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grefven wrote:
Blackadder, and I'd be more than happy for a long time.

+1 for Blackadder. That would be genius

Also like the idea of the GoT team

I think the guy from Kingdom Death would be perfect for a guest artist box for this, Twilight Knight and White Speaker Nico

 DaveC wrote:
I wonder if Allison Twilight Knight will appear seems like good candidate as she has crossed over into a load of games including CMoN games.

Edit:
Sounds good to me (If Adam is free enough to consider it)

Adam appears to be neck-deep with KD:M (as usual). He's still working on that Update he mentioned a while back...

 cincydooley wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
Link, Ash, LotR characters, WoW characters, Conan. High Fantasy is harder than pop culture to get people excited about. We haven't had a ton of good shows or movies in fantasy settings. Maybe some Arthurian stuff. Van Helsing? Underworld?

I think I'll just be along for the ride and hopeful for some rando's that get me excited.

I guess...if they wanted...they could do some to this little known show running on HBO right now...

Game of something or other?

Would they really want to make an IP inspired by GoT? Seems like HBO has been getting pretty tight with any infringement of the GoT property as of late even as going as far as telling a bar to stop showing it. I know CMON already got one cease-and-desist from season 1. Some companies are very protective of their IP like disney, others just have a meh attitude. HBO has generally been laid back but as of late, not so much when it comes to GoT.

Adam is the art DIRECTOR of Kingdom Death, not the artist responsible for the actual figures or images.

 tre manor wrote:
Adam is the art DIRECTOR of Kingdom Death, not the artist responsible for the actual figures or images.

To be fair, Poots is a mad genius.

 Piston Honda wrote:

Would they really want to make an IP inspired by GoT? Seems like HBO has been getting pretty tight with any infringement of the GoT property as of late even as going as far as telling a bar to stop showing it. I know CMON already got one cease-and-desist from season 1. Some companies are very protective of their IP like disney, others just have a meh attitude. HBO has generally been laid back but as of late, not so much when it comes to GoT.

Keep in mind that a C&D letter doesn't mean your actually infringing on IP, just that the company that thinks it owns the IP thinks so... ;-)

Also, in some countries parodies of an IP doesn't exactly fall under copyright infringement. I think CMoN is operating on that exception...

Will we see an armless black knight and killer bunnies?

CMON has fallen foul of IP-infringement with earlier Zombicides (specifically with Tarantino stuff like The Bride and Jules from Pulp Fiction) so now goes out of their way to remove all ties to the original thing being "parodied" - different colour schemes and different character backgrounds. That's why you get Ron Burgundy in a checked suit, and Scarface with grey hair in a burgundy suit.

That being said, I still think that all it would take is one major studio or company to turn their ire on the project, and the parodies would start to evaporate quite quickly. GoT merchandising is HUGE, and if HBO feels that it's losing a slice of that to an unlicensed boardgame...

I frankly think that the parodies are rather lazy, anyway - it's a way of getting people to pay £7 for a bit of boardgame plastic, and saves any major design work at their end. They have done nothing to add value, they're simply exploiting IP, parody laws or not.

While you are free to have your opinion on the matter, my gaming group, myself included, love the characters "inspired" by TV and film. So much so, that it is our driving force behind trying to collect the limted edition figures.

Cergorach wrote:

 Piston Honda wrote:

Would they really want to make an IP inspired by GoT? Seems like HBO has been getting pretty tight with any infringement of the GoT property as of late even as going as far as telling a bar to stop showing it. I know CMON already got one cease-and-desist from season 1. Some companies are very protective of their IP like disney, others just have a meh attitude. HBO has generally been laid back but as of late, not so much when it comes to GoT.

Keep in mind that a C&D letter doesn't mean your actually infringing on IP, just that the company that thinks it owns the IP thinks so... ;-)

Also, in some countries parodies of an IP doesn't exactly fall under copyright infringement. I think CMoN is operating on that exception...

Will we see an armless black knight and killer bunnies?

Don't forget that a parody has to comment on the SOURCE, otherwise it is satire. In other words, you have to be making fun of the thing you are copying, rather than using the thing you are copying to be funny.

