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I am mainly thinking of Techmarines with forcefield (the one that gives 4++) in a Guard Blob. Any one tried this? is it legal does it work?.

not that I know of, not every player plays with guard O.o I prefer a mech build with a 2 vindicator and knight in a land raider centerpiece

I was thinking of maybe using that kind of setup to represent an AdMech army though. ^^;

Isn't the forcefield only models within 3" not units...?

I'm pushing every army I have to 4K before I start thinking about allies.
But for me a pure force usually fits better and plays better.

 dpal666 wrote:

But for me a pure force usually fits better and plays better.

This is rarely the case in competitive play.

Depends on your army. I generally find that any allies dilutes my Sisters' effectiveness rather than boosting it.

I have space wolfs as ally , the DA are very nice for a blob army , but I would have to buy new models , so I dont . If I ever get DAs for free I would totaly use them 5 wound lascanons with +3 sv for cheap are ok .

 pretre wrote:
Isn't the forcefield only models within 3" not units...?

It is, but you can easily bunch up 6 to 7 dudes in front of your tech which will get a 4++, and then you get look out sir, for less of the cost of a runepries (about 80 points), you essentially double the effective amount of wound on your blob, say your 200 points 40 wounds blob, essentially becomes an 80 wound blob. That is pretty significant in my opinion for a blob inexpensive unit.

xxvaderxx wrote:

 pretre wrote:
Isn't the forcefield only models within 3" not units...?

It is, but you can easily bunch up 6 to 7 dudes in front of your tech which will get a 4++, and then you get look out sir. That is pretty significant in my opinion for a blob inexpensive unit.

and then you eat a blast weapon and lose 50% of your squad from one shot.

Yeah, that's just not as good as FNP for the whole blob or some of the other tricks you can pull.

I would think ATSKNF and Prescience are a bigger draw from DA.

Try a Guard blob with Uriah Jacobus or a Canoness in it.

Or both if the Guard are your allies.

Preferred Enemy, +1 Initiative from the Canoness.

+1 Attack, Feel no Pain and Hatred from Jacobus.

Preferred Enemy only works in assault with the Canoness making it much less desirable.

Jacobus doesn't give Hatred, per se, he gives rerolls on the charge.

Which is, game mechanic wise, identical to..?

Hatred allows rerolls in the first round of combat, not just on the charge. Good try though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, Jacobus rerolls wounds as well.

Makumba wrote:
I have space wolfs as ally , the DA are very nice for a blob army , but I would have to buy new models , so I dont . If I ever get DAs for free I would totaly use them 5 wound lascanons with +3 sv for cheap are ok .

I do this as well, just because I wanted a few wolf minis for the collection because I liked them. Of course now a "few" have become close to 1500 on their own...and given that my Dark Angels blossomed to 3.5k, even before the new 'dex came out I don't think I need allies for either now. Hahahahahaha...that have become my 3rd and 4th space marine armies done in my time as a 40k player. Sold the others off in the past, but now have 2 more...gotta stop doing that...

Skriker

Azrael will be stupid good with a large blob. 4++, Furious Charge and ATSKNF on 50 guys? Yes please.

Pass. 50 guardsmen with a 4+ invul save will die just as fast a 50 guardsmen behind an ADL or in ruins. Let me tell you, that's pretty fast. Meanwhile, ATSKNF isn't all that great for slow-initiative guard, especially when you could just put a lord commissar in the squad for much, much cheaper, and you'd have better leadership. As for furious charge, those guardsmen are going to do anything in close combat anymore (much less even get there).

Azrael in a guard blob sounds like little more than a waste of hundreds of points.

As for if people are doing this a lot in general, I can't really say, but at my FLGS we have two dark angels players and neither of them use allies. Belial and a few dozen scoring mix-n-match terminators saying hello on turn 1 is way better than anything that DA could do with guard infantry.

 Ailaros wrote:
Meanwhile, ATSKNF isn't all that great for slow-initiative guard, especially when you could just put a lord commissar in the squad for much, much cheaper, and you'd have better leadership.

The point of ATSKNF is so that you cannot be swept, and you can act as normal after rallying. This leads to you breaking from assaults, rallying, and shooting the life out of the opponent.

Of course, you ideally want to be getting this from a Rune Priest. They have much more utility purposes.

Ah, still...

