It's also just nice to break up the sausage fest a little. Of the named characters with bespoke data sheets we have what? 12guys and 4 (now 5) gals?

Guys:
Eldrad
Illic
Yriel
Asurmen
Baharroth
Maugan Ra
Fuegan
Karandras
Irrilyth
Vizarch
Drazhar
Rakarth

Gals:
Jain Zar
Yvraine
Lelith
The ranger lady from Blackstone Fortress
Now Lhykis

Given I seem to have manifested a few Eldar wish lists in the past?

Here’s a quicky, though I’ve left it late for this Edition.

Character Level Exarchs. We need more than just Farseer/Autarch/Warlocks. We need 2nd Ed style, Lt-ish level Indy Exarchs.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Given I seem to have manifested a few Eldar wish lists in the past?

Here’s a quicky, though I’ve left it late for this Edition.

Character Level Exarchs. We need more than just Farseer/Autarch/Warlocks. We need 2nd Ed style, Lt-ish level Indy Exarchs.

Are Autarchs lost on the path of command? Like exarchs on the aspects and farseers on the seer path? If so that leaves space for someone who is just walking the path of command. Done a few aspects, dabbling in leadership, but might go to basket weaving next.

The way autachs can pick and choose gear means you could field something like a 2nd ed independent exarch. Not quite the same, but could scratch the itch? How they attach to squads in 10th does make it a little lackluster.

I’m not sure Autarchs are stuck on the Path, but to be fair my knowledge of current Eldar background needs a refresh.

Certainly Autarchs are close to what I want. I just want a wee Autarch as well.

Autarchs aren't trapped. I know there are several examples including one in which an autarch goes on to become a seer later, but I'm struggling to recall the details for anyone other than Yriel. Yriel of course famously going autarch -> outcast -> autarch.

They literally just need to split the autarch profile into a pure command and control and a beat stick, with the latter being an exarch ancient, shrine guardian, phoenix prince or whatever you want to call it - menshad korum even to call back to the fact that an exarch is lost to the PATH and not an ASPECT, they can move throughout the path if they wish, but they can never leave it.


I've never liked the implementation of the autarch because it side steps the 'get lost on path, become uber' consequence of the eldar path system.

The literal point of the system is that you try to avoid falling by not becoming super obsessed and specialised, but if you DO then you become the perfect exemplar of that path manifest, making you a monster at that one thing, more than you could be if you were restrained.

Autarchs are a bit mary sue in their interaction with the path system.

I've no problem with the concept of a strategic genius path that conducts eldar warfare, just how they're implemented in the game as a better warrior than the guys who literally sacrifice their souls to their armour and place in society to never sleep or eat and only do war forever.


Autarchs need to be more like guard commanders but with eldar strategic superiority. Exarchs need to be the front line beat sticks that take on enemy champions as a pure test of their martial skill, seeking out the most dangerous and important parts of the battlefield to ply their trade. Hopefully now that the whole army is up to date, they'll start doing some new unit/character designs like this one in the coming years.

There's a whole load of potential within each aspect and shrine to create the depth of lore that a marine chapter has, with exarchs of different skill and focus (we already see that exarchs are entirely willing to wield weapons their phoenix lords don't, so their interpretation of the philosophy of the aspect is not immutable or fixed).

Exarchs are priests, teachers, armourers, walking embodiments of Khaine the warrior and guardians to the shrines, that's a whole load of jobs that could be demonstrated in different ways. Just the idea of an exarch focusing on his representing Khaine as a priest, bringing the bloody hand to the battlefield is cool.


What is lost in eldar discussion is that their entire culture is one of symbology, myth and philosophy and these aren't fixed. They debate them, they are personal and subjective.

It's all interpretive. A farseer interprets runes, they don't assume rigid outcomes. Each path is an interpretation within a philosophy and while the aspects have more structure to them than other paths, there is variety of dress, tradition, weapons, tactics, colours etc within each shrine yet they all claim to be of the same aspect.