Even then, parody is not a silver bullet.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 adamsouza wrote:
While you are free to have your opinion on the matter, my gaming group, myself included, love the characters "inspired" by TV and film. So much so, that it is our driving force behind trying to collect the limted edition figures.

Which strongly supports the idea that CMoN is unfairly deriving value from copying the work of other artists.

I'm not saying that CMoN is infringing a copyright mind, my point is that if a company is getting extra sales/higher value from an allegedly infringing work, it tends to cut against fair use, as that value is effectively being appropriated from the source. That has no bearing on where the appropriation (if any) is MISappropriation.

Anyway, there is a long tradition of pop culture appropriation in the TTWG industry. Just ask Sly Marbo.

Really impressed with the recent Zombicide Kickstarter so likely be interested in this one

Wouldn't an easier way to circumvent the IP issues be to actually contact the company and give them a head's up? Probably the IP owner would just want a share then is my guess.

I'd be happy seeing animal people "inspired" by the houses of Westeros. Drunken midget lions...?

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
Wouldn't an easier way to circumvent the IP issues be to actually contact the company and give them a head's up? Probably the IP owner would just want a share then is my guess.

I'd be happy seeing animal people "inspired" by the houses of Westeros. Drunken midget lions...?

If you don't want to get clawed by a sleeping tiger, isn't it best to grab his tail before he sees you?

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
Wouldn't an easier way to circumvent the IP issues be to actually contact the company and give them a head's up?

It depends but usually it doesn't really change anything. Even someone says there shouldn't be an issue, doesn't mean they gave an ok since it still isn't official. Instead the likely result is you now have put it on their radar by doing this. Just because there is a possible IP issue, doesn't necessarily mean that it is valid either.

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
Wouldn't an easier way to circumvent the IP issues be to actually contact the company and give them a head's up? Probably the IP owner would just want a share then is my guess.

I'd be happy seeing animal people "inspired" by the houses of Westeros. Drunken midget lions...?

Haha, no. The IP owner would not want to share the stuff, they would want a cut of the pie. A royalty to be paid on each figure produced.

GOT definitely has licensing fees, and the popularity means it is not cheap. Zero chance CMoN could afford the fee for homages.

But parody is free, so not a problem.

Unless it isn't really a parody.

I personally don't see how any of the CMoN pop culture refs thus far have actually been parodies.

Again, that DOES NOT mean anything CMoN has done is in any way wrong. Fair use/Free speech is totally irrelevant if what you are doing isn't infringement in the first place.

But all the same, just because something is funny doesn't make it a parody.

Does anyone else wish they didn't go the fantasy route and with historical figures from middles ages, renaissance, etc. ?

I wanna see pope Innocent III, William Wallace, Joan or Arc, vlad Dracula, Simon de Montfort

I rather like the fantasy direction. This is looking to be my jumping-in point after my previous failed starts at getting on the Zombicide train.

Not adverse to the inclusion of historical characters, though.

Fantasy is much more ZCide style. ZCide does not exist in anything like reality.

It is like a mindless, button-mashing, co-op video game with basically no plot. Referencing history, even in really irreverent ways, would seem to throw off the mood.

ZCide exists in a place in your mind wherein a 90 pound waitress can zip around on roller skates swinging a chainsaw and pumping an endless stream of bullets from an automatic rifle. That's a place of gluttonous, hyper-violent fantasy where the blood comes in buckets, is redder than red, and tastes like corn syrup.

I feel that a historical bent would taint that sense of whimsical, consequence-free hyper-violence.

"ZCide exists in a place in your mind wherein a 90 pound waitress can zip around on roller skates swinging a chainsaw and pumping an endless stream of bullets from an automatic rifle. That's a place of gluttonous, hyper-violent fantasy where the blood comes in buckets, is redder than red, and tastes like corn syrup. "
- Weeble1000

This is the kind of product endourcement they should put on the side of the box

Except, it sounds like a wannabe Tarantino movie endorsement.

weeble1000 wrote:
Which strongly supports the idea that CMoN is unfairly deriving value from copying the work of other artists.