 Ailaros wrote:
Pass. 50 guardsmen with a 4+ invul save will die just as fast a 50 guardsmen behind an ADL or in ruins. Let me tell you, that's pretty fast. Meanwhile, ATSKNF isn't all that great for slow-initiative guard, especially when you could just put a lord commissar in the squad for much, much cheaper, and you'd have better leadership. As for furious charge, those guardsmen are going to do anything in close combat anymore (much less even get there).

Azrael in a guard blob sounds like little more than a waste of hundreds of points.

As for if people are doing this a lot in general, I can't really say, but at my FLGS we have two dark angels players and neither of them use allies. Belial and a few dozen scoring mix-n-match terminators saying hello on turn 1 is way better than anything that DA could do with guard infantry.

Said like a player who's never had to face one. It bubble wraps the important units, sits over objectives, and generally is an unkillable annoyance. And any Azreal worth his salt would take FNP, not furious charge.

Sounds like a player who has never tried to keep a few dozen guardsmen alive.

A 50-man naked guard blob with Azrael costs nearly 500 points, and has virtually no killing power. And your opponent will show up with a punisher cannon, or a manticore, or some flamer sternguard or any of a myriad of anti-infantry weapons and that's 500 points going straight into the toilet in a very short time.

Not only is it a horrible waste, but it's a black hole of a horrible waste. You're going to start getting delusions of being good in close combat which you'll never get into, and start taking power axes that you'll never use. Throw on some good heavy and special weapons, and the price of this squad could soar towards SEVEN HUNDRED POINTS. For something that's not going to do much more than sit around and die like guardsmen.

It's a bad idea, plain and simple.

Unless, of course, the only thing you want to do at all costs is keep Azrael alive...

 Ailaros wrote:
Sounds like a player who has never tried to keep a few dozen guardsmen alive.

A 50-man naked guard blob with Azrael costs nearly 500 points, and has virtually no killing power. And your opponent will show up with a punisher cannon, or a manticore, or some flamer sternguard or any of a myriad of anti-infantry weapons and that's 500 points going straight into the toilet in a very short time.

Not only is it a horrible waste, but it's a black hole of a horrible waste. You're going to start getting delusions of being good in close combat which you'll never get into, and start taking power axes that you'll never use. Throw on some good heavy and special weapons, and the price of this squad could soar towards SEVEN HUNDRED POINTS. For something that's not going to do much more than sit around and die like guardsmen.

It's a bad idea, plain and simple.

Unless, of course, the only thing you want to do at all costs is keep Azrael alive...

It doesn't necessarily have to be a 50-man naked IG squad, just a mass of cheap scoring bodies that will be hard to dislodge off objectives. You seriously underestimate 4++ and FNP, they become so much more survivable. If they have heavy weapons they do get Preferred Enemy: CSM as well, which helps, and with a primaris psyker casting prescience you've got a solid firebase. Also, more importantly they unlock Vendettas. Couple cheap IG flyers and Blob with all of Azrael's advantages with a killy Ravenwing/Greenwing list and you have a solid contender.

But it's not cheap, and it's not hard to dislodge.

I'm not the first person to put guardsmen behind an ADL or in ruins. I know the limitations to a 4+ save.

It doesn't make you invincible, it means your squishy guardsmen are just less squishy.

 Ailaros wrote:
But it's not cheap, and it's not hard to dislodge.

I'm not the first person to put guardsmen behind an ADL or in ruins. I know the limitations to a 4+ save.

It doesn't make you invincible, it means your squishy guardsmen are just less squishy.

They're there to die, and occupy terrain with cover-the-board maxed out spacing.

That makes no sense.

"They're there to die"?

I guess you're there to lose, then..? Since, you know, having 700 odd points of your models sole purpose being to die, rather than affect the game in some meaningful way is a good way to do just that...

I saw this thread, stopped, and realized that all the players at my local store who play Dark Angels DO ally with Guard. They run mechanized Guard detachments with Dark Angel allies, to be precise, but it still works. (Guard hammers the enemy with tanks and artillery, Dark Angels pod in and kick the crap out of anything that moves.)

50 guardsmen with a 4+ invul save will die just as fast a 50 guardsmen behind an ADL or in ruins.

helldrake , flamer meta ?

Dont forget the blob is fearless, thats a good boost.

 Formosa wrote:
Dont forget the blob is fearless, thats a good boost.

ATSKNF is infinitely better than fearless.

Fearless blobs cannot go to ground behind an Aegis, and cannot get out of combat except by winning.

Since blobs are there to shoot, and and are awful at melee, this is a bad thing.