An aspect is basically the equivalent of Christianity, while each shrine is a denomination, sticking to similar tenants but performed differently.


There is so much room in their for some amazing stuff, they just have the bad fortune of not being space marines to get that attention.

 Hellebore wrote:

I've no problem with the concept of a strategic genius path that conducts eldar warfare, just how they're implemented in the game as a better warrior than the guys who literally sacrifice their souls to their armour and place in society to never sleep or eat and only do war forever.

I'm inclined to agree, but I'm not sure we need a new autarch datasheet to address this. You could probably just bump autarch WS/BS stats down to normal aspect levels (so hitting on 3s rather than 2s with most weapons) and then maybe beef up exarchs a little. Just letting them hit on 2s (like they used to) and maybe giving them an additional wound would go a long way, I think. Although I don't think most people would complain if you made exarch weapon profiles significantly more scary and upped the cost of aspect squads to match.

But again, the simple solution to making exarchs feel like master warriors while making autarchs feel like they're just smart guys with aspect training... is probably to just swap who hits on 2+ and who hits on 3+.

At it's most basic that's fine.

Within the current GW paradigm of inventing new characters and units, I would expect to see expansion. The exarchs are an untapped potential for one off character ideas for years to come.

Solo exarchs that refuse to train anyone - nothing forces an exarch to teach, they would prefer to be killing anyway. Basically the exarch equivalent of an Assassin.

Exarchs that focus on their emulation of Khaine as his priest - a neglected part of their background that could look pretty amazing. Blood Priests that draw power from the murder they cause - a little incubi-esque due to the darkness of Khaine.

Shrine Progenitors - ancient exarchs that split from their parent shrine to found their own. The shrines were never exclusively started by phoenix lords, they were just the first to do so. Ancient powerful exarchs that are the first amongst their shrine.


plenty more, but these three ideas are probably the ones I like the most at the moment.

 Wyldhunt wrote:

 Hellebore wrote:

I've no problem with the concept of a strategic genius path that conducts eldar warfare, just how they're implemented in the game as a better warrior than the guys who literally sacrifice their souls to their armour and place in society to never sleep or eat and only do war forever.

I'm inclined to agree, but I'm not sure we need a new autarch datasheet to address this. You could probably just bump autarch WS/BS stats down to normal aspect levels (so hitting on 3s rather than 2s with most weapons) and then maybe beef up exarchs a little. Just letting them hit on 2s (like they used to) and maybe giving them an additional wound would go a long way, I think. Although I don't think most people would complain if you made exarch weapon profiles significantly more scary and upped the cost of aspect squads to match.

But again, the simple solution to making exarchs feel like master warriors while making autarchs feel like they're just smart guys with aspect training... is probably to just swap who hits on 2+ and who hits on 3+.

I dunno, I'm thinking Phoenix Lord -> Autaruch -> Exarch isn't awful so Phoenix Lord, hit on 2's, beatstick and/or strong flavor (Scorpion, Hawk, etc) support bespoke, then Autaurch 2's, Milder but wider support bespokes. Exarch, 3's Flavor Bespoke if anything.

Breton wrote:

 Wyldhunt wrote:

 Hellebore wrote:

I've no problem with the concept of a strategic genius path that conducts eldar warfare, just how they're implemented in the game as a better warrior than the guys who literally sacrifice their souls to their armour and place in society to never sleep or eat and only do war forever.

I'm inclined to agree, but I'm not sure we need a new autarch datasheet to address this. You could probably just bump autarch WS/BS stats down to normal aspect levels (so hitting on 3s rather than 2s with most weapons) and then maybe beef up exarchs a little. Just letting them hit on 2s (like they used to) and maybe giving them an additional wound would go a long way, I think. Although I don't think most people would complain if you made exarch weapon profiles significantly more scary and upped the cost of aspect squads to match.