I'm not saying that CMoN is infringing a copyright mind, my point is that if a company is getting extra sales/higher value from an allegedly infringing work, it tends to cut against fair use, as that value is effectively being appropriated from the source. That has no bearing on where the appropriation (if any) is MISappropriation.

Hmm, very good point :/. I don't think CMoN's "parodied" any IP's where the owners could really use the extra support (so don't think it's awful), but it still isn't a very nice practice, and they really do feel like they're hiding behind "parody" where some good people fought for freedom of speech on the matter/lost their livelihoods attempting to fight to change the laws... only for others to exploit it.

 spiralingcadaver wrote:

weeble1000 wrote:
Which strongly supports the idea that CMoN is unfairly deriving value from copying the work of other artists.

I'm not saying that CMoN is infringing a copyright mind, my point is that if a company is getting extra sales/higher value from an allegedly infringing work, it tends to cut against fair use, as that value is effectively being appropriated from the source. That has no bearing on where the appropriation (if any) is MISappropriation.

Hmm, very good point :/. I don't think CMoN's "parodied" any IP's where the owners could really use the extra support (so don't think it's awful), but it still isn't a very nice practice, and they really do feel like they're hiding behind "parody" where some good people fought for freedom of speech on the matter/lost their livelihoods attempting to fight to change the laws... only for others to exploit it.

In large part, I think it is a perfectly fine practice. I think that we would all be a good deal happier if we appreciated that the point of copyright is ultimately to protect the notion that art begets art.

We want to live in a society in which art flourishes. So why should it matter if a product is enjoyable because it bears a passing similarity to something that has made an indelible imprint on our culture? Just because one recognizes a reference in context doesn't mean that a copyright has been infringed. GW tried to pull that BS in the CHS case.

But the nerds KNOW it represents an assault cannon! So we own that! That's not copyright, that's trademark! Market recognition is the realm of trademarks, not copyrights. Consider what makes a reference recognizable. How much of that recognition is due in part to elements that are common or indispensable? Consider an assault cannon. It is a fething rotary cannon. So what if GW uses the same sort of rotary cannon every damn time? Doesn't make it a unique work of art. It is a gameplay expedient that has feth all to do with 'art'.

Edit: Sorry about the rambling and cussing. I've had a few in one of the best darn bars in the US, JM Curly.

BACK ON TOPIC! I just want to be able to flip my ZBP character card over to an epic level version of excessive fantasy kicking! Do that, and I'll back ZBP all the way.

 Piston Honda wrote:
Does anyone else wish they didn't go the fantasy route and with historical figures from middles ages, renaissance, etc. ?

I wanna see pope Innocent III, William Wallace, Joan or Arc, vlad Dracula, Simon de Montfort

Nope. Not even a little bit.

I'm with weeble.

I want to flip the card over for the super heroic versions of the characters- naturally with new figures to throw in as stretch goals!

Bashing parody character in zombicide is like bashing the use of vehicles at a NASCAR race! Zombicide was built on the use of parody characters (seeing chuck norris and Bruce willis forced me to pledge for the first ks/my first ks ever). I for one and many others love parody characters, especially as a gamer, movies buff, music lover, etc. Parody characters let some re-live their childhood or for a moment battle zombies while becoming one of their favorite movie heroes.... (I get it some players don't use their imaginations while playing, but it makes a game experience much more enjoyable!)

The pledge numbers for zombicide speak for those of us who love parody characters, but anyways.....

I also like the idea of super strength characters! I hope we see both historical and parody fantasy characters. William Wallace? Yes please! Gimli? Yes please!

I originally wasnt a fan of a new zombicide genre, but this could be cool!

I think the point here is that they're not so much 'parody' as they are 'homage' and that's not necessarily something that is 'protected' and/or 'allowed'!

 Alpharius wrote:
I think the point here is that they're not so much 'parody' as they are 'homage' and that's not necessarily something that is 'protected' and/or 'allowed'!

And yet the boxed game has them, let alone the Kickstarter exclusives. I really don't think it's something worth worrying about.

I'm also certain that not-Ron Burgundy's jacket was a reference to Stan from the Monkey Island games...

Again, it isn't worth 'worrying' about, it just might mean that we shouldn't expect many of them going forward - other than ones based on historical figures of course!