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Something went badly wrong - any one have a any clues as to what.

Basically I put a couple of ink washes on 2 white figures. The one on the right (which was one of a couple of test figures for a color scheme I did yesterday) is what I was after as a starting point. When I went to do a batch today I ended up with 5 very blotchy figure. they looked ok as I was putting in the first wash, but when it dried it didn't look quite right!! The ink didn't dry in the crevases as expected and the color seems to have stained certain areas whislt looking as though it has been repelled from others.

I can't think what I did different.

I don't know,
at first i thought you must of used different inks! but looking closer i can see the patchs...

they have differnet colour bases, did you prime differently?


Panic...

Panic wrote:I don't know,
at first i thought you must of used different inks! but looking closer i can see the patchs...

they have differnet colour bases, did you prime differently?


Panic...

No they both were done the same, I just blacked the second base afterwards so it wasn't distracting me when I was deciding whether it was going where I wanted in terms of effect.

The one that has gone wrong has only had first of 2 washes, the second wash is the same ink mixed with some green ink to give a more greeny gungy feel. That is how the right hand figure currently stands.

The bad figure is worse than the piccy shows. As you go round you can see that instead of ink settling at the creases etc, it has in quite a few places 'deliberately' avoided them. with an obvious unstained white (undercoat) line showing where the ink would normally have collected.

I don't know whether adding to much water to the inks might have caused it. I water down the inks so they don't stain the whole model quite so vividly. The first was was also watered down, but came out for fine for what I'm wanting. But I don't have any exact measuring tool, so water adding is an imprecise art for me.

It's a surface tension thing, it happens with all ink washes applied over broad areas. You want the pigment to settle down as gravity intended, osmosis has other plans.

Your best options are to start being more selective in where you use your washes (in the cracks instead of broad strokes) or to use something that'll mess up the process in terms of pigment transfer. An obvious solution if you're adding water is a miniscule, tiny amount of soap. Dishwashing liquid, what have you. Problem there is bubbles, possible colouration, etc.

What a lot of modellers have been using for some time is Future Floor Wax, you should be able to find it in most big department stores, and it does the trick nicely.

As to why it worked so well the first time, well.... inks. They hate us.

No no inks are our friends.... (i think)

Dish soap solves the problem, too. I haven't tried
Future Floor Wax yet.

I was joking a bit, Turtle's most likely right.

When batch producing things i mix up my wash in a large amounts prior/while testing, so once the result is good i know i have lots of it to go forth and multiply with.
normally one whole mixing pot, that way i can be sure my mix won't change across the range.

I have two pots of a black/brown/water/soap ink mixed, for my guard pretorians.
I have a tiny not even a half a drop of fairy washing up liquid in that. i just paste that stuff on like i'm dipping, and i get a good/fair result.

but I normally only use soap when i'm painting large thing like tanks...
don't listen to me too much when i paint it's all about speed...


Panic (not at the disco)...

Also, soap makes the paint smell nice.

Panic wrote:
don't listen to me too much when i paint it's all about speed...

Same here - thats why I like washes. A quick dry brush after, and tidy up some details. But by the time I'm done with the little details I seem to have spent ages per model anyway, for something that by the time I've got 5 done I usually don't like any more.

I tried dipping, but I can't seem to get the effects others get - must be all in the wrist action

Panic wrote:I have a tiny not even a half a drop of fairy washing up liquid in that. i just paste that stuff on like i'm dipping, and i get a good/fair result.

I too use good old fairy liquid (uk dish soap), perhaps a 100(water+paint):1(fairy) ratio, and get a very smooth coverage. I have to be very slow with the brush and have to keep it clean and not let the bristles fray or small frothy bubbles start to form which can be annoying. The best advice that can be given is to experiment!

You may have a couple things going on here.

The first thing I thought is that there was some of that greasy "releaser" junk, they spray in the molds to pop them out, left on your model. If you have that on a model most stuff doesn't stick very well: Glue, paint or inks. I don't know if you do this, but its usually a good idea to just wash all your spruse off with soap first before you do any hobby stuff.

The second thing I thought is you may have washed the brush right before you applied the ink to the "good" one, and there was some dishsoap in the hairs of the brush. Dishsoap is actually good, as someone mentioned in this thread, to break the surface tension of your inks and make them run more into crevases and cracks. Which seems to be the effect you wanted.

To fix it, you may have to do your second ink on the "bad" model(s) with a little dishsoap, then go back and touch up the high spots of the models with your original color. Its either that or strip it and start again.

gl

malfred wrote:Also, soap makes the paint smell nice.

and i doubt it could make GW ink taste any worse!

there are other mediums you can try - eg PVA / wood glue, Vallejo glaze medium, some admixtures for acrylic paints to 'de-tension' the surface - i think that they are call wetting agents.

I am told that water is less effective for proper washes than matte medium due to the surface tension issues. I haven't had to wash/ink any models for a little bit though, so I haven't tried it after the wierd terminator issue I had that mirrors your issue here. If I do some I will let you know how it works out.

I use future floor wax and it does work, try mixing that in with the water

Seconding and Thirding the Future Floor Wax use. I mix it about 1/3 FFW to 2/3 water, and it works great.

There's a recent post on Bell of Lost Souls explaining why adding more medium to inks/washes is a good idea, vs. just adding more water. It's always better to get the theory behind whatever one is doing...

On a side note, Bell of Lost Souls is awesome in general. Check it out.

give this link a read from over at Bell of Lost Souls, it deals with Medium. it sounds like it may help fix whats going on.

http://belloflostsouls.blogspot.com/2008/01/matte-medium-and-what-it-can-do-for-you.html

oh well as mentioned above, that's what I get for not reading it all. heheh

I don't use future, but some other brand. works just as well. As far as using soap, on the one hand t will kill surace tension (of course), but I've never used it with models before. The only time I have ever seen it used with paints was to paint lettering on glass (like the inside glass door of a store). It was used so that it could be removed pretty easy, b/c even after it dries it messes up how well the paint sticks to the glass. Has anyone who has used soap with their minis eve experienced poss. a high rate of chipping, easy pant damage, post-dry smudging, any crap like that?

grizgrin wrote:Has anyone who has used soap with their minis eve experienced poss. a high rate of chipping, easy pant damage, post-dry smudging, any crap like that?

I have not had that happen noticeably when I use soap in the paint mix, but it is usually on top of the undercoat and the base coat, with another coat of regular paint over the top, so it tends to just be the crevices that are vulnerable (which dont get the same rough treatment as the outer surfaces).

Well I read that stuff about matt medium on the bell of lost souls site and went out and got some a long with some spare bottles to keep mixes in and and some syringes for measuring.

WOW.

On the 8th day God said let there be matt medium, and there was, and the painters were verily happy.

Instead of an ink, try dryrshedversion of the main colour you want mixed withblack/white(depending on the shade you want) orthesame mixed wth a bit of water.