But again, the simple solution to making exarchs feel like master warriors while making autarchs feel like they're just smart guys with aspect training... is probably to just swap who hits on 2+ and who hits on 3+.

I dunno, I'm thinking Phoenix Lord -> Autaruch -> Exarch isn't awful so Phoenix Lord, hit on 2's, beatstick and/or strong flavor (Scorpion, Hawk, etc) support bespoke, then Autaurch 2's, Milder but wider support bespokes. Exarch, 3's Flavor Bespoke if anything.

I mean, the problem with that is that according to their lore, exarchs should absolutely fight circles around autarchs. Autarchs have a wide breadth of combat experiences thanks to having walked multiple paths, and there's probably some amount of synergy to be found there (ala their wargear loadouts). But they're basically just veteran aspect warriors. Their actual focus is on being big brains who tell other people what to do. In contrast, an exarch is literally obsessed with fighting well. They eat, sleep, and breathe combat so thoroughly they're literally not allowed out of their shrines except during times of war. They're supernatural monsters whose souls have synched up with the war god.

In terms of raw fighting ability, it should go Phoenix Lord > Exarch > Autarch > Aspect Warrior.

 Wyldhunt wrote:

I mean, the problem with that is that according to their lore, exarchs should absolutely fight circles around autarchs. Autarchs have a wide breadth of combat experiences thanks to having walked multiple paths, and there's probably some amount of synergy to be found there (ala their wargear loadouts). But they're basically just veteran aspect warriors. Their actual focus is on being big brains who tell other people what to do. In contrast, an exarch is literally obsessed with fighting well. They eat, sleep, and breathe combat so thoroughly they're literally not allowed out of their shrines except during times of war. They're supernatural monsters whose souls have synched up with the war god.

In terms of raw fighting ability, it should go Phoenix Lord > Exarch > Autarch > Aspect Warrior.

The Autarch has always been in a weird spot. When introduced, he wasn't much of a beat stick, and with the old FOC, I never found a spot for him. His strategic genius was just a +1 on reserve rolls. Oh and he gave the army a strategy rating of 4 while the best rating other armies had was a 3. This rating affected a dice roll for selecting a mission back in 4th. Currently, his combat prowess isn't much of a factor since he can only join guardians of either flavor or be a lone ranger. Strategically he gets you an extra CP per turn and lets you reuse a strategem on his unit.

So I agree that an exarch should much more of a beat stick than an Autarch. But as long as the Autarch comes in his own box or blister and the Exarch comes in a squad box, it's not going to change. Similarly, Warlocks should be better fighters than a Farseer. I'd really like to see them get levels again like in 2nd, but they come 2 to a box now so that's off the table too. Max unit size of 4. Back in the day you could have the council of 10!

 Arschbombe wrote:
Strategically he gets you an extra CP per turn and lets you reuse a strategem on his unit.

You may want to refresh your Index. His "Rites of Battle, But in Elvish" got the same treatment.

 Arschbombe wrote:

 Wyldhunt wrote:

I mean, the problem with that is that according to their lore, exarchs should absolutely fight circles around autarchs. Autarchs have a wide breadth of combat experiences thanks to having walked multiple paths, and there's probably some amount of synergy to be found there (ala their wargear loadouts). But they're basically just veteran aspect warriors. Their actual focus is on being big brains who tell other people what to do. In contrast, an exarch is literally obsessed with fighting well. They eat, sleep, and breathe combat so thoroughly they're literally not allowed out of their shrines except during times of war. They're supernatural monsters whose souls have synched up with the war god.

In terms of raw fighting ability, it should go Phoenix Lord > Exarch > Autarch > Aspect Warrior.

The Autarch has always been in a weird spot. When introduced, he wasn't much of a beat stick, and with the old FOC, I never found a spot for him. His strategic genius was just a +1 on reserve rolls. Oh and he gave the army a strategy rating of 4 while the best rating other armies had was a 3. This rating affected a dice roll for selecting a mission back in 4th. Currently, his combat prowess isn't much of a factor since he can only join guardians of either flavor or be a lone ranger. Strategically he gets you an extra CP per turn and lets you reuse a strategem on his unit.

So I agree that an exarch should much more of a beat stick than an Autarch. But as long as the Autarch comes in his own box or blister and the Exarch comes in a squad box, it's not going to change. Similarly, Warlocks should be better fighters than a Farseer. I'd really like to see them get levels again like in 2nd, but they come 2 to a box now so that's off the table too. Max unit size of 4. Back in the day you could have the council of 10!

I don't think how they're sold is really a factor in this case. The main appeal of the autarch right now is his CP generation, and the wayleaper is a common sight in many lists. (The foottarch is having a bit of a comeback now that his Rites of Battle equivalent actually does something.) So it's not like GW is doubling down on autarchs as beatsticks. They have a perfectly good non-beatstick niche right now. And exarchs are a non-mandatory build option in both old and new aspect kits. So if they wanted to buff exarchs and either raise the point scosts of squads to match *or* make them an optional upgrade for the squad, *or* make them a character that happens to be sold as part of a non-character box (the same way Troupe Masters are just an optional build in the harlequin troupe box), they could absolutely make any of those options happen. If anything, having notably powerful "sergeants" sprinkled throughout the army could be a good way to help give it its own identity.

 Arschbombe wrote:

 Wyldhunt wrote:

I mean, the problem with that is that according to their lore, exarchs should absolutely fight circles around autarchs. Autarchs have a wide breadth of combat experiences thanks to having walked multiple paths, and there's probably some amount of synergy to be found there (ala their wargear loadouts). But they're basically just veteran aspect warriors. Their actual focus is on being big brains who tell other people what to do. In contrast, an exarch is literally obsessed with fighting well. They eat, sleep, and breathe combat so thoroughly they're literally not allowed out of their shrines except during times of war. They're supernatural monsters whose souls have synched up with the war god.

In terms of raw fighting ability, it should go Phoenix Lord > Exarch > Autarch > Aspect Warrior.

The Autarch has always been in a weird spot. When introduced, he wasn't much of a beat stick, and with the old FOC, I never found a spot for him. His strategic genius was just a +1 on reserve rolls. Oh and he gave the army a strategy rating of 4 while the best rating other armies had was a 3. This rating affected a dice roll for selecting a mission back in 4th. Currently, his combat prowess isn't much of a factor since he can only join guardians of either flavor or be a lone ranger. Strategically he gets you an extra CP per turn and lets you reuse a strategem on his unit.

So I agree that an exarch should much more of a beat stick than an Autarch. But as long as the Autarch comes in his own box or blister and the Exarch comes in a squad box, it's not going to change. Similarly, Warlocks should be better fighters than a Farseer. I'd really like to see them get levels again like in 2nd, but they come 2 to a box now so that's off the table too. Max unit size of 4. Back in the day you could have the council of 10!

GW can get round this by releasing super special trademarkable name exarch and warlock though?

Dai2 wrote:

 Arschbombe wrote:

 Wyldhunt wrote:

I mean, the problem with that is that according to their lore, exarchs should absolutely fight circles around autarchs. Autarchs have a wide breadth of combat experiences thanks to having walked multiple paths, and there's probably some amount of synergy to be found there (ala their wargear loadouts). But they're basically just veteran aspect warriors. Their actual focus is on being big brains who tell other people what to do. In contrast, an exarch is literally obsessed with fighting well. They eat, sleep, and breathe combat so thoroughly they're literally not allowed out of their shrines except during times of war. They're supernatural monsters whose souls have synched up with the war god.

In terms of raw fighting ability, it should go Phoenix Lord > Exarch > Autarch > Aspect Warrior.

The Autarch has always been in a weird spot. When introduced, he wasn't much of a beat stick, and with the old FOC, I never found a spot for him. His strategic genius was just a +1 on reserve rolls. Oh and he gave the army a strategy rating of 4 while the best rating other armies had was a 3. This rating affected a dice roll for selecting a mission back in 4th. Currently, his combat prowess isn't much of a factor since he can only join guardians of either flavor or be a lone ranger. Strategically he gets you an extra CP per turn and lets you reuse a strategem on his unit.

So I agree that an exarch should much more of a beat stick than an Autarch. But as long as the Autarch comes in his own box or blister and the Exarch comes in a squad box, it's not going to change. Similarly, Warlocks should be better fighters than a Farseer. I'd really like to see them get levels again like in 2nd, but they come 2 to a box now so that's off the table too. Max unit size of 4. Back in the day you could have the council of 10!

GW can get round this by releasing super special trademarkable name exarch and warlock though?

I mean, if you want a named beatstick autarch, Yriel is right there, longing for a model and lore update.

Breton wrote:

 Arschbombe wrote:
Strategically he gets you an extra CP per turn and lets you reuse a strategem on his unit.

You may want to refresh your Index. His "Rites of Battle, But in Elvish" got the same treatment.

The foot Autarch still has 'Superlative Strategist' for the cheaper option on its own unit (not 2nd use), but the Wayleaper and Skyrunner do not. All have 'Path of Command' for the CP.
So yeah, the 2nd use thing is gone now, but using a strat on this unit is cheaper instead. It is changed in the Index and Balance Dataslate.

Aeldari question. Is it safe to assume that there will be a new Combat Patrol box soon?

Now that I found a totally wonderful incanon and totally in universe way to paint the Aeldari,
I want to paint a Wraithlord, but I was told to wait for the new codex.

Pretty good chance. Certainly I can’t immediately think of a 10th Ed Codex which didn’t come with a revised Combat Patrol?

But then, I can’t say I’ve exactly kept tabs on that either.

My nearest shop is Warhammer store... do you like small games?

Hope you do!

Yeah, so now I'm looking at Combat Patrol, Kill Team, and other small games.

I think if they release a new CP they keep the rules up for the old one? They may or may not make it past an edition reset, but should be good for a codex update.

The Eldar box is not a bad assortment of things to have in your collection anyway.

Considering the UK GW store isn't even listing the combat patrol box - yep there will be a new one

 Overread wrote:
Considering the UK GW store isn't even listing the combat patrol box - yep there will be a new one

Not on the US one either.

Is the moment upon us? Have any seers read the skein of fate and found a release date?

Getting a little excited. Would be interesting to see what’s in the new CP if they release one. If only to get painting back logs of stuff if I need to build it out of my current collection/pile of shame, or what I’d need to pick up in the first wave.

With the new Krieg having only just gone out I'd wager Eldar would be last half of January with an announcement at best (preorder/release in feb)

Better bloody not.

I’ve got an MOT and car tax to pay for this coming pay period!

Hmph!

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Better bloody not.

I’ve got an MOT and car tax to pay for this coming pay period!

Hmph!

Marks of Tzeentch cost money?

That’s actually a good point. I don’t currently know what MOT stands for, other than a hit to the wallet.

Apparently it’s Ministry of Transport.

Essentially it’s a safety check conducted on all cars in the UK over three years old. In theory it ensures cars are roadworthy.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
That’s actually a good point. I don’t currently know what MOT stands for, other than a hit to the wallet.

Apparently it’s Ministry of Transport.

Essentially it’s a safety check conducted on all cars in the UK over three years old. In theory it ensures cars are roadworthy.

Ouch. I'm sure your Eldar will wait for you. Just like I am mind willing Games Workshop to release the Knights after April.

To my benefit, a fat old inheritance cheque should be landing in the next couple of weeks, so that will help 😂

Not for toys. For the MOT and Tax, freeing up other dosh for toys.

And of course, I need to get myself in Box Credit from my 2025 self hobby challenge, or I ain’t buying nowt.